[Megathread] Wildstar - Now F2P

[Edge-]

GW2 is a sequel. it's very famous IP on MMO arena. Comparing budgets is lame. We all know there SWTORs budget went almost entirely - to something GW2 doesn't have, practically.

It is a sequel. However walk up to 20 people on the street and ask them if they've heard of Guild Wars or Star Wars. I'm willing to be a lot of money everyone will say Star Wars and you may get 1-2 people who say Guild Wars.

As for budgets, if you don't want to get into development budgets, then just look at marketing budgets. SWTOR's marketing budget absolutely destroyed GW2's in a major way.

Is calling water a water insulting too?

Nope. But they're not all freeloaders. Freeloaders are a negative aspect to something. However free players are absolutely necessary and beneficial to a F2P MMO. Are they as beneficial as paying players? No. But they still provide a benefit to the game by providing populated worlds.

I'm pretty sure you are talking about a bad game that no one wants to play for the price it is offered. So why would anyone want to play it, regardless of the status of the server population in the FIRST PLACE?

Indeed, many of these MMO's weren't great at launch so people left in droves. However F2P provided an opportunity people to come back and play for a bit for free or while paying small amounts (and for whales to drop some big cash), spurring revenue generation and allowing these games to improve where they would have ended up like Warhammer.

SWTOR was design as p2p game.
Newerwinter is design as f2p game
Every f2p game is designed around cash shop. some are better at it so YOU don't notice it.
Also every f2p game is designed around whales. Does it ring a bell now?

I wasn't aware of how both those games were designed, thanks for the clarification.

And all games are designed around their business model. That doesn't make them inherently better/worse/good/evil.

- - - Updated - - -

It actually isn't, like I said it shares the same lore (hence the name) but it plays 100% different. If I had to pick between the 2 games to get updates I would pick Guild wars 1. Play both and then tell me it's a sequel.

It is a sequel. A sequel doesn't have to have identical gameplay to be a sequel. It's a numbered sequel to GW1 and has been described as a sequel by ArenaNet themselves.[/QUOTE]

[Fencers]

It actually isn't, like I said it shares the same lore (hence the name) but it plays 100% different. If I had to pick between the 2 games to get updates I would pick Guild wars 1. Play both and then tell me it's a sequel.

It's a sequel. How the game plays is not actually a determinate. GW2 is set in the same universe, continues the same fictional world, uses the same context for it's setting, etc.

It is also chro0nilgically marked as afterward. In setting, narrative and marketing. 2.

Just like musicals and plays- Rent 2012, Golddiggers 1933, etc.

That is a sequel by definition.

[syar]

How do they design around the shops? TSW is an obvious example of how they design around the shop by providing DLC (but that's B2P not F2P so that's moot in this context). Rift doesn't offer any content in the shops, just some cosmetic things designed around stuff that was already in the game before they went F2P (mounts, costumes, etc).

Well you have to sell things that people WANT to buy. And if you succeed at that then you are designing the game around them since if you don't have the money for them/don't want to purchase you are screwed. You can of course make a game with a cash shop that features stuff that nobody really wants. ( don't have to be an economic mastermind to understand where that will fail )

[jearle]

Welp, I'm out. Can't invest the time needed to make a sub worthwhile.

This seems pretty ludicrous to me. How many hours a week do you play MMOs? How much time investment do you need to make for 15 bucks to be worthwhile? I know that everyone has varying levels of income, but Im curious to hear further about your statement.

[Newbryn]

Well you have to sell things that people WANT to buy. And if you succeed at that then you are designing the game around them since if you don't have the money for them/don't want to purchase you are screwed. You can of course make a game with a cash shop that features stuff that nobody really wants. ( don't have to be an economic mastermind to understand where that will fail )

I can't really think of any business that will sell something that people don't want to buy, but expect to make a profit so yea..........................

[Elim Garak]

I can't really think of any business that will sell something that people don't want to buy, but expect to make a profit so yea..........................

Ever heard of marketing? It's about making people want to buy things they don't normally want.

[Kelimbror]

Seeing the forum backlash on several sites including this one makes me think that Wildstar just made the one mistake that will drive this game to F2P. I still feel like they are pulling a bait and switch like most sub MMOs that have launched in the last few years. The amount of people who have declared they won't even buy touch the game now is staggering.

There is no way to rectify this other than completely going back on the model. From the invention and implementation of CREDD, I just don't see that happening. This is going to play out just like Rift. They are going to preach the merits of subscription being a service, give pretty frequent updates (that they have been designing for years now), and then a couple of years in flip that F2P switch and recant everything they've told you previously.

What an awful thing to announce for Gamescom. I hope people get trashed at their free drink party and let the devs know "Thanks for the free drinks, but I won't be buying the game during the cash grab phase!"

[Vexies]

This seems pretty ludicrous to me. How many hours a week do you play MMOs? How much time investment do you need to make for 15 bucks to be worthwhile? I know that everyone has varying levels of income, but Im curious to hear further about your statement.

Its not ludicrous in the slightest. Its a fact of reality for those who are older / have more demands on their time than simply playing video games. This varies from person to person (obviously) but there is a large sect of older gamers out there with work, family, life demands that simply dont have a lot of time to invest in games but still enjoy MMO's. This also includes those who simply like to play many games rather than dedicate themselves to one game for a large chunk of time. For these groups a sub is hard to justify, especially if your only spending 10 hours or so a week in game. Why pay the sub? B2P, F2P gives this demographic the ability to enjoy this genre without the pressure / commitment of a sub. Only 15 bucks you say? sure but not everyone just likes throwing money out the window just cause it doesn't seem like all that much.

a couple of years in flip that F2P switch

Your being overly generous. They MIGHT make it a couple of years if its successful. Given the reception / market environment its launching in, one year tops

[Newbryn]

Ever heard of marketing? It's about making people want to buy things they don't normally want.

Sorry after reading most of what you write I cant take anything you say seriously, so this will be the only response you get from me.

[Kelimbror]

Your being overly generous. They MIGHT make it a couple of years if its successful. Given the reception / market environment its launching in, one year tops

I'm imagining it to pay out exactly like Rift which did exist as a dwindling sub service for longer than standard companies operate. Though with this being NCSoft, I imagine it would convert much quicker.

There's always that crazy notion that this will pull a WoW...haha...I have to laugh just typing it. But..it is a possibility. I'm not going to bet any money on it though.

[Valeron]

There's always that crazy notion that this will pull a WoW...haha...I have to laugh just typing it. But..it is a possibility. I'm not going to bet any money on it though.

crazy notion indeed. WoW had a perfect storm condition when it came out, that will never happen again.

[SinR]

why is everyone doomsaying Wildstar since its going Sub based?

[Fencers]

Ever heard of marketing? It's about making people want to buy things they don't normally want.

Um, no?

I work in market research. That isn't what marketing is at all.

Seeing the forum backlash on several sites including this one makes me think that Wildstar just made the one mistake that will drive this game to F2P. I still feel like they are pulling a bait and switch like most sub MMOs that have launched in the last few years. The amount of people who have declared they won't even buy touch the game now is staggering.

Yea, the reaction is quite something.

Massive miscalculation in the long run I think.

[Dorfadin]

BEST NEWS EVER, monthly sub, me and my guild are 100% going to play now, no whiny kids who can't afford the price of a pack of cigarettes or equivalent for a months sub to worry about and plenty hardcore raiding))

[syar]

why is everyone doomsaying Wildstar since its going Sub based?

It was quite predictable.You have the F2P and the P2P crowd .. somebody will QQ eighter way.

[Fencers]

BEST NEWS EVER, monthly sub, me and my guild are 100% going to play now, no whiny kids who can't afford the price of a pack of cigarettes or equivalent for a months sub to worry about and plenty hardcore raiding))

Do you honestly think only serious adults are like playing World of Warcraft by contrast?

I mean. Honestly here.

[wombinator04]

Well we do have some time until Wildstar is released. Who knows, they may change their payment models, but I'd rather them focus on gameplay than a business model now.

But it may be too late for a change, who knows at this point. Wish I had beta!

[Edge-]

BEST NEWS EVER, monthly sub, me and my guild are 100% going to play now, no whiny kids who can't afford the price of a pack of cigarettes or equivalent for a months sub to worry about and plenty hardcore raiding))

Huh, I don't seem to run into the "whiny kids" in the F2P MMO's I play any more than in the subscription based ones I play/have played. Guess I'm just lucky?

[Kelimbror]

Yea, the reaction is quite something.

Massive miscalculation in the long run I think.

I think it's more intentional, much like what we've seen recently, but still a mistake in the long run, yes. This is an intriguing development for observation purposes though. I thought we had hit the plateau of 'failed' games in order to trigger a proper change of business strategy in this market, but apparently we need another martyr.

[Valeron]

BEST NEWS EVER, monthly sub, me and my guild are 100% going to play now, no whiny kids who can't afford the price of a pack of cigarettes or equivalent for a months sub to worry about and plenty hardcore raiding))

because WoW doesn't have any whiny kids