The apparent formula for new classes in WoW

[Teriz]

It's not a matter of them being introduced in an expansion about a demonic invasion, it's your claim about them being thematically tied to the landmass. They aren't. They're thematically tied to the expansion, but not the area that expansion was located.

The area in question houses the tomb of Sagaras. Which is the entire purpose behind its use as locale in Legion. How is a landmass that is tied to demons and the legion not thematically tied to Demon Hunters?

And humorously, we're both wrong about MOBA origins, but that's really beside the point. Blizzard didn't officially release a MOBA until HoTs. Any fan made stuff is just that. DHs have their roots in the RTS, but so does nearly every class up until Evoker because new stuff has to happen eventually.

Which is why I said RTS/MOBA.

If anything, Evoker marks the end of the trend of having classes being based on previous lore. This is the first actual new class we've gotten.

Uh, Evokers are also based on previous lore. Mainly the long established lore of black dragons attempting to create an artificial race of dragons that combine the powers of the flights.

[MoanaLisa]

Obviously Blizzard is not going to introduce a new race/class with zero context surrounding it. I doubt if there's some formula for it other than common sense and a constricted number of ways to introduce context when limited to an expansion release and a very few patches. Identifying foreshadowing after the fact is an exercise in 20/20 vision.

[arkanon]

Obviously Blizzard is not going to introduce a new race/class with zero context surrounding it. I doubt if there's some formula for it other than common sense and a constricted number of ways to introduce context when limited to an expansion release and a very few patches. Identifying foreshadowing after the fact is an exercise in 20/20 vision.

Yeah, i feel like a certain someone is putting the cart before the horse. Obviously they decide to add a new class, and then ensure that they are integrated in a "natural" way by partially crafting the expansion around their introduction. I HIGHLY doubt they sit around making an expansion, fleshing out the theme and setting, the main NPCs and stories, and then suddenly go "hey, you know what would fit PERFECTLY with all this? a fucking dragon class!" and then someone at the back of the room shouts out "OMFG! hear me out, the setting, themes, and new class ALSO work perfectly with a new dragon RACE! what are the chances!" and then the boss yells out "pay rise for everyone!"

[Jazzhands]

The area in question houses the tomb of Sagaras. Which is the entire purpose behind its use as locale in Legion. How is a landmass that is tied to demons and the legion not thematically tied to Demon Hunters?



Which is why I said RTS/MOBA.



Uh, Evokers are also based on previous lore. Mainly the long established lore of black dragons attempting to create an artificial race of dragons that combine the powers of the flights.

The Legion messed around on countless planets. That doesn't thematically connect Demon hunters to every location the Legion has a presence at. They aren't tied to Argus in any way, for example, while the Legion heavily is. The Tomb is related to the Legion, but has nothing to do with Demon Hunters until Demons attack it and they... well, needed to be hunted.

Evokers themselves are brand new. They're a fresh class that's been added to the world in a way that fits existing lore and magics. DKs, DHs, and Monks on the other hand were all featured far back in the RTS, as are practically all the other classes until Evoker. This is why Evokers potentially mark the end of said trend, they're the first class not based on an already existing class or major lore figure from the RTS. And just having some abilities ripped from the MOBA doesn't make them based on a class from said MOBA, they're literally just dragon mages using dragon spells so of course they will have similarities to pre-existing dragon entities, not to mention Blizzards love of reusing assets and recycling ideas to save time and money.

[Teriz]

Obviously Blizzard is not going to introduce a new race/class with zero context surrounding it.

Plenty of posters believe otherwise.

[Lolites]

only formula for wow classes since vanila is:
1. they want to add class? they will
the end
nothing else beyond that, especialy since we know runemaster, which ticks none of the point mentioned, was considered for classic and then again in wrath...
and sure, it didnt make the cut, but why would it be considered second time if the criteria were not met first time?

[Gaidax]

only formula for wow classes since vanila is:
1. they want to add class? they will
the end
nothing else beyond that, especialy since we know runemaster, which ticks none of the point mentioned, was considered for classic and then again in wrath...
and sure, it didnt make the cut, but why would it be considered second time if the criteria were not met first time?

Of course, but they will most certainly wrap a story around that and tie it to expansion.

It won't be - here is a Nature/Elune expansion and BTW we toss in Tinkers completely unrelated to story, whatever. They will create a story for them that will be integral to the expansion.

Practically yes, they can add whatever they want, but it won't be some detached addition with 0 expansion story sense/relation to it.


Like for example they considered adding Demon Hunters in Wrath. They didn't, but if they'd do - it would most certainly be tied to the events of WC3:TFT, where Illidan was gunning for the Frozen Throne, being forced by Kil'jaeden to do so. So they story could be that a bunch of Illidan's scattered Demon Hunters got intercepted by Kil'jaeden and coerced to finish the job.

/shrug

[Teriz]

The Legion messed around on countless planets. That doesn't thematically connect Demon hunters to every location the Legion has a presence at. They aren't tied to Argus in any way, for example, while the Legion heavily is. The Tomb is related to the Legion, but has nothing to do with Demon Hunters until Demons attack it and they... well, needed to be hunted.

Outside of a Demonic invasion, why else would you introduce Demon Hunters? Additionally, where else on Azeroth would be more appropriate for a demonic invasion on a new landmass than the Broken Isles?

Evokers themselves are brand new. They're a fresh class that's been added to the world in a way that fits existing lore and magics. DKs, DHs, and Monks on the other hand were all featured far back in the RTS, as are practically all the other classes until Evoker. This is why Evokers potentially mark the end of said trend, they're the first class not based on an already existing class or major lore figure from the RTS. And just having some abilities ripped from the MOBA doesn't make them based on a class from said MOBA, they're literally just dragon mages using dragon spells so of course they will have similarities to pre-existing dragon entities, not to mention Blizzards love of reusing assets and recycling ideas to save time and money.

Eh, Deathwing was a playable hero in WC2. Also in WC2, Alexstraza was behind the Dragonroost, which allowed the horde to produce dragon units. Additionally, in WC3 you could play as a Blue, Red, Black, Green, or Bronze dragon. Blue had a frost attack, and Bronze had a lightning attack. Evokers potentially have those breath attacks.

So yeah, this class also has a basis in the RTS games.

[Gaidax]

Outside of a Demonic invasion, why else would you introduce Demon Hunters?

Mentioned above, but it was edit so in case you did not see.

Blizzard actually considered introducing Demon Hunters in WoTLK, the Meta locks got there was a byproduct of them toying with the idea.

They would likely have tie in to story for sure, given events of WC3:TFT, where Illidan got forced by Kil'jaeden to take out the Frozen Throne. As Illidan's disciples, DH could be very well shared same fate of being forced by Kil'jaeden to do so again.

So there you go, story that makes sense for DH in WoTLK.

[Neuroticaine]

The DH existed as an RTS character in WC3 first before anything else. The MOBA genre came from RTS games like WC3.

I'm really struggling to figure out the point you're trying to make in this thread.

New Classes are based off pre-existing ideas in the franchise' lore, which is spread across a long running MMO, a couple of off-shoot side games, and the 3 RTS games that predated the MMO. This much is obvious.

New classes are generally tied in some way to the theme of an expansion. This much is obvious.

New classes try to offer gameplay that is new and unique and not already offered by existing classes. This much is obvious.

There is constantly speculation on what's coming next, and once we have a genuine idea of what's coming next, we generally figure out the class from the obvious. Speculation on the current expansion went from "If we go to to the Dragon Isles, we might get a Dragon-themed class" to "we're probably going to the Dragon Isles, so if we get a new class, it'll be dragon-themed."

[Teriz]

Mentioned above, but it was edit so in case you did not see.

Blizzard actually considered introducing Demon Hunters in WoTLK, the Meta locks got there was a byproduct of them toying with the idea.

They would likely have tie in to story for sure, given events of WC3:TFT, where Illidan got forced by Kil'jaeden to take out the Frozen Throne. As Illidan's disciples, DH could be very well shared same fate of being forced by Kil'jaeden to do so again.

So there you go, story that makes sense for DH in WoTLK.

Yeah, but the fact that they nixed that idea and waited for Legion proves my point.

[Phob]

So after the Evoker, it appears that this is required for new WoW expansion classes;

1. A major lore figure to tie into. Death Knights have Arthas, Monks have Chen, Demon Hunters have Illidan, and it appears that Evokers have Alexstraza.

2. A playable version in MOBA/RTS format. Blizzard seems to favor players getting a preview of future class mechanics via their MOBA/RTS games. When the new class releases, the pull abilities and mechanics from those games.

3. A landmass that thematically connects to the new class. DKs had Northrend, Monks had Pandaria, Demon Hunters had Broken Isles, Evokers have Dragon Isles. The next class will likely also have a landmass that matches its theme.

4. Abilities that don't fit in existing classes. The expansion classes house abilities that simply wouldn't work with classes that existed at the time.

Obviously, none of this is set in stone, and Blizzard can do whatever they want, but at this point this appears to be the keys for future class implementation. If you look at the recent DR implementation, they seem to fail at #3 and 4, which partially explains why they weren't implemented.

OK and? /10

[Teriz]

I'm really struggling to figure out the point you're trying to make in this thread.

While many posters figured out that we were getting a dragon themed class, the majority believed that we were getting dragon knights or TTRPG Dragonsworn. If they had followed the formula, they would have recognized that we were going to get a race/class combination akin to the dragon heroes in HotS (and WC2).

[Phob]

While many posters figured out that we were getting a dragon themed class, the majority believed that we were getting dragon knights or TTRPG Dragonsworn. If they had followed the formula, they would have recognized that we were going to get a race/class combination akin to the dragon heroes in HotS (and WC2).

Hey, the majority isn't just you and a few people who you have seen on the forum. The majority just plays the game and doesn't care what form of Dragon blizzard wants to implement.

[arkanon]

While many posters figured out that we were getting a dragon themed class, the majority believed that we were getting dragon knights or TTRPG Dragonsworn. If they had followed the formula, they would have recognized that we were going to get a race/class combination akin to the dragon heroes in HotS (and WC2).

Do you admit you yourself did NOT recognise this "formula" until After the announcement?

Remember your OLD formula said Tinker was coming, since it was "foreshadowed"?

[Teriz]

Do you admit you yourself did NOT recognise this "formula" until After the announcement?

Remember your OLD formula said Tinker was coming, since it was "foreshadowed"?

I stated multiple times before the announcement that we were getting a race/class combined dragon class based largely on the HotS dragon heroes.

[Lochton]

So after the Evoker, it appears that this is required for new WoW expansion classes;

1. A major lore figure to tie into. Death Knights have Arthas, Monks have Chen, Demon Hunters have Illidan, and it appears that Evokers have Alexstraza.

2. A playable version in MOBA/RTS format. Blizzard seems to favor players getting a preview of future class mechanics via their MOBA/RTS games. When the new class releases, the pull abilities and mechanics from those games.

3. A landmass that thematically connects to the new class. DKs had Northrend, Monks had Pandaria, Demon Hunters had Broken Isles, Evokers have Dragon Isles. The next class will likely also have a landmass that matches its theme.

4. Abilities that don't fit in existing classes. The expansion classes house abilities that simply wouldn't work with classes that existed at the time.

Obviously, none of this is set in stone, and Blizzard can do whatever they want, but at this point this appears to be the keys for future class implementation. If you look at the recent DR implementation, they seem to fail at #3 and 4, which partially explains why they weren't implemented.

We cannot believe them to follow a formula as there are more factors to it than this.

[Teriz]

We cannot believe them to follow a formula as there are more factors to it than this.

We’re 4/4 so far.

[RobertMugabe]

Obviously Blizzard is not going to introduce a new race/class with zero context surrounding it. I doubt if there's some formula for it other than common sense and a constricted number of ways to introduce context when limited to an expansion release and a very few patches. Identifying foreshadowing after the fact is an exercise in 20/20 vision.

This and /thread

[Lochton]

We’re 4/4 so far.

Except you don't have any points of behind the scenes or more, for else we would've had Tinker by now, maybe even Necromancer at a stretch, as Unholy Death Knight doesn't fully tie in - a little same treatment as Warlock Vs. Demon Hunter. Time, money, priority, recent release of races, or classes - these as well, counts on the list.