4.0.1 trinket ranking

[Vanderhuge]

These DPS numbers take all of the new mechanics into consideration? I'm pretty sure that TAiaJ was proccing less often on the PTR than Live...

[Ebbikenezer]

Tbh, im gonna use the badge trinket together with Silver of pur ice hc. they are 264 ilvl, but they both give mana back in some way. and i honestly think thats gonna be even more importaint, atleast in 4.0.1 and ICC.

From my experience healing as Disc and Holy (priest obv) on the PTR... mana isn't an issue if you are aware of the new mechanics for mana return and you don't have an issue overhealing. I've always prided myself on topping the meters with the least overhealing so I don't have much trouble in 4.0.1... as a priest anyways. I DID have to learn some new styles, but nothing so dramatic I couldn't perform, Holy is actually OP imho.

Oh! Later edit: The Meteorite Crystal from 10m Algalon is very nice as it is +111 Int and use is for +140 Spirit per stack instead of 60mp5 (so more regen) plus the int also converts to SP. I have always used this trinket as Disc, but it is working really well as Holy on the PTR, better than I thought it would.

[Requital]

These DPS numbers take all of the new mechanics into consideration? I'm pretty sure that TAiaJ was proccing less often on the PTR than Live...

No that is just for the DBW change, I'm going to work on ptr stuff today and see if I can find stack time for SM and what procs motes and the speed involved.

[keyadis]

For holy I will personally be using Sliver of Pure Ice [Heroic] and Purified Lunar Dust as the SP on both of these convert to INT as SP is going away on all non weapon items. The sliver gives 152 INT and the Lunar Dust gives 153, along with the 5% buff from wearing all plate, im expecting a large increase in intellect, which I suspect will still be the best stat to stack for Holy Paladins throughout Cataclysm.

[Deleted]

Is there a confirmation on Herkuml yet? I assume WFS will still be better but does it win out over older trinkets like DMC:G and others?

[underdogba]

for tanks, it'll still be stam, even more so cause you get +20% stam just for speccing prot and wearing plate.

It's actually closer to 21%, because the two effects are not additive, they're multiplicative.

[Nairobi]

So I was playing around on Cata today and I thought hmmm I need to know what swaps I should make the day 4.0 releases so I started digging through all the Trinkets and well trinkets mainly not much else is changing really. So if you have wondered about DPS numbers for Trinkets for 4.0 wonder no more while these are for my gear they should be relatively close for most people.

So I turned the 264 DBW and 271 Scale into 284 Scale and 277 DBW for Cata technically the 271 scale should be just behind the 277 DBW and 264 DBW right ahead of the 264 WFS. I didn't change any other items on this list so the low DBW is still the ArP version 277 we have currently same with the scale the 284 which is the current 284 scale with ArP. I'm writing a full Trinket list right now in ArP just changing old Trinkets and names etc I'll throw the updated image up a little later so you can compare all trinkets.

I've been playing with this and would love to see what you come up with for TAJ

Currently I've tried a few setups. All testing is done using 5/0/31 spec with SoT, TV, and Exo glyphs. I'm using a 277 cryptmaker, and mostly BIS ICC25 gear. I've reforged in priority for haste > mastery > crit.
Trinket setups:

H WFS, TAJ 264 Best parse - 6950 dps
H WFS, H DBW Best parse - 7416 dps
H DBW, TAJ 264 Best parse - 7526 dps

I've rotated trinkets (and reforged accordingly) for each test. Each test was conducted 5 times, on the level 80 (non-boss....stupid kids wont leave it non-debuffed long enough for me to get a steady baseline) dummy. Test was just normal rotation, ie no wings/zealotry. Tests ran to 5mil dmg before conclusion.

I know it's not super scientific, but I'm just wondering if TAJ is worth losing at 80, or if I should hold onto it through 4.0.1? As for motes not proc'ing as much, here is my latest data set if that helps:

Total dmg:5030742 Total time:11m,15s DPS:7350.3
TV - 109 hits, 1,228k dmg, 24.4% overall
Melee - 270 hits, 812k dmg, 16.1% overall
CS - 166 hits, 806k dmg, 16.0% overall
SoT - 640 hits, 543k dmg, 10.6%
Censure - 294 hits, 521k dmg, 10.3%
Exo - 44 hits, 344k, 6.8%
SoC - 910 hits, 301k, 6.0%
Judgement - 60 hits, 242k, 4.8%
Manifest anger - 96 hits, 136k dmg, 2.7%
Holy Wrath - 8 hits, 72k, 1.4%
Exo Glyph - 13 hits, 34k, 0.7%

Anecdotal evidence makes me FEEL like TAJ should still take precedence over another crit trinket, but I cant seem to get any test to be conclusive. Perhaps the answer simply IS that it is too close to call, but it seems to me that there HAS to be a winner. The problem with the ret system now, with mastery especially, is the extreme RNG nature of an encounter, even a 15 minute one, can vary data enough to skew results. Whether its chain HoL procs, (un)lucky DBW procs, etc. the damage values can fluctuate wildly. Sadly I haven't picked up an STS yet to test with, so hopefully someone can test those values.

[cyqu]

i'll try to make one ranking as soon as i'll get my hands on Cata dvd box)

hopefully its not as bad as the other one

[Mokal]

BiS trinkets for Holy, Halion HC, and maybe hc solace.
for retributin: dbw and halion trinket.

[Nairobi]

for retributin: dbw and halion trinket.

Any math for this? Not that I don't believe it, as it seems this latest round of tuning is making pure iLvl win out over "flavor" items (ie no more 200 libram for holy, no more algalon trinket for holy, so potentially no more TAJ over the raw stat bank of STS), especially with lower overall seal damage and manifest anger being a strike and not a melee hit (ie, no mastery benefit). That said, I still see equal or better numbers with TAJ 264 over WFS 264. I'm sure the gap widens at the 271/284 ilvl with STS, but I'd just like to see some tests/parses/rawr configs showing it to be true. Napkin math, seat of the pants conjecture and heresay never sit well with me

[Alenko]

So I was playing around on Cata today and I thought hmmm I need to know what swaps I should make the day 4.0 releases so I started digging through all the Trinkets and well trinkets mainly not much else is changing really. So if you have wondered about DPS numbers for Trinkets for 4.0 wonder no more while these are for my gear they should be relatively close for most people.

-img snip-

So I turned the 264 DBW and 271 Scale into 284 Scale and 277 DBW for Cata technically the 271 scale should be just behind the 277 DBW and 264 DBW right ahead of the 264 WFS. I didn't change any other items on this list so the low DBW is still the ArP version 277 we have currently same with the scale the 284 which is the current 284 scale with ArP. I'm writing a full Trinket list right now in ArP just changing old Trinkets and names etc I'll throw the updated image up a little later so you can compare all trinkets.

pretty sure war token will be really good (better than DBW even dont know just guestemating) with crit being low on the totem poll of stats and haste be really good. also the crit buff from DBW will be sub par as well and a flat amount of haste will be better than an on proc haste that shares a chance to proc as ap or crit. again opionn based on obeservations.

[Mattsvaliant]

Not sure which spec you're talking about. For holy, i'm guessing that high ilvl spellpower trinkets that we used to ignore so far (gunship, halion and badge trinkets) will become very good as spellpower becomes a much more desirable stat than before. For ret, i guess DBW moves up the list due to haste.

Except for the fact that spell power is being removed from all gear but weapons.

[Alenko]

Except for the fact that spell power is being removed from all gear but weapons.

not trinkets, Solace still has SP on it on PTR

[Mattsvaliant]

not trinkets, Solace still has SP on it on PTR

Ive been going by WoWhead Cata, which states the solaces are at 128 int 32 per stack for the normal, and 144 int and 38 per stack for the heroic. (iirc)

[Mokal]

Any math for this? Not that I don't believe it, as it seems this latest round of tuning is making pure iLvl win out over "flavor" items (ie no more 200 libram for holy, no more algalon trinket for holy, so potentially no more TAJ over the raw stat bank of STS), especially with lower overall seal damage and manifest anger being a strike and not a melee hit (ie, no mastery benefit). That said, I still see equal or better numbers with TAJ 264 over WFS 264. I'm sure the gap widens at the 271/284 ilvl with STS, but I'd just like to see some tests/parses/rawr configs showing it to be true. Napkin math, seat of the pants conjecture and heresay never sit well with me

TaJ getting huge nerf when the patch hits, unless it is a bug in ptr side.

[Nairobi]

TaJ getting huge nerf when the patch hits, unless it is a bug in ptr side.

I guess that's what I'm wondering. I've heard on beta that it has an abysmal proc chance, esp 81+. But on PTR it really doesn't seem that much lower than normal. And even with seals being less of our dmg, TAJ is still competitive or superior to WFS264. On beta is it ONLY proc'ing from melee or something?

[Ronark]

I guess that's what I'm wondering. I've heard on beta that it has an abysmal proc chance, esp 81+. But on PTR it really doesn't seem that much lower than normal. And even with seals being less of our dmg, TAJ is still competitive or superior to WFS264. On beta is it ONLY proc'ing from melee or something?

On the beta it has a reduce proc chance per level of gaining motes, just like all trinkets do- Although I think it is closer to 80% then 60% then 0% at L83 or something.

[Nairobi]

On the beta it has a reduce proc chance per level of gaining motes, just like all trinkets do- Although I think it is closer to 80% then 60% then 0% at L83 or something.

I guess I phrased my question poorly, sorry. What I am working on is an ideal setup for 4.0.1 while we are still at 80. I don't plan on keeping TAJ past 81-82 for various reasons, but basic testing shows that it is still competitive at 80. Since we still have ~2 months with 4.0.1 til Cata proper launches, I was hoping to theorycraft for that period of time. So, on that note, at 80 is TAJ "nerfed" on Beta?

[Ronark]

I guess I phrased my question poorly, sorry. What I am working on is an ideal setup for 4.0.1 while we are still at 80. I don't plan on keeping TAJ past 81-82 for various reasons, but basic testing shows that it is still competitive at 80. Since we still have ~2 months with 4.0.1 til Cata proper launches, I was hoping to theorycraft for that period of time. So, on that note, at 80 is TAJ "nerfed" on Beta?

In that case.... see post #21 in this thread.

[Vanderhuge]

Before you fool around with reforging, you'll probably see about 2% damage done coming from Manifest Anger. With Haste prioritized, reforging got my MA back into the 3-4% range, so it's not too different from Live in my case.