Classic World of Warcraft Discussion [Megathread]

[Deleted]

Stop acting like it's a huge deal for them to run a few servers with an old game they don't have to do any developing for.

Of course they have to do developing. It wouldn't just magically work because we wnt it to work soo so much. And that is developement time they could be spending on 8.0 or 9.0 instead. Right now more players want to move forward instead of living in the past.

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But there are not a million ways to make it like vanilla. You can't even do dungeons, world pvp or group while levelling if you want to ironman. Is that supposed to be mmo?

Why can't you do those things with self imposed limitations?

[Zandalarian Paladin]

It's not for the creative team to know that, it's for the marketing research team to figure it out. The developers have to keep track of the trends within the playerbase. The marketing folks have to know what's outside of the playerbase. They're the guys who figure out pricing and gauge potential interest in the game, not the creative team. Blizzard isn't just the Blues, their business side has a ton of people no one knows about who are just as important to their decisions as whether Ghostcrawler promised everybody a pony or Chris Metzen woke up with a hankerin' to voice a new character.

Regarding the IP, ironically the problem for Blizzard is that Nost actually could be shut down. Blizzard's lawyers are probably sending cease & desist letters by the dozen every week, but most of those shitty private servers are in places that cannot or will not enforce copyright laws (like, say, Russia or China). Nost was hosted by a French company, which means that when the C&D letter came they had to comply or face an actual lawsuit. Meanwhile, the other private servers keep having those C&D letters piling up until Blizzard finds a way to wrangle enough judicial power in their respective countries to stop them.

Actually, the creative team should know what the player wants. But that's a whole other story - I work in the industry and I know how shitty people can be with the devs without understanding what's going on behind the scene. But it's the marketing team job to tell the devs what works and what doesn't initially. The problem is that they don't - or then someone comes and decide to cut the content in half for reason. The devs can't reasonably create and understand what the player want because they're creatives, not psychologists. But maybe that's another issue, maybe we should have professionals in player psychology in devs teams.

As for Nost, I think everybody knew it could happen. I know it's the main reason I didn't actually level beyond a certain point - and I was right, it did happen. But what enrage players in this is that Blizzard claimed players wouldn't like it, which is obviously false. Even more enraging - they put updates to their old games, which makes them hypocritical!

So yeah, as a dev myself, I believe that the industry as a whole have a lot of issues with dev/customer communication caused by both parties. But in this particular case, I cannot possibly take for Blizzard - the same way I'll never take for Nintendo and their dictatorship over their content.

[Deleted]

Of course they have to do developing. It wouldn't just magically work because we wnt it to work soo so much. And that is developement time they could be spending on 8.0 or 9.0 instead. Right now more players want to move forward instead of living in the past.

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Why can't you do those things with self imposed limitations?

By self imposed limitations do you mean spamming the forums in trying to find even 1 person to group with? If you go lfd everyone will just one shot the mobs and be immortal, same if you group with them while levelling. World pvp against the one heirloom decked person you might see in your whole time levelling?

[Deleted]

So that is around a dozen servers, just for Vanilla and another 2 dozens for TBC and WotLK. And if we have that don't think there won't be demand for Cata and MoP and WoD as well. So we have more than 50 servers. 50 servers that need to be maintaned, while never ever changing. That is too much, and according to Blizzard's marketing team not profitabel. I am inclined to agree with them.

I just said that they would be unlikely to do anything other than Vanilla initially. How did you manage to turn two or three servers into a dozen?

[Deleted]

By self imposed limitations do you mean spamming the forums in trying to find even 1 person to group with? If you go lfd everyone will just one shot the mobs and be immortal, same if you group with them while levelling. World pvp against the one heirloom decked person you might see in your whole time levelling?

So sit in IF and smap trade chat to find likeminded fellows. Everyone here is saying millions miss the hard leveling experience. Surely it wouldn't be too hard to find 4 others.

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I just said that they would be unlikely to do anything other than Vanilla initially. How did you manage to turn two or three servers into a dozen?

They are calculating if it would be worth it for them. They wouldn't stop the projections at Vanilla. They would have to plan ahead.

[Roamingstorm]

Just like the original game. Release patches over time... Sell it for $ 5 and $ 15 a month fee and you earn money... Huge problem right :S. Start with Vanilla or Vanilla and TBC, see how it works then move on to TBC or WotLK.

What they really don't want is losing people to those servers who are not paying high priced expansions and who are not using their ingame shop and tokens. That's the sad truth.
And the only other problem I guess they might have is that they changed the engine.

Stop acting like it's a huge deal for them to run a few servers with an old game they don't have to do any developing for.

The thing people are missing though if they were to create a few servers in doing this they'd have to get a team dedicated to fixing bugs, patches, class balance, etc, because people WILL expect it. That is the major problem with all of it. As much as people are saying "yeah I want the old stuff and that's it" honestly I feel they'd be the first to post on the forums going "man X/Y/Z doesn't work, isn't balanced, not fun", and except them to work on it.

While I take no stance on if they did or didn't make a "nostalgia" server (because I don't care and played in Vanilla, so been there done that) people making it to be just a simple switching a light on thing and expecting people to be content with just that are fooling themselves.

[Ebalina]

I suggest you start reading this thread at the beginning. But I will summarize for you:

We know it is illegal. We know Blizzard is in their legal right to take action against the server and the company that hosts it.

We know that, as a company, it is Blizzard's decision to progress the game the way they feel is best.

We know that sanctioning a private server based off of a previous version of a game can potentially be beneficial.

What we are trying to do is find a way to change Blizzard's mind and allowing a legacy server(s) to exist or to allow (with rules and regulations), certain private servers to continue to develop and grow to allow their (Blizzard's) fans to enjoy the game they created long ago.

I suggest you stop looking for solutions to something you have nothing to do with.

Even if blizzard give you legacy servers they will not balance them they will not give you content for them.
And we know after few months that all of you will be crying why legion(what ever the newest expansion is) gets content but their legacy servers don't.

How are you gonna make spec valuable?

So warriors can tank only(yes they are the only option nostralius wasn't coded properly so you could use feral).
Where the enh shamans or the ele ones right they are useless they do not exist.

Shadow priest is unplayable disc even more so......... oh wait what about prot paladins right either you are holy or you are not a paladin.

All these things are things of the past.
Now many of you have played vanilla and every expansion till legion in 1 way or another.
How are you gonna justify those specs been excluded out of the game just because its a legacy server?

Do you not think the uproar that it will create after a while?

Can you people not think with your heads instead of your rose tinted hearths full of all these old memories and feelings?


Get it right blizzard even if they make a legacy server or allow some one to make a legacy server and keep it running sooner or later you will scream for content and balance because lets face it its what humans do.

You wont find a way to fix it there isn't a way to fix it.
It is all up to Blizzard an Blizzard alone because they are the IP holders of this game.

[corebit]

I just said that they would be unlikely to do anything other than Vanilla initially. How did you manage to turn two or three servers into a dozen?

Why not? By opening the vanilla servers Blizzard opens the Pandora's Box and the nightmare begins. Who are you to say vanilla gets to be first and not TBC/Wrath/Cata/MoP/free-for-all PVP/hardcore/strict RP/moonglade 2.0 servers? If you got your vanilla demands it would be very selfish of you to deny the other groups.

[Deleted]

So sit in IF and smap trade chat to find likeminded fellows. Everyone here is saying millions miss the hard leveling experience. Surely it wouldn't be too hard to find 4 others.

The millions who aren't playing the game are now all in IF in one realm just waiting? I miss the atmosphere and adventure too, not just the hard levelling. Which was also more relaxing than hard to me.

Even if I go to IF and find someone, the world still won't be crowded. It would be me + 4, with no one else anywhere to see. That's not mmo.

[Zandalarian Paladin]

Why not? By opening the vanilla servers Blizzard opens the Pandora's Box and the nightmare begins. Who are you to say vanilla gets to be first and not TBC/Wrath/Cata/MoP/free-for-all PVP/hardcore/strict RP/moonglade 2.0 servers? If you got your vanilla demands it would be very selfish of you to deny the other groups.

This is the same argument that was used for Transmogrification. I mean, Transmogrification totally rendered useless old gear.

[Xilurm]

Once again, in your horribly ridiculously biased Opinion. No market research, no insight into blizzard's cost structures, nothing. You just want Vanilla, you enjoyed it, I enjoyed it too. Sorry that not everyone, especially blizzard, agrees that bringing back Vanilla so that player base can piss and moan about balance fixes/no content after they don't even justify the return in the first place.



And I'm having plenty of fun with current content. 6 of my IRL buddies and I are currently running a Xrealm pub using the LFM tool, something we'd never be able to do in any other expansion. If this was any other expansion the fact that we were the crippling 2-3 players short of a 10 man we'd be fucked. Garrison's were a mediocre, but the things I enjoy are still decent. It's not my favorite expansion and there's def things I'd change, but don't mistake your pissing and moaning for Vanilla or discontent as a valid reason to belittle the rest of us that are enjoying. I love TBC, by far and away my favorite time in WoW. Doesn't mean I ever want to stamp my feet and cry until blizzard makes a special TBC server and I'd never expect them to make a special server just for me even if I wanted to replay TBC. And I definitely wouldn't be surprised if I were to make a private server of TBC in a country that America has good standing with and has comparable views on copyright law to America if my server got shut down because they defended their property.

I have zero issues with Blizzard starting a Legacy server, assuming it's a smart business decision. All evidence points to it not being unless viewed through horribly nostalgia/entitlement goggles.

First of all, the only people belittling anyone here are the retail players.

And of course Blizzard doesn't think it's profitable. How would it be profitable if they actually had to work for it? Heck they aren't even sure if Legion will have more than 2 tiers. As long as they milk the box price they don't give a shit.

[Deleted]

The millions who aren't playing the game are now all in IF in one realm just waiting? I miss the atmosphere and adventure too, not just the hard levelling. Which was also more relaxing than hard to me.

Even if I go to IF and find someone, the world still won't be crowded. It would be me + 4, with no one else anywhere to see. That's not mmo.

Yes it is. There are a massive ammount of online multiplaying people. And you can group with them if you want. I understand you miss the node stealing killstealing gankers (/s) I on the other hand like to play alone and only group up if I want to. Not when I have to. But to each their own.

[corebit]

First of all, the only people belittling anyone here are the retail players.

This is absolute BS. I suggest you go back from page 1 and revisit each page to realize your ridiculous bias. There is belittling on both sides here, and you're being part of the problem.

[Deleted]

The thing people are missing though if they were to create a few servers in doing this they'd have to get a team dedicated to fixing bugs, patches, class balance, etc, because people WILL expect it. That is the major problem with all of it. As much as people are saying "yeah I want the old stuff and that's it" honestly I feel they'd be the first to post on the forums going "man X/Y/Z doesn't work, isn't balanced, not fun", and except them to work on it.

..
And we know after few months that all of you will be crying why legion(what ever the newest expansion is) gets content but their legacy servers don't.

How are you gonna make spec valuable?
...

That is literally why I fear Blizzard will fuck it up. Classes had their spot and need. Some specs were bad, others good. People weren't in Nostalrius to look for balance or polished perfect lfd experience. They were there to have fun. I saw so many people who even keyboard turned and clicked spells.

[Akka]

You use the word fact a lot. Fact is most of the players on Nost didn't even get to level 30. So while some (in the ten thousands) surely enjoyed it, that is simply not a big enough number to justify an official Vanilla experience.

Entire MMO have a playerbases that amount to just tens of thousands. Trying to argue that this would not enough to support just a handful of servers is just ludicrous.

[Deleted]

First of all, the only people belittling anyone here are the retail players.

And of course Blizzard doesn't think it's profitable. How would it be profitable if they actually had to work for it? Heck they aren't even sure if Legion will have more than 2 tiers. As long as they milk the box price they don't give a shit.

On one hand the retail player's will tell you it wouldn't be profitable, on the other hand they believe the people running Nost were secretly evilly profiting off of Blizzard's IP.

Dat double think.

[Deleted]

Yes it is. There are a massive ammount of online multiplaying people. And you can group with them if you want. I understand you miss the node stealing killstealing gankers (/s) I on the other hand like to play alone and only group up if I want to. Not when I have to. But to each their own.

So you are just mad someone ganked you while levelling? You never had to group in vanilla, I didn't most of the time. But the memorable moments were when I did.

[Deleted]

On one hand the retail player's will tell you it wouldn't be profitable, on the other hand they believe the people running Nost were secretly evilly profiting off of Blizzard's IP.

Dat double think.

Nost might have been profiting for very little work.

Blizz wouldn't profit, because they would need to create a proper functioning vanilla. One not ductaped together. That takes a lot more time and money than what Nost did

[Raiju]

On one hand the retail player's will tell you it wouldn't be profitable, on the other hand they believe the people running Nost were secretly evilly profiting off of Blizzard's IP.

Dat double think.

Except it's not a contradiction at all if you have any understanding of the private server you used. Most operated voluntarily and did not get paid. A handful could've reaped the rewards there, had they been so inclined. Also, that's exactly what the hosting company DID do.

Blizzard cannot field such a scenario - they'd have to pay everyone involved.

[Deleted]

So you are just mad someone ganked you while levelling? You never had to group in vanilla, I didn't most of the time. But the memorable moments were when I did.

Nah, I never played Vanilla and I only play on PvE servers. I was just guessing. And describing what MMO means. And what my preferred playstyle is.