How to make old content relevant

[rhorle]

Yeah, that is what the game revolves around and that's exactly why offering as much variety as possible is important.

But as you have established with Deadmines variety doesn't apply if you've done the old content lots of times already.

[nocturnus]

But as you have established with Deadmines variety doesn't apply if you've done the old content lots of times already.

I explained this a few times already, but I will again, because I’m a generous and ultimately, nice guy.

Deadmines is a. A relevant dungeon, I did that dungeon recently while leveling and b. I personally never really liked that dungeon in general. That doesn’t mean that I don’t welcome variety.

BT, ssc, tk, gruul’s, swp, on the other hand, I haven’t seen in more than ten years. Ergo, they would be a welcome return.

Variety is everything and sure, you apparently don’t enjoy elaborate freedom of choice. I wager that most people do, though.

Besides, saying “yeah but all content will become boring after having repeated it a ton of times, so why bother” is a blatant fallacy. That’s not how you should think, ever.

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The balance people are talking about is balancing the effects of items from all the old content. What happens when that agi trinket from Lost City of Tol Avir becomes BiS for agi users and now players have to go do that dungeon as well? No one wants to factor in every dungeon in the game when gearing and Blizz isn't going to want to spend their time nerfing all the shit players go back and find. If they were to do something like this they'd have to remove anything with an effect from the loot table.

So what if that trinket becomes BIS? That’s the way it works right now as well. But what’s even more worrisome is your ridiculous addiction driven mentality; no, you don’t have to do that content if you don’t like it. You don’t have to get that BIS trinket, you don’t need it to perform well. You’re either brain washed, or you conditioned yourself into thinking you need to have stuff, even if that means engaging in activities beyond your enjoyment, in a video game that’s made for no other reason than enjoyment.

Honestly and I don’t mean this derogatory, but I think you need therapy man.

[rhorle]

Besides, saying “yeah but all content will become boring after having repeated it a ton of times, so why bother” is a blatant fallacy. That’s not how you should think, ever.

But it is true and it is not a fallacy. You keep bring up how old content turned into 5-mans will bring variety when it ultimately will not. Because people have done that old content a bunch of times and it will be akin to what deadmines is for you. And the variety won't last where it won't matter what 5-man they are running while pushing M+ for the 100th time.

So using variety as the sole reason doesn't work. Because variety is ultimately of low importance to the people that will continue to run dungeons regardless. If you miss the old instances that much then just go run them for transmog.

[Drusin]

So what if that trinket becomes BIS? That’s the way it works right now as well.

But contained within 8 dungeons, not the entirety of the game

But what’s even more worrisome is your ridiculous addiction driven mentality; no, you don’t have to do that content if you don’t like it.

True, but people are going to.

You don’t have to get that BIS trinket, you don’t need it to perform well.

All true, but people are going to. If you want to begin a journey to change the nature of wow players good luck

Honestly and I don’t mean this derogatory, but I think you need therapy man.

I think you need to stop assuming I or others are referring to themselves when they mention things


We all know some wow players are going to "the best" farm. Opening up every single instance in the game to the potential pool will absolutely make certain old content relevant, just like players were doing heroics and leaving and Blizz removed the lockout from it players are going to be in all kinds of wacky places trying to get some obscure item with a proc that does more damage than it should because Blizz didn't care to tune it in 20 years when they made the change for all dungeons to give good gear for max level.

Eventually Blizz would probably just get annoyed and remove all the procs from old gear like how they removed all the set bonuses from working.

[nocturnus]

But it is true and it is not a fallacy. You keep bring up how old content turned into 5-mans will bring variety when it ultimately will not. Because people have done that old content a bunch of times and it will be akin to what deadmines is for you. And the variety won't last where it won't matter what 5-man they are running while pushing M+ for the 100th time.

So using variety as the sole reason doesn't work. Because variety is ultimately of low importance to the people that will continue to run dungeons regardless. If you miss the old instances that much then just go run them for transmog.

No, it’s not true. You’re factually wrong; more instances is per definition more variety. Per definition. Yes, people will get bored by that as well, which is why it’s a never ending cycle: Blizzard make content, people consume content, Blizzard makes new content. Your argument that ‘people have already done that content a bunch of times’ barely holds ground as well, because a. that content is more than a decade old and b. only ~3% of all 12 million players did that content back in the day. Which suggest that most players would consider that brand new content for a fraction of the price that actual brand new content would cost.

Luckily, Bizzard doesn’t think like you do, or we’d still be stuck in Vanilla. “Guys, why bother making expansions, right? People will get bored anyway.”

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True, but people are going to.

And that is their problem and their doing. Not mine, nor Blizzard’s.

Also, for the 100th time (I won’t hold it against you; reading is hard), I never suggested they had to ‘open every single instance’. I said one raid. One. This would add 3 more dungeons in a rotation of 8 and it would still be less than Legion’s variety. Maybe, use a few raids spread over the whole duration of the expansion. So this content influx you’re referring to, wouldn’t exist.

As for proc-driven items, yes, I was the first one to say those should either be removed completely, or carefully balanced. I for one, never liked trinkets. They’re nigh impossible to balance.

[Drusin]

And that is their problem and their doing. Not mine, nor Blizzard’s.

Nor is anyones health

Also, for the 100th time (I won’t hold it against you; reading is hard), I never suggested they had to ‘open every single instance’. I said one raid. One. This would add 3 more dungeons in a rotation of 8 and it would still be less than Legion’s variety. Maybe, use a few raids spread over the whole duration of the expansion. So this content influx you’re referring to, wouldn’t exist.

Strange I don't recall seeing you say that to me 100 times

[nocturnus]

Nor is anyones health



Strange I don't recall seeing you say that to me 100 times

Then I suggest you scroll back and read.

What do you mean with “nor anyone’s health”?

[rhorle]

No, it’s not true. You’re factually wrong; more instances is per definition more variety.

And yet you wouldn't consider Deadmines to be variety because you've done it a bunch of times already. Weird right? Deadmines was revamped 10 years ago since it was done as part of Cataclysm and that expansion launched 12/7/10. And I am sure there are a lot of players that have never run it at end game or while leveling. Nothing I have said is against new expansions or new content. If there was a choice between creating new instances from old content I would prefer 100% new stuff any day.

[nocturnus]

And yet you wouldn't consider Deadmines to be variety because you've done it a bunch of times already. Weird right? Deadmines was revamped 10 years ago since it was done as part of Cataclysm and that expansion launched 12/7/10. And I am sure there are a lot of players that have never run it at end game or while leveling. Nothing I have said is against new expansions or new content. If there was a choice between creating new instances from old content I would prefer 100% new stuff any day.

Says who? Deadmines does add to variety; this is another simple fact.

Of course, I would prefer brand new content on a regular basis as well. But we already established that that’s the ideal scenario most of us enjoy best.

Let’s not repeat the same conversation that was had some four pages ago.

[Drusin]

Then I suggest you scroll back and read.

Scrolling back is lame, just go to the quote section of your profile and you can find all the replies someone has left And you never made whatever comment you're thinking of to me

What do you mean with “nor anyone’s health”?

But what’s even more worrisome is your ridiculous addiction driven mentality;
...
Honestly and I don’t mean this derogatory, but I think you need therapy man.

No ones health is your or Blizzards business.

[nocturnus]

Scrolling back is lame, just go to the quote section of your profile and you can find all the replies someone has left And you never made whatever comment you're thinking of to me

No ones health is your or Blizzards business.

If you're too lazy to actually read posts made in a thread you're attempting to participate in, you might as well leave. Besides, who said it was in a reply to you specifically?

Ah now I understand what you mean.

Well, you're wrong about that; if I choose to make it my business, it is by default my business.

As for Blizzard, well, that's actually an interesting one. I remember a case where Squeenix had to gate particular content in FFXIV I think (?) to prevent players from literally killing themselves farming. So there might be legal ramifications.

[Drusin]

If you're too lazy to actually read posts made in a thread you're attempting to participate in, you might as well leave. Besides, who said it was in a reply to you specifically?

Read what's said to me ¯\_(ツ)_/¯ No way am I reading 100% of posts in every thread I go in. I got threads here I'm reading, threads on the official forums and reddit.

Ah now I understand what you mean.

Well, you're wrong about that; if I choose to make it my business, it is by default my business.

Heh, good luck

[nocturnus]

Read what's said to me ¯\_(ツ)_/¯ No way am I reading 100% of posts in every thread I go in. I got threads here I'm reading, threads on the official forums and reddit.

That actually explains a lot.

[Rucati]

Please don't.

I did the old content when it was relevant. In most cases I did that content for over 2 years. I have literally zero desire to ever go back and do it again.

Add new shit to the game, don't try to make people do the things they're already burnt out on.

[nocturnus]

Please don't.

I did the old content when it was relevant. In most cases I did that content for over 2 years. I have literally zero desire to ever go back and do it again.

Add new shit to the game, don't try to make people do the things they're already burnt out on.

Oh I wouldn't dream of making you do shit you don't want to.

Is that how you feel right now? Do you feel you have to do all content Blizzard makes? If so, why?

[Drusin]

That actually explains a lot.

Glad that's cleared up

[Rucati]

Oh I wouldn't dream of making you do shit you don't want to.

Is that how you feel right now? Do you feel you have to do all content Blizzard makes? If so, why?

If you turn old raids into mythics and they competitive gear then yeah, if you want to compete you'll need to do them.

Instead of making old shit relevant add new things, it isn't hard. Old dungeons are still there if you wanna go do them.

[nocturnus]

If you turn old raids into mythics and they competitive gear then yeah, if you want to compete you'll need to do them.

No, you really don't. You can compete just fine without your BIS set-up, this has been proven over and over again. The only one forcing you to do content you don't like, is you. Not a very smart thing to do, I might add.

Instead of making old shit relevant add new things, it isn't hard. Old dungeons are still there if you wanna go do them.

I definitely agree that new content, dungeons specifically, are more desirable. But that's the whole point of this thread, my suggestion hypothetically finds the sweet spot between new content and expensive content development; it's not entirely new, but it's old enough to be considered new by most players and it's supposedly cheaper to accomplish than brand new content. That's the gist of it anyway.

Glad that's cleared up

I'm happy you're content about the fact that you've been attempting to participate in a conversation whilst refusing to research what the conversation was actually about

[Drusin]

I'm happy you're content about the fact that you've been attempting to participate in a conversation whilst refusing to research what the conversation was actually about

I address those that address me, there isn't much research that needs to be done. If you want me to have your opinion you should provide it to me.

[nocturnus]

I address those that address me, there isn't much research that needs to be done. If you want me to have your opinion you should provide it to me.

Why would you think that?

What you're doing is accusing me of having said something but claim ignorance when I said I never did. Not a very smart thing to do.

"You said open up all content!"

"Eh, no I didn't."

"Oh well, scrolling back is lame. But you never said you didn't want that TO ME!"

"I didn't tell you I wanted to open up all content either."

"I didn't know! I didn't know!"

You're not a very credible individual, I'm afraid. You are entertaining, though. Especially on slow days - which nowadays I embrace - like today.