The azerite system is boring

[Tradu]

This couldn't be any less true IMO. If anything the Alpha/Beta collects a load of data that is EXTREMELY useful in fixing the game and making it better for Live.

Maybe they should start using that data earlier than 2 months before launch.

[Swisted]

Wrong.

Necklace + 3 slots. Filled with boring passives that barely replace Tier bonuses.

Name interesting tier bonuses pls. Not wrong, you can use any piece of gear that drops for those 3 slots. Also 3 pieces of gear, 2 effects per piece for non-epic quality, 3 effects for epic quality gear. So 6 additional bonuses for heroic geared, 9 for Mythic/raid equipped. Id say that replaces tier bonuses quite easily.

[Swisted]

Any... Piece?

Nah you'll just use the 3 pieces that sim highest. Just like using your tier.... Because it sims highest.

You get one spec specific trait per piece of gear. So 3 total. One more than tier! Amazing system.

I can't wait to give up the 5 systems we have in Legion for this!

See if you were in beta or even followed anything about it you would know, Epic quality gear has 4 levels, 2 offensive traits 1 defensive and the 5 Item level increase. So again, 9 effects. Much better than tier bonuses.

Also, yeah there will be traits that are obviously better to use but its not going to be something extreme. Take Elemental Shaman for example ( i mained Ele on beta so i know what im talking about ) You had a trait where if you used Lightning Bolt of Chain Lightning you would gain x Intellect stacking up to 5 times and lasting 20 secs with refreshing duration with each cast of Lightning Bolt/Chain Lightning. Blizz nerfed it to the ground because they saw it as the trait that everyone would push for.

[Count Zero]

The game is on life support and they're just trying to milk it to the last drop.

People have been saying this for literally a decade.

Meanwhile they're making as much or more profit than ever.

[Byleth]

I agree that the system is boring.

But it's the start of the Xpac, Blizz are very likely to expand upon it in patches, so I will reserve judgement.

I have very low expectations that it can be exciting though.

Despite this, I am still looking forward to BfA.

[Swisted]

Only. One. Is. Spec. Specific. Like. Tier. Bonuses.

No one gives a fuck about your "shield for X amount" or your weak trinket/enchant proc tier, let alone the +5 iLevels.

If you want to do a 1 for 1 comparison. Do it.

Nothing you say is going to convince anyone with half a brain that this system is good.

"Weak trinket/enchant proc" Thats pretty much the direction that tier bonuses were going. There was nothing creative about them anymore. Frost mages T21 Bonuses are a good example, "Use this spell and get +20% dmg on this spell"

The system is much better than the shitty tier system that kept you locked into keeping lower ilevel pieces of gear because you couldnt break your 4pc or 2pc. The system may not be the greatest at the moment but its literally the first version of what this system has to offer and im convinced that it will offer great things in the future tiers.

[Better]

So what you are telling me is that people will not see any of the interesting traits until few months in the expansion.

Do you realize that 99% of the playerbase doesn't read mmo-champion and wowhead ? They will literally never see these traits. It's still a massive failure by all definitions.

Most players didn't see legendaries till about a month into the expac, or later. 99% of the playerbase didn't have their artifact fully unlocked till months into the expac (and it then got further expanded later into the expac). We'll have to wait and see what comes out of the system later to find out if it was a failure or not.

[Swisted]

Your Frost example literally mirrors 99% of the Azerite bonuses. I get it - your standards are low. So glad we lost Artifacts, Legendaries, Set Bonuses and NLC for this.


I'm quite sure that if Blizzard put shit on a plate and told you to eat it you'd be convinced it tasted delicious.

Death Knight T21
Blood: Passive CDR and Rune regeneration
Frost: 15%Inc Dmg to 3 Abilities and Random Spell being used on hit
UH: DoT and chance for same spell to hit again

Demon Hunter T21
Havoc: 40% Eyebeam dmg and Haste after using Eyebeam
Vengeance: Chance to parry 5% and CDR reduction

Druid T21
Balance: 20%dmg inc to 2 spells and 10%dmg inc for 4sec for 2 spells
Feral: 10% chance for rip to multistrike and chance for free finisher
Guardian: CDR and increased healing
Restoration: Healing DoT and Increase tick speed

Hunter T21
BM: 10% dmg inc to Kill command and CDR
MM: Focus dealing shots deal 30%more dmg/generate 25% more focus and chance to multistrike on one ability
Sv: free crit on one ability/inc dmg and stacking dmg inc with use of one ability

Mage T21
Arcane: Dmg increase and increase to haste
Fire: Inc Duration and 10% crit inc after using Combustion
Frost: Flurry deals 15% for each hit and 20%inc to dmg of one spell

Monk T21
BM: Stack gen and CDR
MW: Healing DoT and Random heal
WW: 1 free chi and inc dmg

Paladin T21
Holy: More healing and 30% crit inc for 10 sec
Prot: 10% block chance inc and Buff
Ret: 40% to judge dmg and reduce holy power cost

Priest T21
Disc: CDR and 30% dmg to penance
Holy: Increase to healing with both bonuses
Shadow: Inc crit strike dmg and Inc crit strike rating with buff

Rogue T21
Assassion: Increased poison proc chance and chance to gain 3 energy
Outlaw: Stacking dmg inc for ability and 16% chance to gain random buff
Sub: CDR and Finisher refund Combo points

Shaman T21
Elemental: 20% dmg inc to one spell and inc chance to multistrike for one spell
Enhance: DMG increase to one ability and Target takes inc dmg for 5secs
Resto: Both bonuses effect one spell and how it acts while people stand in it

Warlock T21
Affliction: Chance to inc duration and Target takes 15% more dmg from spell
Demo: Spell inc dmg for one spell and Making pet use move again
Destro: Inc crit strike rating on target for one spell and DoT after using spell

Warrior T21
Arms: Crit dmg by 7% for 8sec and Inc dmg and chance to crit on target
Fury: DoT bleed and dmg inc after using ability
Prot: Instant CDR and Blocking inc effect of buff on you.



Heres all of them laid out for you since i know you wont go look them up. Compare these to all the Azerite traits and tell me they are superior. Only a few are interesting and may change things up, everything else is just a normal following of the rotation for passive effects.

Im not calling everything Blizzard does is gold, i do however judge things without being a biased shit. You already saw me say the system isnt the greatest at the moment and yet you seem to think that i am incapable of judging them in a negative light.

[Swisted]

You keep ignoring the bigger picture though.

Please tell me which picture you are looking at right now so i can respond correctly

[Rogalicus]

Please tell me which picture you are looking at right now so i can respond correctly

Probably the one where they started doing weaker set bonuses when they realized how they fucked up with titanforging and adding extra set piece, because that was both balancing nightmare and also added unintended farming of earlier raids. The whole purpose was to cause players to think "Ah, they are weak and boring anyway, deleting them won't do much".

[longxia]

Priest T21
Holy: Increase to healing with both bonuses

Compare these to all the Azerite traits and tell me they are superior. Only a few are interesting and may change things up, everything else is just a normal following of the rotation for passive effects.

Its an alternating 30% and 60% buff to spells used in a certain rotation. Compare that to Azerite traits like "+2% healing for 6s". The former feels powerful, feels *really* powerful, if used correctly. It totally changes the playstyle in an interesting way I will really miss. The latter is pathetic, boring, is irrelevant to gameplay, and will not be noticed let alone missed.

Thats the only T21 I know a lot about, I wonder though if all or many of the other T21 bonuses are similarly glossed over and demeaned. Azerite traits right now look like the worst game feature Blizzard have ever made. We'll all see in a month I guess.

[Deleted]

Its an alternating 30% and 60% buff to spells used in a certain rotation. Compare that to Azerite traits like "+2% healing for 6s". The former feels powerful, feels *really* powerful, if used correctly. It totally changes the playstyle in an interesting way I will really miss. The latter is pathetic, boring, is irrelevant to gameplay, and will not be noticed let alone missed.

Thats the only T21 I know a lot about, I wonder though if all or many of the other T21 bonuses are similarly glossed over and demeaned. Azerite traits right now look like the worst game feature Blizzard have ever made. We'll all see in a month I guess.

Same with the Balance one: http://www.wowhead.com/spell=251809/...lance-4p-bonus
It is about maintaining the buff as close to 100% of the time as possible by casting your spenders with the correct rhythm.
It's not the most "crazy fun" tier bonus (t20 was more fun), but it does change how you cast your spells even if only slightly. It's also a buff you have complete control over and not a random proc.
Definitely not the most imaginative bonus but it's still better/more interactive than the vast majority of azerite bonuses (that we know of).

[Deleted]

People have been saying this for literally a decade.

Meanwhile they're making as much or more profit than ever.

I usually never agree with these type of comment and with Legion they did push things forward specially into an "ending" (at least in my view..) bringing classes togethers with the respective artefacts and etc..

But BFA.. Is just so... Dull. I don't know it's boring, we just finished fighting the Legion and we had tons of Old Gods teasing over the years and we are back at fighting each other.. I mean I get the whole Old God thing going behind all of this and the whole manipulation thingy going as well but there's just lack of major features like in Legion.

Sub-Races are cool but it doesn't seem like an expansion selling point to me..

[Halyon]

Look, nothing is ever gonna be perfect, people will bitch and moan either way. This is still a lot better than the rng fest of you getting a good or bad legendary early, and don't get me started on the BS of first raid tier being superior the entire expansion if you rolled it high enough on Titanforging.

Stabil upgrade progress is vastly preferrable in my own opinion.

[Deleted]

Look, nothing is ever gonna be perfect, people will bitch and moan either way. This is still a lot better than the rng fest of you getting a good or bad legendary early, and don't get me started on the BS of first raid tier being superior the entire expansion if you rolled it high enough on Titanforging.

Stabil upgrade progress is vastly preferrable in my own opinion.

I agree but they gotta somewhat spice it up half way thorough otherwise it's gonna be a pain in the a**... It's a waiting game I assume.. But yeah everything beats grinding legendary

[Jamie081]

They listened to the people crying about how Artifact Weapons had a big impact on the way classes and specs played, which is like the dumbest complaint I've read since Legion's inception. Now all we have is these shallow passive traits which make next to no difference in gameplay.

[Wallmaker Yahzarah]

Its cool seeing people so passionate about a game to ignore all reasoning. But seriously... the Azerite system is trash. They didnt even know how to properly promote it until the forums went up in arms during alpha. Then you can even nitpick their so-called words from the white knight posters from the forums. Anyways... its a boring system. You can stand on your soapbox and say otherwise, but thats not going to change the reality that is coming to live servers in... 34 days. ugh... and beta is still unstable as hell and quests dont completely connect from beginning to end.

[rrayy]

There's no difference between the 2 if they don't communicate(and for most of beta, they didn't)

Wrong. There is still a difference. Listen to you does in no way require them to talk to you. In fact, the only thing you need to listen is your ears, not your mouth.

- - - Updated - - -

Its cool seeing people so passionate about a game to ignore all reasoning. But seriously... the Azerite system is trash. They didnt even know how to properly promote it until the forums went up in arms during alpha. Then you can even nitpick their so-called words from the white knight posters from the forums. Anyways... its a boring system. You can stand on your soapbox and say otherwise, but thats not going to change the reality that is coming to live servers in... 34 days. ugh... and beta is still unstable as hell and quests dont completely connect from beginning to end.

Ahh the old "my opinion is fact and anyone who disagrees with me is wrong simply because I say so" bit. Your opinion is just that. An opinion. It is not fact no matter how much you try to claim otherwise.

[Tradu]

Death Knight T21
Blood: Passive CDR and Rune regeneration
Frost: 15%Inc Dmg to 3 Abilities and Random Spell being used on hit
UH: DoT and chance for same spell to hit again

Demon Hunter T21
Havoc: 40% Eyebeam dmg and Haste after using Eyebeam
Vengeance: Chance to parry 5% and CDR reduction

Druid T21
Balance: 20%dmg inc to 2 spells and 10%dmg inc for 4sec for 2 spells
Feral: 10% chance for rip to multistrike and chance for free finisher
Guardian: CDR and increased healing
Restoration: Healing DoT and Increase tick speed

Hunter T21
BM: 10% dmg inc to Kill command and CDR
MM: Focus dealing shots deal 30%more dmg/generate 25% more focus and chance to multistrike on one ability
Sv: free crit on one ability/inc dmg and stacking dmg inc with use of one ability

Mage T21
Arcane: Dmg increase and increase to haste
Fire: Inc Duration and 10% crit inc after using Combustion
Frost: Flurry deals 15% for each hit and 20%inc to dmg of one spell

Monk T21
BM: Stack gen and CDR
MW: Healing DoT and Random heal
WW: 1 free chi and inc dmg

Paladin T21
Holy: More healing and 30% crit inc for 10 sec
Prot: 10% block chance inc and Buff
Ret: 40% to judge dmg and reduce holy power cost

Priest T21
Disc: CDR and 30% dmg to penance
Holy: Increase to healing with both bonuses
Shadow: Inc crit strike dmg and Inc crit strike rating with buff

Rogue T21
Assassion: Increased poison proc chance and chance to gain 3 energy
Outlaw: Stacking dmg inc for ability and 16% chance to gain random buff
Sub: CDR and Finisher refund Combo points

Shaman T21
Elemental: 20% dmg inc to one spell and inc chance to multistrike for one spell
Enhance: DMG increase to one ability and Target takes inc dmg for 5secs
Resto: Both bonuses effect one spell and how it acts while people stand in it

Warlock T21
Affliction: Chance to inc duration and Target takes 15% more dmg from spell
Demo: Spell inc dmg for one spell and Making pet use move again
Destro: Inc crit strike rating on target for one spell and DoT after using spell

Warrior T21
Arms: Crit dmg by 7% for 8sec and Inc dmg and chance to crit on target
Fury: DoT bleed and dmg inc after using ability
Prot: Instant CDR and Blocking inc effect of buff on you.



Heres all of them laid out for you since i know you wont go look them up. Compare these to all the Azerite traits and tell me they are superior. Only a few are interesting and may change things up, everything else is just a normal following of the rotation for passive effects.

Im not calling everything Blizzard does is gold, i do however judge things without being a biased shit. You already saw me say the system isnt the greatest at the moment and yet you seem to think that i am incapable of judging them in a negative light.

Frost DK 4set interacts with Razorice, pushing a talent that wasn't used before to the top.
Havoc completely changed the talent build you used.
Feral had strong interaction with the legendary helmet.
WW massively changed the pace of the spec, and made a previously bad legendary BiS.
Ret changed a talent and shifted the stat priority massively.
Elemental 2set added another layer of gameplay(which is sort of being continued as a talent in BfA)
Arms changed the talent build used.
Fury changed the talent build used(to one that plays feels very different to play than previous tiers this expansion)

That's the most gameplay altering ones I can think of out of the T21 bonuses, previous tiers also had a bunch(WW had pretty noticeable gameplay alterations from tier sets basically every tier since its creation, especially in HFC and Legion)
So were all of them amazingly interesting? No, but there were more interesting and gameplay altering ones than the current azerite traits(which include bullshit like getting intellect for using Innervate, which causes stupid conflicts because the boomkin and the healer don't want it used at the same points in the fight)

[Halyon]

I agree but they gotta somewhat spice it up half way thorough otherwise it's gonna be a pain in the a**... It's a waiting game I assume.. But yeah everything beats grinding legendary

Well, it's just the start of the expansion, the entire thing isn't defined by patch 1, so take it easy and see what they do later on.