[Megathread] Final Fantasy XIV

[Berethos08]

All Potato falafells are creepy and sad, some hide it with dance though.

Love this guys long videos - that video, the previous dancing one, and the primal one are awesome.

That Rou Rou one with the sad potato? That one scares me.

[dope_danny]

Best part of getting a new player in your daily Antitower roulette isnt the tome bonus, its watching them inevitably freak out at Calcabrina.

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That Rou Rou one with the sad potato? That one scares me.

You should be, female Lalafells are vicious predators.

[Kaelwryn]

You should be, female Lalafells are vicious predators.

But...Rou Rou is male....

I derped. IGNORE MEH

[Fadewind]

On the topic of Dusk Vigil being more brutal on tanks, it doesn't even matter what gear or level you are. I recently levelled up a Warrior and geared up as much as I could, but I always had issues during trash pulls in that dungeon. (Sohm Ah wasn't as bad, but yes, it was not a smooth damage intake.) Any tanks that struggle aren't using their smaller CDs at the beginning of every trash pull. They do help mitigate things and smooth out the damage, but it is very bursty at the start of those trash pulls for some reason. I actually found a lot of HW dungeons to be like that. I think the only reason you notice it more in the earlier dungeons is that any dungeon from 1-50 that is required to move through the story doesn't have that kind of burst damage on the majority of trash pulls.

Honestly, I like SE's approach to "get good" in dungeons. In order to progress through the story, you have to do harder content. Now they're forcing tanks to learn that the 90s CDs aren't meant to be saved ONLY for bosses. (That said, I've also tanked for pretty much everything over a seven year period. When shit hits the fan, I can quickly react to most things.)

About my issues with tanking in this game is how annoying it can be to peel mobs off (even with provoke), especially on DPS and healers that run away. And initial AoE threat generation isn't consistent. I haven't played a high level paladin yet, but...ugh...flash is down right awful at lower levels. Overpower is nice, but I feel like it needs a larger radius. It's nice to start a pull off with Steel Cyclone as no one can rip aggro from me then. I didn't notice as much of an issue on DRK when I tried to play one (but it was squishy as hell at lower levels X_X)


Sadly, it'll be a while before I can really tank again. I moved over to the PS4 as HW content made my PC chug hard. (Plus wi-fi sucked, so....wired connection as well.) I just don't have the mentality to hit 4 buttons for a quick melee combo. (So levelling Black Mage as it is less strenuous on the brain for this)

[SodiumChloride]

Equal difficulty would at least be nice.
I play a healer because I like healing, not to mash 1 damage button for 50% of the run. :/

In the other side of the coin, I'm sure SE gets complaints along the line of "I rolled a healer to heal, not DPS. If I wanted to DPS I would play a DPS class." ...

[Edge-]

Man, trying to catch my astro up with my whm so I can switch primary jobs but it feels so slooowwww -_-

[SodiumChloride]

Honestly, I like SE's approach to "get good" in dungeons.

IMHO The Hall of the Novice was excellent. It literally runs you through everything you are expected to do in a dungeon - on DPS side at least; haven't done the tank and healer version. I surprised it took so long for such a (in hindsight) obvious idea to be implemented in a MMO.

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There needs to be done sort of auto grouping feature for large FATEs and A/S rank hunts. Spamming for a group sucks - without a group you won't live long in most cases (no heals) and can't get credit worth a damn.

[Granyala]

Best part of getting a new player in your daily Antitower roulette isnt the tome bonus, its watching them inevitably freak out at Calcabrina.

I never got what was supposed to be "creepy" about her.

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About my issues with tanking in this game is how annoying it can be to peel mobs off (even with provoke), especially on DPS and healers that run away. And initial AoE threat generation isn't consistent. I haven't played a high level paladin yet, but...ugh...flash is down right awful at lower levels. Overpower is nice, but I feel like it needs a larger radius. It's nice to start a pull off with Steel Cyclone as no one can rip aggro from me then. I didn't notice as much of an issue on DRK when I tried to play one (but it was squishy as hell at lower levels X_X)

Dunno, I usually pull with bodypull -> Flash/Unleash x2
Provoke + Shield throw brings back every mob to me. Unless the person having the aggro runs really far away (in which case he is dumb).
I only have problems on WAR due to the facing requirement of the cone attack. UARGH >.<

I agree that DRKs that don't use their CDs can be REALLY squishy and prone to spiking damage. Imho Pallys are most comfortable to heal.

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There needs to be done sort of auto grouping feature for large FATEs and A/S rank hunts. Spamming for a group sucks - without a group you won't live long in most cases (no heals) and can't get credit worth a damn.

There is.
It's called: part finder.
Open it -> klick group -> klick join. No spamming required.

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In the other side of the coin, I'm sure SE gets complaints along the line of "I rolled a healer to heal, not DPS. If I wanted to DPS I would play a DPS class." ...

If dungeons will continue to be like the current expert ones, you can count me into this group, yes.

[Fadewind]

IMHO The Hall of the Novice was excellent. It literally runs you through everything you are expected to do in a dungeon - on DPS side at least; haven't done the tank and healer version. I surprised it took so long for such a (in hindsight) obvious idea to be implemented in a MMO.

The tank version is just as good, at least from a novice standpoint. Tank is especially cool as they just tell you what abilities to use to do various things. (Since there are only 3 tanks, they can just add things like that in.) However, there are still things it doesn't teach you. (Like CD management) Tankings in this game is rather unique as it has multiple CDs and CD types. I never got the argument people made for needing to use one of my smaller ones (Foresight and Bloodbath) every pull until I got to HW dungeons. I guess expert dungeons and the older dungeons in 2.x were just like HW dungeons now. Of course, I'd always use Vengeance or Holmgang if shit hit the fan and a couple pats ended up being pulled into the group. *cough* Stone Vigil *cough*

My only complaint about the Hall of Novice is...well...MORE! Not more at level 15 mind you. I think there should be a Hall of the Journeyman at level 30 and a Hall of the Master at level 50. The 30 one can award another set of gear (plus a ring to get more xp to level 50) and the 50 one can add right side gear into the mix (with a ring to boost xp above 50).

Dunno, I usually pull with bodypull -> Flash/Unleash x2
Provoke + Shield throw brings back every mob to me. Unless the person having the aggro runs really far away (in which case he is dumb).
I only have problems on WAR due to the facing requirement of the cone attack. UARGH >.<

I agree that DRKs that don't use their CDs can be REALLY squishy and prone to spiking damage. Imho Pallys are most comfortable to heal.

I usually advise against body pulling. Dark Mend/Tomahawk/Shield Throw IMO is a better start as it'll tell ranged and melee which one you'll have more aggro on first. As well as at least putting up a 1st to attack sign.

Anywho, Flash is good, but my Glad/Pal is only level 24 or something. I only levelled that up to get Provoke right now. 2 Flashes will produce enough AoE to make the initial pull a non-issue. But I don't feel like it gives enough for me to hold aggro on 3+ mobs during AoE or if DPS aren't focusing down the same targets in the case of single-target. I know it's mostly due to a lack of Shield Oath, but...definitely a huge step down from Warrior before then.

Oh, trust me. I've gotten Warrior to level 60 and have pretty much played a tank in every MMO at some point. Overpower can be hard to land, especially if the mob moves just slightly. Steel Cyclone can be a god-send. IMO it's almost worth it not to spend Wrath stacks on the last mob as to make sure you have a Cyclone ready.

As for DRKs, I only ran a level 30 dungeon with one...and I barely had any of my CDs. Hell, I had to toss a couple from WAR in there just so I didn't die. (Bloodbath is good with...Blood Weapon(?), or w/e the mana leech + attack speed CD is). I also hate the design of Living Dead. I wish it acted more like Ardent Defender from WoW Prot Pally (as in, if you die while you have it up, you don't take fatal damage) instead of having to be healed until full. Similar to Holmgang in that regard, but you have to time it right.

[Granyala]

I usually advise against body pulling. Dark Mend/Tomahawk/Shield Throw IMO is a better start as it'll tell ranged and melee which one you'll have more aggro on first. As well as at least putting up a 1st to attack sign.

I don't like pulling like that. You do aggro on ONE mob and are then left with a 2.5 GCD until you can perform the next action.
Typically that means, the mobs run to the jittery healer because "you did something so they start doing sth".

If you go in with body pull, people see that you didn't perform an action yet and they automatically wait.
Disclaimer: Bodypull doesn't work well if the mobs stand very far apart. But that is rarely the case in dungeons.

Pally w/o Shield oath is painful in terms of aggro, I agree.
It can be done but it necessitates dumping 50%+ of your mana into flashes on every pull.

So you play with 3 buttons only: flash + manareg combo. Pretty boring.

[SodiumChloride]

There is.
It's called: part finder.
Open it -> klick group -> klick join. No spamming required.

I said "auto".

Having to click and search through a list isn't "auto". Not to mention with groups getting full ... having to split tanks and healers ... it's such a mess.

Don't see the harm in letting the computer put together "best fit" groups, it's not like anyone cares who they are grouped with 99% of the time - maybe centre around healers since every group needs a healer; tanks and DPS will be distributed among the healer groups.

[unholytestament]

Anyone ever use this? http://guildwork.com/client

Good? Bad? Ugly?

[Granyala]

I said "auto".
Having to click and search through a list isn't "auto". Not to mention with groups getting full ... having to split tanks and healers ... it's such a mess.

Oh come on. You're starting to sound ridiculous now.

[Faroth]

I never got what was supposed to be "creepy" about her.

You're a healer. Try being melee DPS having to fight her while she moons you the whole fight. *shudder, rocks back and forth*

Creepy freaky doll of creepiness...



On another note, apparently I've fallen behind in FFXIV slang. Lalafell are known as potatos?

[SodiumChloride]

Oh come on. You're starting to sound ridiculous now.

It's not that outrageous ... >.>

Just have the system keep track of the number of healers in the FATE's "zone" and add tank and DPS to their groups as it goes along - while avoiding shifting players that are already in combat.

Let manual groups override the auto-grouping. But if you aren't a full group the system can extend your group via the auto-grouping - effectively creating a (manual) group within a (auto) group.

Grouping for FATEs/Hunts are practically random anyway where you basically just grab anyone who shouts "inv".

[Lathais]

I said "auto".

Having to click and search through a list isn't "auto". Not to mention with groups getting full ... having to split tanks and healers ... it's such a mess.

Don't see the harm in letting the computer put together "best fit" groups, it's not like anyone cares who they are grouped with 99% of the time - maybe centre around healers since every group needs a healer; tanks and DPS will be distributed among the healer groups.

RIFT works kinda like this. I mean it does not auto split up groups or anything, but if you walk up to a Rift and there are other people doing it a button pops up on your screen to join the group. You just click it and join. It helps that joining a group does not lose you your place in any ques you are in as well.

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Oh come on. You're starting to sound ridiculous now.

Actually, not that ridiculous seeing as other games have implemented systems close to this one. I agree, some of what SC says is dumb, but this is not. It seems like you are disagreeing with SC just to disagree with SC at this point.

[Kaelwryn]

I'm sorry but I agree with Granyala. Party Finder is there, use it. A lot of people who are doing fates/hunts will put up PFs. Makes use of it. In regards to fates, you usually don't need a healer if someone else's group can worry about tanking, and if you need healing, in my experience healers outside of my party will heal me if they see that I'm low and can get to me.

An automatic world party finder thing is just...you're fucking lazy. And this is coming from someone who hates having to rely on others for pretty much anything!

[Lathais]

I'm sorry but I agree with Granyala. Party Finder is there, use it. A lot of people who are doing fates/hunts will put up PFs. Makes use of it. In regards to fates, you usually don't need a healer if someone else's group can worry about tanking, and if you need healing, in my experience healers outside of my party will heal me if they see that I'm low and can get to me.

An automatic world party finder thing is just...you're fucking lazy. And this is coming from someone who hates having to rely on others for pretty much anything!

Yeah, but a system more like Rift's where you can set your party to public(which most people have by default) it becomes very easy to join a players group when you are in the same area doing the same thing. It's just a button pops up on your screen and you can join group. I loved this as a healer there, especially as a mage healer. Most of the mage heals were smart heals that healed based on damage you did. So if you were not in a group, you were not healing, and the damage was pitiful. Walking up to a group and asking for an invite during combat would not usually get you an invite. So I could sit there and do pitiful damage and not get credit or click join group and start healing everyone right away and get credit. Was a great system.

[Fadewind]

I don't like pulling like that. You do aggro on ONE mob and are then left with a 2.5 GCD until you can perform the next action.
Typically that means, the mobs run to the jittery healer because "you did something so they start doing sth".

If you go in with body pull, people see that you didn't perform an action yet and they automatically wait.
Disclaimer: Bodypull doesn't work well if the mobs stand very far apart. But that is rarely the case in dungeons.

Pally w/o Shield oath is painful in terms of aggro, I agree.
It can be done but it necessitates dumping 50%+ of your mana into flashes on every pull.

So you play with 3 buttons only: flash + manareg combo. Pretty boring.

I'd rather have people moving into action ASAP than waiting. But, I see that as more personal preference (and tons of tanking experience) than a skill thing. If a tank wants to body pull, I always respect that choice. Especially since I'm just going to cause a metric ton of aggro anyway. (Yeah, archer is like level 5...so, not going to work on Quelling Strikes until I get BLM to 60.) And yes, I do run to tanks when I get aggro.

Yeah, and I feel bad when I have a GLD/PAL tank while I'm levelling up. They can't put out the aggro needed to deal with my AoE or barely can. (Fire II is ridiculous at lower levels.) DRKs and Marauder/WARs don't have an issue. (Maybe Improved Flash should add a small damage component?)



As for the discussion on automatic FATE groups, I have to agree with it. Party Finder is great, but you run into issues when you're doing anything below Coerthas Central where there are VERY few parties for groups. If a FATE has 2 or more ungrouped people, it should automatically put them in a party together. (And have an option to NOT do this as well.) IMO, I don't think Party Finder should have to be used for FATEs in ARR area. They should scale down to one person so you don't have to find a group. I don't mind current expansion areas needing groups for FATEs, especially since SE forces you to do them for Anima weapons (good job on keeping non-endgame content relevant for end-game!)

20-30 levelling on alt classes is pretty much the biggest pain for me in-game. Levels need significantly more leves to burn through. (And they don't benefit from the armory bonus...for some reason.) You won't have side-quests to push through all the time. The only other thing I'd like to see SE do is increase the armory bonus more for 1-50 in the next xpac (once you have at least 1 level 50 that is).

[Kaelwryn]

Yeah, but a system more like Rift's where you can set your party to public(which most people have by default) it becomes very easy to join a players group when you are in the same area doing the same thing. It's just a button pops up on your screen and you can join group. I loved this as a healer there, especially as a mage healer. Most of the mage heals were smart heals that healed based on damage you did. So if you were not in a group, you were not healing, and the damage was pitiful. Walking up to a group and asking for an invite during combat would not usually get you an invite. So I could sit there and do pitiful damage and not get credit or click join group and start healing everyone right away and get credit. Was a great system.

Except we basically already have that with party finder. Open PF -> see a group -> click join! If you don't see any PFs, make your own. Typically in a pretty populated area, you'll find people quickly. And if you're not then you're not in any worry about dealing with not getting credit (Gold is typically pretty easy to get for most fates, if you're there from start to finish or even for 50%).