All the progress and 13+years goes down the toilet

[rrayy]

What you earned were memories and experiences, the number on your character screen doesn't make or break that.
If you're this attached to numbers, I am unsure how you've survived the last number squishes we've had..



I just don't understand how people percieve that they're losing something, when they're going to be just as powerful as before, the numbers are just different.
Going from doing 1m damage to a mob that has 10mil hp to doing 100 damage to a mob that has 1000 hp is still the same amount of power, just different numbers, and I don't get why people would be upset about that.

I don't understand why you and many other scontinue to try to dictate how to feel and try to insist your opinions are fact. What you say is meaningless is not meaningless to others. As I said before I EARNED those levels and I ACHIEVED those levels. Now I am losing them. It isn't about power. It's about progression. Level numbers are my progression. Now, over half of what I EARNED has been taken away from me. It doesn;t matter that my power is the same. That is only a means to eventually overpower content and expansion specific. Level numbers show progress over the entirety of my playing time.

Stop trying to dictate to me how I should feel. I don't agree with you.

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If you speed up the leveling to the point where you hit cap in an afternoon, leveling loses any sense of achievement it may have, so you're effectively making the experience worse for everyone else to maintain your 'sense of achievement'.

That's awfully egotistic.

Who said speed it up that fast? Nice strawman.

All they have to do is make you able to level to 130 in the same amount of time they say it will now take you to 60. You don't have to in any way remove levels to make it less daunting. So, I am not making the experience worse for anyone and I am not removing anything from players who don't want levels removed.

In fact, since they think it is too daunting, they never should have nerfed XP gains and herlooms into the ground while increasing XP requirements in 7.3.5 in the first place.

[oland138]

These amps go to 11.

[Gungnir]

I don't understand why you and many other scontinue to try to dictate how to feel and try to insist your opinions are fact. What you say is meaningless is not meaningless to others. As I said before I EARNED those levels and I ACHIEVED those levels. Now I am losing them. It isn't about power. It's about progression. Level numbers are my progression. Now, over half of what I EARNED has been taken away from me. It doesn;t matter that my power is the same. That is only a means to eventually overpower content and expansion specific. Level numbers show progress over the entirety of my playing time.

Stop trying to dictate to me how I should feel. I don't agree with you.

The level numbers aren't progression though, as long as you're capped the actual number doesn't matter. At all.
The last time you ever had to do any meaningful amount of leveling was in Vanilla, every other expansion has been in increments of 10 or 5 levels, which is a pittance and barely takes any time at all.

If level numbers are your progression, which again doesn't make even a modicum of sense, you'll likely just stop playing in SL as Blizzard is going to crunch it down to a lvl 60 cap.

Who said speed it up that fast? Nice strawman.

All they have to do is make you able to level to 130 in the same amount of time they say it will now take you to 60. You don't have to in any way remove levels to make it less daunting. So, I am not making the experience worse for anyone and I am not removing anything from players who don't want levels removed.

In fact, since they think it is too daunting, they never should have nerfed XP gains and herlooms into the ground while increasing XP requirements in 7.3.5 in the first place.

It's already fast enough to where you can get to cap within 20 hours without much sweat, far faster than needed and there's no amount of 'achievement' to be gained from it. When you say speed it up, you do realize that it will be so fast that it's just completely useless at that point.

1 to 60 will be about 70% faster than 1 to 120.
If you make the level cap 130 (which I don't know why, it's getting way bloated), you'd have to make it around 100% faster. Which means that you'll hit 130 within 10 hours of gameplay, meaning about 13 levels PER HOUR while playing at a very casual speed. The majority of these levels won't give you anything, as you can't spread the amount of class content we have over that many levels and still leave it feeling like you're actually progressing.
This is actively making the experience a lot worse for people, since you've just made it completely meaningless at that speed.

Though I will suggest that you'll probably like Runescape, you constantly have numbers go up when leveling skills.

[Xilurm]

A bigger slap in the face is a dead game scaring off new player with 130 levels

I made a new character and started on Teldrassil last night. There were so many people there you'd think it was a new game. Heck, even a hordie came around and was killing the quest npc's for a good hour.

[d00dles]

It's just like when you boot up Mega Man 3 and then you finally realize something is wrong...

What the hell happened to all previous Special Weapons collected in previous games? Also, how come Dr. Wily is always coming back again and again with a new evil master plan, just like ...... SYLVANAS!

[bloodmoth13]

most dont actually give any decent power, just very minor stat boosts that likely wouldnt even influence the outcome of most engagements. Most dont unlock new content nor abilities.
If your in it for the 'ding!' then good for you, but... meh? id rather a more condensed system instead of the thinned out one we have now.

[rrayy]

The level numbers aren't progression though, as long as you're capped the actual number doesn't matter. At all.
The last time you ever had to do any meaningful amount of leveling was in Vanilla, every other expansion has been in increments of 10 or 5 levels, which is a pittance and barely takes any time at all.

If level numbers are your progression, which again doesn't make even a modicum of sense, you'll likely just stop playing in SL as Blizzard is going to crunch it down to a lvl 60 cap.


It's already fast enough to where you can get to cap within 20 hours without much sweat, far faster than needed and there's no amount of 'achievement' to be gained from it. When you say speed it up, you do realize that it will be so fast that it's just completely useless at that point.

1 to 60 will be about 70% faster than 1 to 120.
If you make the level cap 130 (which I don't know why, it's getting way bloated), you'd have to make it around 100% faster. Which means that you'll hit 130 within 10 hours of gameplay, meaning about 13 levels PER HOUR while playing at a very casual speed. The majority of these levels won't give you anything, as you can't spread the amount of class content we have over that many levels and still leave it feeling like you're actually progressing.
This is actively making the experience a lot worse for people, since you've just made it completely meaningless at that speed.

Though I will suggest that you'll probably like Runescape, you constantly have numbers go up when leveling skills.

Then you shjould be complaining that 1-60 is too fast. And no you don't have to make it 100% faster. You take the amount of XP you were going to require for the new 1-60 and spread it out over 1-130. That means going from 1-130 won't take any longer than how fast they want 1-60 to go. SO all that bluster about about capping in 10 hours is completely irrelevant. And you can very easily give out something over every level. You can bring back spell ranks(which would be automatically given out and would be on screen representation of what now all done behind the scenes) for example. There are many ways to ensure you are rewarding the player something at ever leve, but Blizzard is lazy and loves to take the path of least resistance and least amount of creativity.

As it is it is hilarious that they are now saying leveling is too slow after they nerfed everything one expansion ago because they thought it was too fast. They really have no clue what they are doing.

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I mean imagine crossing from Canada to the US and having a meltdown about the speed limit suddenly being 70 instead of 110. Because you know, no one can tell you how you should feel about the number being lower even though physically your velocity didn't change. That makes about as much sense as this thing.

Not even remotely the same thing. In fact, the average speed limit in the US is 70 mph and that 110 in Canada you speak of is kilometers, which is roughly 68 mph. That means you actually have a HIGHER speed limit when you enter the US as you can actually go 75mph on most freeways. Terrible and factually wrong analogy.

[Najja]

I don't understand why you and many other scontinue to try to dictate how to feel and try to insist your opinions are fact. What you say is meaningless is not meaningless to others. As I said before I EARNED those levels and I ACHIEVED those levels. Now I am losing them. It isn't about power. It's about progression. Level numbers are my progression. Now, over half of what I EARNED has been taken away from me. It doesn;t matter that my power is the same. That is only a means to eventually overpower content and expansion specific. Level numbers show progress over the entirety of my playing time.

Stop trying to dictate to me how I should feel. I don't agree with you.

So only the numerical representation of your characters power is how you track progression. The abilities you gain, the talents you choose, the weapons and armor your acquire... those mean less that that little number near your name?

And ultimately, as you've stated numerous times, this is all based on your "feel"ings. All this outrage and foot stomping is cause you FEEL like you're loosing something. When you're only losing a fraction of a part of a section of a characters actual growth and progression. Level, Abilities, Talents, Gear, Boss Kills. Those are all progression and you're all worked up over losing a portion of arguably the least important one.

You've your opinion and we've ours, either way the game will survive and in all likelihood be a better experience for new/returning/alt characters. And honestly I think that's all that really matters in the end.

[rrayy]

So only the numerical representation of your characters power is how you track progression. The abilities you gain, the talents you choose, the weapons and armor your acquire... those mean less that that little number near your name?

And ultimately, as you've stated numerous times, this is all based on your "feel"ings. All this outrage and foot stomping is cause you FEEL like you're loosing something. When you're only losing a fraction of a part of a section of a characters actual growth and progression. Level, Abilities, Talents, Gear, Boss Kills. Those are all progression and you're all worked up over losing a portion of arguably the least important one.

You've your opinion and we've ours, either way the game will survive and in all likelihood be a better experience for new/returning/alt characters. And honestly I think that's all that really matters in the end.

ANd yet you are still trying to dictate to me how to feel and now are being condescending to boot.

[sourlol]

OP and everyone who agrees with him sound like the kind of dumbasses who can’t understand how currency exchanges work

But surely 90 yen is more valuable than 1 dollar, there’s 90 of them!!!

[Dartz1979]

I'll say this when they did the stats/ilevel squishes for the first time listen up very closely NOTHING is changing about your character you will still be able to SOLO older content it's just you will have smaller numbers how hard is it for people to understand this? So you aren't gonna see that you aren't level 120 or doing millions of damage get over it already....i personally like the new change i for one welcome the level squish and change of things.

[Najja]

ANd yet you are still trying to dictate to me how to feel and now are being condescending to boot.

Never said you couldn't feel the way you do, but rather that I believe it to incredibly foolish and loses sight of how the change in all likelihood would be a net positive.

[GreenJesus]

The game has pay-to-win boosts. So honestly who cares what they do about leveling good or bad? The integrity of it was already destroyed.

[Trend]

Not even remotely the same thing. In fact, the average speed limit in the US is 70 mph and that 110 in Canada you speak of is kilometers, which is roughly 68 mph. That means you actually have a HIGHER speed limit when you enter the US as you can actually go 75mph on most freeways. Terrible and factually wrong analogy.

The problem here is that if you understood the analogy you would not be able to hold onto your faux outrage. What an absurd thing to be so caught up with arbitrary numbers and unable to understand that the numbers' only significance is their context.

[Twdft]

OP and everyone who agrees with him sound like the kind of dumbasses who can’t understand how currency exchanges work

But surely 90 yen is more valuable than 1 dollar, there’s 90 of them!!!

I remember back in 2001 when the Euro was introduced... a fuckton of people here in Germany whining how they only have €51.13 instead of their precious DM100. They felt as robbed as some of the people in this thread. As much as you tried to explain it to them, the couldn't get away from FEELing robbed.

[rrayy]

The problem here is that if you understood the analogy you would not be able to hold onto your faux outrage. What an absurd thing to be so caught up with arbitrary numbers and unable to understand that the numbers' only significance is their context.

The analogy was absolutely terrible and not even close to the same. speed in Canada is measured in kilometers and hour while in the US it is measured in miles per hour. Two completely different measurements.It's even stupider when you realize you are actually able to go faster in the US than you can in Canada. With WOW, it is the same measurement. This isn't a conversion. This is an outright removal of levels. The only thing "absurd" here is you and others insistence on trying to dictate to others how to feel while projecting your opinions as fact.

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I'll say this when they did the stats/ilevel squishes for the first time listen up very closely NOTHING is changing about your character you will still be able to SOLO older content it's just you will have smaller numbers how hard is it for people to understand this? So you aren't gonna see that you aren't level 120 or doing millions of damage get over it already....i personally like the new change i for one welcome the level squish and change of things.

Not the point at all. How hard is it for you to understand that people feel like they had something removed when 70 levels that they earned are taken away. It's not about power. It's about progression over the time spent playing the game. We have the right to be upset about that no matter how much you try to dictate to us how to feel.

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OP and everyone who agrees with him sound like the kind of dumbasses who can’t understand how currency exchanges work

But surely 90 yen is more valuable than 1 dollar, there’s 90 of them!!!

Another terrible analogy. There is no conversion with WoW levels. THey are outright removing them. The issue is not about power. It's about progression.

[Lora]

yeah stat squishes i can understand but level squishes are entirely unacceptable. completely bullshit.

[willtron]

I agree, especially after leveling one of every class to 120... what's even the purpose of a new 120 boost if it's getting squished to 50? What the hell level are my level 80 twinks going to be!?

You're assuming that anyone gives a fuck about twinking.

Man this thread is full of people going full retard. It literally makes no difference. Do you ever mid raid think to yourself "huh, I'm level 120" or in the middle of a BG think "this would be much better if we were all a different arbitrary level that doesn't really mean anything".

[Dald]

No progress is being lost. If this makes levels more meaningful, then it's absolutely welcomed.

OP is dOPey

[tmamass]

It's not useless to Blizzard and the folks who have said 120 was a daunting number of levels to deal with. I'm not saying it's some amazing thing, I'm just saying they're doing it for a reason. Disagree with, or downplay the reason all you want, but the reason exists.

you and I know the ONLY reason for the squish to the magic number of 60 is classic.
there is NOTHING daunting about a level number, thats just blizzards strawman argument.

This isn't some nebulous claim, it's pretty well known when they implemented the first stat squish.

Wrong the first stat squish was because of the 32bit client. thats the only reason they did the first one

Because they want it to be 60? All I'm saying is that the numbers for levels didn't get to be daunting until well after 60, there's no reason to think that they won't let it grow to say 80, 90 or maybe even 100 before squishing again.

there is also NO reason to not squish us back to 50 after each xpac.

Levels are a pretty core mechanic in RPGs, this being an MMORPG, they will likely never get rid of them.

so core that blizzard doesnt care about them and makes them even more useless in SL by #1 reducing them and #2 make them go so fast that leveling doesnt matter anymore

Yes there's a reason, but power levels are just a relative number, there's no reason they need to stay the same numbers they are now if smaller numbers are able to capture and show the relative strength/ power.

its a rpg core mechanic also to RISE in power - we dont.

The number itself is pretty arbitrary, it's what that number represents that is meaningful. What the number represents isn't changing with the level squish.

this doesnt make sense either the number is important or it aint. and YES it IS changing. 60 aint 130

This is meaningless drivel and you know it. No need to needlessly exaggerate or hilariously underplay how many players play those games just because you disagree with it or whatever. This just makes you sound ridiculous.

yes downplay the facts all you like but the games you mentioned failed HARD compared to wow and you know it (even if you dont wanna aknowledge it!)

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Not entirely sure why this thread still exists, no one is losing anything by squishing the levels from 120 to 60.
It's literally just a number, your character still exists and everything you've done on it.

if its just a number then why change it? oh the hypocrits are at it again

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If you speed up the leveling to the point where you hit cap in an afternoon, leveling loses any sense of achievement

so you mean like leveling will be in Shadowlands is bad, eh? so why do we need a sqish again (hint: we dont!)

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The abilities you gain

we dont gain anything past 100 anymore and oh wonder we dont gain anything new in sl either.

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I remember back in 2001 when the Euro was introduced... a fuckton of people here in Germany whining how they only have €51.13 instead of their precious DM100. They felt as robbed as some of the people in this thread. As much as you tried to explain it to them, the couldn't get away from FEELing robbed.

could u stay on topic please???