Shadows Rising Thread [Spoilers]

[Villager720]

Alleria has always had a darkness in her, well before she became enmeshed with the Void. In WC2: BtDP she basically turned into a pitiless Orc-murdering machine seeking vengeance for the death of her younger brother Lirath, so much so that she couldn't even feel anything beyond hate and rage. She was turned from that course more or less through the intervention of Turalyon and Khadgar, but the seed of it is still inside her at the end of the day.

And previously she has flat out stated she knows the Void will take her eventually. So, while concerning, this isn’t “new” foreshadowing - it’s just a continuing thread.

Alleria is a timebomb.

[Combatbutler]

And previously she has flat out stated she knows the Void will take her eventually. So, while concerning, this isn’t “new” foreshadowing - it’s just a continuing thread.

Alleria is a timebomb.

Not just her, the whole doomsday cult she is currently helping to create, the player void elf will never fall, but the "race" itself is doomed.

[Sarethion]

I got to the second "interrogation" scene and... it's legit much darker stuff than what I've expected from a Warcraft novel. Damn.

[Greengrim]

"Anduin is ashamed of who he is."

And who is he???

[Varodoc]

You people focus way too much on prophecies and visions. Did you not pay attention to Legion? The entire point of Legion was to prove that visions should never be taken for granted. According to visions, the Legion could only be stopped by a golden version of Illidan, there was no other way. Velen even said that the future of mortals was never in fate's hands. Just because Alleria saw one vision of herself succumbing to the whispers doesn't mean that will happen, nor that her destiny is set in stone and can't change.

Also, if Visions of N'Zoth are anything to go by, then Thrall is also a timebomb. I wonder why people only focus on Alleria. The truth is that anyone is susceptible to the whispers. Even the almighty titans can succumb to the corruptive energy of the Void.

[Maljinwo]

"Anduin is ashamed of who he is."

And who is he???

A 18 year old that was thrust to lead an entire faction with no time for himself

For reasons

Even the almighty titans can succumb to the corruptive energy of the Void.

Only when they are in their infant state as full grown titans seem impervious to it.
The fact that everyone focuses on Alleria and her merry band of loonies is because they are literally infused with the Void that is constantly whispering to them

But I think that can be discussed in another topic

[reiserfs]

The best part of the book!

[Aucald]

You people focus way too much on prophecies and visions. Did you not pay attention to Legion? The entire point of Legion was to prove that visions should never be taken for granted. According to visions, the Legion could only be stopped by a golden version of Illidan, there was no other way. Velen even said that the future of mortals was never in fate's hands. Just because Alleria saw one vision of herself succumbing to the whispers doesn't mean that will happen, nor that her destiny is set in stone and can't change.

Also, if Visions of N'Zoth are anything to go by, then Thrall is also a timebomb. I wonder why people only focus on Alleria. The truth is that anyone is susceptible to the whispers. Even the almighty titans can succumb to the corruptive energy of the Void.

There is a difference between a vision or a prophecy, and someone knowing their own limits. Alleria is speaking to the latter as opposed to the former. And, as I said, she could be wrong about her own limits - but given who she is and her general experience, it seems unlikely.

[Varodoc]

There is a difference between a vision or a prophecy, and someone knowing their own limits. Alleria is speaking to the latter as opposed to the former. And, as I said, she could be wrong about her own limits - but given who she is and her general experience, it seems unlikely.

Okay, she knows her own limits, cool. Soooo why does that mean that she will succumb to the whispers and there is just no hope to avoid that fate?

A 18 year old that was thrust to lead an entire faction with no time for himself

For reasons



Only when they are in their infant state as full grown titans seem impervious to it.
The fact that everyone focuses on Alleria and her merry band of loonies is because they are literally infused with the Void that is constantly whispering to them

But I think that can be discussed in another topic

Yet Visions of N'Zoth proves that Thrall is also a timebomb who could easily succumb to N'Zoth's whispers.

The actual answer is that some people want the Alliance to be the villains for once, no matter how forced or rushed that might be.

[Cherry123]

Sira says Anduin "you will serve well... "

The boy-king serves at the master's table is back

[Syegfryed]

Lillian Voss has Calia as her advisor and Calia doesn't want to be the leader immediately.

@Super Dickmann, what did i tell you? Danouser is slowly making his move to make Calia the Forsaken leader

Calia is more belligerent than expected.

they are trying to make her more "bad girl" to appeal and more palatable to the forsaken LUL, those guys don't want to admit their failure.

[Combatbutler]

Okay, she knows her own limits, cool. Soooo why does that mean that she will succumb to the whispers and there is just no hope to avoid that fate?

Because Alleria herself is too weak, someone who goes that batshit over the loss of a family member coupled with the void is just a recipe for downright disaster, the next Lirath is just one stray arrow away after all.

[Aucald]

Okay, she knows her own limits, cool. Soooo why does that mean that she will succumb to the whispers and there is just no hope to avoid that fate?

Because there's no other recourse for her. The Void is part of her now, several times over - she consumed the dark heart of a Void entity and absorbed the essence of a darkened Naaru, and she was transfigured into a completely new type of entity as a result. Does that seal her fate utterly? Who really knows, this is the Warcraft universe where anything can happen. But if the status quo persists, she's quite literally telling us "I will eventually go mad because of this power." I think it would be foolish not to take her at her own word.

[Varodoc]

Because there's no other recourse for her. The Void is part of her now, several times over - she consumed the dark heart of a Void entity and absorbed the essence of a darkened Naaru, and she was transfigured into a completely new type of entity as a result. Does that seal her fate utterly? Who really knows, this is the Warcraft universe where anything can happen. But if the status quo persists, she's quite literally telling us "I will eventually go mad because of this power." I think it would be foolish not to take her at her own word.

Plenty of fictional characters make bold statements like "There is no hope for me" or "It is too late for me", only to be proven wrong later on. This is a story, the characters are in the hands of the writers. You have to look at the bigger picture and ask yourself what is likely the writers would want to do with a certain character. Alleria's dark claim could merely serve to set the stage for a character arc where she fights and ultimately overcomes her "fate".

Besides, if Alleria really believed there was no hope for her, why would she even agree to train Umbric and his people? Or at the very least why would she not warn them that their path will inevitably lead to madness and death? On the contrary, Alleria actually gives hope to Umbric and adopts a very optimistic mindset.

[Sarethion]

Anduin to Jaina, when she asks him what Turalyon and Alleria's actions are saying about the Alliance:

"He sounded almost offended that she had to ask. - It says that we will do whatever we must to bring murderers to justice. It says that we will not forget those lost in war. It says we will not forget Teldrassil or Lordaeron. It says that we will not forget the Mak'gora. It says that we will not forget the flames blazing over the Veiled Sea or the fires reflected in the eyes of a thousand mourning children. - His hand closed into a fist, with every word his determination grew. Rising and rising, a crescendo that nearly reached a shout. Then he glanced at her out of the corner of his eye and his voice dropper to a whisper. - There was a time not so long ago, where you were not above swinging the harsh hammer of retribution. I have not forgotten, Jaina. Have you?"

Just leaving it here, because I think some people might like this quote

[Aucald]

Plenty of fictional characters make bold statements like "There is no hope for me" or "It is too late for me", only to be proven wrong later on. This is a story, the characters are in the hands of the writers. You have to look at the bigger picture and ask yourself what is likely the writers would want to do with a certain character. Alleria's dark claim could merely serve to set the stage for a character arc where she fights and ultimately overcomes her "fate".

True enough, but Alleria isn't really bemoaning her own fate with dramatic license, either - she's up front and quite frank about it, giving it the context that she's speaking as objectively as possible about her own chances. Alleria could also be the centerpiece of a cautionary tale for the rest of her people, about the price of power and the consequences of assuming too much of it, especially when said power is derived from the Void.

We can't really know what the writers intend, after all; so we have to use the existing narrative as a contexual anchor. In that sense Alleria's pronouncements should be taken more at face value than as some kind of histrionics, at least in my opinion.

[Greengrim]

A 18 year old that was thrust to lead an entire faction with no time for himself

For reasons



Only when they are in their infant state as full grown titans seem impervious to it.
The fact that everyone focuses on Alleria and her merry band of loonies is because they are literally infused with the Void that is constantly whispering to them

But I think that can be discussed in another topic

He has it much easier than his father did... But anyway, he can't be ashamed for being a leader. He must be ashamed of something else. And I wonder what.

[rogueMatthias]

Okay, she knows her own limits, cool. Soooo why does that mean that she will succumb to the whispers and there is just no hope to avoid that fate?


Yet Visions of N'Zoth proves that Thrall is also a timebomb who could easily succumb to N'Zoth's whispers.

The actual answer is that some people want the Alliance to be the villains for once, no matter how forced or rushed that might be.

Well they don't need to be "villains" because it hurts this game when things are that black and white. The fact BfA started with a full on genocide made it good v bad which hurt the expansion.

&It's annoying that Blizz can't even balance it. "Omg the Alliance is just as bad as hordes genocide because Alleria lightly tortured someone keeping information about a violent war criminal from her, and then felt bad."

Void elves imo SHOULD be treated as a danger. BFA would have been better if Hordes quest for change and redemption was mirrored by Alliances fall while gaining any power they could. Imagine Alliance win the war, with half of Orgrimar sucked into a void portal and Dark Irons giant elementals burning down the Barrens and Anduin is like "holy fuck what have I done?"

[Varodoc]

Anduin just demolished Jaina. God I can't stand her in this novel. Alleria and Turalyon did what they had to do. It was not pleasant, but they had no other choice. Jaina is one to talk when she imprisoned a lot of people in the Violet Hold. She's acting in such a hypocritical way in this book.

Well they don't need to be "villains" because it hurts this game when things are that black and white. The fact BfA started with a full on genocide made it good v bad which hurt the expansion.

&It's annoying that Blizz can't even balance it. Omg the Alliance is just as bad as hordes genocide because Alleria lightly tortured someone keeping information about a violent war criminal from her, and then felt bad.

Void elves imo are a danger. BFA would have been better if Hordes quest for change and redemption was mirrored by Alliances fall while gaining any power they could. Imagine Alliance win the war, with half of Orgrimar sucked into a void portal and Dark Irons giant elementals burning down the Barrens and Anduin is like "holy fuck what have I done?"

That's not what Blizzard said, that's what some players are saying.

It's quite telling that a lot of these people who claim the Alliance will start a war cling to the smallest "evidence". "Alleria and Turalyon tortured a defying prisoner? Damn, I guess Turalyon is gonna go full mode psycho on the Horde. Fifth War hype!!!"

Void elves are as much of a danger as anyone else. Visions of N'Zoth prove that the people of Stormwind and Orgrimmar can easily succumb to the whispers.

[Shandris]

Of course, you don’t see the difference between “ arrest people for interrogation and kill only those who attacked you” and “torturing random people to find out if they saw your sister.” You would first read the book yourself, and then come to the forums. Alleria says she is sorry that she does not regret what she is doing. And in the end, Anduin also ceases to trust her, for she crossed all borders.