Belfs turned into traitors and scumbags

[Jastall]

You know, if Baine challenged Sylvanas to a one on one fight, even if he lost he would still win by becoming a martyr, but that would require him to sacrifice for the Horde and sadly he's saving himself for the Alliance. Or better said, for Anduin.

What's the point of a martyr? To aid a rebellion? Then we're back to square one, except Baine is dead now.

Which I'm sure is as advantage for some, but not for Baine.

[Alixie]

The Sunreavers getting smoked by Sylvanas' Horde because of dissenting views would be poetic justice for the way Lor'themar exiled those high elves who would later end up (re)joining the Alliance, only to be killed by Nathanos afterwards. If that truly was to happen, then it would be karma performing a boomerang headshot on Lor'themar.

Its probably unintentional, but so satisfyingly ironic. Sylvanas sending Nathanos and Horde players to slaughter High Elves, and now Blood Elves. All because of Lorthemar.

[Magnagarde]

Its probably unintentional, but so satisfyingly ironic. Sylvanas sending Nathanos and Horde players to slaughter High Elves, and now Blood Elves. All because of Lorthemar.

And these blood elves would be getting themselves killed for having a different view from the rest, not necessarily a lack of loyalty, within a group they considered to be their own - a group whose leader who will have none of it. The blood elves would basically fill their victims' shoes a decade later.

[Soppatykki]

"Thanks for ensuring we don't go extinct after we were almost wiped out by murlocs/centaurs/undead, we swear ourselves to your existing system. Oh, by the way, please change everything about yourselves and continue carrying our useless asses or we'll rebel. We the Horde now."
t. tauren, Darkspear, blood elves. Twice.

The Irony of rebellion? What was the status of the Forsaken before they got the Horde membership? Nothing relevant.

[Super Dickmann]

The Irony of rebellion? What was the status of the Forsaken before they got the Horde membership? Nothing relevant.

The Forsaken formed without orcish assistance and the Horde basically only gave them name value and fuck all else in terms of material support until Cata. When they rebelled they did it purely because they could, not out of any ideological claims on the Horde as a whole.

[mickybrighteyes]

Shame he didn't listen to his advisors who were, you know, advising him not to put Garrosh in charge cause he was too unstable. In fact Baine's dad challenged Garrosh to a duel as a protest to Thrall's... or should I say Go'el's choice.

As far as I'm concerned Thrall can drop dead the moment he decides to work with the Alliance.

Actually, Cairne challenged Garrosh because he believed Garrosh to have ordered the killing of certain druids. This was not the case as the killings were done by another group of orcs tied to Twilight Cultists. Cairne still challenged Garrosh over it... NOT because he was protesting Garrosh's appointment.

[Soppatykki]

The Forsaken formed without orcish assistance and the Horde basically only gave them name value and fuck all else in terms of material support until Cata. When they rebelled they did it purely because they could, not out of any ideological claims on the Horde as a whole.

That's correct. Standing alone, forsaken would've been hunted down. Even if you don't personally value it, horde as faction actually has some power behind it.

[Super Dickmann]

That's correct. Standing alone, forsaken would've been hunted down. Even if you don't personally value it, horde as faction actually has some power behind it.

Yup, that used to be the difference in dynamic between the Eastern and Kalimdor Horde. The Kalimdor Horde was the actual Horde, based around orcish values and the Eastern Horde were allies of convenience, who needed the Horde else the whole world would be after them, but didn't align with it ideologically. This started falling apart in Kalimdor when the writing increasingly emphasized that the bonds between the orcs and the trolls and tauren were one-sided, with the orcs carrying the weight and the others reaping the benefits and in EK pretty much right after that bloc was created when the belves got the Sunwell fixed and thematically became an Alliance race.

[Soppatykki]

Yup, that used to be the difference in dynamic between the Eastern and Kalimdor Horde. The Kalimdor Horde was the actual Horde, based around orcish values and the Eastern Horde were allies of convenience, who needed the Horde else the whole world would be after them, but didn't align with it ideologically. This started falling apart in Kalimdor when the writing increasingly emphasized that the bonds between the orcs and the trolls and tauren were one-sided, with the orcs carrying the weight and the others reaping the benefits and in EK pretty much right after that bloc was created when the belves got the Sunwell fixed and thematically became an Alliance race.

Off topic; should the Horde reconstitute itself instead of self-destruction? I find both these options rather baffling.

[Ramz]

They've been that way since they betrayed the Alliance and sided with the Horde scum.

Correction, they have been scumbacks since they reached EK. They were the ones that started conflicts the moment they appeared.

[Super Dickmann]

Off topic; should the Horde reconstitute itself instead of self-destruction? I find both these options rather baffling.

In what sense do you mean?

[Oswen]

How can you blame him?
The Alliance is treating Void Elves, which should be reviled for their existence alone, as total bros since they joined and just on Alleria's word while the Horde sends his people to die on the first line every time a tyrant is ruling (which is every other expansion at this point) even after all this years of service.
Bob is probably regretting big time to have turned down the Alliance offer multiple times (and making a joke out of Alleria), the Alliance has been pretty "friendly"with the Blood Elves after all even after they joined the Horde and no, Jaina was pretty much representing the Kirin Tor during the purge and not the Alliance.

Meanwhile in the Horde we are all scratching our head trying to guess where this trainwreck of story will bring us...who am I kidding, we know where this is going, it's either Sylvanas-Kerrigan or Warcrimes 2, now with infinite time travel.

[derpkitteh]

How can you blame him?
The Alliance is treating Void Elves, which should be reviled for their existence alone, as total bros since they joined and just on Alleria's word while the Horde sends his people to die on the first line every time a tyrant is ruling (which is every other expansion at this point) even after all this years of service.
Bob is probably regretting big time to have turned down the Alliance offer multiple times (and making a joke out of Alleria), the Alliance has been pretty "friendly"with the Blood Elves after all even after they joined the Horde and no, Jaina was pretty much representing the Kirin Tor during the purge and not the Alliance.

Meanwhile in the Horde we are all scratching our head trying to guess where this trainwreck of story will bring us...who am I kidding, we know where this is going, it's either Sylvanas-Kerrigan or Warcrimes 2, now with infinite time travel.

here's the thing.

lor'themar shouldn't have ever wanted back in the alliance, not after two betrayals at their hands. but then, they have the gall to betray a third time in the middle of talks to rejoin? no, no thalassian elf that knows of this history should ever want anything to do with humans again. they have done nothing but betray the elves for over 20 years.

which makes the void elves one of the lowest forms of life in existence, to wholeheartedly embrace the alliance. it doesn't matter if they were kicked out for their studies, nothing should ever drive a thalassian to trust or care about humans in any way.

an alliance of convenience with one because you're facing down a woman so incredibly powerful as azshara? understandable, she's probably the strongest mortal on azeroth at this time. but after that, there should just be no interaction "poof, we're done with you. don't let us catch you in our lands, and we won't come down and fuck with you."

[mickybrighteyes]

here's the thing.

lor'themar shouldn't have ever wanted back in the alliance, not after two betrayals at their hands. but then, they have the gall to betray a third time in the middle of talks to rejoin? no, no thalassian elf that knows of this history should ever want anything to do with humans again. they have done nothing but betray the elves for over 20 years.

which makes the void elves one of the lowest forms of life in existence, to wholeheartedly embrace the alliance. it doesn't matter if they were kicked out for their studies, nothing should ever drive a thalassian to trust or care about humans in any way.

an alliance of convenience with one because you're facing down a woman so incredibly powerful as azshara? understandable, she's probably the strongest mortal on azeroth at this time. but after that, there should just be no interaction "poof, we're done with you. don't let us catch you in our lands, and we won't come down and fuck with you."

basically this.

I can get temporary truce... but once that deal is done... it's DONE

edit:

If the elves of Quel'thalas are at all defecting at this point it's to be a neutral party unrelated to either faction and holing up again if ANYTHING. ONly defection arc that could really make sense, imo

[Oswen]

here's the thing.

lor'themar shouldn't have ever wanted back in the alliance, not after two betrayals at their hands. but then, they have the gall to betray a third time in the middle of talks to rejoin? no, no thalassian elf that knows of this history should ever want anything to do with humans again. they have done nothing but betray the elves for over 20 years.

which makes the void elves one of the lowest forms of life in existence, to wholeheartedly embrace the alliance. it doesn't matter if they were kicked out for their studies, nothing should ever drive a thalassian to trust or care about humans in any way.

an alliance of convenience with one because you're facing down a woman so incredibly powerful as azshara? understandable, she's probably the strongest mortal on azeroth at this time. but after that, there should just be no interaction "poof, we're done with you. don't let us catch you in our lands, and we won't come down and fuck with you."

The actual humans they are dealing with are from Stormwind and never betrayed any Thalassian elf ever, Garithos was from another nation and self appointed in a time when Stormwind was busy rebuilding and not partecipating into the war.
If anything their beef should be with Dalaran, a neutral party, since they are the ones who turned a blind eye on said Garithos *and* purged them out of their city.
Pretty much the "but not the Same orcs/undead/trolls/etc!" should apply to "not the same humans" aswell.

The elves on the other hands owed humanity (and in particular, Anduin's Lothar line, a man from Stormwind) big time.
They were fed and saved from extinction when they arrived in EK and again during the troll wars (which they initiated when they decided to settle on holy Amani land out of all places) a debt they took as "paid" just by partecipating into the Second War (only after the Amani started to burn Quel'Thalas) with a token force and then leaving immediatly right after.
When Lordaeron fell they pretty much did the same, looked away hoping the problems wouldn't arrive there without sending any help save for a few volunteers (hailing mostly from Dalaran of all things) and then pretended to be surprised when an army of undead steamrolled them right after.
Not to mention that the current Alliance, which includes humans from Stormwind, restored the Sunwell and saved them again, without asking for anything back.

Thalassian elves have always been scummy and basically are the untrusty friends who take anything they can but barely give anything back while also complaining for anything unrelated at the same time.
I agree that a temporary truce would be the best thing to ask for at most and indeed Bob and his friends shouldn't take a step out of their dead forest to avoid causing any more troubles.

Blood Elves at least had a nice story with all the after-Kael and their struggle to survive in TBC which made them way more interesting (and a better fit for their new faction) but then they turned them back into a worse form of what they were before and now we have to deal with them in the Horde in the most blandest and dull form they could possibly get.
It's no surprise that every odd warchief immediatly sends them to their death at the first chance they get.

[Ujimasa Hojo]

Funny enough, Blood Elves always get highlights every expansion.

[Tripzzz]

The actual humans they are dealing with are from Stormwind and never betrayed any Thalassian elf ever, Garithos was from another nation and self appointed in a time when Stormwind was busy rebuilding and not partecipating into the war.
If anything their beef should be with Dalaran, a neutral party, since they are the ones who turned a blind eye on said Garithos *and* purged them out of their city.
Pretty much the "but not the Same orcs/undead/trolls/etc!" should apply to "not the same humans" aswell.

The elves on the other hands owed humanity (and in particular, Anduin's Lothar line, a man from Stormwind) big time.
They were fed and saved from extinction when they arrived in EK and again during the troll wars (which they initiated when they decided to settle on holy Amani land out of all places) a debt they took as "paid" just by partecipating into the Second War (only after the Amani started to burn Quel'Thalas) with a token force and then leaving immediatly right after.
When Lordaeron fell they pretty much did the same, looked away hoping the problems wouldn't arrive there without sending any help save for a few volunteers (hailing mostly from Dalaran of all things) and then pretended to be surprised when an army of undead steamrolled them right after.
Not to mention that the current Alliance, which includes humans from Stormwind, restored the Sunwell and saved them again, without asking for anything back.

Thalassian elves have always been scummy and basically are the untrusty friends who take anything they can but barely give anything back while also complaining for anything unrelated at the same time.
I agree that a temporary truce would be the best thing to ask for at most and indeed Bob and his friends shouldn't take a step out of their dead forest to avoid causing any more troubles.

Blood Elves at least had a nice story with all the after-Kael and their struggle to survive in TBC which made them way more interesting (and a better fit for their new faction) but then they turned them back into a worse form of what they were before and now we have to deal with them in the Horde in the most blandest and dull form they could possibly get.
It's no surprise that every odd warchief immediatly sends them to their death at the first chance they get.

100% facts!

[derpkitteh]

The actual humans they are dealing with are from Stormwind and never betrayed any Thalassian elf ever, Garithos was from another nation and self appointed in a time when Stormwind was busy rebuilding and not partecipating into the war.
If anything their beef should be with Dalaran, a neutral party, since they are the ones who turned a blind eye on said Garithos *and* purged them out of their city.
Pretty much the "but not the Same orcs/undead/trolls/etc!" should apply to "not the same humans" aswell.

stormwind betrayed them when they sent a dwarf and night elven saboteurs to spy on them and fuck around at their last lifelines, the arcane sanctums.

stormwind was a part of the alliance, the same alliance that garithos was a part of. it's nothing but further evidence of human duplicity.

garithos started it, dalaran went along with it, stormwind joined it, and dalaran did it again.

which is why umbric, and the silver covenant, are a level of traitor lower than just about anything else. humanity deserves nothing from the elves after all they've done.

[raz98]

You know what? this has been some damn fine trolling on OP's part
10/10. Best I've seen on MMOC

[eurojust]

stormwind betrayed them when they sent a dwarf and night elven saboteurs to spy on them and fuck around at their last lifelines, the arcane sanctums.

stormwind was a part of the alliance, the same alliance that garithos was a part of. it's nothing but further evidence of human duplicity.

garithos started it, dalaran went along with it, stormwind joined it, and dalaran did it again.

which is why umbric, and the silver covenant, are a level of traitor lower than just about anything else. humanity deserves nothing from the elves after all they've done.

So you put the blame on Stormwind and Humans because they were part of the Alliance, and therefore responsible for Garithos doing his own thing with a group of survivor in a time of chaos where Stormwind wasn't even involved?
What kind of mental gymnastic is this?
But at the same time, it's fine for the Blood Elves to be friend with the Horde lead by Orcs, the exact same Orcs who were on the verge of annihilating Quel Thalas? But it's okay because it's the Horde 2.0? Meaning that Stormwind had to explicitly state that the Alliance of WoW is the Alliance 2.0 so the Elves could feel welcomed?
Tell me, do the Humans of Storwminds worship Garithos or made statues of him?
Because the Horde named their capital Orgrimmar. You know Ogrim right?
Also good job ignoring what the other posters said : The humans saved the ass of the Elves on numerous occasions. So much for the "racist against Elves race". Even Arthas saved them against the trolls of Zul’Aman.

Belves are the biggest traitor of WoW. That's a fact. Siding with Sylvanas, aka Lich Queen to destroy the Night Elves, same Night Elves who helped them against the Scourge in TFT.