Mythic+ is terrible for the game

[VooDsXo]

Why do you half of you treat this site like your personal blog to vent on?

Forum - a place, meeting, or medium where ideas and views on a particular issue can be exchanged.

Why are you here is a better question...ignorant asshole.

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Literally no one is telling you to do m+ content.

Thats true no one is telling you, well you're assuming no one is telling them in their guild. You're also forgetting the game basically asserts you have to do M+, and if you're going to say some casual nonsense about how you can do this and this and this no, no, no you can't you can do dungeons M+ specifically or raid thats it there is no greater portion of the game like running the economy or any of that to the majority of players it is the daily dungeon grind and raids that are the entirety of your journey.

This is why you never hear anyone exclaim how excited they are to level up!!!

[Onikaroshi]

Only problem with M+ is it overlaps too much with raiding, if they could separate the two out (make m+ gear better for m+ and raiding gear better for raiding) it would be 100x better.

It could also do with a better loot system but a weekly lock like EVERYTHING else that gives that level of loot, maybe only loot from 1 key of each level.

[Celista]

Thats true no one is telling you, well you're assuming no one is telling them in their guild. You're also forgetting the game basically asserts you have to do M+, and if you're going to say some casual nonsense about how you can do this and this and this no, no, no you can't you can do dungeons M+ specifically or raid thats it there is no greater portion of the game like running the economy or any of that to the majority of players it is the daily dungeon grind and raids that are the entirety of your journey.

You don't have to do it. If you hate m+ that much then don't run them. If you're a min/max player and determined to stay that way then suck it up, like raiders have done in the past when it comes to farming mats or resistance gear or gearing alts for raids or running raid content they don't actually like or apply/interview for raiding guilds or do pvp. Part of being one of the most well-geared (note that I did not say best) players is sucking it up and doing shit you don't want to do.

If your complaint is, "the best gear should still come from raiding" or "raid gear comparatively sucks" then there is more discussion to be had here.

[predlol]

I was serious about raiding during this expansion for the first time since MoP. I was farming the heroics and then we started raiding as a Heroic raiding guild. It was fun. Then M+ unlocked. Guild leaders going "We expect you to farm M+ for gear and get +x ilvl by next raid"... .

I've never heard of an heroic guild that does that? You have M raiding guild with less annoying RL (obv not top world but still). M+ wasn't your issue (granted that I also find this content boring; but I just ignore it); you were just in the wrong guild.

[Dundebuns]

You don't need to raid or do m+. You can get plenty of gear to do normal and heroic raids if you want to, or lower level m+. You don't need to do high m+ levels for loot because you'll never tackle content that needs it. But you can do it if you want to. And iof you do need the higher levle gear for higher level content then you'll earn it in as many ways as you can/want.

[Kokolums]

An MMO lives or dies on its in-game social community. M+ actively works against the formation of a social community. That's the bottom line. M+ needs to go.

If M+ was such a great feature, subs would at least be increasing since its implementation. They aren't. Set aside your biases, it sucks. People don't want it. They continue to leave the game instead. It doesn't hook them.

[Vargur]

The glorified Diablo 3 greater rift system, now renamed to "Mythic+", is an un-MMO like feature that completely ruined ANY other way of gearing. It's literally a system taken from a non-MMORPG. It does not belong here.

The fact that you get the same ilvl from M+ as raiding is just awful. Why would anyone raid? Even Method has only defeated Jaina 2 times. Why farm her more? They get better gear from M+.

I was serious about raiding during this expansion for the first time since MoP. I was farming the heroics and then we started raiding as a Heroic raiding guild. It was fun. Then M+ unlocked. Guild leaders going "We expect you to farm M+ for gear and get +x ilvl by next raid"... I hate doing the same dungeons over and over again with scaled hp and dmg. Also raiding don't even give a single Tier set that looks cool... I quit raiding 3 weeks after M+ unlocked.

Raiding gear can't compete with M+. PvP gear can't compete with M+. Nothing can comete with M+.

I tried to cap on Conquest points each week to get that kind of gear but it's still miles worse than what M+10 gives.

How about making a dungeon system that can feel rewarding all expansion long without any scaling, while still giving incentive to raid? PS: Vanilla managed to do it, see dungeons set 1 and 2.

The game has gone from "raid or die" to "m+ or die", and I for one, rather die then.

Yeah, but who's gonna listen to us?

Blizzard sure won't.

[Onikaroshi]

Yeah, but who's gonna listen to us?

Blizzard sure won't.

not when they can make easy money off the MDI. MDI basically ruined M+

[Twdft]

Only problem with M+ is it overlaps too much with raiding, if they could separate the two out (make m+ gear better for m+ and raiding gear better for raiding) it would be 100x better.

Blizzard started doing this (Legion outdoor set, Argus trinket, 2 piece dungeon sets) and I wish they'd go all in next expansion. Give us set boni that only works for the content in which the items were aquired.

Imagine how cool dungeon sets could be if the set bonus changed every season and would help overcome the season affix. Reaping: 6 piece bonus a small AE damage proc, 8 piece AE interrupt proc. (season 1 could have been a proc that decurses a ghoonie). This would also help with farming the same gear every season just higher ilvl.

[Katie N]

I agree, I stopped playing for several reasons but mythic plus is a big factor in that decision. If I wanted to play diablo 3, I'd play diablo 3, not WoW.

[Onikaroshi]

Blizzard started doing this (Legion outdoor set, Argus trinket, 2 piece dungeon sets) and I wish they'd go all in next expansion. Give us set boni that only works for the content in which the items were aquired.

Imagine how cool dungeon sets could be if the set bonus changed every season and would help overcome the season affix. Reaping: 6 piece bonus a small AE damage proc, 8 piece AE interrupt proc. (season 1 could have been a proc that decurses a ghoonie). This would also help with farming the same gear every season just higher ilvl.

I'd go for that, that'd be a much better system then what we have now. Do the content you WANT to do to get the gear to do that content.

Right now if you don't want to do M+ you're letting your raid down.

[Nnyco]

M+ is best addition in this game since aoe-loot.

[Divada]

It promotes a toxic wannabe elitist attitude.

To be fair, toxic elitism has existed in the game since vanilla. The type of elitism might be different (vanilla certainly didn't have the GOGOGO dopamine crowd) but it's always been there in one form or another.

[Kokolums]

Yeah, but who's gonna listen to us?

Blizzard sure won't.

Rumors I'm hearing is Diablo 4 NEEDS to be a hit or else Activision is gonna start getting REAL hands on and start shuttering most of Blizzard and go full sellout on its IPs before all luster is lost in one final cash grab. But I cannot corroborate that. Blizzard is basically on its last legs from what I've heard. It sounds about right. The management and staff at Blizzard clearly hate people. They now design antisocial games and do not care. So it should collapse.

At the end of the day, it'll be things like m+ that destroyed the company.

[Voidwielder]

If it wasn't for M+, I would have quit a long, long time ago.

And I know at least 15 people in my loose circle of mates who'd say the same. And I bet thousands, maybe even dozens of thousands, would say the same.
Raiding is fine if you've a fixed schedule and your duties are permanently set in the medium-term. I and many others don't have that.
And frankly, I don't get as much kick of out raiding as I used to. In M+, I am the only healer and if I fuck up, everyone knows that and there's nowhere to hide from that fact. It keeps me on the edge. I like it.

Kokolums is a fool who has no idea what he's talking about. M+ has reinvigorated the game.

[Katie N]

You don't have to do it. If you hate m+ that much then don't run them. If you're a min/max player and determined to stay that way then suck it up, like raiders have done in the past when it comes to farming mats or resistance gear or gearing alts for raids or running raid content they don't actually like or apply/interview for raiding guilds or do pvp. Part of being one of the most well-geared (note that I did not say best) players is sucking it up and doing shit you don't want to do.

If your complaint is, "the best gear should still come from raiding" or "raid gear comparatively sucks" then there is more discussion to be had here.

Huh? You have to do it if you want to get gear, it drops gear on par with heroic dazar'alor and is about on par with mythic dazar'alor in the chest items, better than dazar'alor if they titanforge. You have one shot per boss in the raid for gear while you can farm mythic plus infinitely for gear. It ruins the character gear progression totally.

[Voidwielder]

If M+ was such a great feature, subs would at least be increasing since its implementation. They aren't. Set aside your biases, it sucks. People don't want it. They continue to leave the game instead. It doesn't hook them.

Subs have been in decline since late-WoTKL. The addition of [insert feature here] has been a disaster. It sucks. People don't want it.
I would attribute M+ as one of the aspects of the relative success of Legion. BfA died due to Azerite, bad lore and horrible, horrible class play.

You're a fool.

[Celista]

If it wasn't for M+, I would have quit a long, long time ago.

And I know at least 15 people in my loose circle of mates who'd say the same. And I bet thousands, maybe even dozens of thousands, would say the same.
Raiding is fine if you've a fixed schedule and your duties are permanently set in the medium-term. I and many others don't have that.
And frankly, I don't get as much kick of out raiding as I used to. In M+, I am the only healer and if I fuck up, everyone knows that and there's nowhere to hide from that fact. It keeps me on the edge. I like it.

Kokolums is a fool who has no idea what he's talking about. M+ has reinvigorated the game.

I hated healing m+ before finding a group to run with as pugs were ass lol. I like it too and think it's added a lot of depth to the game.

[Kokolums]

You don't have to do it. If you hate m+ that much then don't run them.

If doesn't work like that because things like M+ affect the entire nature of the game. Its like saying if you don't like the sun then don't use it.

[Katie N]

If it wasn't for M+, I would have quit a long, long time ago.

And I know at least 15 people in my loose circle of mates who'd say the same. And I bet thousands, maybe even dozens of thousands, would say the same.
Raiding is fine if you've a fixed schedule and your duties are permanently set in the medium-term. I and many others don't have that.
And frankly, I don't get as much kick of out raiding as I used to. In M+, I am the only healer and if I fuck up, everyone knows that and there's nowhere to hide from that fact. It keeps me on the edge. I like it.

Kokolums is a fool who has no idea what he's talking about. M+ has reinvigorated the game.

Mythic plus requires you to have a schedule as well. I've failed countless of runs because I've had to go AFK because of my daughter. I have to plan to play when she's not home if I'm going to do mythic plus. In raids, I could just say I'll be brb 5 min and come back without a timer failing.