Reforging, bring it back please

[Thundermoose]

I don't really miss reforging much to be honest.

I miss sockets more, imo that gave a better illusion of choice with meta sockets etc.

EDIT: Old style sockets on gear. Not this "PLING, you got an upgraded version shit"

[ITJae]

If you hate min-maxing don't use it, and stop trying to remove it for rest of the others who like it

Stop trying to re-implement an unnecessary feature just so you can expand your dong a little further (and sooner).

Sure it was convenient having maximized (as possible) haste for my combat rogue during MoP at every level before mythic with the click of a button. But ultimately it was there to offset hit/exp.

In the case of WoD, you can still min-max, you just simply kill the boss that drops the gear that has your preferred stats and ultimately end up in the same position assuming every piece of gear has your attuned stat. All the stats that could have been hit/exp are now actual secondaries that you actually benefit from, is that not a fair trade off? -but muh choices-

If anything please do return profession benefits and enchants. As it stands every profession may as well be renamed farmers.

[Kuntantee]

No. As a player, I shouldn't be dealing with an obvious optimization problem.

[caervek]

I liked reforging for a number of reasons, but one of the biggest was that it made it easier to upgrade your gear, and getting gear is fun. The amount of times in WoD I got an item which wasn't an upgrade due to stat weights but would have been an upgrade if it could be reforged and DE'd it was ridiculous, or my raid dropped an item that was DE'd or given off spec which would have been a MS upgrade with reforging.

That and I liked being able to make myself better, I liked having the option to tune my character for set specs, I liked having the additional content, it just made the game feel more/bigger, now because the absence of reforging can really be felt it feels less.

[Nightcrwler]

I enjoyed reforging and I'd love it back. I don't want hit/expertise back that's for sure.

I doubt they'll ever bring it back as it will reduce the RNG element of the game. Blizzard LOVES RNG.

[GMZohar1]

Most Gems/Enchants gone

Went from 3 types of Glyphs to 2 to 1...

Reforging Gone..

Predetermined Stats for PvP

Old Talent Trees gone (I know this will get some hate)

Basically anything that gave you CHOICE is gone or going away

[slade1135]

Let's say that all the loot drops for gloves have stat distributions that are terrible for my spec this tier. This happened more in Highmaul than in Blackrock Foundry. This happened about as much in Hellfire Citadel what with all the off-the-wall stat ratios that were experimented with. As things are now you just have to pick the best (or least bad) from a list of choices you don't like. It leaves a bad taste in your mouth, but it's the best you can do.

I completely disagree with Blizzard's stance that it should just be obvious based on item level what is better. If a piece of gear has enough levels of difference, sure it's an upgrade. That has always been true and always will be. The question is whether the itemization sucks for what you want to do. Though I don't PVP much, I understand how having more versatility is or at least was desirable. For other situations it would be fun to get closer to a stat break point and then move to a different stat. That would be something much easier to do now that hit and expertise are gone.

I also hate their trend of moving towards scenarios where the player cannot be permitted to fail. Situations like that mean that there's not a place where they can feel like they truly succeed either. But I fear I'm getting off track.

Looking to a slightly different situation, in the past in MoP you might find a piece of gear that was a marginal upgrade. Yet once reforged it was then of significantly more use. Turning questionable or minimal improvements into clear ones felt good.

For that matter I hate with a passion the random reroll items for crafted gear. Making 30 or more of those things to try to get one well set up piece was just aggravating.

So let's zero in on the core of it. Although I want reforging back, I think it's more that I want what came with it. I felt more in control of my kit and management. I felt like I had more options and not less. Even if that was all an illusion it felt great. I want that feeling back. Blizzard talks about how they have many knobs to tune for different aspects of the game. That's a good parallel, I think. Give me more knobs to turn if I want to, even if they're optional ones.

[Huntingbear_grimbatol]

There's nothing constructive about "holy paladin dps"

No but that's not the point, it's a game and outside min maxing in proper raids there's very little to do. "Fucking about" with random builds and so on was entertaining because you had all these options, which we don't anymore.

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Stop trying to re-implement an unnecessary feature just so you can expand your dong a little further (and sooner).

Sure it was convenient having maximized (as possible) haste for my combat rogue during MoP at every level before mythic with the click of a button. But ultimately it was there to offset hit/exp.

In the case of WoD, you can still min-max, you just simply kill the boss that drops the gear that has your preferred stats and ultimately end up in the same position assuming every piece of gear has your attuned stat. All the stats that could have been hit/exp are now actual secondaries that you actually benefit from, is that not a fair trade off? -but muh choices-

If anything please do return profession benefits and enchants. As it stands every profession may as well be renamed farmers.

Racials should be disabled in raids so people can play what they want as well as racials not making you do 5% more damage than others... There's a reason why 90% of top horde guilds have their dpsers all troll (if they can be)- sure there's exceptions in some cases but for the most part it's troll or go home.

- - - Updated - - -

Most Gems/Enchants gone

Went from 3 types of Glyphs to 2 to 1...

Reforging Gone..

Predetermined Stats for PvP

Old Talent Trees gone (I know this will get some hate)

Basically anything that gave you CHOICE is gone or going away

Yep. All those choices made me play way more back in the days, I would mess around with builds and talents just to see what would happen- even did it in a few raids (on farm). Now I play 3-4 hours a week for 6-8 months and then 20hrs a week for 2 months when progressing. The game has completely lost it's flare and I would've quit several years ago if I didn't enjoy the guild I play with.

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If you wanted to play optimally, then none of these things you mentioned actually gave you choices

Play optimally in raids, progression anyways, then outside raids you were free to mess around- try some bullshit in 5mans or pvp just to have some ill-advised fun.
Being a Paladin/Druid player I would go holy paladin dps- which I still did in WoW as paladin (Holy DPS in pvp was quite fun with 40% crit stolen from rogues and hunters). Anyways the point isn't that reforging and so on change what's simulated as the "best" way to play but that you had the choice to do something else when you weren't min/maxing. All you can do now is collect 40 pieces of gear with different stats on them (which I have since I play a hybrid), with enchanting you can only gain 275 stats atm- that's not customization at all and it sucks!

[kary]

No but that's not the point, it's a game and outside min maxing in proper raids there's very little to do. "Fucking about" with random builds and so on was entertaining because you had all these options, which we don't anymore.

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Racials should be disabled in raids so people can play what they want as well as racials not making you do 5% more damage than others... There's a reason why 90% of top horde guilds have their dpsers all troll (if they can be)- sure there's exceptions in some cases but for the most part it's troll or go home.

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Yep. All those choices made me play way more back in the days, I would mess around with builds and talents just to see what would happen- even did it in a few raids (on farm). Now I play 3-4 hours a week for 6-8 months and then 20hrs a week for 2 months when progressing. The game has completely lost it's flare and I would've quit several years ago if I didn't enjoy the guild I play with.

- - - Updated - - -



Play optimally in raids, progression anyways, then outside raids you were free to mess around- try some bullshit in 5mans or pvp just to have some ill-advised fun.
Being a Paladin/Druid player I would go holy paladin dps- which I still did in WoW as paladin (Holy DPS in pvp was quite fun with 40% crit stolen from rogues and hunters). Anyways the point isn't that reforging and so on change what's simulated as the "best" way to play but that you had the choice to do something else when you weren't min/maxing. All you can do now is collect 40 pieces of gear with different stats on them (which I have since I play a hybrid), with enchanting you can only gain 275 stats atm- that's not customization at all and it sucks!

The troll reroll stopped lol. Most people are belves or pandas rn afaik.

[Mafic]

Most Gems/Enchants gone

Went from 3 types of Glyphs to 2 to 1...

Reforging Gone..

Predetermined Stats for PvP

Old Talent Trees gone (I know this will get some hate)

Basically anything that gave you CHOICE is gone or going away

Yup.

I would spend hours on shadow panther planning out different builds. Good times.

[Allenseiei]

No but that's not the point, it's a game and outside min maxing in proper raids there's very little to do. "Fucking about" with random builds and so on was entertaining because you had all these options, which we don't anymore.

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Racials should be disabled in raids so people can play what they want as well as racials not making you do 5% more damage than others... There's a reason why 90% of top horde guilds have their dpsers all troll (if they can be)- sure there's exceptions in some cases but for the most part it's troll or go home.

- - - Updated - - -



Yep. All those choices made me play way more back in the days, I would mess around with builds and talents just to see what would happen- even did it in a few raids (on farm). Now I play 3-4 hours a week for 6-8 months and then 20hrs a week for 2 months when progressing. The game has completely lost it's flare and I would've quit several years ago if I didn't enjoy the guild I play with.

- - - Updated - - -



Play optimally in raids, progression anyways, then outside raids you were free to mess around- try some bullshit in 5mans or pvp just to have some ill-advised fun.
Being a Paladin/Druid player I would go holy paladin dps- which I still did in WoW as paladin (Holy DPS in pvp was quite fun with 40% crit stolen from rogues and hunters). Anyways the point isn't that reforging and so on change what's simulated as the "best" way to play but that you had the choice to do something else when you weren't min/maxing. All you can do now is collect 40 pieces of gear with different stats on them (which I have since I play a hybrid), with enchanting you can only gain 275 stats atm- that's not customization at all and it sucks!

Racials give close to almost no advantage. The difference in performance is usually due to boss/class design, mechanics and roles tied to those mechanics. You can also add the fact that everyone performing well increases the overall performance of everyone else.

You can still mess around with stat builds, just that you have to grind the gear necessary. Which is more of the hassle of acquiring the gear than the impossibility of messing around with stats. Your holy paladin example enters class design, not equipment customization.
Glyphs had small impact in performance.
Old talent trees where fun when no one knew what was optimal. The moment you knew it, many people don't feel comfortable knowing they are running a worse build, even more knowing that most of those talent points were passive damage increases that didn't affect gameplay. Current talent points are more into those end talents every 10 spent points, which did affect gameplay.

[Tharkkun]

Most Gems/Enchants gone

Went from 3 types of Glyphs to 2 to 1...

Reforging Gone..

Predetermined Stats for PvP

Old Talent Trees gone (I know this will get some hate)

Basically anything that gave you CHOICE is gone or going away

You never had a choice though. You either did it the right way or you were made fun of for being a noob.

[Malico]

It wont happen, blizzard said it is not needed.

[ITJae]

The troll reroll stopped lol. Most people are belves or pandas rn afaik.

^ This. I will only ever play Belf because I refuse to not be fabulous. In my case Arcane torrent returns resource AND wave silences, pretty good for raiding if you like being useful outside of dps.

Case in point, racials are so trivial now it literally doesn't matter what you roll - they will benefit you in some way or another.
Unless you're pvping in which case you're probably better off as human scum.

Edit: I'm still trying to figure out why racials were even brought up when my point was -
1: Reforging is no longer necessary unless you're lazy.
2: Professions are very lackluster this expansion.

[kary]

^ This. I will only ever play Belf because I refuse to not be fabulous. In my case Arcane torrent returns resource AND wave silences, pretty good for raiding if you like being useful outside of dps.

Case in point, racials are so trivial now it literally doesn't matter what you roll - they will benefit you in some way or another.
Unless you're pvping in which case you're probably better off as human scum.

Edit: I'm still trying to figure out why racials were even brought up when my point was -
1: Reforging is no longer necessary unless you're lazy.
2: Professions are very lackluster this expansion.

Only point I disagree with is #2. Yeah professions aren't important to raiding but this is prob the best expansion for crafting professions (except engineering) to date. You get usable gear and things that actually sell.

Having to roll engi/bs or bs/lw or some combination for the best enchant combo was kinda silly. RIP double crafting for da cheese. (that's a good thing)

[Ciddy]

I liked reforging. It was nice when you picked up some piece of gear that wasn't exactly optimal but could be an upgrade if you reforged that worthless stat to something good.

[clevin]

They didn't even have to do that. They used an addon. Went to the reforging NPC. Clicked button on addon. Most min-maxers annoy the hell out of me. I understand why the world first guilds do it. But other than those extremely niche cases it *really* doesn't matter if you spend 200g to improve your performance by 0.1%.

Why do you care what someone else does?

[hulkgor]

"yes, let's just use an addon to optimize our stats!"

[cuafpr]

no thank you, less they drastically changed it. All it was a bad gold sink where u used a mod click a few buttons and done.

[Huntingbear_grimbatol]

Racials give close to almost no advantage. The difference in performance is usually due to boss/class design, mechanics and roles tied to those mechanics. You can also add the fact that everyone performing well increases the overall performance of everyone else.

That's so far from true...
Go check any top guilds and check their dpsers class, they're all Trolls or B.elfs for the racial bonus.
Especially now with the legendary ring having a extra on use cd inflates your ring even more, if you don't understand the power of CD stacking then I can see how you could say that it doesn't matter what race you are BUT for absolute min/maxing it matters a lot!

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Why do you care what someone else does?

Because looking at other (judging) is something human that everyone does? including you.