Mega-Thread: Trump Focused Discussion

[Skroe]

https://twitter.com/CarolLeonnig/sta...343152133?s=19

Putin has Trump so pussy whipped that he didn't want help from an allied country.

Screwing America to own the libz.

[Captain N]

Screwing America to own the libz.

He didn't have to stand in the middle of 5th Avenue and shoot someone to lose support. He just downplayed a pandemic that will likely kill thousands (maybe a million) Americans and still not lose support.

[Zan15]

And to further undercut what you're saying, I've said on MANY occasions I'd be perfectly fine if the country severely cut its defense budget SO LONG AS it has the policy discussion FIRST. If it wants to spend $300 billion on defense, it should have a defense strategy sized for $300 billion. What it should not do is have a $300 billion budget trying to impliment a $800 billion policy. Does that sound militarist or unreasonable to you? Because it sounds like prudent governance to me.

BTW please stop calling it only 800 billion. its closer to 1.3 trillion. We've already been over this with the ancillarty charges, associated programs, benefit programs, service on the US debt related to the military budget...etc etc.

- - - Updated - - -

Before I answer this point by point, let me ask, why do YOU think it increases every year? Functionally, how does it happen?

Votes.

I saw your other response but you left out that one point. Fucking votes.

Just like Medicare if you touch it, its toxic to the boomer and their parents generation.

Good thing that over the next few decades this will be less of a factor and we can actually go off the needs of society instead of worrying about just saving their jobs

[Skroe]

BTW please stop calling it only 800 billion. its closer to 1.3 trillion. We've already been over this with the ancillarty charges, associated programs, benefit programs, service on the US debt related to the military budget...etc etc.

Okay now do the same to entitlements.

We can _all_ have fun with numbers if you want to play this game. This rabbit hole will go very very far. We can extended it down to state and local too. So we can hold hands and skip down it together, or we can keep it straightforward and just point to the top line where the comparison is most straightforward and represents the annual budgetary process negotiated and written by distinct committees.


And regardless, my point stands. You want UBI? Hell.. you want a anything... M4A, childcare, a ham sandwich on some rye... the "I'm an uninformed forum poster who just want to emote" approach is "YEAH LETS CUT THE DEFENSE BUDGET! IT'S A BLOATED MESS!". The sophistcated, factually correct approach is to recognize the bipartisan budget consensus that's seen 5 (soon 6) budgets fly through both houses of Congress and got signatured from Obama and Trump despite changes in control to the White House and Senate, budgets that have increased defense and nondefense discretionary spending almost 1:1 by hundreds of billions, and ask "how can I fold my want into this framework."

Want to go against that? M4A will be "your wall". UBI will be "your wall". Your am sandwich on rye will be "your wall".

You've been educated. Be better.

- - - Updated - - -

Votes.

I saw your other response but you left out that one point. Fucking votes.

Just like Medicare if you touch it, its toxic to the boomer and their parents generation.

Good thing that over the next few decades this will be less of a factor and we can actually go off the needs of society instead of worrying about just saving their jobs

I'm unclear. What votes are you referring to? Elections? Or votes in the legislature by Senators and Congressmen.

Because if it is the former, you're in for a big surprise. A congressman and Senator's principal job is to maximize their share of the federal money they can bring back to their states. Military contracts are a major source of that. The Demcocratic Senator from Virginia that votes against ship building and pushes to cut federal funding for that will not be a Senator for much longer when there are layoffs at Newport News, and everyone connected to that industry.

[Zan15]

Must be killing trump that he now has to bail out companies like the BushObama bailout plans did.
Oh that is going to be fun roasting him on those!!!


BTW what did airlines, casino's, banks, ect do with all those billions in tax savings? Did they beef up their reserves? Pay down debts? Better their overall financial positions...
LOL, i know none of the above...they fed the rich.


I just wonder how much this time we are going to lose vs actually turning a profit on bailouts.
i think it could be in the hundereds of billions with republicans being so generious to corproations in this administration

[Breccia]

Must be killing trump that he now has to bail out companies like the BushObama bailout plans did.

I know he wants to, but can he? I think he needs a bill to sign. I don't think that bill exists yet.

I agree with the irony that the tax cut for the rich gave these companies vast profits which they used for stock buybacks -- see other thread for how that worked out for them -- and now the airline industry is asking for $50 billion of socialist handouts, more than the farmers have gotten.

And just so we're clear, I'm actually okay keeping these job-producing companies alive. I just want it on the record that there are people who voted against or otherwise called out Obama for doing this, and who are about to give socialist handouts themselves. They just need to admit they're hypocrites.

[Zan15]

Okay now do the same to entitlements.

We can _all_ have fun with numbers if you want to play this game. This rabbit hole will go very very far. We can extended it down to state and local too. So we can hold hands and skip down it together, or we can keep it straightforward and just point to the top line where the comparison is most straightforward and represents the annual budgetary process negotiated and written by distinct committees.

.

Never did i say we shouldn't also be cutting the fat on entitlements. did i?

Medicare benefits should be cut to hell since the participants did not pay in full for the program. They get over 300 billion dollars a year from the general fund for a program that was supposed to be paid for fully by employment taxes. CUT CUT CUT. Sorry boomers you fucked up when your elected pols stopped incremental increases in employment taxes in the 1990's and never touched them again
Funny how this bucket of people is the ones most against M4A because of 'other people's money... ra ra socialism....


Outside of Service on the debt no entitlement program has programs outside of their main budget except for Medicare which uses the IRS to collect taxes but that expense is also the same for the military just on a smaller scale since it does not require individual managment of person to person.

Unless you have something on the level of 200+ billion dollar VA program for entilements, or programs like the NSA...??

And regardless, my point stands. You want UBI? Hell.. you want a anything... M4A, childcare, a ham sandwich on some rye... the "I'm an uninformed forum poster who just want to emote" approach is "YEAH LETS CUT THE DEFENSE BUDGET! IT'S A BLOATED MESS!". The sophistcated, factually correct approach is to recognize the bipartisan budget consensus that's seen 5 (soon 6) budgets fly through both houses of Congress and got signatured from Obama and Trump despite changes in control to the White House and Senate, budgets that have increased defense and nondefense discretionary spending almost 1:1 by hundreds of billions, and ask "how can I fold my want into this framework."

Want to go against that? M4A will be "your wall". UBI will be "your wall". Your am sandwich on rye will be "your wall".

You've been educated. Be better.

you are a perfect example of why this country can't balance a budget. Everyone has their "thing" they don't want touched. Military. Medcare. Medicaid. Etc etc. No one side is willing to compromise. They think they are 120% right and there is no way their thing can be cut.

I'm unclear. What votes are you referring to? Elections? Or votes in the legislature by Senators and Congressmen.

Because if it is the former, you're in for a big surprise. A congressman and Senator's principal job is to maximize their share of the federal money they can bring back to their states. Military contracts are a major source of that. The Demcocratic Senator from Virginia that votes against ship building and pushes to cut federal funding for that will not be a Senator for much longer when there are layoffs at Newport News, and everyone connected to that industry.

Votes from local elections to presidental elections. Votes for them to keep their jobs. You come out against a few key topics/area's you are toast. Military, SS, Medicare to name a few.

You do know military contract spending could be replaced with whatever else we spend the money on right?

Perfect example is funding M4A at the federal level and states would get a fucking windfall of billions to tens of billions to hundereds of billion dollars they no longer need to budget for. Can you imagine what states could do with an extra 25-35 billion dollars like NY and CA? Even small states would get billions. 222 billion last year.
Virginia you say? 5 billion...five...
This is before we even calculate the savings on moving all state employees to M4A.

[Dontrike]

https://www.vanityfair.com/news/2020...ovid-19-danger

This is why you don't have family in the White House.

He has no one to attack, no one to truly blame, and most of all this is something his conman history did not prepare him for; something that he cannot escape with his usual tricks. This is serious and no amount of lying is going to fix this, he now has to act like a president and a fucking normal adult to figure out a plan. Unfortunately for America he has no plan and we're just now seeing him try to bring back the hamster on the wheel that is his brain to life, but it died long ago.

[Paranoid Android]

Trump administration seeks roughly $850 billion in emergency stimulus to confront coronavirus economic fallout https://t.co/m6dhlJCiec

https://twitter.com/washingtonpost/s...341451271?s=19

Hahaha! I really want to leave it at that.

So this on top of tax breaks? Yes we can say this is a 'act of God' but Trump spends money like a drunk sailor.

[Dontrike]

https://twitter.com/washingtonpost/s...341451271?s=19

Hahaha! I really want to leave it at that.

So this on top of tax breaks? Yes we can say this is a 'act of God' but Trump spends money like a drunk sailor.

So essentially $2.5 trillion given to companies. I wonder if we'll ever see any of that money back.

[Daelak]

https://twitter.com/washingtonpost/s...341451271?s=19

Hahaha! I really want to leave it at that.

So this on top of tax breaks? Yes we can say this is a 'act of God' but Trump spends money like a drunk sailor.

Do you think all the piece of shit conservatives in government are having a moment of introspection after their tax cut now that our deficit will double in size in less than 1 quarter in 2020?

No, they won't, because they don't give a shit about the United States, they only care about pursuing agendas that make their interests more wealthy and consolidating their power.

Never take a word a conservative/republican says as face value, not even the blind followers.

[Beefhammer]

Do you think all the piece of shit conservatives in government are having a moment of introspection after their tax cut now that our deficit will double in size in less than 1 quarter in 2020?

No, they won't, because they don't give a shit about the United States, they only care about pursuing agendas that make their interests more wealthy and consolidating their power.

Never take a word a conservative/republican says as face value, not even the blind followers.

Good thing most here aren't taken seriously. I just wish everyone else would put them on ignore and stopp giving them credibility, especially a certain Mod that constantly engages with dishonest poster and trolls.

[Paranoid Android]

Do you think all the piece of shit conservatives in government are having a moment of introspection after their tax cut now that our deficit will double in size in less than 1 quarter in 2020?

No, they won't, because they don't give a shit about the United States, they only care about pursuing agendas that make their interests more wealthy and consolidating their power.

Never take a word a conservative/republican says as face value, not even the blind followers.

Well we all remember the Tea Baggers. They came to D.C. to stop all this bailout money (Well, we know why they really went there, to stop the black President) and I'm sure they will scoff at this.

Again, overall big picture this is an "Act of God" and likely money needed. Let's really look at what this bill is I'm pretty sure. Most money will go to corporatins, who got the massive tax cuts. Little to people who need it the most, mainly service people who barely make a living and now suffering more, etc.

As far as your statement about he conservative movement, of course. Once again we all know what was coming before coronovirus, when the new President was facing this massive run-up debt by Trump. We gotta cut social programs, Dems spending is out of control, etc. Hey, its the game the run and about 50% of the people fall for it everytime.

[Breccia]

Do you think all the piece of shit conservatives in government are having a moment of introspection after their tax cut now that our deficit will double in size in less than 1 quarter in 2020?

A couple of thoughts:

1) The Party of Trump will now try to blame the record-breaking deficit on the coronavirus. They will try to handwave how much the deficit grew before Jan 1, 2020.

This is unacceptable. If you spent all your money on Pokemon cards and then your car's engine falls out, you're not broke because of the auto repair. You were already broke. And you need to admit it.

2) To me, the most realistic way to pay for the upcoming socialist bailout to companies (and my thoughts on that can wait) is to reverse our largest recent expenditure: selling our Pokemon cards. I mean um, reversing the tax cut for the rich.

It wasn't giving us useful results anyhow. And we need that money back. Besides, if we're going to bail out companies, it makes sense for them to repay the taxpayers -- slowly over time, of course.

Now, if one of those "just give every American $XXX" goes through, which I still don't think makes sense, then raising personal taxes to have individuals repay it would make sense. But I don't believe that's going to happen.

- - - Updated - - -

It looks like there are two major approaches on the subject:

1) Schumer has proposed a $750 billion stimulus package.

2) Trump has proposed a $850 billion tax cut.

Yes, Trump is still sticking with the payroll tax cut which still makes minimal sense. Someone sick now isn't going to get better with $20 a week. Someone who isn't working -- because their business is closed for example -- isn't paying payroll taxes because they're not working.

Expect more details of both shortly.

[CastletonSnob]

I predict the coronavirus won't significantly hurt Trump's approval rating.

[Breccia]

Adding to the list:

1) The Fed will start buying bonds from companies that are in real trouble.

The Fed on Tuesday revived a facility last used during the 2007-08 crisis and recession to buy bonds from companies facing severe financial distress that would otherwise be creditworthy.

The Fed’s Commercial Paper Funding Facility (CPFF) will buy three-month bonds from companies with strong credit ratings to help those firms retain workers and handle operating costs amid a likely nosedive in consumer spending. The facility will be run through the Federal Reserve Bank of New York and backed by $10 billion in credit protection from the Treasury Department.

“Commercial paper markets directly finance a wide range of economic activity, supplying credit and funding for auto loans and mortgages as well as liquidity to meet the operational needs of a range of companies,” the Fed said in a statement.

“By ensuring the smooth functioning of this market, particularly in times of strain, the Federal Reserve is providing credit that will support families, businesses, and jobs across the economy.”

As always, buying a bond is supposed to be an investment. If these companies survive, they're supposed to pay the Fed back. If not, everyone loses. Of course, these companies are in trouble for reasons

Also why should we bail out airlines?.

covered in this post.

2) 13 GOP Senators wrote to MBS, begging for them to call off the oil war with Russia.

As the United States and the rest of the world—including the Kingdom of Saudi Arabia—are dealing with COVID-19 pandemic response, mitigation and prevention efforts, the added impact of unsettled global energy markets is an unwelcome development.

It was greatly concerning to see guidance from the Kingdom’s energy ministry to lower crude prices and boost output capacity. This has contributed to a disruption in global oil prices on top of already hard-hit financial markets.

We urge the Kingdom to assert constructive leadership in stabilizing the world economy by calming economic anxiety in the oil and gas sector at a time when countries around the world are addressing the pandemic

Now, maybe I'm way off, but I was under the impression a trade war was supposed to hurt. I mean, Team Trump has been saying how many billions China is paying us HARDEE HAR HAR and how much their economy is sinking. The term "war" is right there. I get that the GOP doesn't like that things are tanking under Trump's watch, but that's not really the Saudi's problem, is it? Also, expect the messenger to be ambushed and killed.

[Drutt]

Fellow millennial, it's finally our time. WE HAVE THE POWER. WE CONTROL THE DESTINY OF THE FOX NEWS VIEWING AUDIENCE.

Wield this power wisely, my compatriots, for we know our time wielding it is short.

Boomers, just one more thing the Millennials will kill.

[Beefhammer]

https://twitter.com/CarolLeonnig/sta...343152133?s=19

Putin has Trump so pussy whipped that he didn't want help from an allied country.

But the orange turd said the US was out ahead of this early and the virus is under control. How is that possible if we aren't testing people? Magaholes how do you defend this shit?

[Edge-]

https://www.propublica.org/article/f...ighters-corona

In a 27,000-member private Facebook group for first responders who support President Donald Trump, firefighters and paramedics have posted thousands of comments in recent weeks downplaying the coronavirus pandemic that they are responsible for helping to handle.

Posts in the group, which is called IAFF Union Firefighters for Trump and has been endorsed by Trump, scoffed at the seriousness of the virus, echoing false assertions by Trump and his allies comparing it to the seasonal flu. “Every election year has a disease,” read one meme, purporting to be written on a doctor’s office whiteboard. “This is a viral-pneumonia being hyped as The Black Plague before an election.”

Cool, so thousands of first responders and medical professionals, who all just happen to support Trump, somehow believe this is all overblown and it's basically the flu.

Where on earth would they ever get that idea?

This is increasing the evidence that supporting Trump is a disease of the mind.

- - - Updated - - -

I like the part where Trump says he felt it was a pandemic before anyone called it a pandemic. Because, you know, he certainly never said anything to dispute that. Certainly not in public. Nope.

So nice of them all to crowd that small stage. God forbid they actually try this social distancing thing. But be the word "social" that trips them up. Bet it is linked to socialism!

https://twitter.com/atrupar/status/1239957114254233601

Heh, glad I wasn't the only one that noticed that the reporters are at least paying attention to medical advise. They've each got at least one chair between them and the next person.

[D Luniz]

I like the part where Trump says he felt it was a pandemic before anyone called it a pandemic. Because, you know, he certainly never said anything to dispute that. Certainly not in public. Nope.

So nice of them all to crowd that small stage. God forbid they actually try this social distancing thing. But be the word "social" that trips them up. Bet it is linked to socialism!

As long as he has people willing to carry water for him, he'll keep doing.