9.0 General Discussion

[Lahis]

What people are forgetting is that Ysera still got sent to Ardenweald. As none of the creatures seem to know who Ysera is that means that this is her first rodeo in Ardenweald and Elune + Arbiter is directly responsible for making that happen.

Elune doesn't seem to be able to save people from death, but she can help them. Jailer is likely responsible for why she couldn't save the Teldrassil victims (as they got chucked into the Maw) and implies his cosmic power is on par with hers (which has big implications, seeing as she is probably the biggest god yet).

During the questline the caretakers says that Ysera was amongst the last souls to come to Ardenweald before the anima drought began. So she got there naturally, but shortly after that the Arbiter got shut down. Could Sylvanas' deal with Helya have something to do with it?

As for Ysera's first time in Ardenweald: well duh, she hasn't died before. She was born as a Proto-Drake in ancient Azeroth and uplifted into a Dragon Aspect by the titans several dozen millennia ago.

[EbaumsTipster]

If night elves get paladins, then what does the Horde get? They can't have another shaman race because no one else makes sense(unless they do Belf shamans which is...weird but I guess not so unheard of since there's at least one high elf "druid"). Giving them another paladin race might make sense but who? Nightborne? Trolls would be a good candidate, since they could be "shadow hunters" but if they did that, I would hope they start doing thematic paladin skills(Tauren/blood elf get sun themed skills, trolls/night elves get night/shadow themed spells, humans, dwarves, and draenei keep light themed)

Vol'jin is getting reborn in Ardenweald with an essence of Rezan inside him. Between that and their shared culture with Zandalari it might push them into Paladins.

Forsaken are clearly getting a revamp to some extent (I don't think it'll be dramatically different) but seeing as Calia is a light figurehead and they can already be Priests (although it hurts them) it would make sense if they could become paladins as a kind of atonement for all their previous bullshit. Also makes them more in tune with their old Lordaeron image. (Also, just realized, some kind of poetic irony that they are paladins as well as their previous allies the Tauren and Blood Elves)

If Night Elves get Paladin it makes sense for Worgen to follow, so then you get 2/2 paladins. Makes sense to me.

[gunner_recall]

Oh shit, I forgot Zandalari even existed.

And Calia.

...and Worgen.

[Hellspawn]

While she didn't save them, she did grant Astarii and everyone else stuck in the temple of Elune a painless death.

And then directly into the maw after that painless death what a treat!

[EbaumsTipster]

And then directly into the maw after that painless death what a treat!

Well, that's why the "Bad Night Elves" exist that piss so many people off, despite making sense. If you went to hell after being murdered you'd probably be pissed off too.

[Hellspawn]

Well, that's why the "Bad Night Elves" exist that piss so many people off, despite making sense. If you went to hell after being murdered you'd probably be pissed off too.

I think its only annoying because they help their murders.

[EbaumsTipster]

I think its only annoying because they help their murders.

With Sira the Dark Warden in the new book and not in alpha so far I think there's a high chance it's a long con for many of them, and she's going to try to get revenge (and fail.) Some like Delaryn might be actually mindbroken/insane.

[Raetary]

Pretty sure Delaryn is with Calia now.

[EbaumsTipster]

Pretty sure Delaryn is with Calia now.

Right, and from her comments on her state of mind she might actually be nuts.

Sira seems in control and tells the players in 8.1 there's a reason she's evil, but won't tell them (because lol can't spoil Shadowlands). Now that we know it's because Night Elves got sent to the Maw it's either that she's genuinely morally bankrupt now or it's a long con to get revenge on Nathanos and Sylvanas.

Or Jailer has some power that makes people eviler like what he did to Sylvanas after Edge of Night, which would be really stupid.

[Hellspawn]

With Sira the Dark Warden in the new book and not in alpha so far I think there's a high chance it's a long con for many of them, and she's going to try to get revenge (and fail.) Some like Delaryn might be actually mindbroken/insane.

You have not followed recent events. Delaryn and most of the Kaldorei Dark Ranger got back to normal, she met up with Calia (Voss arranged that) and will probably follow her somehow, maybe we will even see her in the Shadowlands (unless she dies in the recent book).
Sira hunts Bwonsamdi together with Nathanos (the guy that killed her), not sure how she can get revenge this way. Also I think she will die in the book.

[Raetary]

And then directly into the maw after that painless death what a treat!

Well, we don't really know that.
Elune could've put them in Ardenweald for all we know.


Anyways, not like it really matters.
Knowing Blizz, they have already forgotten about that part of the book.

[gunner_recall]

Right, and from her comments on her state of mind she might actually be nuts.

Sira seems in control and tells the players in 8.1 there's a reason she's evil, but won't tell them (because lol can't spoil Shadowlands). Now that we know it's because Night Elves got sent to the Maw it's either that she's genuinely morally bankrupt now or it's a long con to get revenge on Nathanos and Sylvanas.

Or Jailer has some power that makes people eviler like what he did to Sylvanas after Edge of Night, which would be really stupid.

The Light seems like it drives people batshit at some point, if they end up being a conduit for it.

Like...Turalyon's fanaticism now vs how he was during the Second War(hell, even the Draenor expedition) is completely different.

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Well, we don't really know that.
Elune could've put them in Ardenweald for all we know.


Anyways, not like it really matters.
Knowing Blizz, they have already forgotten about that part of the book.

That would actually be kind of interesting if we find out Elune knew about this shit and she's been using a good chunk of her power to keep her people safe.

[EbaumsTipster]

Well, we don't really know that.
Elune could've put them in Ardenweald for all we know.


Anyways, not like it really matters.
Knowing Blizz, they have already forgotten about that part of the book.

There's been a datamined quest about getting Tyrande from Torghast and she is being attacked by corrupted Night Elf souls. So they all got thrown in there with everyone else (and explains why some became Dark Ranger Night Elves).

- - - Updated - - -

You have not followed recent events. Delaryn and most of the Kaldorei Dark Ranger got back to normal, she met up with Calia (Voss arranged that) and will probably follow her somehow, maybe we will even see her in the Shadowlands (unless she dies in the recent book).
Sira hunts Bwonsamdi together with Nathanos (the guy that killed her), not sure how she can get revenge this way. Also I think she will die in the book.

No, I know what happened. Delaryn is good now but her COMMENTARY (like in that quest) implies her state of mind is not sound and she was genuinely following Sylvanas to kill her former brothers and sisters because she was "lost".

Sira however seems cold and calculated in comparison.

[Aeluron Lightsong]

The Light seems like it drives people batshit at some point, if they end up being a conduit for it.

Like...Turalyon's fanaticism now vs how he was during the Second War(hell, even the Draenor expedition) is completely different.

He's not really a fanatic, just very devoted. If you wanna see a fanatic and or abberation of faith see Yrel which is an absurd questline but we are here. And don't mention Xera, only reason he got mad is because he regards Xe'ra highly and well since we went all the trouble to fix her and then she dies.....well from his POV yeah no shit he's mad.

No, I know what happened. Delaryn is good now but her COMMENTARY (like in that quest) implies her state of mind is not sound and she was genuinely following Sylvanas to kill her former brothers and sisters because she was "lost".

Provided that is the case, I feel like Blizzard would spell it out if she was insane.

[Hellspawn]

Well, we don't really know that.
Elune could've put them in Ardenweald for all we know.


Anyways, not like it really matters.
Knowing Blizz, they have already forgotten about that part of the book.

There was already something datamined about some mad night elf soul blob Tyrande fights in the Maw

I think the souls are there to have a goal for Tyrande/Shandris beside revenge, or have a talk whats actually more important the souls or revenge.

[Raetary]

There's been a datamined quest about getting Tyrande from Torghast and she is being attacked by corrupted Night Elf souls. So they all got thrown in there with everyone else (and explains why some became Dark Ranger Night Elves).

There was already something datamined about some mad night elf soul blob Tyrande fights in the Maw

I know, i'm not saying she saved ALL of them.
I'm saying she saved the few that were stuck in the temple of Elune in Darnassus, as Elegy makes it pretty clear that specifically those were the ones basked in Elunes light.

[EbaumsTipster]

The Light seems like it drives people batshit at some point, if they end up being a conduit for it.

Like...Turalyon's fanaticism now vs how he was during the Second War(hell, even the Draenor expedition) is completely different.

Turalyon is fine. Xe'ra was bad, Yrel is bad with good intentions (and heavily implied to be corrupted by Alt Xe'ra) and the only other really bad Light Guys are the Scarlets who despite having good intentions at the start became more and more paranoid and insane.

Benedictus doesn't count.

People keep saying Blizz has some boner for making the light bad when they've only introduced two antagonists using it since Vanilla. Sensitive playerbase.

[gunner_recall]

No, I know what happened. Delaryn is good now but her COMMENTARY (like in that quest) implies her state of mind is not sound and she was genuinely following Sylvanas to kill her former brothers and sisters because she was "lost".

Sira however seems cold and calculated in comparison.

That's one thing I think a lot of people don't understand and it's something we saw all the way back in WC3: who raises them into undeath matters. Like...I'm not really sure how to explain this but like the person's mental thinking has an effect?

For instance, if someone like...Jaina raised people into undeath, they wouldn't be murderous monsters. They would probably have a significant degree of free will. Or even as an example, Sylvanas in Cata vs Sylvanas in BfA. In Cata, recently raised undead had a degree of free will. They could choose to join the Forsaken or they could choose to pursue their own destiny. Sylvanas in BfA is nah fuck em, dominate.

Does that even actually make sense or is it crazy person rambling?

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He's not really a fanatic, just very devoted. If you wanna see a fanatic and or abberation of faith see Yrel which is an absurd questline but we are here. And don't mention Xera, only reason he got mad is because he regards Xe'ra highly and well since we went all the trouble to fix her and then she dies.....well from his POV yeah no shit he's mad.

Yeah, but his attitude is a LOT different compared to how he was during the Second War.

He went from "yeah, the light's pretty cool" to "PURGE THE HERETICS"

Y'rel is a great example but we haven't seen her enough since the end of WoD to really say if she's like "fuck all y'all"

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Turalyon is fine. Xe'ra was bad, Yrel is bad with good intentions (and heavily implied to be corrupted by Alt Xe'ra) and the only other really bad Light Guys are the Scarlets who despite having good intentions at the start became more and more paranoid and insane.

Benedictus doesn't count.

People keep saying Blizz has some boner for making the light bad when they've only introduced two antagonists using it since Vanilla. Sensitive playerbase.

I'm saying a conduit for it, like you're being used as a vessel of the light like the old gods use people as their vessel. Think Cho'gall: horrible mutations and all that shit because the void was using him as a vessel

Y'rel is a better example than Turalyon, but we haven't seen enough of her since the end of WoD to really say what the fuck she's doing. Scarlet Crusade doesn't count because they're more just religious fanatics than actually being used by the light, so they're just kind of dicks.

Edit: I do agree there's this like weird push for the Light to be the bad guys from the fanbase but I also think that's fair. Like...it kind of emphasizes the idea that there's these great cosmic forces that don't care about us and want to use us as puppets in their war. I think that's honestly a good direction for the game because, and this is probably an unpopular opinion, but a large emphasis since the end of Cata has been Azeroth's agency. The Age of Mortals and all that trash. And I could get really deep into WHY people want the "religion" of the universe to be the bad guys but I want to avoid political/religious discussion about it because to be honest, I'm fucking tired of everything. This week has been an exhausting year.

[Aeluron Lightsong]

Yeah, but his attitude is a LOT different compared to how he was during the Second War.

He went from "yeah, the light's pretty cool" to "PURGE THE HERETICS"

Y'rel is a great example but we haven't seen her enough since the end of Legion to really say if she's like "fuck all y'all"

...He's not purge the heretics, Yrel landed on that far more then Turalyon. He just got hostile with Illidan about it for maybe a minute(Again understandable we helped her only to have her die again). Him being lightforged(Sorta..) doesn't mean he's some vessel for the Light like you compared it to a vessel for the Old Gods. When Turalyon goes *Fanatic* I'll be here to be upset about it...but that day is not today.

People keep saying Blizz has some boner for making the light bad when they've only introduced two antagonists using it since Vanilla. Sensitive playerbase.

Riiiight cause it doesn't mean anything

[Adoxe]

They announced the Sloot interview delay very late, but nobody's delaying anything anymore (to my knowledge) so we seem in the clear for Tuesday.

Yeah... about that.
https://twitter.com/Warcraft/status/1268950734847873024