“Race≠Faction” hopes aren’t dead yet

[Omedon]

Ok so, ding-dong, unfortunately cross faction gameplay is dead, but I couldn’t help but notice that every answer about cross-factionisms at Blizzcon only addressed the idea of “I am alliance, my friend is horde, don’t want to roll alts, what do?” They did not fully address “I like dwarves, buddy likes trolls, want to play on the same side, don’t like playing alts, what do?”

Looking past the fact for a moment that the idea of the alt-less player is pretty much no longer supported in WoW, there is one angle that could still happen within what Ion has said, while still representing a significant change in regards to factional limitations.

Unless something was said that I did not catch, nothing that Ion said to gun down faction mechanical change killed the idea of uncoupling factions from races. In leaning into “agency,” and in confirming that Calia isn’t going horde, as well as basically ending allied races (lightforge undead) tied to BFA stories... there’s still an opening there.

There’s enough room for individual dissension, especially if Tyrande gets louder and Genn respectfully supports her right to her opinion, that “the singular champion of Azeroth” might be put in a position to “declare allegiance” (again, the tag line of BFA) regardless of race... once and for all.

Furthermore, they could simply uncouple faction change from race change, and the whole “they won’t do cross faction because microtransactions” angle is addressed.

I started BFA with a hunch that stories of dissention would lead to faction mechanical change, and while free flowing cross factional mechanics have been shot dead for now, permanent decisions to swap sides, with those sides fully seperated could still be in the cards.

After all... there are still those grey’ed out faction symbols at character select, and patch 8.3.5 to be accounted for.

[cuafpr]

hard pass from me, i don't want core horde races in my alliance might as well not have factions.

[Lollis]

The faction divide at this point is just fucking stupid. They say that warcraft is about war between Alliance and Horde, despite the fact that not only have we stopped fighting against each other multiple times and lorewise fought together for the greater good, but also we have members from both sides who actively want peace.

It's just an excuse from a development team incapable or unwilling to do anything that might disrupt their abitrary line which is just causing one side to slowly die off.

What main game content has actually involved the faction war really? BFA is basically the only time since Admiral Proudmoore's death in Warcraft 3 where Horde vs Alliance has truly made any real difference in the core gamelore.

Vanilla: Battleground factions & Honor System - We essentially fight alone for most of it, and then fight together against the Qiraji.
TBC: Battleground factions, Halaa, various capture points - We share Shattrath and fight against Illidan & Co.
WotLK: Battleground factions, Wintergrasp - We share Dalaran and fight against the Lich King as an army split by an arbitrary line.
Cataclysm: Battleground factions, Tol Barad - Again, we fight against Deathwing

It goes on, each expansion until BFA, the so called faction war has been nothing but a stupid line in the sand which in the end amounts to us fighting together against a bigger foe, every, single, time.

It's ridiculous that the only real faction wars going on throughout WoW's history have been Battlegrounds, and in those you can do mercenary mode so what exactly is the point?

They can keep warmode, hell they can even keep cities off limits for each faction. But at this point there is no logical reason why Horde and Alliance should not be able to group together and there hasn't been one for a very long time.

[Doffen]

After all... there are still those grey’ed out faction symbols at character select, and patch 8.3.5 to be accounted for.

They are probably just for us who can't see the difference between an orc and a Human. Why else would it be there right? Must be the only reason. I don't see them touching Factions or Cross Faction PvE after the answers they gave. They sounded pretty clear on that. And if there was some changes, they would have said so during one of the panels at Blizzcon.

[ChairmanKaga]

They could for group forming do that thing like the PVP Npcs, you talk to someone, it tosses a buff on you and you gain one of the Hallow’s End like masks for an opposing faction race like you are in disguise and voila. As for just a complete breakdown of the HvA dynamic in game with core opposing races wandering through capitals etc. no thanks.

[Kemsa]

There are more chances that they introduce a third or a fourth faction (sylvannas/tyrande) to cut down more the factions to finally find a Equilibrium... than no Faction/race.

This is the World of WARcraft, insisted by Ion. The guy that probably will introduce blue eyes for blood elves in the 40 new customization for them.

[Omedon]

There are more chances that they introduce a third or a fourth faction (sylvannas/tyrande) to cut down more the factions to finally find a Equilibrium... than no Faction/race.

This is the World of WARcraft, insisted by Ion. The guy that probably will introduce blue eyes for blood elves in the 40 new customization for them.

Oh yeah, just remembered (thank you for reminding me) another point that I should have mentioned in my OP:

They’re going deep, apparently, on blood elf customization.

An ability for a bloodelf to go alliance... plus some blue-eyed face options...

I’m not sayin... I’m just sayin!

[Syegfryed]

it should be dead and buried, alliance and horde are pillars of the game, and the game is already damaged enough

[Sialina]

Cross faction PvE grouping is a rather logical step, the alliance in EU is all but dead at this point, so much so that even the lower tier of pugs are getting hard to find compared to if you are on the horde side.

They should not dissolve the factions, they should simply let you /invite your horde/alliance friends to the same group, for PvE purposes only.

What I find really stupid is that we can already cooperate, with WM off we can share the same rares out in the world, horde and alliance side by side, if you want to pvp, you can do it for the opposite faction in case there is a lack of players on their side. The pvp mercenary system should have been the last step, not the first.

Keep cities off limits, keep the 2 factions enemies in Warmode, keep camps and such off limits, quests, everything, just give us the ability to do dungeons and raids together.

[matrix123mko]

it should be dead and buried, alliance and horde are pillars of the game, and the game is already damaged enough

I hate Calia but factions should be buried with her.

[Polarthief]

They are probably just for us who can't see the difference between an orc and a Human. Why else would it be there right? Must be the only reason. I don't see them touching Factions or Cross Faction PvE after the answers they gave. They sounded pretty clear on that. And if there was some changes, they would have said so during one of the panels at Blizzcon.

I'd love to see them say this again in another 2 expansions when the top 100 guilds have 0 alliance ones.

Honestly shocked they're being this stubborn on an issue that's easily fixable.

[Mixxy]

They are probably just for us who can't see the difference between an orc and a Human. Why else would it be there right? Must be the only reason. I don't see them touching Factions or Cross Faction PvE after the answers they gave. They sounded pretty clear on that. And if there was some changes, they would have said so during one of the panels at Blizzcon.

To be fair, those faction symbols are definitely going to be replaced by Covenant icons in Shadowlands.

[Doffen]

To be fair, those faction symbols are definitely going to be replaced by Covenant icons in Shadowlands.

Yeah, why not

I'd love to see them say this again in another 2 expansions when the top 100 guilds have 0 alliance ones.

Honestly shocked they're being this stubborn on an issue that's easily fixable.

I just don't think it's an issue they care that much about tbh. I don't agree with them myself either. But it sounded like they have decided. Can always hope of course^^

[Obelisk Kai]

Ok so, ding-dong, unfortunately cross faction gameplay is dead, but I couldn’t help but notice that every answer about cross-factionisms at Blizzcon only addressed the idea of “I am alliance, my friend is horde, don’t want to roll alts, what do?” They did not fully address “I like dwarves, buddy likes trolls, want to play on the same side, don’t like playing alts, what do?”

Looking past the fact for a moment that the idea of the alt-less player is pretty much no longer supported in WoW, there is one angle that could still happen within what Ion has said, while still representing a significant change in regards to factional limitations.

Unless something was said that I did not catch, nothing that Ion said to gun down faction mechanical change killed the idea of uncoupling factions from races. In leaning into “agency,” and in confirming that Calia isn’t going horde, as well as basically ending allied races (lightforge undead) tied to BFA stories... there’s still an opening there.

There’s enough room for individual dissension, especially if Tyrande gets louder and Genn respectfully supports her right to her opinion, that “the singular champion of Azeroth” might be put in a position to “declare allegiance” (again, the tag line of BFA) regardless of race... once and for all.

Furthermore, they could simply uncouple faction change from race change, and the whole “they won’t do cross faction because microtransactions” angle is addressed.

I started BFA with a hunch that stories of dissention would lead to faction mechanical change, and while free flowing cross factional mechanics have been shot dead for now, permanent decisions to swap sides, with those sides fully seperated could still be in the cards.

After all... there are still those grey’ed out faction symbols at character select, and patch 8.3.5 to be accounted for.

It is dead and buried.

They were quite emphatic on Alliance and Horde and the division between factions being pillars of the game world.

They are not in the business of playing with their words in order to obfuscate some grand reveal, particularly at a major event such as Blizzcon when all cards will be on the table.

The factions and their associated restrictions are going nowhere and it is best people accept this as the state of the game going forward.

[Syegfryed]

I hate Calia but factions should be buried with her.

only if you also want to bury the game with it

[Jimson]

/snip

I know it's been said that you can't kill hope, but man. You are really reaching for your desired conclusion here.

[Pony Soldier]

I'm an altoholic and even I'm in the "end faction divide" boat. I mean at this point in the story it just doesn't make any sense. After BfA it's going to feel more forced in than ever before. It's like they just make up reasons for them to continue hating each other to keep that "warcraft feeling". Warcraft is not the same game as it was 10 years ago when it actually still made sense. Over the years we gradually started working together more and tsrted to understand each other more or so it seemed. You'd think by now, especially in BfA we'd start to fully trust each other and get along.

We spent a good portion of BfA talking about working together for the greater good and all that mumbo jumbo but yet we're going to go right back to each other's throats in the very next expansion? What could we seriously be fighting over now? And it's going to be the same shit as it always has been. We fight each other over some stupid bullshit and then eventually shake hands to a truce and work together to fight a common enemy. How many times are we going to repeat this?

I think now would be the best time to end the faction divide. It fits perfectly with what's going on right now but apparently that's not what they're planning to do. I feel if they aren't going to do it here then they probably never will in the future because everything seemed like it was leading up to finally unifying all races and ending the faction conflicts. If even that doesn't lead to a faction unification how can you top that without making the characters sound like they're just repeating what they already said they wanted to do before?

Unless there's something I'm missing and keeping the faction divide actually makes sense even after BfA then I'll take back what I said but I haven't seen anything that supports this. Then again I haven't really been looking either.

[jellmoo]

only if you also want to bury the game with it

Having these nonsensical factions continue is what's killing the game. Removing them would set the narrative free, and allow stories to have actual and meaningful conflicts. More than just the same lame ass red vs blue storytelling we've had for so bloody long.

[Syegfryed]

Having these nonsensical factions continue is what's killing the game. Removing them would set the narrative free, and allow stories to have actual and meaningful conflicts. More than just the same lame ass red vs blue storytelling we've had for so bloody long.

so, all the problems who re putting this game into the dumbster you think what is killing the game a Faction system that existe since the implementation?

We had meaningful conflicts before, the problem are the writers not the factions

removing we will be stuck with characters of races i don't like, i play horde to do quests and interact with horde races, not fucking humans and night elves, it was one of the reasons i scorn Legion with all my force

[Paperfox]

I think the only reason they're not getting rid of factions is because of the WAR in warcraft, but then there is only a A / H war when the story demands it, so that is a flimsy - at best - excuse. When I think about the story, at some point all the leaders who want to keep fighting should be deposed - after all how many Pyrrhic victories can their society handle? How many times do they need to stick their hand back into the fire to see if it is still hot?