WOW- Now pay to win?

[Xauro]

P2W is old news, OP.

People have simply been buying PVP/PVE carries (where you obtain the loot directly, or you obtain in-game currency, to buy that loot) since very TBC. It was pay to win from the beginning.

Look at ppls above you in this thread. Clearly the answer not that clear. So are you right? maybe in your world! Also i font feel the powerspike is the same. Yes you could buy a mythic run before and get few items but the powersike from them is not even close to the BOE with socket and good corrupt. I could live with it better if the difference wasnt so big. But now i can look at the damage meter and really see what ppls have shit corr and not. Really bad gameplay.

We agree to disagree!

[SirCowdog]

Can you elaborate on this? Not saying you are wrong at all, just never read anything about it

Google "Activision-Blizzard copyright matchmaking tech".

But again, my point was not that Blizzard has access to this technology(because they do, despite it being copyrighted by Activision), or is even using it. It's that they have the capability to have extremely fine-tuned data and technology to know how to best exploit customers and their habits/psychology. Even if you disregard the technology itself(as it's Activision, Destiny2, and supposedly not being used) the research and data that went into developing that technology illustrates my point.

And that point is that Blizzard knows, and intends, to manipulate players into using the token to purchase powerful BOEs by dropping them into the power and progression dynamic of the game.

[Seranthor]

You can buy power for real money. Fact. You can also buy power for gold. Good another fact. What's the point?

What 'power' did you buy with real money... oh wait... you didn't... at best you bought a token... That token has no 'power' attached... its a token.

[Onikaroshi]

Fair point - the difference is the actual raid boss loot can't be sold

Well, I mean... it can be. You just can't guarantee what you'll get from the boss, but you can sell every piece of loot if it's tradeable.

[Seranthor]

But never or atleast very few times..... have ONE boe been so good. 1 item adds like like 20% of your total damage inside mythics? Thats balanced i guess and very good gameplay?

Then crack open your wallet... and buy your win sport....

[Shadowsgrace]

BOE have never been this powerfull that it adds 20% of your total dps or more. Like 1 boe. Could add that. Tell me when? it havent ALWAYS been like that anyway. 100% sure.

I can emphatically say, you are Wrong. During Firelands, for example, Frost DK BiS weapons were Trashdrops. I remember my assistant GM/RL always bitching that they would never drop, and refused to pay the going rate on the AH. So if BiS weapons are not "20% of your Total DPS" idk what is.

- - - Updated - - -

It wasn't the case since Vanilla. No single item could increase your dps by 20%+

- - - Updated - - -



Infinite Stars wants a word with you.

No, but with enough gold you just paid for a Carry in a raid group, this DID happen in Vanilla, and is the Essence of "Pay to Win".

[Linkedblade]

That is a bit stupid as in classic/vanilla you can/could not use real money to buy gold (without using illegal sources). How could buying stronger items for gold be pay to win if you are not able to use real money to buy gold?????

That's why they implement the token system. So people had a legit way to convert USD to gold. That's the point. Either way you do the same thing.

[Xauro]

So what EXACTLY did you 'win'? Here's a hint, not a thing. While you are bombing the thread with your tears, what are you actually going to do about it except sit there and cry? That's right, you aren't going to do anything.

Win? Im not here to "win". I just feel it feels bad that by playing the game less and work more at my job i get me more ingame. My character will be stronger then ppls that play more then me. By simple work 10h extra i get something that could take many 100 hours in game to get. If not very lucky. Not great gameplay. But maybe you dont care about dps...about winning that. But i can tell you that top 2 most downloaded addon are a dps meter on. One of them i mean. Now go think of what this mean!

Good luck!

- - - Updated - - -

I can emphatically say, you are Wrong. During Firelands, for example, Frost DK BiS weapons were Trashdrops. I remember my assistant GM/RL always bitching that they would never drop, and refused to pay the going rate on the AH. So if BiS weapons are not "20% of your Total DPS" idk what is.

- - - Updated - - -



No, but with enough gold you just paid for a Carry in a raid group, this DID happen in Vanilla, and is the Essence of "Pay to Win".

Ok maybe you are right. Dont even care if there is 10 items before this expansion. I still feel its very bad gameplay and P2W. Like if you dont have the items you cant win the DPS meter. OR even get high. In the most cases. Not fun being mile away in DPS and only reason is one BOE.

[Seranthor]

Win? Im not here to "win". I just feel it feels bad that by playing the game less and work more at my job i get me more ingame. My character will be stronger then ppls that play more then me. By simple work 10h extra i get something that could take many 100 hours in game to get. If not very lucky. Not great gameplay. But maybe you dont care about dps...about winning that. But i can tell you that top 2 most downloaded addon are a dps meter on. One of them i mean. Now go think of what this mean!

Good luck!

oh oh you 'feeeeeel it feeeels bad'... What are you going to do about it? Nothing... You are going to continue to give Blizzard your money.
No, I dont care what Blizzard does, because I haven't given them any of my money since 2017

[Wakozi123]

I never thought that I would read the words "pay to win" and "WoW" in one sentence... How deluded can you be to think it is pay to win? I mean, yes... In theory you can buy the item by getting gold with real money and then buy x-item for said gold in the AH. But: No decent player will do so. And that is because of two reasons.

First: Anyone who needs to buy an item for real life money in order to compete with people in regards to dps, probably is just bad at the game. Ofcourse, there is the whole world first example and using real life money in order to buy items probably has happened. But that is a very specific scenario and shouldn't be taken as an example.

Secondly: You all say that it is "so bad" at the moment because the items never increased your DPS by 25+%. This is simply not true. They don't increase your DPS by that %. Infinite Stars is a Simbait. It is the most useles trait to ever exist. Unless, we talk about a pure single target encounter. Which in regards to most bossfight in this expansion isn't the case. I mean look at Nyalotha... Almost all fights are AOE cleave. Besides that, the pure stat traits like "x% more haste out of all sources" are way better because they are consistent. EV has been nerfed into the ground, so who cares about that and then we have TD which is a good trait. But that doesnt make the whole game pay to win, tbh. Also... Pay to win for me means to be able to compete with the best people in the worlds or to yolo throught Nyalotha Mythic by buying overpowered gear with money. You do not do this AT ALL. It literally has 0 impact in regards to that.

This whole thread, in all fairness, is just another example for people crying about the game for the sake of crying. Hate culture at its finest. Or... Probably just someone who gets outdpsed by other people and then blames it on the bad, bad, corruption.

[rhorle]

Win? Im not here to "win". I just feel it feels bad that by playing the game less and work more at my job i get me more ingame. My character will be stronger then ppls that play more then me. By simple work 10h extra i get something that could take many 100 hours in game to get.

You feel it is pay to win because you are making use of what you feel is wrong and pay to win? LoL. The same person playing the game can earn that gold because that is how tokens work. Every token you sell is paid for by someone making that gold in-game. The gold is not created with tokens but transferred. So if you can sell a token to "pay to win" then someone can not buy your token and instead buy a BoE.

[dacoolist]

all limit did was buy bis corrupt and auto won right

On Topic.. It's not pay to win, it's play or die

Totally different

[Niwes]

I see 475ilvl items with socket and good corruption for like 2-3 million on the AH. So now ppl buy wow tokens for real life money and then buy this items...

Is this good gameplay or not? Pay to win?

Blizzard probly happy about it as they earn more $$$


EDIT: What i mean by p2w is win the damage meter. More dps make dungeon/raid/pvp easyer. One with buyed BIS for real life money VS one with no corrupt or a bad one. Who would you put your money on? Who would you like to have in your raid/dungeon/arena. Also my english are pretty bad so sorry for not explaining so all understand. I did my best, sorry.

Apparently Preach Gaming have a video about it.

... NOW ? ...

i think you are a bit late to the cash grab party.

[Onikaroshi]

all limit did was buy bis corrupt and auto won right

On Topic.. It's not pay to win, it's play or die

Totally different

Pretty sure Method spent even more (even going so far as to pay for transfers) and they totally got WF because of that right? haha... yea, skill still matters a shit load more than the gear.

[Relapses]

Pretty sure Method spent even more (even going so far as to pay for transfers) and they totally got WF because of that right? haha... yea, skill still matters a shit load more than the gear.

Method dropped about 250 million while Limit dropped 400 million. How much of that can be attributed to Method simply having better connections is anybody's guess. But neither guild used WoW tokens to buy the gold so it's kind of pointless to talk about it.

[Donimic]

You could always buy BOEs for money, so either wow has always been p2w or never.

buying BoE’s has been a thing since
Classic so if that’s your metric then the game has always been P2W.

Tokens for real money is a fairly new thing, so while you could make a 3rd party deal to purchase items for $ it was against the ToS making. Its when there is a methodology supported by blizzard for MAJOR spikes in power that an issue arises.

[Tatahe]

You could always buy BOEs for money, so either wow has always been p2w or never.

When I used to play (from WotLK til mid BfA) you almost never were able to buy end game pieces. Even if you got a mythic titanforged socketed leech piece on the AH it was like a small 3-4% upgrade on that slot, not even a 1% dps increase. And most of the time those pieces were boots, bracers, gloves, nothing relevant.

[Alvito]

is there anyone apart from guilds trying to compete for world first like Method or Limit actualy wiling to spend some 80-120euro to buy single item?
if so, i pity the fool

Never mind the server transfer fees to go and grab them. Look at class discords on 3 different ones I have seen people asking for add ons or websites to track multiple server AH so they can buy boes. Which is just pure insanity at this point the race is over, some do still want things for high end mythic plus and arena.

[Xauro]

You feel it is pay to win because you are making use of what you feel is wrong and pay to win? LoL. The same person playing the game can earn that gold because that is how tokens work. Every token you sell is paid for by someone making that gold in-game. The gold is not created with tokens but transferred. So if you can sell a token to "pay to win" then someone can not buy your token and instead buy a BoE.

well in OP i didnt say its pay to win. Where? i ASKED if it is. But if you now ask me i say its very close to it. And so does preach and other streamers and ppls in this thread think. Maybe all of us are wrong and you are right. Could be! And my point was really it dosnt feel good that you depend on luck. Get good corr gear else your dps suck compared to ppls with luck. Could even be like you put 200 hours in playtime...someone put 100h . But he have more luck and does 20% more dps then you becuz 1 item. Balanced and good gameplay?

- - - Updated - - -

... NOW ? ...

i think you are a bit late to the cash grab party.

Its more so then ever. Alot bigger powerspike from ONE item. And yes some dont even agree with me. So cleary its not clear as you(and me) see it. Read the thread and you get what i mean.

[D3cadent]

Rank 1 world (in every class, not just mage) mage currently on Ra'den, not a single point of corruption damage https://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports...done&source=16

Lmfao. Love it when people make these posts.