Star Wars Episode IX: The Rise of Skywalker

[Nefarious Tea]

Also because sci-fi/fantasy always does this with super-powered people.

Why doesn't a character that can teleport or have super speed just carry a knife and shank everyone in the 0.001 seconds it takes them to move from point A to point B? Why can't Tracer have a gun that can actually shoot people? Why doesn't Wolverine just carry a gun so he doesn't have to constantly be charging at enemies 50 feet away who are shooting at him?

Like you said, it's all just written for "coolness" as opposed to what would actually make sense.

To be fair there's also the psychological impact: some crazy fucker wearing brown or red robes and swinging around a sword just jumped 20 feet, blocked/dodged every blaster shot at them, and hacked the rest of your platoon to pieces. I DARE you to try and honestly tell me you wouldn't shit yourself in fear if that happened to you.

[UnluckyAmateur]

I admit when Kylo stopped a blaster bolt in midair that was badass.

Not to mention its a natural advancement of what we've seen on screen with Vader blocking one with his hand. It's a shame, the trilogy started off so well (until they introduced death star 2.0 and a bunch of other resource issues...)

[PACOX]

One blaster bolt, yeah. Far as I know these can fire more than one bullet every five seconds, unless these things are somehow worse than real-life revolvers. Plus, Force accelerate the bolts or something.

To say nothing of the fact that it's curious that Force users can stop blaster bolts in midair but not, ya know, lightsabers. One's a projectile propelled by a firearm, the other only has the strength of a person behind it. Ah well, the perils of overanalyzing Star Wars.

Jedis casually block a hail of blaster fire with their little light sticks in the prequels. Doing it with the force should be no problem. But then in RotS the Clone shoot down hundreds of Jedi like its nothing.

Yes, SW is dumb. Probably why its so popular.

[Jastall]

Jedis casually block a hail of blaster fire with their little light sticks in the prequels. Doing it with the force should be no problem. But then in RotS the Clone shoot down hundreds of Jedi like its nothing.

Yes, SW is dumb. Probably why its so popular.

I wouldn't as far as to say that it's popular specifically because it is dumb, and more that it never lets logic, sense and consistency get in the way of the Rule of Cool. As an example the MCU does that as well but, apart from the time travel in Endgame, it's never really nitpicked about, probably because the movies themselves don't even try to justify all the bullshit happening. Whereas Star Wars is outright fantasy in space with some trappings of sci-fi, a genre where more consistency is expected.

[Kokolums]

Those are people who suck at Star Warsing, then. I imagine those same people think the Duel of the Fates between Maul and Qui Gon/Obi Wan was masterful.

There's been some revisionist history with the lightsaber duels. In 1999, 2002, and 2005, fans didn't cry that the duels were over-choreographed. They in fact preferred them over the stilted fighting in the original trilogy. I think in another 20 years, opinion will swing back around and decide the prequel duels were better than BOTH the original trilogy and sequel trilogy.

[fakaroonie]

There's been some revisionist history with the lightsaber duels. In 1999, 2002, and 2005, fans didn't cry that the duels were over-choreographed. They in fact preferred them over the stilted fighting in the original trilogy. I think in another 20 years, opinion will swing back around and decide the prequel duels were better than BOTH the original trilogy and sequel trilogy.

Only if Jar Jar comes in episode 9 and reveals himself as the one True Sith behind it all.

[Ihavewaffles]

Lightsaber fights were better in the prequels, u have to be insane to think ep04-06 were good...
Obi-Wan vs Darth Vader has to be the shittiest duel in star wars history...

Like watching two senior citizens fighting over the last pudding...

While DV didn't duel anybody in Rogue One, he wasn't a stiff slow zombie...

Ep07-09 is just wild shitty swinging like Luke did in Return of the Jedi when he got angry...

U can like rey, kylo ren, luke, obi-wan etc all u like, but they are just some actors while the guy who did darth maul is an irl martial artist...

[Kokolums]

Lightsaber fights were better in the prequels, u have to be insane to think ep04-06 were good...
Obi-Wan vs Darth Vader has to be the shittiest duel in star wars history...

Like watching two senior citizens fighting over the last pudding...

While DV didn't duel anybody in Rogue One, he wasn't a stiff slow zombie...

Ep07-09 is just wild shitty swinging like Luke did in Return of the Jedi when he got angry...

U can like rey, kylo ren, luke, obi-wan etc all u like, but they are just some actors while the guy who did darth maul is an irl martial artist...

I don't like the lightsaber duels were getting in the sequel trilogy either and I think time will be unkind to them. People will look back in 20 years and think "wow they really seem like forgettable fights". George Lucas did a lot of things wrong in the prequels but he fully understood the bread and butter was a great laser sword battle.

[Verdugo]

Lightsaber fights were better in the prequels, u have to be insane to think ep04-06 were good...
Obi-Wan vs Darth Vader has to be the shittiest duel in star wars history...

Like watching two senior citizens fighting over the last pudding...

While DV didn't duel anybody in Rogue One, he wasn't a stiff slow zombie...

Ep07-09 is just wild shitty swinging like Luke did in Return of the Jedi when he got angry...

U can like rey, kylo ren, luke, obi-wan etc all u like, but they are just some actors while the guy who did darth maul is an irl martial artist...

And Episode 3 was the bestest because it had lava in it!

[Ihavewaffles]

And Episode 3 was the bestest because it had lava in it!

Bad movies, but good fighting n coordination..

Ep04-09 is like fighters forgetting technique, anticipation, strategy, like a boxing match where's there's only wild swung hay-makers, which should earn loss with blocking n swift counter-strikes..

Luke should have lost to Vader the moment he got angry n started swinging wildly...hell, a padawan would have blocked that shit..

This is how ep04-09 duels should always end...

I don't like the lightsaber duels were getting in the sequel trilogy either and I think time will be unkind to them. People will look back in 20 years and think "wow they really seem like forgettable fights". George Lucas did a lot of things wrong in the prequels but he fully understood the bread and butter was a great laser sword battle.

Word.

[Verdugo]

Bad movies, but good fighting n coordination..

Ep04-09 is like fighters forgetting technique, anticipation, strategy, like a boxing match where's there's only wild swung hay-makers, which should earn loss with blocking n swift counter-strikes..

Well if you prefer "this" instead...

[Ihavewaffles]

Well if you prefer "this" instead...

I can feel the hate in you, young padawan.

By no means are ep01-03 perfect, but lightyears better fighting.

[Lorgar Aurelian]

One blaster bolt, yeah. Far as I know these can fire more than one bullet every five seconds, unless these things are somehow worse than real-life revolvers. Plus, Force accelerate the bolts or something.

To say nothing of the fact that it's curious that Force users can stop blaster bolts in midair but not, ya know, lightsabers. One's a projectile propelled by a firearm, the other only has the strength of a person behind it. Ah well, the perils of overanalyzing Star Wars.

Force users can actually stop a saber in both the old and current canon though like a blaster you need to be rather powerful to do so.

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Jedis casually block a hail of blaster fire with their little light sticks in the prequels. Doing it with the force should be no problem. But then in RotS the Clone shoot down hundreds of Jedi like its nothing.

Yes, SW is dumb. Probably why its so popular.

Not all Jedi have the same powerlevel and we have only seen higher up Jedi/sith stop blasters. It’s likely that many just don’t have the power to do it.

The clone betrayal is also rather sensible in how many of the Jedi die some are shot in the back and even the ones that do deflect some bolts proabbly weren’t expecting there whole squad to open up on them.

[Beloren]

I can feel the hate in you, young padawan.

By no means are ep01-03 perfect, but lightyears better fighting.

Agreed, fighting was much cooler - both lightsaber actions, gun fights and space fights

Also the scenry was much better - we saw Naboo, Coruscant, chaomeno, every film had some incredible vistas...

The rest just tend to show you broken down place,s deserts and swaps, so bland

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Well if you prefer "this" instead...

That was funny

[eschatological]

The prequel fights had no emotional resonance, just flash. That easily makes them the worst fights in the series. They never hit anything, and when they did, the lightsabers practically bounced off each other. What we saw in the OT was this idea that the lightsaber was a knight's weapon. Heavy, two-handed, taking years of mastery to even get a downstroke right. When Vader and Obi Wan clashed, or when Luke and Vader clashed, you felt the weight of the blades against each other. The blades actually seemed to flex, and bend under the weight of the stroke.

Not to mention that the emotional impact behind those fights - mentor vs apprentice, son vs father - far outweighed anything the prequels did. Even the fight between Anakin and Obi Wan in episode 3 felt flat, but that had more to do with Anakin's ridiculous heel turn, Hayden's poor acting, and the dumbass amounts of CGI trying to make up for a fight which should have been simple, close-shot, between two men who considered each other brothers.

The new trilogy has tried to compromise on these two differing views. They have some of the flash of the prequels, especially from Rey as the movies go along, but the weightiness of Kylo's pommeled lightsaber. When their sabers clash, you can feel the impact. And there is always some sort of emotion there, especially from Adam Driver, because he's probably the best actor in the damn trilogy right now. You can feel Kylo Ren's rage, in his fight with Luke.

Imagine thinking the ep 1 snooze fest between Maul and the Jedi was a better lightsaber duel than Obi Wan and Vader in ANH. That's like comparing Transformers to the Shawshank Redemption.

[Frontenac]

Ah well, the perils of overanalyzing Star Wars.

Exactly. It's like overanalysing the Arthurian Legends. In the end, it just spoils the fun.

[Endus]

The prequel fights had no emotional resonance, just flash. That easily makes them the worst fights in the series. They never hit anything, and when they did, the lightsabers practically bounced off each other. What we saw in the OT was this idea that the lightsaber was a knight's weapon. Heavy, two-handed, taking years of mastery to even get a downstroke right. When Vader and Obi Wan clashed, or when Luke and Vader clashed, you felt the weight of the blades against each other. The blades actually seemed to flex, and bend under the weight of the stroke.

Not to mention that the emotional impact behind those fights - mentor vs apprentice, son vs father - far outweighed anything the prequels did. Even the fight between Anakin and Obi Wan in episode 3 felt flat, but that had more to do with Anakin's ridiculous heel turn, Hayden's poor acting, and the dumbass amounts of CGI trying to make up for a fight which should have been simple, close-shot, between two men who considered each other brothers.

The new trilogy has tried to compromise on these two differing views. They have some of the flash of the prequels, especially from Rey as the movies go along, but the weightiness of Kylo's pommeled lightsaber. When their sabers clash, you can feel the impact. And there is always some sort of emotion there, especially from Adam Driver, because he's probably the best actor in the damn trilogy right now. You can feel Kylo Ren's rage, in his fight with Luke.

Imagine thinking the ep 1 snooze fest between Maul and the Jedi was a better lightsaber duel than Obi Wan and Vader in ANH. That's like comparing Transformers to the Shawshank Redemption.

The thing is, if I go back and watch the Prequel fights, they look like garbage. If I go back and watch something like, say, the Captain America v. Winter Soldier fight in in CA:TWS, or anything in the John Wick films, they hold up to repeat viewings. They took those fights seriously, and the characters act like they should. In CA:TWS, pretty much every single move Bucky makes is a killing strike, if Steve doesn't block or dodge it. The actor's not aiming to the side or above Chris Evans' head; they practiced to do the moves RIGHT. And Steve is mostly focusing on defense and disabling. It's a distinction you can SEE, just in how they carry themselves in the fight. It looks natural, with everyone acting more or less as they should.

The prequel fights are dances with glowsticks, where they never strike at their enemy, just their weapon. They look completely fucking ridiculous.

It's why we got this kind of bullshit;

[MrTharne]

The prequel fights are dances with glowsticks, where they never strike at their enemy, just their weapon. They look completely fucking ridiculous.

It's why we got this kind of bullshit;

What are you talking about ? They are obviously building momentum to make a powerful strike. /s

[Frontenac]

The prequel fights are dances with glowsticks, where they never strike at their enemy, just their weapon.

What's the difference with the original trilogy duels? I mean, it's in the nature of that kind of weapon to rarely hit. Because when it does, you usually lose a limb. I believe the sequel is the first time we actually see someone get only superficially wounded by a lightsaber.

[Fabinas]

The prequel fights had no emotional resonance, just flash. That easily makes them the worst fights in the series. They never hit anything, and when they did, the lightsabers practically bounced off each other. What we saw in the OT was this idea that the lightsaber was a knight's weapon. Heavy, two-handed, taking years of mastery to even get a downstroke right. When Vader and Obi Wan clashed, or when Luke and Vader clashed, you felt the weight of the blades against each other. The blades actually seemed to flex, and bend under the weight of the stroke.

Not to mention that the emotional impact behind those fights - mentor vs apprentice, son vs father - far outweighed anything the prequels did. Even the fight between Anakin and Obi Wan in episode 3 felt flat, but that had more to do with Anakin's ridiculous heel turn, Hayden's poor acting, and the dumbass amounts of CGI trying to make up for a fight which should have been simple, close-shot, between two men who considered each other brothers.

The new trilogy has tried to compromise on these two differing views. They have some of the flash of the prequels, especially from Rey as the movies go along, but the weightiness of Kylo's pommeled lightsaber. When their sabers clash, you can feel the impact. And there is always some sort of emotion there, especially from Adam Driver, because he's probably the best actor in the damn trilogy right now. You can feel Kylo Ren's rage, in his fight with Luke.

Imagine thinking the ep 1 snooze fest between Maul and the Jedi was a better lightsaber duel than Obi Wan and Vader in ANH. That's like comparing Transformers to the Shawshank Redemption.

Are you really thinking that the lightsaber fight style in OT was meant to convey all those things you mentioned?

The only reason the OT llightsaber fights were such was the lack of technology and the prop material they used to actually film the fight. Lucas says so in the OT commentary, that, in the Vader vs Obi-Wan fight, the sticks they used to film the fight kept breaking, if the actors actually clashed them.
The lightsaber fights (and the materials used) in the 2nd and 3rd film of the OT were better, thus we see more elaborate fights between saber users.

While i don't disagree that many of the lightsaber fights in the prequels lack soul and are mostly there for the flash bang, thinking that there was a deliberate meaning about the lightsaber fight filming in OT is just a joke. There was less choreography only because of production reasons. When the prequels were filmed, that stuff was no longer a problem.

That's the point, Yoda would never use a lightsaber. It's longer than his entire body. Lucas was like, "Wouldn't it be cool...." and didn't stop to think whether it would make sense for a Jedi Master who was like 2 feet tall and ancient to need a lightsaber to defend himself. It would have been much cooler if Yoda worked more in force pull, telekinesis, shielding, etc, to defend himself.

In fact, Twi'lek Jedi probably shouldn't be using lightsabers either. That's a workplace accident waiting to happen.

Also, LOL. Yoda's "shenanigans" is actually a lightsaber fight form called "Ataru" and because of that jumping and spinning style is much less used by beings of average human stature (its tiring even when using the Force), but is perfect for small stature beings. Like Yoda.
Lightsaber fight IS traditional for Jedi, all have to be trained to its use (and even construct one), so i find nothing silly about Yoda fighting as shown

Both your posts above are opinions, i know, but they are heavily contradicted by lore and reality (the production problems i mentioned earlier). So, it's just your "self-canon" and not an actual critique.