Guilds dying because of Castle Nathria?

[arkanon]

The Youtuber is irrelevant to the core gameplay. .

If preach is irrelevant.. then which WoW youtuber is relevant?

None of them.
.

They are not irrelevant to the community. They are, in fact, very relevant to the community in that they spread their pet issues and toxic bullshit and make the community worse all around.

This is getting very confusing. So you are saying None of them are relivent, however, they are so relivent they make the community toxic. They have no impact on the core gameplay, but make the game worse for you to play?!?!?!?

Have i got that right? Its all getting extremely confusing.

- - - Updated - - -

What a garbage followup to a trick question.

Asking you to back up your claim that streamers have ruined your gameplay experience is a trick question? Now now, dont be silly - you made a claim, i asked you to back it up with examples. Nothing more, nothing less. And instead of replying, you went on a long winded rant about why you wouldnt answer the question, and then started going on about Trump?

- - - Updated - - -

What did you eat for dinner twelve days after your 9th birthday? Can't answer that? Then maybe you'll understand why I couldn't answer your request for an ultra-specific example of my experiences from 10+ years ago.

This would be an accurate statement..........IF i had said "man, what i ate 12 days after my 9th birthday really ruined the rest of the year for me, it was horrible".

Streamers ruined your gameplay experience 10+ years ago? You are desperately shifting the goalposts - you never said ANYTHING about it being 10 years ago - you have introduced this new factor because your argument is crumbling.

[Zig Zug]

You think that was the only guild that stopped raiding during Castle Nathria though? Was it just a coincidence?

- - - Updated - - -



??? He's one of the most popular content creators in the community.

Oh no, I apologize - I was unclear.

There may be a greater trend of guilds in decline, but I don't consider this as anything resembling evidence of that, nor holding Castle Nathria as the cause.

[GreenJesus]

They tried smaller raids in Cata, wasn't a very popular decision.

??? 10 man raids weren't popular? Lol are you kidding me? And those were in Wrath already. 10 man was the most popular raid mode. If anything, now that blizzard is relying on mythic+, having a 10 player raid would make it easier for 10 man guilds to form into 2 teams for mythic+ instead of 2 tanks being shared for 20 players.

[Monster Hunter]

You had my curiosity, but now you have my attention.

World of warzone: solos

Id be interested in that tbf.

[Baconeggcheese]

Nothings been as damaging to guilds as the decision to remove 10 man / 25 man which auto killed a shit ton of guilds. After that legion murdered a ludicrous number of guilds.

This to me just seems like normal turnover.

[ashblond]

This is what happens when you treat wow as a work instead of a game. This is the end of every hardcore raiding guild, just a matter of time.

All Preach's videos are about mythic raiding: mythic guild, mythic world first, best class or spec for mythic raiding, etc. It is his only focus. He doesn’t care about anything else in wow. He is not interested in lore, story, mounts, pets, transmog, etc (his own words).

He treats wow raiding as a job and his opinions are absolutely irrelevant for most players. You can’t get anything interesting from his videos others than mythic raiding.

It is perfectly fine and normal that Preach's guild is dead. It will be surprising if it isn't.

[Zyky]

I never said they were unique viewers? It's simply tracking the amount of viewers coming to the site, so being that high in terms of numbers at least shows how much viewer retention it gets. On my end I have at least visited Wowhead multiple times weekly for the last 2-3 months. Meanwhile I haven't done the same for MMO-Champion. I think that is pretty typical of the average WoW player in this day and age to use Wowhead that much, which also reflects on the numbers.

If they're not unique it doesn't really matter what the traffic is lol

[Belloc]

And instead of replying, you went on a long winded rant about why you wouldnt answer the question, and then started going on about Trump?

So, what you're basically saying is that you have zero critical thinking skills.

I used Trump's approach to the COVID pandemic as an analogy. Trump (a popular personality) said a bunch of stupid, toxic stuff and his followers damaged a large portion of the United States community (by spreading false information and by literally killing them). Popular streaming personalities say stupid shit and their followers spread the toxicity around, just the same. The fact that you couldn't make this obvious connection speaks volumes.


This quote basically explains the problem:

His persona is that of a colossal prick. His followers as a rule act like colossal pricks too.

That's about Asmongold. You know, the guy who had his followers start harassing people who purchased store mounts? And you can't figure out how these people ruin the game for some people?

[Monster Hunter]

Oh no, I apologize - I was unclear.

There may be a greater trend of guilds in decline, but I don't consider this as anything resembling evidence of that, nor holding Castle Nathria as the cause.

There is NEVER a singular cause for a decline in wow

People often use a decline as evidence of strong support against a design decision, and that is often a contributing factor, but declines are complex.

Ghost crawler knee said its hard to pin point a drop in subs to a specific change, because people often take months to quit after a change they don't like and in that time might accumulate other grievances befor something is the last straw, but for every 1 person that quits because of a change there usualy a bunch that quit simply because they are there freinds and what was keeping them in the game was that social aspect.

To give an example from my self this patch.

Guild was taking alot longer to progress the raid, the usual suspects in the guild are leeching as you normally get, you know the guys who refuse to play anything but frost mage or fury warrior, loot is scarce so carrying those mooks is much harder than it was, tensions rise, no ones having fun and eventually my mate goes fuck this im out, that makes me think about the game and I go yea im not having fun im out, then 3 days later 2 more of our group go fuck it, were not having fun without you guys we prefer playing what you guys are now, so that was 5 down in a week, week later 3 more left the game, then the guild had big roster problems, raids started getting canceled, 2 more quit and then the guild leadership went fuck it and the guild collapsed, so a jnch more quit going fuck finding a new guild.

And though that's one story, its generally how it goes, and of all those who quit the game only 2 actually left because they didn't like a design change, the rest left because others left that made other leave and so on till dead guild.

Now some will quit for a bit, some jntill the design changes or something brings them back and some are just gone for good and thats that.

[MrLachyG]

I noticed this vid from preach and it's quite sad. Even though he's been in this guild for a while it was during this raid cycle that they ended up stopping raiding.

What's blizz going to do about dying guilds? When is the new raid going to be out?

guilds disband after they've finished a raid; this has happened since Vanilla. it's not a new phenomenon.

[arkanon]

snip political garbage out

So just to be clear - you made a claim that streamers have "ruined" your gameplay experience, 1 page after saying they are completely irrelevant, and its ME that has issues? You have been completely unable to provide even a single example of a streamers actions negatively impacting your gameplay. All it boils down to is you dont like that these people have followers and fans. Is it really just jealousy? Because thats certainly what it sounds like at this point.

ps - leave the trump stuff out - politics are a nogo around here.

[Frozen Death Knight]

If they're not unique it doesn't really matter what the traffic is lol

Well, neither of the numbers from MMO-Champion or Wowhead were unique viewers, yet the latter is still used around 10 times more compared to the former in December alone after having double checked the stats and doing some simple math (96 million vs 9,4 million visitors). I seriously doubt that counting just the amount of unique viewers for each website somehow would make MMO-Champion come even remotely close to the popularity of Wowhead.

[KaPe]

This is what happens when you treat wow as a work instead of a game. This is the end of every hardcore raiding guild, just a matter of time.

All Preach's videos are about mythic raiding: mythic guild, mythic world first, best class or spec for mythic raiding, etc. It is his only focus. He doesn’t care about anything else in wow. He is not interested in lore, story, mounts, pets, transmog, etc (his own words).

He treats wow raiding as a job and his opinions are absolutely irrelevant for most players. You can’t get anything interesting from his videos others than mythic raiding.

It's amazing how much wrong you can fit into one post while acting some smug about it. No, not "all of his content" is about Mythic raiding. In fact, he specifically mentioned that his last mythic focused video was far less popular than his "fresh character gearing" series. He often does that kind of stuff, which isn't really intended for high-end raiders, but people far below that skill level.

But hey, we both know that you don't actually care about his content and just wanted to trash him. Facts tend to get in the way of that.

[A Chozo]

lmaoooo Preach's lame-ass guild dies and people think this is not only post-worthy but also a indication of the game's quality

Castle Nathria is probably the most fun raid I've had in this game. If his guild died it could've been from burnout, lack of interest or a million factors, especially considering they raid Mythic.

[Firebert]

Open all raid difficulties to the LFR tool.

[dacoolist]

There's no reward in raiding. 1800 pvpers have better gear.

1800 gives 220 , mythic end bosses (the last two) give 233 also normal mythic gives 226

[Zig Zug]

There is NEVER a singular cause for a decline in wow

Now some will quit for a bit, some jntill the design changes or something brings them back and some are just gone for good and thats that.

Well, in that context, the number of variables to consider for any guild's health or success are nearly infinite.

I think there has been a condensing of guilds of persistent players who want to be in guilds, which I see as a net positive. But in the end, a guild's success lies with the leader.

Context: I play on a top 5 Population North American server.

[arkanon]

lmaoooo Preach's lame-ass guild dies and people think this is not only post-worthy but also a indication of the game's quality

Castle Nathria is probably the most fun raid I've had in this game. If his guild died it could've been from burnout, lack of interest or a million factors, especially considering they raid Mythic.

Had a skim through the video and he appears to be quite open that many of the members simply are not enjoying SL much, and wanted a break. Obviously their reasons for not enjoying it are varied, but thats the explanation given. Someone is welcome to correct me if i skimmed over a different reason, but thats what I got from the video.

[bowchikabow]

There are 3 times when guild attrition is at its highest:

Expansion start: The lull in content causes people to leave, and then maybe a number of them don't come back or find a new, more active guild

End of Content cycle: When either the guild has cleared the content, or hit a wall that exposes issues/drama etc that just doesn't get overcome. You will always a bump in guild deaths in this time, every patch.

End of Expansion: This would be the genesis of number 1, people are looking ahead to new expack, the raid tier will be longest lasting, most mind-numbing experience after content is cleared. People will generally use this time to step away, or maybe play alts that they decide will be mains.. but their guild doesn't need so they look to greener pastures.. etc.

There are some niche scenarios, like if a raid tier or general end game is just so fucking terrible that it drives people away (think WoD outside of raids).. but the mean average comes down to those 3 times.

[Lycras]

My 11 years old non-stop raiding guild just stopped raiding yesterday... I've nothing to say. Thank you.