Russian Opposition Leader Alexei Navalny Poisoned

[Santti]

So what you're saying is "this is the perfect poison if you want to assassinate someone and get away with it". No wonder Russia uses it all the time. That's useful information, thanks for helping us understand how Russia assassinates people.

Has it claimed it's food poisoning yet?

[postman1782]

lmao shackler you have to stop with the conspiracy theories. four cases one killed, dawn sturgess. By some bumbling gru scumbags who since they fucked off back to russia and are fully protected by the state we can only hope they get the most aggressive ass cancer going.

Some adhoc assasination on Nalvany isnt really much of a stretch given the kremlins operational procedures.

are you reading the grayzone again?

He has to get those turnips.

[jonnysensible]

He has to get those turnips.

nah its being caught in the orbit of information pollution.

you know how all the right wing chuds on here post andy ngo, ian miles cheung and tim pool whenever the post a video or someshit, its like that but shackler is in the mark ames, yasha levine, matt taibbi, john dolan (old eXile crew) information pollution world - which leads into max blumental and dipshits like that.

[Shalcker]

lmao shackler you have to stop with the conspiracy theories. four cases one killed, dawn sturgess. By some bumbling gru scumbags who since they fucked off back to russia and are fully protected by the state we can only hope they get the most aggressive ass cancer going.

Some adhoc assasination on Nalvany isnt really much of a stretch given the kremlins operational procedures.

Noone wanted to kill Dawn Sturges, and noone (as far as we know) used Dawn Sturges's amounts in actual poisonings so far, so it's silly to think they keep using it in under-lethal amounts thrice to kill people (and fail each and every time).

Nothing stopped them from diverting plane, preventing it from landing, adding more poison in hospital, and so on and so on if they wanted him killed.

So... is it GRU taking over politics through force? Forcing German hand to get quick profit and not having to deal with inevitable US sanctions with Nord Stream II? Khodorkovsky or his entourage? (Navalny secretary didn't tell why Navalny was flying in the first place) Prighozin finally perfecting his poison formula he tested in Syria?

Lots of possibilities no matter if you believe it's Kremlin (which also has plenty of factions) or not.

[jonnysensible]

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Noone wanted to kill Dawn Sturges, and noone (as far as we know) used Dawn Sturges's amounts in actual poisonings so far, so it's silly to think they keep using it in under-lethal amounts thrice to kill people (and fail each and every time).

lol what, it causes long term damage.

Nothing stopped them from diverting plane, preventing it from landing, adding more poison in hospital, and so on and so on if they wanted him killed.

lol they delayed the dr's put it was too politically sensitive by then.

So... is it GRU taking over politics through force? Forcing German hand to get quick profit and not having to deal with inevitable US sanctions with Nord Stream II? Khodorkovsky or his entourage? (Navalny secretary didn't tell why Navalny was flying in the first place) Prighozin finally perfecting his poison formula he tested in Syria?

Lots of possibilities no matter if you believe it's Kremlin (which also has plenty of factions) or not.

conspiracys.


likely hood is there is an understanding that whacking thorns in putins side is open season, and that you wont get punished for doing anything to any oppo figure or turncoat even if you are such a bumbling cunt you kill a british citizen.

As we saw in other theaters it seems adhoc. we saw with the troll factories that they werent state run to begin with but when they were viewed as usefuul they got coopted (and russian tax payer funded woohoo!). The adhoc nature of russia is not about strict control but loose control with a set of stated goals and then state takeovers of successful startups.

[rijomathew]

We assume that Alexei was poisoned with something mixed into the tea. It was the only thing that he drank in the morning. Doctors say the toxin was absorbed faster through the hot liquid. Alexey is now unconscious.

what more do you expect from dictator read more on this

[Slant]

Novichok never was detected by medical tests as far as I'm aware.
Skipping investigation from first clue straight to condemnation is wrong no matter how much you despise accused.

What do you think a toxicological test performed on blood samples by a patient in a hospital is? A half time midget entertainment dance at the super bowl? That is a medical test. And for the record, medicine involves chemistry. And analytics. Do you even understand the concept of science? In any case...

It's proof admissable in any court of the civilised world. The question is not what happened now, the only question is how much the Russian Government was involved in the use of a poison used exclusively by Russian military or state agencies. The fact that Russia does exactly squat but deny just like the Soviet Union did in its best times really speaks volumes. Yeah, absolutely I and everyone else is going to draw conclusions from that. The silence is deafening.

I don't accuse Russia because I despise them. I do not despise Russia at all, I'm actually quite indifferent about third world nations, to be honest. I wish Russian people had a better life, but I think the same about people living in India. I do accuse Russia based on damning evidence, history, experience and above all PROOF that something fishy has been going on.

And since this isn't a court trial I don't even have to care about the bullshit people like you are putting up. See, this is the situation where I will absolutely rely on proof, circumstantial evidence, common sense and history to just say, Russia dunnit. Everyone knows they dunnit. We can't do anything about it, but they dunnit. And if you even try to refute it so pathetically as you did just now, you're just making yourself complicit with state sanctioned attempted murder of dissedents. YOU, my friend, are one of those people that enabled Stalin. You are one of the bad guys, just in case you were curious.

[Breccia]

Alexey is now unconscious.

But at least he's no longer in a coma. So, there's that.

The poisoning by dictator for life Putin could very easily have killed him.

[Shalcker]

likely hood is there is an understanding that whacking thorns in putins side is open season, and that you wont get punished for doing anything to any oppo figure or turncoat even if you are such a bumbling cunt you kill a british citizen.

Where do you get this conspiracy theory from?

As we saw in other theaters it seems adhoc. we saw with the troll factories that they werent state run to begin with but when they were viewed as usefuul they got coopted (and russian tax payer funded woohoo!).

Troll factories are self-funding, their profits mostly come from commercial astroturfing.

The adhoc nature of russia is not about strict control but loose control with a set of stated goals and then state takeovers of successful startups.

Which "stated goals" do you think everyone pursues?

As far as i see everyone just does what they think might work opportunistically.

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What do you think a toxicological test performed on blood samples by a patient in a hospital is? A half time midget entertainment dance at the super bowl? That is a medical test. And for the record, medicine involves chemistry. And analytics. Do you even understand the concept of science? In any case...

It wasn't performed in medical setting, thus as far as i see it wasn't medical test. Simple enough.

It's proof admissable in any court of the civilised world. The question is not what happened now, the only question is how much the Russian Government was involved in the use of a poison used exclusively by Russian military or state agencies.

How exactly do you prove exclusivity?

The fact that Russia does exactly squat but deny just like the Soviet Union did in its best times really speaks volumes. Yeah, absolutely I and everyone else is going to draw conclusions from that. The silence is deafening.

Are you even listening? They are saying same thing they said before, there is no silence. Maybe you just tuned it out.

I do accuse Russia based on damning evidence, history, experience and above all PROOF that something fishy has been going on.

Noone denies that something fishy have been going on though.

And if you even try to refute it so pathetically as you did just now, you're just making yourself complicit with state sanctioned attempted murder of dissedents. YOU, my friend, are one of those people that enabled Stalin. You are one of the bad guys, just in case you were curious.

I'm not "refuting" anything; i'm just looking at different versions that fit available evidence.

And people like you enabled Hitler (by assuming that, obviously, whatever government says is right and they know better).

At least Stalin got loads of letters about how wrongfully people got convicted.

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But at least he's no longer in a coma. So, there's that.

The poisoning by dictator for life Putin could very easily have killed him.

It's a wonder why he never does lately.

[Easo]

Strict Doctor-patient confidentiality, for one, and second, a lot of pressure.

I would argue that in this case talking about confidentiality is totally out of place, very public and known persons get it less and it is in the interests of others for it to be published in this case. Especially when chemical weapons are involved, that shit overrules a lot.

Additionally - they clearly said that they have indisputable proof that it was Novichok, so according to Germany it actually is black and white. Or so they say.
Hence, we need that proof they said they have.

[Nastard]

It wasn't performed in medical setting, thus as far as i see it wasn't medical test. Simple enough.

Sweet, if I eat a burger outside of a restaurant it doesn't count as food so I can go back and get another without worrying about weight gain.

[Shalcker]

Sweet, if I eat a burger outside of a restaurant it doesn't count as food so I can go back and get another without worrying about weight gain.

Poisons detected through non-medical means are just as effective as food eaten outside of restaurant.

[postman1782]

Poisons detected through non-medical means are just as effective as food eaten outside of restaurant.

So, how low are you willing to go, to defend Putin?

[Ripster42]

So, how low are you willing to go, to defend Putin?

This poster has said previously that he's fine with corruption as long as it helps putin. He's fine with knowingly lying and spreading propaganda as long as it helps putin. He literally posted doctored pictures of a ukranian jet shooting down the malasian air flight, then, when people showed him why it was bullshit, still insisted it was a real picture and then over the course of the following day had switched to some other bullshit about how the ukranians had somehow gotten a gta launcher behind russias lines and fired the missile the downed the plane. There is no bottom.

[postman1782]

This poster has said previously that he's fine with corruption as long as it helps putin. He's fine with knowingly lying and spreading propaganda as long as it helps putin. He literally posted doctored pictures of a ukranian jet shooting down the malasian air flight, then, when people showed him why it was bullshit, still insisted it was a real picture and then over the course of the following day had switched to some other bullshit about how the ukranians had somehow gotten a gta launcher behind russias lines and fired the missile the downed the plane. There is no bottom.

Wow, and MMO-Champ lets him continue posting? That is some serious bullshit.

[Shalcker]

So, how low are you willing to go, to defend Putin?

Where do you see me defending Putin?

I just don't see it as unequivocal "Putin did it" because a lot of actors can do it without Putin's pre-approval; "Putin did it" isn't useful to me, exact source inside or outside Putin's apparatus can be.

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This poster has said previously that he's fine with corruption as long as it helps putin.

As long as it helps country; acceptance of corruption is predicated on overall situation actually getting better.

Which it largely isn't.

[Ripster42]

Wow, and MMO-Champ lets him continue posting? That is some serious bullshit.

I mean, take a look at post #197. Defends putin the entire thread, says he's not. Reiterates corruption is good, denies that putin and the state of russia aren't one and the same until putin dies, you know, because of the corruption.

[Shalcker]

I mean, take a look at post #197. Defends putin the entire thread, says he's not. Reiterates corruption is good, denies that putin and the state of russia aren't one and the same until putin dies, you know, because of the corruption.

State and Putin are certainly not one and the same, even while Putin is alive.

Never said corruption is good, only that in certain circumstances it can be tolerated.

Stop strawmanning.

[jonnysensible]

State and Putin are certainly not one and the same, even while Putin is alive.

Never said corruption is good, only that in certain circumstances it can be tolerated.

Stop strawmanning.

dude lets remember

you denied syrian chemical weapons attacks, shooting down a commercial plane, sailsbury attacks and now this poisioning. I cant remember the position on crimea, ill assume it was awful.

'im just keeping my options open to every conspiracy theory'.

[Shalcker]

dude lets remember

you denied syrian chemical weapons attacks, shooting down a commercial plane, sailsbury attacks and now this poisioning. I cant remember the position on crimea, ill assume it was awful.

Yes, i prefer to have more information before making definitive judgement. And some of those chemical attacks did turn out to be hoaxes in the end (like Douma).

'im just keeping my options open to every conspiracy theory'.

Definitely not every; but i'm willing to be open to alternative possibilities.