1. #33361
    Quote Originally Posted by cubby View Post
    The word comes from referring only to written words, but now encompasses "speech" - which of course covers all forms of news expression. But it would be something that Giuliani might get wrong, given how he's usually wrong about everything.
    So libel covers slander now?

  2. #33362
    Merely a Setback cubby's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by wunksta View Post
    https://www.buzzfeednews.com/amphtml...secret-memos-2
    BuzzFeed News sued the US government for the right to see all the work that Mueller’s team kept secret. We published the second installment of the FBI’s summaries of interviews with key witnesses.

    The 302s are just the beginning. BuzzFeed News is pursuing five separate lawsuits to pry loose all the subpoenas and search warrants that Mueller’s team executed, as well as all emails, memos, letters, talking points, legal opinions, and financial records it generated. In short, we asked for all communications of any kind that passed through the special counsel’s office. We also requested all the documents that would reveal the discussions among Attorney General Bill Barr, former deputy attorney general Rod Rosenstein, and other high-ranking officials about whether to charge Trump with obstruction.

    In response, Justice Department lawyers claimed the volume of records requested could total 18 billion pages and take centuries to produce.
    If only they were all on some kind of digital format that could easily transfer all those documents and information....

    Those fuckwads at Trump's Personal Law Firm The Department of Justice could fit the entire set of documents (if it in fact really is 18 billion pages, which is more than likely a lie - how do we know? because they said it) on a single computer.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Vegas82 View Post
    So libel covers slander now?
    Perhaps not. They are certainly divided in the law.

    As you're pointing out, libel is spoken while slander is written. Good catch.
    Last edited by cubby; 2019-12-03 at 01:57 AM.

  3. #33363
    Quote Originally Posted by cubby View Post
    If only they were all on some kind of digital format that could easily transfer all those documents and information....

    Those fuckwads at Trump's Personal Law Firm The Department of Justice could fit the entire set of documents (if it in fact really is 18 billion pages, which is more than likely a lie - how do we know? because they said it) on a single computer.

    - - - Updated - - -



    Perhaps not. They are certainly divided in the law.

    As you're pointing out, libel is spoken while slander is written. Good catch.
    To be fair, 18 billion pages would be 20 TB. And that’s if they’re simple ascii files.

    Yeah, Giuliani is clearly losing touch with reality when he claims lawyers told him a spoken statement was libel. These morons are really earning that Stupid Watergate name for this scandal.

  4. #33364
    Bloodsail Admiral wunksta's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by cubby View Post
    If only they were all on some kind of digital format that could easily transfer all those documents and information....

    Those fuckwads at Trump's Personal Law Firm The Department of Justice could fit the entire set of documents (if it in fact really is 18 billion pages, which is more than likely a lie - how do we know? because they said it) on a single computer.
    Haha I was just doing the calculations before I looked at your link. It's hard to say exactly since PDFs could vary in size but one person mentioned having a 877 page pdf that was 6.8MB in size. 18 billion pages with that average size would be 139,566,702‬ MB or 139 terabytes.

    And yes, everything should already be scanned and digitized. I guess the hard part would be going back through and classifying material.

  5. #33365
    Quote Originally Posted by wunksta View Post
    Haha I was just doing the calculations before I looked at your link. It's hard to say exactly since PDFs could vary in size but one person mentioned having a 877 page pdf that was 6.8MB in size. 18 billion pages with that average size would be 139,566,702‬ MB or 139 terabytes.

    And yes, everything should already be scanned and digitized. I guess the hard part would be going back through and classifying material.
    Yeah, the biggest issue with releasing the documents will be redacting them. Claiming there are 18 billion pages though... it just makes you wonder what all is in there that wasn't covered in the report. And there's no provision in the FOIA that says if it's too many pages you get to ignore the law. The DoJ needs to stop defending Trump and start upholding the fucking law.

  6. #33366
    @Breccia

    You are much more active than me on here. Has this been brought up yet?

    Trump had also held up aid for Lebanon for months and I found out about it just a few days ago only to it now also get released.

    https://abcnews.go.com/Politics/whit...85h8_ilr0W7CZw


    I remember wondering if all of a sudden Lebanon was going to start announcing investigations into the Bidens, Warren or Sanders or we would suddenly have troll and/or hacker farms starting to operate from there targeting us.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Vegas82 View Post
    Yeah, the biggest issue with releasing the documents will be redacting them. Claiming there are 18 billion pages though... it just makes you wonder what all is in there that wasn't covered in the report. And there's no provision in the FOIA that says if it's too many pages you get to ignore the law. The DoJ needs to stop defending Trump and start upholding the fucking law.
    I honestly don't see how that is possible. While yes, he had a sizable crew to do all this over all that time, I doubt it would take longer to print the documents out than it did to actually research and create them all in the first place.
    Since we can't call out Trolls and Bad Faith posters and the Ignore function doesn't actually ignore it. Add
    "mmo-champion.com##li.postbitignored"
    to your ublock or adblock filter to actually ignore ignored posters. Now just need a way to ignore responses to them as well.

  7. #33367
    Quote Originally Posted by Fugus View Post
    @Breccia

    You are much more active than me on here. Has this been brought up yet?

    Trump had also held up aid for Lebanon for months and I found out about it just a few days ago only to it now also get released.

    https://abcnews.go.com/Politics/whit...85h8_ilr0W7CZw


    I remember wondering if all of a sudden Lebanon was going to start announcing investigations into the Bidens, Warren or Sanders or we would suddenly have troll and/or hacker farms starting to operate from there targeting us.

    - - - Updated - - -



    I honestly don't see how that is possible. While yes, he had a sizable crew to do all this over all that time, I doubt it would take longer to print the documents out than it did to actually research and create them all in the first place.
    I remember the Lebanon aid being mentioned once or twice, but there was no reason it was mentioned yet.

  8. #33368
    Quote Originally Posted by Orbitus View Post
    I remember the Lebanon aid being mentioned once or twice, but there was no reason it was mentioned yet.
    They still never gave a reason, from what I know, but the fact they were withholding this for months as well and even while the Ukraine stuff was coming to a head they continued to do it anyways and then only released it after getting caught.

    It's like, what the hell are they thinking?
    Since we can't call out Trolls and Bad Faith posters and the Ignore function doesn't actually ignore it. Add
    "mmo-champion.com##li.postbitignored"
    to your ublock or adblock filter to actually ignore ignored posters. Now just need a way to ignore responses to them as well.

  9. #33369
    Quote Originally Posted by Fugus View Post
    They still never gave a reason, from what I know, but the fact they were withholding this for months as well and even while the Ukraine stuff was coming to a head they continued to do it anyways and then only released it after getting caught.

    It's like, what the hell are they thinking?
    Nobody ever claimed that Trump was smart. And neither are his supporters, because they keep believing him and his mouthpieces like Kennedy that still believes that Ukraine meddled in our election.

  10. #33370
    Quote Originally Posted by Orbitus View Post
    Nobody ever claimed that Trump was smart. And neither are his supporters, because they keep believing him and his mouthpieces like Kennedy that still believes that Ukraine meddled in our election.
    For the record, you are not allowed to say they are wrong. Someone may take offense to that.

    This has been directed by the powers that be. Even if they are objectively wrong.
    Quote Originally Posted by Knadra View Post
    Multiculturalism hurts and kills. This happened before Trump and it would be happening without him. Racism arises from a multicultural society. If we were monocultural, people would not see issues through the lens of race.
    This is a poster saying that people are at fault for being the victims of terrorism, because they are not white.

  11. #33371
    Merely a Setback Breccia's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Fugus View Post
    Has this been brought up yet?

    Quote Originally Posted by Orbitus View Post
    I remember the Lebanon aid being mentioned once or twice, but there was no reason it was mentioned yet.
    Yes. @Shadowferal mentioned it in this post.

    I remember the Lebanon aid being mentioned once or twice, but there was no reason it was mentioned yet.
    ]Withholding the aid even for a month after Congress learned he was withholding it and begged him to stop sounds like a dick move, and I'm curious to see how this figures into the GOP defense.

    "Aid was withheld from Ukraine because corruption! You heard him say the word 'corruption' in the phone call!"
    "No, we didn't."
    "Yes, but that's the story we're going with."
    "Okay. And Lebanon?"
    "Uh..."
    "Trump gave no reason at all. Are you calling Lebanon also corrupt? I'm sure they'd love to hear the administration say that. Just come out, and say in public, Lebanon is corrupt. Like, right now."
    "Well, Trump's not going to give a reason."
    "Doesn't that immediately invalidate the 'Because Corruption' defense, then? I mean, if Trump needed a legitimate reason to withhold aid to Ukraine, and the reason stated was 'Because Corruption' then surely he has a legitimate reason for withholding aid to Lebanon, too. Or, he's making shit up again."

    - - - Updated - - -

    So there's a report from the DoJ that's supposed to come out shortly. WaPo reports two things:

    1) The DoJ found no mishandling in the Russia probe, including catching Team Trump flat-out working with Russia without illegally spying to do it, and
    2) Barr read the report and chooses not to believe it, because reasons.

    Just a reminder: Barr's believe that President Trump is Emperor 40k or some shit shouldn't really be applied here. Trump wasn't President when he and his campaign intentionally worked with Russia and got caught.

    - - - Updated - - -

    So there are more releases from the Mueller report, but I'm sure there's nothing we haven't alr--

    On the night Comey was fired, a Justice Department spokesperson contacted Rosenstein. It's unclear what she said to him, but Rosenstein states his reply was that the DOJ “cannot participate in putting out a false story.”
    Huh. Interesting.

    - - - Updated - - -

    More info from the recently released documents.

    Remember how Trump said Mueller was just jealous and bitter and wanted revenge because he applied to be head of the FBI and Trump turned him down? If you don't remember, here is a FOX News link so there will be no blaming Fake News today.

    It has been reported that Robert Mueller is saying that he did not apply and interview for the job of FBI Director (and get turned down) the day before he was wrongfully appointed Special Counsel. Hope he doesn’t say that under oath in that we have numerous witnesses to the interview, including the Vice President of the United States!
    That's a Trump tweet, right there. Interestingly enough, Mueller did say that under oath, while Trump said it on Twitter.

    Well...funny story, and by that I mean, tired old punchline we've heard literally twelve thousand times. Trump was lying.

    The document sheds new light on the circumstances of Trump's May 16, 2017 meeting with Mueller in the Oval Office. Trump has claimed that Mueller applied for the suddenly vacant job of FBI director in that meeting and turned him down. The next day, Mueller was named special counsel investigating links between the Trump campaign and Russian interference in the 2016 election.

    In the interview, according to the notes published by BuzzFeed News, Rosenstein described feeling "angry, ashamed, horrified and embarrassed" at how the abrupt firing of then-FBI director James Comey on May 9, 2017 was handled. "It was also humiliating for Comey," his interviewers quoted Rosenstein as saying.

    Rosenstein said he spoke to Mueller, a former FBI director, about becoming special counsel the next day.

    He had a separate conversation with Mueller and then-Attorney General Jeff Sessions on May 13 to see if Mueller would be interested in returning to his old job as director, the notes say.

    "Mueller informed them he did not want to be interviewed for FBI director position," but told them his views about "what should be done with FBI," the document says. "Sessions thought Mueller's comments were 'brilliant,'" Rosenstein is quoted as saying.

    "Nevertheless, Mueller was placed on the White House's list of potential candidates for FBI director," the notes say. "Mueller was interviewed for the position of FBI director, but later decided to withdraw from consideration," the notes say.
    So there you have it.

  12. #33372
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    Apparently the Ghost of the Mueller investigation will continue to Haunt Trump for a while longer, as Michael fuckin' Cohen returns to the stage to proclaim: "That there were more communications with Russia and more communications with Trump than were reflected”

    In a not so shocking twist, the Fixer that Trump threw under the bus had a lot more to say then we were made privvy too, locked away in the bowls of an investigation report most of us weren't allowed to see. Gee, I wonder fuckin' why.

  13. #33373
    Quote Originally Posted by Xyonai View Post
    Apparently the Ghost of the Mueller investigation will continue to Haunt Trump for a while longer, as Michael fuckin' Cohen returns to the stage to proclaim: "That there were more communications with Russia and more communications with Trump than were reflected”

    In a not so shocking twist, the Fixer that Trump threw under the bus had a lot more to say then we were made privvy too, locked away in the bowls of an investigation report most of us weren't allowed to see. Gee, I wonder fuckin' why.
    Not entirely surprising. We kinda knew there was more. Because no way in hell does Manafort just give random internal Republican polling data to a Russian oligarch that is friends with Putin.

  14. #33374
    WASHINGTON — Attorney General William P. Barr has told Justice Department officials that he is skeptical of a conclusion by the department’s inspector general that the F.B.I. had sufficient information to open the investigation into whether any Trump associates conspired with Russia during the 2016 presidential race, according to two people familiar with the conversations.

    It was not clear what Mr. Barr based his uncertainty on. The threshold to open the Russia investigation was not particularly high. The F.B.I. can open a preliminary inquiry based on “information or an allegation” that a crime or threat to national security may have occurred or will occur, according to bureau policy. Typically, agents open counterintelligence investigations with a small amount of evidence, Lisa Page, a former F.B.I. lawyer who has also been a target of Mr. Trump’s ire, testified privately to congressional investigators last year.
    Looking forward to see if Barr will twist the truth according to those fucked up conspiracy theories again, this guy will go down as the worst AG ever.

    Russia Inquiry Review Is Expected to Undercut Trump Claim of F.B.I. Spying
    The F.B.I. never tried to place undercover agents or informants inside the Trump campaign, a highly anticipated inspector general’s report is expected to find.



    Odd how republicans are ok with the tax money being spent on Trumps conspiracies and "OMG WITCH HUNT" bullshit stories. Every single one of the "witch hunts" were justified and came up with something. Unlike his own birtherism witch hunt.
    Last edited by Crispin; 2019-12-03 at 08:19 AM.

  15. #33375
    Quote Originally Posted by Crispin View Post
    Like I said in many other posts, if they had such a damning report, they would have released it 2 months ago when they said that the Horowitz report was going to exonerate Trump when it came to the FISA warrants that were issued. The Durham report is going to be largely the same. There is a reason there hasn't been any charges filed, even though they labeled it a "criminal investigation" even though they haven't really shown who they are investigating.

  16. #33376
    Member when Trump said he have a trade deal before the 2020 election...
    I member

    https://www.marketwatch.com/story/di...?mod=home-page

  17. #33377
    The Insane Belize's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by kaelleria View Post
    Member when Trump said he have a trade deal before the 2020 election...
    I member

    https://www.marketwatch.com/story/di...?mod=home-page
    What's that smell? Christmas Tariffs? Oh-hoh-hoh!

  18. #33378
    Quote Originally Posted by kaelleria View Post
    Member when Trump said he have a trade deal before the 2020 election...
    I member

    https://www.marketwatch.com/story/di...?mod=home-page
    Yeah, now he's shifting to "You gotta reelect me or nothing will get done in this trade war I started!" I remember when he claimed trade wars were easy to win...

  19. #33379
    Merely a Setback Breccia's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Xyonai View Post
    the Fixer that Trump threw under the bus had a lot more to say then we were made privvy too
    While "more of this please!" is the first, second, third, and most of eleventh through twentieth things that leap to mind, if Cohen can't prove it, it'll be handwaved with all the other witnesses who said "Trump intentionally broke the rules/law/weight limit". At the very minimum, he needs to say such under oath. Yes, again.

    Quote Originally Posted by Crispin View Post
    "It was not clear what Mr. Barr based his uncertainty on."
    Oh, I think we all know what this uncertainty is based on. "If I release this report as is, I'll be called a traitor, a Never Trumper, and possibly fired."

    Quote Originally Posted by kaelleria View Post
    Member when Trump said he have a trade deal before the 2020 election
    Now this is something I should have seen looming on the horizon, like the S. S. Fatass sailing back to port on goddam steam and a hull full of lies, mysogyny, and spelling errors.

    Putting the trade deal off till past the election fits exactly in with Trump's standard procedure. Trump has no results to speak of, so he has to run on promises. In this case, however, it's especially fat, sweating, and orange. If literally anyone but Trump is elected, like we're talking even Sarah Palin here, the tariffs Trump unilaterally placed on China that gutted GDP, manufacturing jobs and retail will immediately be removed with a flick of a pen held in substantially larger hands. Trump's "Only I Can Fix It" becomes laughably false. Still, "I'm putting the trade deal off until after the election" (he did the same with Israel, remember? Bang up job there) plays a lot better to a crowd than "Well, I'm still in control, and I have no idea how to fix this place!"

  20. #33380

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