Jab Nerfed Again :D

[Deleted]

The most i MW the most i need new chi dumpers

It's just mandatory, it can be a long hot, a new aoe, it can be a change on Envelopping, a new form of chi sphere, don't care, but i want diversity

or you can juste make tier 30 tlaent free with cd as bm/ww, without cd and cost chi for mw.


You don't want too much uplift but 5.2 will probably bring even more uplift as you screwed all other chi dump

[Totaltotemic]

With the huge ilvl increase in the next tier, why would you need to go out of your way to stack spirit? At the rate things are going T16 is more likely to see healing priority for all specs change to "lol just spam your big heal until your fingers get sore" unless they either nerf healing scaling, or up the cost of all spells. I won't deny it's going to screw you around as soon as the patch lands for heroic progression, mind.

This is an interesting question that reveals a lot of misconceptions people have about Spirit.

Here's a secret: Spirit accounts for very little of your actual mana regeneration, such that doubling your Spirit number gives you no where near double your mana regeneration.

I don't recall the exact numbers off the top of my head (and they're not terribly easy to find either, due to wowpedia being grossly out of date), but the mana regeneration formula includes 2% of your base mana every 5 seconds PLUS around 0.638 mp5 per Spirit (that's the number I'm fuzzy on). If you math it out, the passive regeneration is already worth 9k or 10k Spirit. On top of that, Monks especially get a ridiculous amount of mana back from Mana Tea which is also in the neighborhood of ten thousand Spirit.

When you go from 10k Spirit to 12k, you might think that you've increased your total mana available in a given fight by 20%, but it's closer to 7%. The increase in stats from 509 to 541 is only a 35% increase in stats, which would account for, being generous, a 20% increase in available mana between Crit and Spirit. If we switch from Jab chi generation to SCK, that's a 138% increase in mana spent.

No, we're not just going to "out gear" this nerf, nor are we going to just be able to "stack Spirit" to make it okay again. chi gen/chi gen/Uplift is dead unless you want to spend a ridiculous amount of mana, or one of those is Expel Harm or Renewing Mist. You cannot use it more than a couple times before finding yourself OOM.

[Deleted]

You can find all combat rating scalars in the source code of Simulationcraft if you need them by the way.

[Spotnick]

Did they really just up the mana cost of surging mist?

I mean, really? granted it was cheaper than jab, but wtf. We'll need 20k spirit by the way it's going.

[Totaltotemic]

Did they really just up the mana cost of surging mist?

For anyone wondering, no it's not some simple tooltip fix. It is 24,000 mana on live which is 8% of base mana. They really did increase its cost by 10%.

Because Mistweavers are so OP that we need more mana cost nerfs on everything.

[apepi]

Did they really just up the mana cost of surging mist?

I mean, really? granted it was cheaper than jab, but wtf. We'll need 20k spirit by the way it's going.

I should have never pointed out that is we were going to jab spam we might as well just surging mist spam.....

[Deleted]

For anyone wondering, no it's not some simple tooltip fix. It is 24,000 mana on live which is 8% of base mana. They really did increase its cost by 10%.

Because Mistweavers are so OP that we need more mana cost nerfs on everything.

Unequip your 2 piece I mean, I know it's fucking useless but you should probably remember you have it

[Totaltotemic]

Unequip your 2 piece I mean, I know it's fucking useless but you should probably remember you have it

I don't have 2 piece, but thanks for assuming anyways.

Besides, if I DID have 2 piece and it was 8.8% to begin with, it would be reduced to 23,760, not 24k.

[Deleted]

Surging Mist now costs 8.8% of base mana, up from 8%.
LOLOLOLOL MOAR NERFS YAY
I want moar gc, let's nerf uplift ReM SM. Soothing mist now only has 0,01% chi gen, that's balanced.

[Deleted]

26400/300000= 0.088

The version of surging you see nerfed is the 2pc version, it's meant to discourage us from glyphing it and using it as jab probably...

[Totaltotemic]

26400/300000= 0.088

The version of surging you see nerfed is the 2pc version, it's meant to discourage us from glyphing it and using it as jab probably...

Except it doesn't cost 26,400 on live...

On live no 2-piece: 24,000
On live with 2-piece: 21,600

PTR no 2-piece: 26,400
PTR 2-piece: 23,760

I understand why the nerf, but really, it's a nerf to the live version, it's not a tooltip fix that is being confused by the T14 2-piece set bonus. Can we at least be clear on that?

EDITEDITEDITEDITEDIT

This is not a nerf, the glyphed version of Surging Mist costs 8% mana on live when it should be 8.8%. This isn't a tooltip fix or a nerf, it's a bug fix.

[Deleted]

It does lol, unless I'm blind but this number is definitely 26400;

[Tatuin]

So what do they excpet us to heal wiht now wihtout going oom in 3 sec?

---------- Post added 2013-02-25 at 09:17 PM ----------

Mine Surging Mist also cost t26,4k mana on live wihtout 2set

[Dreyo]

So what do they excpet us to heal wiht now wihtout going oom in 3 sec?

Soothing Mist, apparently. Yes, its throughput is low, both in amount healed and chi generated. If we want more throughput (aka chi) then we pay more mana. I don't have a problem with this, on its face - more of an issue of how we got here.

[Totaltotemic]

Uh... well, either something is screwing with my mana costs (no buffs on) or something entirely different is going on here. Any input from anyone else as to what their Surging Mist costs on live?

As a note, I did cast the spell each time to make sure it was costing the proper amount of mana. I'm kind of at a loss here.

Found it: Glyphing Surging Mist reduces the mana cost to 8%. If you look, the wording of the Surging Mist spell that was changed on PTR is the glyped version "heals the lowest.." It seems like this change is fixing the glyphed version to be the proper amount. The better question is, how did we not know about this?

[Coraulten]

Uh... well, either something is screwing with my mana costs (no buffs on) or something entirely different is going on here. Any input from anyone else as to what their Surging Mist costs on live?

As a note, I did cast the spell each time to make sure it was costing the proper amount of mana. I'm kind of at a loss here.

Yeah mines 26,400 by chance do you have the glyph?

[Totaltotemic]

Yeah mines 26,400 by chance do you have the glyph?

I tested it with the glyph on/off. It's 26,400 with it off, 24,000 with it on. The 2-piece also reduces each by their respective amounts.

[Coraulten]

Well thats neat, intentional or glitch you think? And is it just tooltip or actual cost?

[Totaltotemic]

Well thats neat, intentional or glitch you think?

Almost positive that it's an oversight from when they nerfed it in 5.1 or a hotfix (forget when it happened). It's the same deal as Jab, different spell IDs and they only changed the mana cost on one of them. I'm betting that no one noticed because it was ridiculously expensive anyways, but when we started to explore other areas of chi generation, some special person figured out that a 21k mana Surging Mist was kind of powerful for chi generation.

[Deleted]

The glyphed version just survived the 10% nerf earlier on I guess