I don't think that some people realize how good Dragonflight actually is.

[mrgreenthump]

Hard to say yet. Only played 30 hours so far, so don't know if it has legs. It's pretty funny though, cause much of the stuff I see in instances at least have taken inspiration of previous expansions.

[Zantera]

Hard to say yet. Only played 30 hours so far, so don't know if it has legs. It's pretty funny though, cause much of the stuff I see in instances at least have taken inspiration of previous expansions.

Isn't this just the fairly normal 'back to basics' approach you see everywhere? Whether it's a band trying to win their fans back after a different album that misfired or a new movie sequel trying to get back to the feel of the original because the last one wasn't well liked.

It makes sense with Dragon Isles being part of Azeroth to have elements we recognize from other places whether it's certain creatures or titan facilities or whatever else. Coming up with entirely new things that has no 'connection' to things we already know just seems like a dumb move on their part considering most of the player base will jump to criticism as soon as something 'doesn't feel like Warcraft'.

I've only done the dungeons once on HC so far though so it will be interesting to see how they fare in the long run.

[Arlette]

An office? In medieval-fantasy game? Yeeeeeeah... I mean.... some of these things really "extinguish" the flavor of that "World we used to have". Sadly.

Ignoring the homophobia and the 'My gay friend TOTALLY said this' nonsense, comments like this always make me laugh.

Warcraft, medieval? I'm not sure what game you think you've been playing but Warcraft has never been that. Even before Burning Crusade brought in literal space ships, we had different worlds out in outer space, we had inter-dimensional portal travel, ect ect ect.

Also the notion that places in the medieval period didn't have 'offices' is just...untrue? lol

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I actually discussed this with my mates when we were on discord levelling on the day of release.

There is a pair of crafters in one of the first cities, both male. They share the same last name, yet they do not look alike, at ALL. If Blizzard had just LEFT IT AT THAT, it would've been a very clever, subtle inclusion of a gay couple. You could see their names, Miguel and Thomas White (I think White is their surname), notice how they do not look at ALL alike, and be like "Aaaaaaaaah, the clever buggers at blizzard, they put an undercover gay couple! They can't have the same last name without being brothers, yet they don't look alike at all! So they MUST be a couple! Good one Blizz, good one". That's what we agreed upon, as a group, would be the smart way to do it.

But what does Blizz do? They call each other "Husband". Straight in your face. Not a subtle inclusion, left for the player to discover on his own. Nope. Slap-bang in the middle of the fucking quest-text box. In your face.

I wouldn't have minded the under-cover gay couple of crafters in the first big city you go to. I really wouldn't. I'd even feel intelligent for figuring it out on my own, and give Blizzard an honest "well played, you got me". None of my group would have minded. But "Husband" slap bang in the middle of the quest-text box when these NPCs are explaining the new profession system to you? Nah.

Also, about the office part, I'm sure that NPC doesn't mean an actual modern office with a laptop a gaming chair and an air-conditioner. That NPC means the old-school version of the word "office", which means "An enclosed place inside a building that offers privacy, so that work (which usually has to do with parchments, reading, writing, researching, calculating etc) can peacefully take place". No gripes about the word "office" being used in WoW.

I won't even talk about the gay centaur marriage that the player is forced to witness and take part in (if you wanna get the Sojourner achievement, that is).

Why does inclusion of LGBT characters have to be subtle? Sorry, but it's not our job to cater to your bigotry. I love that this thread immediately turned into a "We hate LGBT" circle-jerk. Instantly. Because of two, maybe three, sets of characters lol.

What a good community this website has fostered.

[Lolites]

Why does inclusion of LGBT things have to be subtle?

bcs if its not subtle its not inclusion...

[Arlette]

bcs if its not subtle its not inclusion...

Yes...it is.

This is the exact same bullshit as, "Well as long as those queers hide in their houses when they're together and I don't have to see it, then I guess they can exist."

And yes I'm talking about forbidden issues because this disgusting thread deserves to be locked. I'm so glad the mods have just let multiple people spout hatred without any intervention.

[DechCJC]

Aye, my favourite is when people are so attached to the game that they will stay up and play the midnight release. They'll play it for days or weeks on end and have a blast, then come to forums and call it trash.

I feel so detached from the general consensus towards WoW: I appreciate early WoW for what it is and its sense of adventure; But for me, I genuinely think that the game's in a fantastic place right now. I think people love to jump on the bandwagon. WoW's like Nickelback, how many people actually dislike his music? Most people just don't want to have an opinion different from what they believe the majority has, even if it's not a majority at all.

There's still a lot of work to be done with the game; But how someone can look at past expansions and think that there was better content to do is beyond me. Players also frequently compare WoW to other MMO's, and while they definitely have their strengths, I'm yet to find any that has such a fluid feel to it as WoW. Final Fantasy, while it has a great story, is largely carried BY its story. Frankly, I just can't care for reading thousands of pages of dialogue in a video game; It takes me out of it entirely and I struggle to get immersed.

Yeah, I'm in the honeymoon phase; But I also enjoyed the last couple patches of Shadowlands so there's that. Most of what I want done with WoW is fixing the basic structure, which is what this expansion is making leaps of bounds in regards to. I hope they continue it.

Also, regarding all of the LGBT stuff.... Who cares? Why does anyone care? I too think it's a silly change but it doesn't really affect my experience. I swear, people are looking for shit to get worked up about. Dragonriding for example; People claiming that it's stolen from GW2. You know GW2 isn't the only game with realistic flight, yeah? And you know nearly everything that exists is inspired by something else? You think the devs should go, "Hey, we could do with making our flight more immersive!" - "Yeah that's a great ide- wait, doesn't GW2 have good flying?" - "Ah yeah, fuck, guess we can't do that then". For real...

[loras]

Personal flavors aside.

It seems that they went to drawing board and nailed it. Where would you start at this point? Whatever gives you the kick. To me is the simple yet profound changes that makes huge difference. Especially things that allows you to have some powerhouse plays (including talent tree generocity).

Anyway, going to approach this expansion with more positive look, since positive thinking has been benefiting me greatly lately.

It seems like it is all i had hoped for.
And yet... i lack the time to play it >_>

Perhaps for the better, i've not yet heard much about the pvp i would focus on.

[Lolites]

This is the exact same bullshit as, "Well as long as those queers hide in their houses when they're together and I don't have to see it, then I guess they can exist."

which is a fair point (unless its formulated in purposefuly hated way as YOU did), and applies to heterosexuals too...
i do have some homosexual coworkers and ex-coworkers, and surprise surprise, most of them think that way too, and despise pride parades and things like that...

[HitRefresh]

This.

Same was said even by 2 of my gay "wow-friends" (1 of whom is married to another man). They feel like its been forcefully pushed into game.

It's like a person you might know who says they support black people so they start blasting rap in the car and shit

[loras]

Yes...it is.

This is the exact same bullshit as, "Well as long as those queers hide in their houses when they're together and I don't have to see it, then I guess they can exist."

And yes I'm talking about forbidden issues because this disgusting thread deserves to be locked. I'm so glad the mods have just let multiple people spout hatred without any intervention.

How about representing them appropriately though?
Much of the backlash can be understood quite easily once you put their picture-prominence into perspective next to their actual numbers.

It's a warped perspective that's presented, and people are justly annoyed by that. As time goes on that sentiment only grows so long as such obvious misrepresentations continue, ultimately turning out counterproductive towards any sort of broad acceptance.

Besides many such attempts at representation are so poorly done that subtlety would be a very good "know your own weaknesses" failsafe.

[Nyel]

Yes...it is.

This is the exact same bullshit as, "Well as long as those queers hide in their houses when they're together and I don't have to see it, then I guess they can exist."

And yes I'm talking about forbidden issues because this disgusting thread deserves to be locked. I'm so glad the mods have just let multiple people spout hatred without any intervention.

No, it's really not. It's subtle when it feels genuine and natural - which is not the case. I've met two gay couples where the focus was on them being a gay couple. Why does it matter? Why does it have to be said and stated? It just feels forced because it's said time and time again. There is nothing hateful about this thread at all. The heavy emphasis on LGBT topics this time just doesn't feel inclusive or genuine. And I say this as a gay guy.

[Arlette]

which is a fair point (unless its formulated in purposefuly hated way as YOU did), and applies to heterosexuals too...
i do have some homosexual coworkers and ex-coworkers, and surprise surprise, most of them think that way too, and despise pride parades and things like that...

I’m super glad the mythical gay people who agree with your bigotry exist. Thank you so much for that. Also, I guess thank you for being honest that you’re a bigot? Most of you hide it better than you have.

I love that you try to act like you’re being equal by talking about heterosexual relationships, which are far more prevalent in every possible way in our society and culture in every corner of it. But God forbid if there are two sets of gay characters in a video game played by millions of people. Then we have a problem.

I swear some of you see a pair of husbands or a centaur and a dryad together and you act like you’re being forced to watch hard-core gay sex.

[Vilendor]

I have to force myself to play it. As a wow addict with 2 server first achievement and thirty lvl60 characters i have never been more apathetic toward a new expansion and leveling trough it.

The world is meh, everything looks like a battlefield after a year of constant carpet bombing, i have jet to see a flat surface, craters, chasms, mountains, spikes everywhere. I guess that's their idea to make traversing and dragonflying "interesting". Dragonflying was fine for a few hours now it's just annoying and frustrates the hell out of me that i have to constantly move forward and can't stop for a second to hover in the air peacefully and look around. Also what should i do with the 600 useless mount? Mobs are reskins of reskins, Actizzard didn't built a single new mob skeleton since 10 years. The zone music is the most generic flute and trumpet garbage you can find in cheap chinese mobile games. And what happened with the NPC voices? They all sound like Billy from the hardware store on the corner, not a dragon or a dwarf. Mehhhh...

[loras]

I’m super glad the mythical gay people who agree with your bigotry exist. Thank you so much for that. Also, I guess thank you for being honest that you’re a bigot? Most of you hide it better than you have.

I love that you try to act like you’re being equal by talking about heterosexual relationships, which are far more prevalent in every possible way in our society and culture in every corner of it. But God forbid if there are two sets of gay characters in a video game played by millions of people. Then we have a problem.

I swear some of you see a pair of husbands or a centaur and a dryad together and you act like you’re being forced to watch hard-core gay sex.

...You do realise that it's by now a widely known concern, that gay people feel almost coerced into supporting the "correct" political stuff just because of their preference, right?

I happen to have a lot of gay people amongst my acquaintances, friends and family, and few of them are liberal fans of gay parades and such.
Shouldn't be too surprising either since one of them got his teeth knocked out by islamic fanatics and was urged to hush it by a few of his "fellow" gays of the liberal persuasion.

It's a little bit like o'l Biden's comment that you aren't really black unless you vote democrat in the US, plain old political opportunism mixed with actual bigotry poorly disguised as tolerance.

[Zantera]

It's great that we're almost in 2023 and all it takes to rustle the jimmies of most people is to include a gay couple in a video game where there's 1 or 2 mentions of them being in a relationship.

[Aesahaettr]

I was indifferent to the gay couples but actually, I'm looking house many people are getting their panties in a twist, so I hope we see more .

I'm not sure why a guy calling his husband "husband" is all that bad. If it had been a male / female couple and he'd refered to his wife would that also upset you?

So many snowflakes.

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It's great that we're almost in 2023 and all it takes to rustle the jimmies of most people is to include a gay couple in a video game where there's 1 or 2 mentions of them being in a relationship.

But according to some they're ramming it down our throats!

It's interesting how many homophobes are obsessed with things being rammed down their throats but that would be a Freudian matter.

[Nyel]

I was indifferent to the gay couples but actually, I'm looking house many people are getting their panties in a twist, so I hope we see more .

I'm not sure why a guy calling his husband "husband" is all that bad. If it had been a male / female couple and he'd refered to his wife would that also upset you?

So many snowflakes.

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But according to some they're ramming it down our throats!

It's interesting how many homophobes are obsessed with things being rammed down their throats but that would be a Freudian matter.

I love these pointless generalizations when something is criticized it obviously must be racism, homophobia, islamophobia or whatever. Killing every discussion, even if it's based. And it's particularly funny when I, a gay guy, is called homophobic because I feel this whole stuff feels disingenuous.

[loras]

I was indifferent to the gay couples but actually, I'm looking house many people are getting their panties in a twist, so I hope we see more .

I'm not sure why a guy calling his husband "husband" is all that bad. If it had been a male / female couple and he'd refered to his wife would that also upset you?

So many snowflakes.

...Has that even happened at all in the game?
A no-name couple putting a spotlight only on their relation at a central location?

I mean if we were seeing heterosexual couples do this stuff all the time then fair enough, or maybe i am genuinely blind to it, but i do not know of a single example.
Which would not be surprising given WoW's focus on pretty much everything except love. ^^

But yeah, you may have just illustrated just how atypical and forced this might be, good job.

[Zantera]

But according to some they're ramming it down our throats!

It's interesting how many homophobes are obsessed with things being rammed down their throats but that would be a Freudian matter.

I've lost count how many times there's been a small quest chain (or just 1 quest) of a heterosexual relationship where you help one of them win the favor of the other one by getting them some quest item and you basically help them hook up. Nobody cares or complains, but you make both of them the same gender and everyone just loses their minds.

[Aesahaettr]

It's a very quick quest, it's barely in the spotlight.

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I love these pointless generalizations when something is criticized it obviously must be racism, homophobia, islamophobia or whatever. Killing every discussion, even if it's based. And it's particularly funny when I, a gay guy, is called homophobic because I feel this whole stuff feels disingenuous.

And that's good for you. I'm bi. I have no issue with the quests.