If Tyrande indeed breaks out from the Alliance

[Faroth]

So that's already Anduin, then? I mean, the only time he raised his voice was with Greymane at Lordaeron, he never sounded so angry, not even with Garrosh in War Crimes or Wrathion under N'Zoth's influence.



She wants to punish the Horde too and says, and I quote, "the Horde must pay for its treachery". She also still believes there is a Warchief, who will inevitably muster an army in the future and cause another war. She's definitely not after Sylvanas alone. That's why she's dangerous to the peace Anduin seeks to build and must be kept into the fold.

Thanks for the details. I haven't played since BfA launched and mostly keep up with lore tidbits through here, so I'm not 100% up to speed these days, but after a decade I'm still invested enough to somewhat care about the story, even if night elves have been dragged so long and I think they're going to get another beating in the long run with Tyrande the raid boss.

[Varodoc]

Thanks for the details. I haven't played since BfA launched and mostly keep up with lore tidbits through here, so I'm not 100% up to speed these days, but after a decade I'm still invested enough to somewhat care about the story, even if night elves have been dragged so long and I think they're going to get another beating in the long run with Tyrande the raid boss.

Hopefully she doesn't become a raid boss, but it won't end well for her if she decides to be reckless and start another war with the Horde -- which wouldn't even be a faction war, since she wouldn't have the support of Anduin.

Knowing Blizzard, her future doesn't look bright. But then again, Jaina was basically in her position back in MoP and she survived just fine.

[ravenmoon]

That's not a flaw, that's just being a bad character.

A character that doesn't respond to the forces around him and stays blinded to a fault is either ridiculously obtuse in-universe, or they're just a shoddily written vehicle.

And such people don't exist in real life, including leaders of people?

Face it, you may view him like that, but there are others of good character who would side with him too.. in fact to many.. modern day politicians pretty much go for Anduin's option and believe it is a good thing to do.

the pursuiit of peace is avery nobel and good goal to pursue, worthy even.. but a leader shouldn't give in so easily after the level of aggression and massacre the opposite has done. Yes, you ahve to ask the question when does the bloodshed end, and both sides need to come to terms with loss and actively sue for peace if it is to ever have a chance. But you can fully understand and agreew ith both their stances. Tyrande does give an out though, she is only interested in the Banshee's blood, not in destroying the horde or committing them to genocide.

ofc, when Tyrande learns fo the full plot in teh shadowlands, her view will change, because the information changes. PEace shoudl be possible then.

[TheFirstOnes]

Hopefully she doesn't become a raid boss, but it won't end well for her if she decides to be reckless and start another war with the Horde -- which wouldn't even be a faction war, since she wouldn't have the support of Anduin.

Knowing Blizzard, her future doesn't look bright. But then again, Jaina was basically in her position back in MoP and she survived just fine.

She's not going to be a villain. She's a major factor in the Ardenweald story, and apparently, we're going to aid her in learning a lot more about Elune and who she truly is.

[Mehrunes]

The reason they couldn't beat Nathanos is because he's a stupid self insert Mary Sue, plain and simple. Lore wise, he's nothing more than an undead boi who knows how to use a bow and that's it. Tyrande should have no problem dealing with him, even before she became the Night Warrior. But the writers love Nathanos and his banshee waifu too much, so they couldn't let Tyrande beat him.

Tyrande's biggest offensive achievement prior to becoming the Night Warrior was shooting the bridge she stood on and almost drowning in the process. And we have no point of reference for how strong a Night Warrior is supposed to be.

Imagine what would happen if she actually rightfully wanted all of the Horde to pay for the genocide that they participated in. It would make the Blood Elf player cries about Dalaran look like a joke. (Which it already is, but still.)

Yes, ethnic cleansing is truly a joke.

[Yarathir]

Tyrande's biggest offensive achievement prior to becoming the Night Warrior was shooting the bridge she stood on and almost drowning in the process. And we have no point of reference for how strong a Night Warrior is supposed to be.




Yes, ethnic cleansing is truly a joke.

Yes, five shopkeepers, four of which attacked and incurred retaliation is surely the tragedy of our time.

But stop complaining about Teldrassil, it's been over a year already.

- - - Updated - - -

And such people don't exist in real life, including leaders of people?

Face it, you may view him like that, but there are others of good character who would side with him too.. in fact to many.. modern day politicians pretty much go for Anduin's option and believe it is a good thing to do.

the pursuiit of peace is avery nobel and good goal to pursue, worthy even.. but a leader shouldn't give in so easily after the level of aggression and massacre the opposite has done. Yes, you ahve to ask the question when does the bloodshed end, and both sides need to come to terms with loss and actively sue for peace if it is to ever have a chance. But you can fully understand and agreew ith both their stances. Tyrande does give an out though, she is only interested in the Banshee's blood, not in destroying the horde or committing them to genocide.

ofc, when Tyrande learns fo the full plot in teh shadowlands, her view will change, because the information changes. PEace shoudl be possible then.

Dumb people exist in real life, therefore a painfully dumb leader should be taken seriously in a fictional story.

[Moonrage]

They more or less are. But no, she sadly doesn't.

She holds Sylvanas accountable above all-- even she has been made to buy into the scapegoat, and despite that, she's still being considered 'cuhraaazi' by a subset of Horde players because she wants Sylvanas dead just a little more than everyone else does.

Imagine what would happen if she actually rightfully wanted all of the Horde to pay for the genocide that they participated in. It would make the Blood Elf player cries about Dalaran look like a joke. (Which it already is, but still.)

I do think she still holds the entire Horde accountable. Yes she hates Sylvanas more than the rest but it's clear that she doesn't trust the Horde, and thinks Anduin is a fool for believing a truce will work this time.

- - - Updated - - -

Tyrande's biggest offensive achievement prior to becoming the Night Warrior was shooting the bridge she stood on and almost drowning in the process. And we have no point of reference for how strong a Night Warrior is supposed to be.

She had no problem obliterating an army of Horde soldiers, and an entire camp of forsaken after the ritual. It's clear that Nathanos just survived because the writers wanted him to.

Yes, ethnic cleansing is truly a joke.

Again, Jaina was justified in imprisoning the sunreavers, she even only killed the ones that fought back. Ultimately it was Aethas Sunreaver's own fault. He decided to look the other way, thinking Jaina's fury would be less than Garrosh's. And how wrong he was.

[Yarathir]

I do think she still holds the entire Horde accountable. Yes she hates Sylvanas more than the rest but it's clear that she doesn't trust the Horde, and thinks Anduin is a fool for believing a truce will work this time.

- - - Updated - - -



She had no problem obliterating an army of Horde soldiers, and an entire camp of forsaken after the ritual. It's clear that Nathanos just survived because the writers wanted him to.





Again, Jaina was justified in imprisoning the sunreavers, she even only killed the ones that fought back. Ultimately it was Aethas Sunreaver's own fault. He decided to look the other way, thinking Jaina's fury would be less than Garrosh's. And how wrong he was.

Well, there's a difference between being distrustful and holding them accountable. She's not currently going after the Horde. She just refuses to sign a peace treaty so long as Sylvanas is still around.

While she'd be more than justified in wanting to hunt down more than just Sylvanas. She didn't just waltz up to Teldrassil and solo it, after all.

- - - Updated - - -

Again, Jaina was justified in imprisoning the sunreavers, she even only killed the ones that fought back. Ultimately it was Aethas Sunreaver's own fault. He decided to look the other way, thinking Jaina's fury would be less than Garrosh's. And how wrong he was.

This is a so-so case.

Jaina isn't fully justified. You can't just imprison people like that, but I also understand that she did it out of desperation more than anything. She was stabbed in the back (after already having her city wiped off the map and a lot of people she cared for along with it) and she was obviously not willing to let anyone who was culpable get away scot-free. So without any recourse, she made a broad strokes choice to imprison all the Sunreavers she that she could be sure that the guilty party or parties would be held responsible, whether that was only 2 of them, or all of them. But Jaina didn't kill anyone who didn't attack her.

However, one can't say the same about the Silver Covenant. Far as I know, those were feeding Sunreavers to sharks for the fun of it?

[Aucald]

I think it is more likely that Tyrande will continue to alienate and isolate herself from friends and loved ones as she delves deeper and deeper into unreasoning hatred and vengeance, until finally she has only Malfurion left in her corner and is in the process of driving him away as well. She will eventually reach a breaking point, and an intervention of some kind will be staged for her. The end-result will be that she reconciles the Night Warrior within her with the Priestess of the Light aspect of her former self, and there will be a return to a form of status quo when all is said in done.

I don't think Tyrande will permanently break from the Alliance, nor will she initiate a coup against Anduin in all likelihood.

[Newname1234567890]

She wont leave the Allaince she'll be the lore excuse for pvp

[Eosia]

At that point she didn't know that Sylvanas was gonna burn the tree. She thought that the Horde was going to occupy Teldrassil (that was originally the plan, until Delaryn opened her trap and triggered Sylvanas into burning the tree).

So what? What kind of a leader runs off with her boyfriend and leaves her people? Does not matter what she thought the Horde would or would not do. Would you leave your people to an enemy's mercy when you have the time and the means to get them out?

[Highelf]

The Kaldorei suffered a lot of losses as well, also Malfurion did nothing in Darkshore aside from killing a few soldiers to look cool, also Tyrande spent the entire BfA tirelessly trying to retake a charred wasteland called Darkshore. She'd never win a faction war and she'd be alone against Horde + Alliance.

You lose one argument so you just pick right up on another. I admire your tenacity.

[Amaterasu65]

Can I join her as a Stormwindian Human Mage?

[Varodoc]

You lose one argument so you just pick right up on another. I admire your tenacity.

I didn't lose any argument, I pointed out how the Horde is not the only one that suffered losses while at the same time proving that Tyrande would hardly have the advantage if she was the aggressor. Case in point, it took her two entire patches just to reclaim Darkshore.

[Highelf]

I didn't lose any argument, I pointed out how the Horde is not the only one that suffered losses while at the same time proving that Tyrande would hardly have the advantage if she was the aggressor. Case in point, it took her two entire patches just to reclaim Darkshore.

The first argument of your little theory that makes no sense. you dropped that. the guerilla warfare one. So you're right, you lost 2. I suppose you'll turn this in to one as well even though the facts are on the first few pages.

[Varodoc]

The first argument of your little theory that makes no sense. you dropped that. the guerilla warfare one. So you're right, you lost 2. I suppose you'll turn this in to one as well even though the facts are on the first few pages.

Except that he did not counter my argument, because guerrilla warfare is and remains one of the best methods of defending huge swathes of untamed lands, and is actually a great strategy to adopt when you're waiting for reinforcements and need to slow down the enemy. That post only pointed out how guerrilla warfare ultimately couldn't stop the Horde war machine for long.

Has it ever occured to you that maybe I didn't answer that because I had other things to do or think about, since MMO-Champion isn't a job? Thanks for the reminder, I guess.

Also, a "little theory" is better than senseless flame, which is what you are doing.

[Highelf]

Except that he did not counter my argument, because guerrilla warfare is and remains one of the best methods of defending huge swathes of untamed lands, and is actually a great strategy to adopt when you're waiting for reinforcements and need to slow down the enemy. That post only pointed out how guerrilla warfare ultimately couldn't stop the Horde war machine for long.

Also, a little theory is better than senseless flame, which is what you are doing.

See. you're doing it peter.

[Specialka]

Except that he did not counter my argument, because guerrilla warfare is and remains one of the best methods of defending huge swathes of untamed lands, and is actually a great strategy to adopt when you're waiting for reinforcements and need to slow down the enemy. That post only pointed out how guerrilla warfare ultimately couldn't stop the Horde war machine for long.

Has it ever occured to you that maybe I didn't answer that because I had other things to do or think about, since MMO-Champion isn't a job? Thanks for the reminder, I guess.

Also, a "little theory" is better than senseless flame, which is what you are doing.

Just to bing some closure on that argument. You can't stop a massive army with Guerrilla tactics. You can win against an occupation force but not the main army.

[Varodoc]

Just to bing some closure on that argument. You can't stop a massive army with Guerrilla tactics. You can win against an occupation force but not the main army.

But they didn't even win against the occupation force. Or rather, they won after a long drawn-out fight and with the help of Gilneas, which is not a guarantee in this what if, since there is no indication that Greymane is willing to take up arms against what is basically his adopted child.

[Mehrunes]

Yes, five shopkeepers, four of which attacked and incurred retaliation is surely the tragedy of our time.

Because in-game portrayal is super accurate in terms of numbers. Orcs totally all fled to Kalimdor on just three ships too. Because that's what makes sense here, as opposed to Jaina's own proclamation as to her goals for the purge or, you know, understanding what a purge even is (hint: it's another word for cleansing).

But stop complaining about Teldrassil, it's been over a year already.

Am I supposed to be impressed by this strawman? Because for some reason I'm not.