Is WoW always going to be like this?

[Venant]

People will always choose the easy way. And I mean ALWAYS with caps and bold, if the chance/option is given to the player base.

Ex:
1- Looking for Group tool: Everyone uses it to level up. No one is doing quest to level up. Resulting in a empty world
2- 25 man drops = 10 man drops. Results: The number of 25 man guilds dropped DRAMITICLY and are now near to extinct.

Its just human nature man. If an easy route is presented to us WE will always follow it 99% of the people.
Blizzard gave us the option. Is just normal to expect this behavior from people.

"You cant blame the 7 year old kid for crashing and breaking his leg on a bike...You blame the adult that gave him the bike to ride" xD

Are you claiming that there was a time when people didn't chose the easy road? The truth is that people naturally choose what they see as the best route to an objective. I remember in vanilla that when they made it easier to get high ranks in pvp, raiders stopped raiding en masse and started pvping for their gear. I don't know what type of magical world you want to imagine where everyone that plays the game is either a gladiator or an elite raider.

The truth is that the difficulty curve of WoW is designed in such a way that only a very small % of players ever make it to the actual top, so perhaps your problem is that you have a different vision of what 'the top' is than what the developers consider it to be. You have to ask yourself whether your bias in this area is reflective of your own overestimation of your own talent, which results in your condemnation of the game as 'too accessible' even though you yourself have not accessed the elite aspects of the game.

[Sicarius87]

If you want to avoid this, avoid LFR. Problem solved.

[Rogabr]

The sentence "full epic" to refer "I'm LFR geared." is going to make you laughed at.

laughed at by who?

more hardcore players than you are?

do you really think that a new player, someone who plays maybe once a week would really care what someone whos put in more time than them think? do you actually think that anyone REALLY cares? to the new player, to the absolute casual (no not that retard that plays 8 hours a day and doesnt actually do anything but still thinks theyre a casual because they dont raid) they dont give a shit who thinks what of them. To them, they have seen all the content that the game has to offer. so whats left? a harder version? most people dont go through a singleplayer game multiple times just for the harder difficulties, theyve seen what the game has to offer and thats it.

- - - Updated - - -

If you want to avoid this, avoid LFR. Problem solved.

try getting into a flex raid without LFR gear and no guild to help you gear up on previous normal modes (because theyre just going to say "go to LFR")

go on

[Rilas13]

It's a fair point and im not entirely sure how to balance it. Blizz likes LFR so the mass player base can see their content. They won't want to go the other way too much. I have had an issue staying interested in this game since Wrath came out. My community started to die and iv just come and gone for months many times now since then. And now the video has it pretty well pegged. At this point I can play a few classes well and one exceptionally well as I have put a lot of time into it. Into Normal SoO. However im starting to question the point as I get further along.
My best short term solution is to make LFR not exist for the most current tier level. So now that we are up to SoO, LFR will only allow players to see ToT. Maybe in next expac situations allow SoO in new xpac pre-patch. As it will not be the primary focus anymore.
Guild levels should disappear. They hurt more then help. People spam guild invites forever and a day because there isn't any reason not to. Worst case someone says no. Best case you have a new person that while they are in the guild will help level it or one day agree to do things at max level. It is a farm scheme.

Leveling is currently broken in all but most current of content and it is only ever getting further broken. The game has never been so unfriendly to new players. People have no reason to help others. Old players leveling a new char can do literally anything they may want or need. And level themselves as hermits with quests. Even if heirlooms didn't exist it is still such a sub part of the game now. It has all been expedited to get everyone to the climax of current content. Leveling is arbitrary, new players don't have to learn their class in the slightest.

I'm sorry that turned into more of a rant then I originally intended.

[Deleted]

The question being asked here is...what are the motivations to a new player to keep doing PVE after clearing LFR

-item level
-Gear with the same design (possibly a different color)
-tag in the armor saying heroic
- + stats on gear

<--- This to me (in my personal opinion) is the most irrelevant stuff I can experience in a game. Stats? Color? Same bosses? Same thing but harder?
This is the true question here...is this enough for a new player or even a normal player to want to improve and see.
You guys are calling us insane for believing a full geared person with LFR as seen 90% of the game...but I just cant see the point for fighting so hard to gain so little.
Im sorry but I see nothing cool enough to excite me. Maybe a title...nah, still no good feeling in my trousers. Nothing excites me anymore :C

[Stonecloak]

Would be interesting if lfr was taken out of the game, but I think we all know that's a long shot. To many ____ players depend on it.

[Chrysia]

The question being asked here is...what are the motivations to a new player to keep doing PVE after clearing LFR

-item level
-Gear with the same design (possibly a different color)
-tag in the armor saying heroic
- + stats on gear

<--- This to me (in my personal opinion) is the most irrelevant stuff I can experience in a game. Stats? Color? Same bosses? Same thing but harder?
This is the true question here...is this enough for a new player or even a normal player to want to improve and see this insane stuff that you guys are saying every LFRaider is missing.
Im sorry but I see nothing cool enough to excite me :C

And again, those players never were enticed by those rewards in the first place. The same exact players that actually made it to Naxxramas in Vanilla are the players that are clearing heroics. They do it not for stats, not for "same boss but harder," but because it is hard. They want to be challenged.

[Phasma]

If you play Mortal Kombat 2 on Very Easy you will get to kill Shao Kahn.
If you play Mortal Kombat 2 on Very Hard you will still only get to kill Shao Kahn.

Some people play on very easy and put the game aside.
Some people strive to complete it on the hardest mode available.

Whoever plays on Very Easy shouldn't care that people spend time / effort to do it on Very Hard.
Whoever plays on Very Hard shouldn't care that people clear it on Very Easy.

Play your game. Let others play theirs.

As a disclaimer, this applies to seeing content. Very Hard has/should have exclusive rewards as a carrot on stick. Normal/Heroic Titles should be exclusive to while content is current. Mounts can keep dropping on a extremely low drop rate, like it is today. Aside from that, it's fine.

So you are saying Blizzard is just wasting their time with the whole multiplayer aspect of WoW because nobody really cares what other people can do. I'd like to believe that, but it simply isn't true. People care about what other people can do and get jealous when they can't do it. It's human nature. And, here's the kicker: people want everything without trying, but, at the same time, they want Blizzard to prevent others that do try from getting further than them. It wasn't always like this, but, when the casual outbreak happened, it became that way. This "do little, get everything" attitude has got to go. It's like a disease that is spreading rapidly, and, if we don't stop it, games will stop being challenging and fun.

[Deleted]

You obviously miss the point. You don't play to see the content. You play for the challenge of beating the bosses on harder difficulties and in the long run to upgrade your own gear.

[Regalbeast]

Let me get this straight....you get your pleasure or enjoyment out of this game by knowing that other people won't be able to do/see all of the content unless they "work hard"? lol....sounds like you don't understand the point of a game, or that you don't have enjoyment from just playing it so you should maybe move on?

[notorious98]

Look guys. It's this thread again.

[Deleted]

Let me get this straight....you get your pleasure or enjoyment out of this game by knowing that other people won't be able to do/see all of the content unless they "work hard"? lol....sounds like you don't understand the point of a game, or that you don't have enjoyment from just playing it so you should maybe move on?

Not when others cant do it. ME. Its cool when i cant do it at the first try while eating my lunch and finishing my highschool works at the same time.
Its cooler if I actually wipe 5/10/20 and not be able to do it with my eyes closed...and yes getting a unique reward that only people that actually took effort to learn the mechanics and study the fight and practice it SHOULD be the only ones able to get the reward...I think

[notorious98]

So you are saying Blizzard is just wasting their time with the whole multiplayer aspect of WoW because nobody really cares what other people can do. I'd like to believe that, but it simply isn't true. People care about what other people can do and get jealous when they can't do it. It's human nature. And, here's the kicker: people want everything without trying, but, at the same time, they want Blizzard to prevent others that do try from getting further than them. It wasn't always like this, but, when the casual outbreak happened, it became that way. This "do little, get everything" attitude has got to go. It's like a disease that is spreading rapidly, and, if we don't stop it, games will stop being challenging and fun.

You're right. It's like when I see people who do less work achieve more than me, I get super jelly.

Oh wait. Nevermind, I don't. Because their life isn't mine and I don't give a shit about their life because it doesn't affect me.

[Chrysia]

Not when others cant do it. ME. Its cool when i cant do it at the first try while eating my lunch and finishing my highschool works at the same time.
Its cooler if I actually wipe 5/10/20 and not be able to do it with my eyes closed...and yes getting a unique reward that only people that actually took effort to learn the mechanics and study the fight and practice it SHOULD be the only ones able to get the reward...I think

And you do get a visually different reward, visually unique mounts, and unique titles for doing the harder content.

[Lumikor]

why do you care what other players are playing or not playing? are you forced to run LFRs?

If you consider yourself a superdupersmarthardcoreimba player, then join heroic progression guild.

[Phasma]

You're right. It's like when I see people who do less work achieve more than me, I get super jelly.

Oh wait. Nevermind, I don't. Because their life isn't mine and I don't give a shit about their life because it doesn't affect me.

That's why you responded to my post then, huh? I affected you just now and you weren't even aware of it. You cared enough about what I thought to post something against it. What would be the reasoning behind that?

[Lillemus]

try getting into a flex raid without LFR gear and no guild to help you gear up on previous normal modes (because theyre just going to say "go to LFR")

go on

I assume you weren't here before when no guild to help you meant that you wouldn't even see ANY endgame content, not LFR, not flex, not normal, not HMs and not HC. So the alternative is... more desirable for you?

[Dormie]

And again, those players never were enticed by those rewards in the first place. The same exact players that actually made it to Naxxramas in Vanilla are the players that are clearing heroics. They do it not for stats, not for "same boss but harder," but because it is hard. They want to be challenged.

Incorrect. A lot of people play to see more content, not the same content that hits harder.

[Sul]

I don't see why it would seeing as it's completely correct.

Because the colour of the gear means nothing - purple is just a colour --its the the green writing that says Raidfinder , Flex , Normal or heroic that defines gear these days

[Dormie]

You obviously miss the point. You don't play to see the content. You play for the challenge of beating the bosses on harder difficulties and in the long run to upgrade your own gear.

What? I mean...what? This is asinine.

- - - Updated - - -

Because the colour of the gear means nothing - purple is just a colour --its the the green writing that says Raidfinder , Flex , Normal or heroic that defines gear these days

So? You get LFR gear to do LFR, heroic gear to do heroic. Which means gear is entirely pointless when the actual content doesn't change.