France highest court declares Valve has to allow re-sale of games.

[Varitok]

Wrong, Blu-Rays being Sturdy Contradicts your points.

No it doesn't. How does that in anyway count as a fact or a thought? It's an opinion based on nothing but "feeling" that blurays are apparently impervious.

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Wrong, Blu-Rays being Sturdy Contradicts your points.

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I did give valid arguments, you just refuse to accept that there is little to no inherent risk in buying used modern games.

You didn't. You said "blurays are sturdy". That isn't an argument, It's barely an opinion.

[szechuan]

No it doesn't. How does that in anyway count as a fact or a thought? It's an opinion based on nothing but "feeling" that blurays are apparently impervious.

"Feeling" it's not a feeling. Blu-Rays are much more sturdy then CD's and DVD's.

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You didn't. You said "blurays are sturdy". That isn't an argument.

Yes it is, as it contradicts your points that there is some "Extreme Hidden Risk" in buying Modern Used games.

[Varitok]

"Feeling" it's not a feeling. Blu-Rays are much more sturdy then CD's and DVD's.

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Yes it is, as it contradicts your points that there is some "Extreme Hidden Risk" in buying Used games.

I am not going to try to argue with someone who just says "it has little to no risks" without any backing of that past "blurays are strong". Please bring better points to the table next time you try to debate my dude.

[szechuan]

I am not going to try to argue with someone who just says "it has little to no risks" without any backing of that past "blurays are strong". Please bring better points to the table next time you try to debate my dude.

Says the person refusing the accept the fact that there is little to no inherent risk in Buying Modern Used Games as Blu-Rays are very Durable.

[Darleth]

Social media and twitch giving free/sponsored advertisement to indie developers in order to promote their games, they are not promoting to their games in order gamers buy their games for 1$, also there is different between paying less money in certain websites like 10%-25% off and paying 1$ for their game, it seems you suck at math.

Nice insult buddy, but no. You seem to suck at thinking logically, because if you REALLY think that you can just resell a game for a DOLLAR after a week, you are out of your fucking mind. If anything, ANY STORE PLACE will have a system in place that will prevent the reselling of new games for less than a MINIMUM price (Paid 70$ for a game? Cant sell it under 60 for this time frame). Those time frames can EASILY BE SET by both distributor AND publisher. If anything, this shit is completely exaggeration.

you seem you live under a rock that most companies now are promoting to digital copies (you know that digital copies are cheaper than physical..right?) and since horny kids that can't wait a day to get it on disc they are following the trend, you know you can't sell your digital copy unless you give away your PS4 or Xbox account... right? This was one of the tactics of the companies to mitigate the reselling of physical copies..download now and play today rather than move your ass to the nearest store to buy a physical copy.

Most of the games if not all of them are being sold digital cheaper than physical, you all thought this because of the different cost of the disc and print out of the box, it is but the main purpose was you to download and purchase the game and lock it to your account. They are willing to sell you the game 55$ cheaper than you trying to sell it after you are done with it...totally went over your head, doesn't it?

Goddayum Sherlock, you found out that physical copies cost money to make! Hey guess what: they still are sold for the same price both physical and digital either way, it doesn't matter. I've NEVER PAID LESS for a digital version of a game, even if I could have bought it physical at my local Media Markt. People following the trend and buying shit on day 1 is a whole other issue, that people made for themselves, falling for hypetrains and other stuff.

Of course you have to sell your account for this right now. I fail to see your point here with your baseless insult. You are so stuck with your goddamn "PEOPLE WILL SELL GAMES FOR A DORRAH ERRRMAHHGEERRRD!", I think you have a fucking problem if you really believe that this will be the case.

...and we want more aggressive methods introduced to the gaming industry because cheap ass kid wants 1$ out of his paid 60$ game.

Those aggressive methods will come either way, it won't just suddenly change because of a law. Companies will ALWAYS want your (the customers) money, and not just a little bit of your money, but ALL the money.

Again it seems you fail at math pretty hard, you are comparing 10% even up to 80% off of a price of a game compared to the sheer amount of copies being sold at even lower price than that, why the hell I wait for summer sale that will drop 60$ game to 40$ when I can buy it from another steam user at 5$. Use your calculator next time.

And again, you rather insult me for being bad at math, while not thinking logically, that both steam and publishers can have restrictions on resells. If anything, people selling a brand new game for a DOLLAR is complete nonsense. Get your head out of your ass and start to THINK logically.

If I ever bought hacked steam account and got stripped away and lost my money this is on me because I knew the risks involved, what I'm talking about is someone buying games from Steam itself legit (bolded and lined for your blind eyes to see) fair and square to find out it was from hacked account, can you imagine the headache and resources from steam support to to dive in this shit.

You thought Blizz and other big companies are promoting for authenticators to our accounts out of love? it was because the sheer amount of idiots were losing their accounts and gear left and right and they have to deal with support to fix these issues.

Ah yes, an account that just starts selling all the games it has - if you buy a game from an account that has its whole library up for sale, MAYBE you should think for yourself and say "huh... thats kinda strange and seems fishy" and rather report the account instead? If you think that this seems like an unsolvable problem, no it is not. If anything, an account that does this is rather suspicious and probably gets banned extremely quickly if enough people actually care to report it.

Yes illogical andy, you figured it out: Blizzard and other companies promote more security, because people were stupid and got hacked. The difference: a lot of companies give you the option for free nowadays, while blizzard sold an authenticator before smartphones were a common thing for most people. Thats a real shocker right here.

If this have been forced on steam, others will have to follow Epic store, Origin and guess what Xbox and PS4 stores, later on, the sales will start to dive on every platform because as I said people will wait for after-sale to buy games. In conclusion, Publishers losing on digital and physical fronts means they will find more creative way to mitigate this..remember when was one of the EA or Activision (can't remember) was talking in meeting about charging players money for relading their gun or ammo to continue playing..guess what ? it seems not funny joke anymore.

your post is bullshit, see how easy it is?

Again, you are missing the point. Publishers will ALWAYS look for ways to make ALL THE MONEY. Funny that you pick the biggest pieces of shit in the industry to make an example, when most of their games in the last 2 years mostly were "behind expectations" in terms of sales and other things, because people started to not give a fuck about EA anymore. It turns out, people already have enough of this shit and if publishers/companies decide to go even harder, it will just hasten their downfall with newer regulations, customers not buying the games and other things. We already see the effect of lootboxes.

If anything, the people who STILL buy those games are to blame. People who STILL invest money into said games are a much bigger problem than the reselling of a game.

[-aiko-]

You already started with a flawed argument because Steam will have zero control over what a game is being sold for. If Johnny wants to sell his game for a buck, he can. That is how second hand markets fundamentally work. The developer will NEVER be able to compete with them. They will always play the game and then when they are done undercut the devs by a few bucks.

After reading the 2012 ruling this is based off of, I don't think that would be how it would work. Here is an example quote from that ruling:

Moreover, a copyright holder such as Oracle is entitled, in the event of the resale of a user licence entailing the resale of a copy of a computer program downloaded from his website, to ensure by all technical means at his disposal that the copy still in the hands of the reseller is made unusable.

See, this can't really be handled by a 1:1 comparison to second hand markets. Digital sales are fundamentally different. I don't see why the courts would not allow Valve to control the activation/reactivation of the licenses on their platform, by requiring users to resell it within Steam, so they can properly control distribution and ensure the original license holder doesn't resell the license but retain access to the software.

If they would be required to allow reselling outside the Steam platform, Valve would still retain a degree of control when it is inevitably reactivated back onto the Steam platform. They can incentivize using the Steam platform to resell and can de-incentivize selling outside of the platform in numerous ways.

At the end of the day though, consumers choose the path of least resistance. I could go through the work of selling my physical copy of Borderlands 3 on eBay, or Craigslist, etc and deal with shipping it or arranging a pickup. Or I can just trade it in at my nearest game store for store credit. Most consumers choose path number 2.

It would be the same for digital games...it's less work than physical selling, sure, but why go through the trouble of finding a buyer, emailing back and forth, dealing with people trying to haggle, when I could instead go to Steam and click a few buttons to resell my copy? /shrug

TL;DR I really think people are overthinking this. I mean, at this point so am I but it's kind of fun to discuss the possibilities.

[kasuke06]

Yeah damn the EU for thinking about consumer rights, the US is so much better where consumers have no rights at all and big businesses can shit on people without trouble...

Yeah, how dare we allow people to simply take their business elsewhere and leave it up to the businesses to adapt or die instead of trying to nanny-state your whole fucking life for you. What's next? Need daddy macron to tell you smoking is bad so we're stealing your right to a slow, horrifying death? Oh wait then we'll need to get rid of that insidious poison known as alcohol! And... you know, you really shouldn't be playing videogames anyways they're just a waste of time when you could be helping others!

[szechuan]

Yeah, how dare we allow people to simply take their business elsewhere and leave it up to the businesses to adapt or die instead of trying to nanny-state your whole fucking life for you. What's next? Need daddy macron to tell you smoking is bad so we're stealing your right to a slow, horrifying death? Oh wait then we'll need to get rid of that insidious poison known as alcohol! And... you know, you really shouldn't be playing videogames anyways they're just a waste of time when you could be helping others!

Good Healthcare and Benefits = Nanny State?

How dare Corporations be held accountable in other countries Unlike the U.S.A.

[kasuke06]

Good Healthcare and Benefits = Nanny State?

How dare Corporations be held accountable in other countries Unlike the U.S.A.

Well, more of "telling people how to live their lives and attempting to force extra rules on foreign businesses" Though I guess you could argue against that last part. Since, for the life of me I can't think of a single french company that's all that international that I personally use.

[szechuan]

Well, more of "telling people how to live their lives and attempting to force extra rules on foreign businesses"

Yeah how dare rules Exist in society.

Bipartisan bill proposes banning flavored e-cigarettes amid vaping crisis

https://abcnews.go.com/Health/bipart...ry?id=65716889

America is a nanny state too?

[Powerogue]

Honestly I had always taken the cheap prices on Steam as a big benefit of the digital platform and this as just a compensating side effect. I was under the impression it was "I have a pass to play this game however I want" rather than "I own this", in the same sense as you don't own your MMORPG character.

Whatever, I'm cool with it as long as they don't up the steam prices to compensate. I don't have friends to re-sell to.

[kasuke06]

Yeah how dare rules Exist in society.



America is a nanny state too?

*Rules imposed on foreign businesses, that they have no say in other than saying hey you know what, fuck it let the EU innovate something other than "ways to feel holier than thou about Americans while resting safe under their implied threat should anyone try anything militarily" for once.

Some people want america to be a nanny state. Their representatives are incredibly stupid, incompetent, and hopefully to be voted out for those facts soon, as the deaths linked to vaping were all black market related and therefore already illegal to my knowledge.

[szechuan]

*Rules imposed on foreign businesses, that they have no say in other than saying hey you know what, fuck it let the EU innovate something other than "ways to feel holier than thou about Americans while resting safe under their implied threat should anyone try anything militarily" for once.

Rules imposed on Foreign Buisnesses like Trade Agreements that almost every country has?

Some people want america to be a nanny state.

Rules = nanny state got it.

[Myr010]

If steam do provide for the reselling of games as a result of this ruling it will be worth looking through for games being resold that are no longer distributed on steam, for example metro exodus.

[Gorsameth]

*Rules imposed on foreign businesses, that they have no say in other than saying hey you know what, fuck it let the EU innovate something other than "ways to feel holier than thou about Americans while resting safe under their implied threat should anyone try anything militarily" for once.

Some people want america to be a nanny state. Their representatives are incredibly stupid, incompetent, and hopefully to be voted out for those facts soon, as the deaths linked to vaping were all black market related and therefore already illegal to my knowledge.

If businesses don't want to be bothered by foreign rules they are free to not operate in those foreign nations.
Sadly for you the EU is a market to large to ignore so companies will follow EU rules because the money is worth the hassle of not being able to freely exploit people.

[kasuke06]

If businesses don't want to be bothered by foreign rules they are free to not operate in those foreign nations.
Sadly for you the EU is a market to large to ignore so companies will follow EU rules because the money is worth the hassle of not being able to freely exploit people.

Yup, they're just going to have to make everyone's lives way more shitty for it, way to go guys, I was enjoying this "businesses have to make a worthwhile product that they feel will convince me to part with my hard earned money" instead of returning to being nickel and dimed to extreme annoyance because they're not seeing a penny of the massive amounts of resale.

Way to go beaurocrats in a foreign country forcing your views on everyone!

[szechuan]

Way to go beaurocrats in a foreign country forcing your views on everyone!

They're not, Steam doesn't have to do business with France.

[kasuke06]

They're not, Steam doesn't have to do business with France.

Here's hoping they do. No refunds, just a nice passive-aggressive note where steam used to be telling them to petition whatever passes for governance there to quit trying to bend the world to their whim.

[Wilian]

Yeah, how dare we allow people to simply take their business elsewhere and leave it up to the businesses to adapt or die instead of trying to nanny-state your whole fucking life for you. What's next? Need daddy macron to tell you smoking is bad so we're stealing your right to a slow, horrifying death? Oh wait then we'll need to get rid of that insidious poison known as alcohol! And... you know, you really shouldn't be playing videogames anyways they're just a waste of time when you could be helping others!

Imagine being outraged for having ownership over the products you buy. What a communistic idea.

[Azerate]

There are of course some issues with the implementation of such a system, but these can all be sorted out I'm sure. Fundamentally this is a consumer friendly ruling and it's how things should be. This is also why all those websites like g2a are perefctly legal and morally okay, because it's our damn right to resell things we purchased.

It boggles my mind there are people arguing against this. You are basically fighting against your consumer rights. It's cool to like Steam, or any other platform, but there has to be limits to your consumer devotion. Respect yourselves and your rights. Just because you were told by a CEO of this or that company that you don't have them, doesn't mean it's true. They don't get to decide.