Define Classic+ design features, concisely.

[ChaosRanger]

Lets put our heads together and ponder a bit.

After seeing some posts about Classic+/w "some changes", I'm curious if there can be found a common ground recipe for it in some manner we can agree on with exciting features and additions. I'm well aware tastes differ and we see requests for features and changes that are highly controversial to some.

As such, list your features you see as necessary to Classic+.

Example format:

General changes
- XYZ should ABC instead of CBA.
- A should do more damage.
- Pet z should have ability Y.

Raids
- Dungeon X should become a 20man raid.

Class changes
- Class F should have ability K.
- Ability K should be usable in combat.

...and so on. Keep it as a neat list we can easily parse. I will omit my own opinions on the subject in this opening post intentionally.

Cheers.

[anon5123]

TBC class balance in vanilla content. That's about it.
Every time I see people discussing "classic+" changes, half or more of the things they list are things TBC already fixed.

[Khaza-R]

Most Classic + suggestions end up being a personal wishlist more than anything else.

I think it would be more beneficial to look at what changes Blizzard has made with each Classic iteration and try to find a common theme that the developers think is "Classic"

[NineSpine]

I would like to see them utilize the existing assets they have to show what WoW would have looked like if it expanded horizontally rather than vertically with constant content deprecation.

Examples:
Add Outland as a set of 30-45 zones
Add Northrend as a set of 45-60 zones
Blood Elves and Draenei
Death Knight
Kara as a level 60 10-man raid
Utilize the unfinished content to add new zones all across the 1-60 range

That said, I'm not sure this model works unless it is some kind of seasonal situation because then they could do things like shuffle the endgame dungeon and raid content between seasons.

If you read this and think "lol that's already in the expansions" you are entirely missing my point.

[ChaosRanger]

TBC class balance in vanilla content. That's about it.
...

Does this include the TBC talent trees? How would that work, or would there be added levels with less scaling, with the new class design philosophy? Elaborate please, because "TBC class balance" is a very broad scope of changes.

[Morlat]

Defining classic+ is realy easy 2 additional 40man raids 2 additional 20 man raids a few new dungeons + attunement quest chains (ony like) 2-3 new world boss´s for wold pvp enjoyers (MUST BE SCARECE no sharding on wboss zone) disable summons to raid entrances and bring dispellable/grief-able world buffs back, you need the social drama!! yw blizzard
PS: if you dont wana go forward because it will mess the timeline just go backwards in time for the new pve content, like way back in time.

[DrIvoRobotnik]

New dungeons, races, classes, finishing and releasing areas that has been originally planned but never released (or not til many years later) . Maybe some balancing tweeks and QoL like duel spec or collections tab.

[SinR]

I would like to see them utilize the existing assets they have to show what WoW would have looked like if it expanded horizontally rather than vertically with constant content deprecation.

Examples:
Add Outland as a set of 30-45 zones
Add Northrend as a set of 45-60 zones
Blood Elves and Draenei
Death Knight
Kara as a level 60 10-man raid
Utilize the unfinished content to add new zones all across the 1-60 range

That said, I'm not sure this model works unless it is some kind of seasonal situation because then they could do things like shuffle the endgame dungeon and raid content between seasons.

If you read this and think "lol that's already in the expansions" you are entirely missing my point.

So what you're saying is that everything should lead to Lich King at 60?

ten tiers of Raid Content over... a two year cycle?

[NineSpine]

So what you're saying is that everything should lead to Lich King at 60?

ten tiers of Raid Content over... a two year cycle?

Definitely did not say that.

[SinR]

Definitely did not say that.

Then explain.

Cause I read that as three expansions worth of Raid Content over the course of Classic+.

Which is even more jarring because you go from 1-30 in Vanilla World, 30-45 in Outland, 45-60 in Northrend... only to go back to Vanilla World for T1 T2 T3 content.

[crusadernero]

We all want classic+ content. Question is - Can Blizzard of 2023 be trusted for this task?

Doubt it. Classic+ is better off in our minds as a dream.

[kranur]

1. Class balance. No more 80% of the classes being warriors, rogue and mages. (at least not for the reason of complete domination).
2. Specs that actually work (i.e. elemental and boomkins not running oom after 5 casts, locks being able to use full dots etc.) - can borrow some stuff from TBC.
3. Reitemization. There are too many items that are just useless. More hit options ... hell can even go full haywire and add JC for more customization and Inscription for more convenient scrolls.
4. New content that never made it in original vanilla ... Hyjal & Grim Batol can easily be added in a pre-cataclysm state with stories ending towards where Cataclysm picks off ... Azshara Crater bg, Karazhan Crypts dungeon. Also new quests or reduced XP to eliminate the need to just grind away in order to be able to move on.
5. PVP ranking updated. Maybe the entire level 60 bg's can be rated bg's with top 1% of each race also receiving the "Hero of <race capital city>". At the very least, less decay at higher ranks.
6. Optional hardcore and hardcore challenge characters. Hardcore can simply be a char without any restrictions that is just gone if it dies. Hardcore challenge can bring the restrictions and additional challenges (speed penalty, dmg penalty, locks/hunters unable to use pets etc.).

[Biomega]

We all want classic+ content.

We definitely do not all want that.

Remember #nochanges? There's an entire horde (no capital H) of Classic people who'd be foaming at the mouth if you started to mess with what they think was perfection.

But the point is moot anyway, because it'll never happen.

[kranur]

We definitely do not all want that.

Remember #nochanges? There's an entire horde (no capital H) of Classic people who'd be foaming at the mouth if you started to mess with what they think was perfection.

But the point is moot anyway, because it'll never happen.

Truth be told, there are more people that want classic+ than there are raiding mythic on retail.
It will likely never happen, true.

[Biomega]

Truth be told, there are more people that want classic+ than there are raiding mythic on retail.

And you know this through... psychic powers?

[NineSpine]

Then explain.

Cause I read that as three expansions worth of Raid Content over the course of Classic+.

Which is even more jarring because you go from 1-30 in Vanilla World, 30-45 in Outland, 45-60 in Northrend... only to go back to Vanilla World for T1 T2 T3 content.

I didn't say that, so I'm not sure what I'm even being asked to explain.

[SinR]

I didn't say that, so I'm not sure what I'm even being asked to explain.

Then, again, please explain your idea of "Horizontal Progression". Break it down so MMO-C can understand it. Because clearly I'm too stupid to understand.

[NineSpine]

Then, again, please explain your idea of "Horizontal Progression". Break it down so MMO-C can understand it. Because clearly I'm too stupid to understand.

I didn't say anything about horizontal progression.

[SinR]

I would like to see them utilize the existing assets they have to show what WoW would have looked like if it expanded horizontally rather than vertically with constant content deprecation.

my Sibling in whatever religious figure you believe in...

[Lorgar Aurelian]

Keep classic class design, update the story with a diverging timeline, keep he great design of special effects like iron foe and hand of Justice, keep ilvl the same all the way through so fear is about mix matching effects not just what’s newer.