Legion Alpha - Build 21491

[Multibocks]

A phrase I've heard VERY OFTEN over the last couple of expansions has been "welfare epics."

Another phrase: "Loot pinata." Or another: "Monty Haul" (though that's something that older gamers remember...). ESPECIALLY in WoD.

Raiders went on rants, saying "if you're not doing raids, you don't need raid gear." And it makes sense. Raids are tuned to higher gear levels (and, especially, split-second timing, group tactics, and knowing the fight), whereas outdoor content should be tuned to the majority who are casuals.

I mean, unless Blizzard is going to give us gear for just clicking a button? Something that keeps up with content...? That would be in keeping with the trend they've shown in the last couple of expansions. I'm sure we'll reach the point where casuals walking around in Normal-mode current tier raid gear is possible within a couple months of each raid tier being released, without stepping foot into a raid.

If so, I'm hoping that they include the cool set bonuses and the awesome trinkets this time around. (I mean, hey, if you guys WANT to keep up the "you get raid gear, you get raid gear, EVERYBODY gets raid gear!!!" Blizzard is using to keep the casuals subscribed...?)

You haven't even seen the loot yet. Don't let it stop your crusade.

[tangers58]

We've remade the Stormwind harbor again! But the park would cost a raid tier

[arcaneshot]

Give your head a shake.

Holy hell there is one fucking guy in every group. How does the real world work? Most of the time, open a map or your phone and look at a map for where you gotta go. Stop complaining for the sake of complaining ffs.

The guy you quoted wasn't complaining in the slightest, what the heck are you blowing up for?

[PragmaticGamer]

You haven't even seen the loot yet. Don't let it stop your crusade.

In MoP, we got a few pieces from running early quests in Timeless Isle. Then you had to grind.

In WoD, we got pieces from the mission table, the salvage yard, the treasures laying around the map, a few quests, etc. Then you had to grind. (But at least you REMAINED only a tier or two behind...)

Do you think they'll roll back the "loot pinata," or do you think that it'll get even greater levels?

- - - Updated - - -

The guy you quoted wasn't complaining in the slightest, what the heck are you blowing up for?

They quoted someone who quoted me.

I made the mistake of being a casual who doesn't like the "welfare epics." Apparently, that will piss off either group (casuals and elitists).

[Gadzooks]

Yeah. I think this is slightly generational:

For us older farks out there (35+) it is a slight disconnect to go running to a connected device (as our Maps are in WoW) to answer something. We think of going to a person or a stationary device like a library or a computer. We don't always think to go to that thing in our pockets. Given the younger ages of many of WoW's designers, I can imagine it's quite simple to them where to put this info.

Yeah. Running to an NPC, or unlocking a quest hub in a region is called "immersion".

Immersion seems to be slowly being removed from the game. Because "talking head" quest givers is so much better, amirite?

More convenient? For the devs, yes. And for the players.

Does it help maintain immersion? No, it pretty much ignores it.

It's up to you how important immersion is to an MMO. Me? I think it's kind of important. Plus, this removes the need to explore, since the map does all the exploring for you. I like the start of a new expansion, and the greyed out map, and exploring all the regions to find out what's there - and kill everything there. Wee! Now the map does it for me, and I can just flight straight to an objective with no silly exploring or story.

But, hey, they're not dailies, so that's good, right?

[webzagar]

I love that the dreamway seems to utilize the old Emerald Dream Portals. But where is Ashenvale? I realize that it would be a little silly to be able to have portals to Ashenvale, Hyjal and Moonglade. But it's also equally weird for there not to be a portal right by ORG. Especially since Duskwood is so close to Stormwind.

[IIamaKing]

Going to need that beholder for a companion pet.

[Baluki]

New Voidwalker models at last! Looks great, rather than like an undulating mass of triangles like it does now. (It was fine 11 years ago.)

I really hope the other elemental models are soon to follow. I bet they can do some really cool stuff with the fire and water elementals.

[b0928]

It's up to you how important immersion is to an MMO. Me? I think it's kind of important. Plus, this removes the need to explore, since the map does all the exploring for you. I like the start of a new expansion, and the greyed out map, and exploring all the regions to find out what's there - and kill everything there. Wee! Now the map does it for me, and I can just flight straight to an objective with no silly exploring or story.

Huh? How does world map objectives defeat immersion?
-It's not like it stops you from exploring. Feel free to explore as much as you want.
-It's also something that only comes into effect at lvl 110, when you should have already been exposed to a majority of the content anyway.
-It would be ridiculous if there were numerous, ever-changing quests and you had to run around to multiple places try to find which was active at any given time.

Also, have you played for the past 3 expansions? Everything has had a generic breadcrumb quest saying "Hey go here" which is no different than a talking head map say "Hey go here."

[ElDoorO]

A phrase I've heard VERY OFTEN over the last couple of expansions has been "welfare epics."

Another phrase: "Loot pinata." Or another: "Monty Haul" (though that's something that older gamers remember...). ESPECIALLY in WoD.

Raiders went on rants, saying "if you're not doing raids, you don't need raid gear." And it makes sense. Raids are tuned to higher gear levels (and, especially, split-second timing, group tactics, and knowing the fight), whereas outdoor content should be tuned to the majority who are casuals.

I mean, unless Blizzard is going to give us gear for just clicking a button? Something that keeps up with content...? That would be in keeping with the trend they've shown in the last couple of expansions. I'm sure we'll reach the point where casuals walking around in Normal-mode current tier raid gear is possible within a couple months of each raid tier being released, without stepping foot into a raid.

If so, I'm hoping that they include the cool set bonuses and the awesome trinkets this time around. (I mean, hey, if you guys WANT to keep up the "you get raid gear, you get raid gear, EVERYBODY gets raid gear!!!" Blizzard is using to keep the casuals subscribed...?)

To be fair, by their own logic: You don't need any gear from Mythic Archi because there's nothing harder and you don't NEED it to down any further bosses. I mean, we're talking need, right? So Archi shouldn't drop anything, right? Since you don't need it. Fair is fair.

[Super Kami Dende]

Give people 300 varying quests to do at max level, on top of Profession Quest, Class Quests and Story Quests and they still complain about something.

GG forums.

[ombus]

i am clinging to the hope of varian wyrm being alive... hope in 3/4 of the expansion he appears... hope.

[maccajoe]

Lol make no difference for the majoirty whether world quests are from map or out in the world. If they were in the world they would have rough spawn times and rough location marks they would never be 100% random. And even if they were someone would make an addon to detect when they are up. And if they wernt random people would just goo to wowhead and type "legion world quests spawns"

The games changed people have changed and so has the landscape an addon for everything and a google search for everything.
Sure would it be nice if the quests were random? Sure maybe not sure if i could actually care about searching for them.

[grexly75]

Give people 300 varying quests to do at max level, on top of Profession Quest, Class Quests and Story Quests and they still complain about something.

GG forums.

Yeah for sure when you had pkayers going troppo for having little or nothing to do, now Blizz went okay lets give players a lot to do and they still complain, makes one wonder if the players actually know what they want..

[Kathranis]

The new beholder and voidwalker models are excellent!

[Sentynel]

i am clinging to the hope of varian wyrm being alive... hope in 3/4 of the expansion he appears... hope.

I recall people saying Varian is one of the most useless and boring characters and why he's still alive, and now that he's dead people want him desperately back.

[Wolfie of Medivh]

Yeah. Running to an NPC, or unlocking a quest hub in a region is called "immersion".

Immersion seems to be slowly being removed from the game. Because "talking head" quest givers is so much better, amirite?

More convenient? For the devs, yes. And for the players.

Does it help maintain immersion? No, it pretty much ignores it.

It's up to you how important immersion is to an MMO. Me? I think it's kind of important. Plus, this removes the need to explore, since the map does all the exploring for you. I like the start of a new expansion, and the greyed out map, and exploring all the regions to find out what's there - and kill everything there. Wee! Now the map does it for me, and I can just flight straight to an objective with no silly exploring or story.

But, hey, they're not dailies, so that's good, right?

See, in my mind, it made no sense.

LEt's take the Shadow-Pan Garrsion in Towlong Steppes as an example. The one near the Temple of Nu'zao.

There's this big camp of highly trained guards there. They stand around waiting for you to stumble on them, and they give you a bunch of quests every day.

....

This makes no sense. If they're so powerful and knowledgeable why am I doing this instead of them? Why are they standing here, giving me gold for doing it? And they have a vendor with expensive items to help them!

Now let's look at the Garrison table. I have recruited and geared out a bunch of followers. They go out and do things and bring me the gold/items.

....

This doesn't make any sense either! if these folks are so powerful they can take on a wing of a raid dungeon why do they need my sterling leadership? Don't ya think they could figure it out?

So yeah, too far the other way.

Now, let's look at Legions idea: I send a scout out to find hotspots. They report it back to me on my map, which I can then use to get to the trouble and fix it.

Now, doesn't that seem a lot more balanced? I have a follower who is specifically set up to do work for me to give me something to do. These things vary so I'm not going to one set geographic spot, and I actually have to go there and do something.

This seems like the best of both worlds: a good reason to do something, and reason to go out and do it.

[Traveler Voltin]

We've remade the Stormwind harbor again! But the park would cost a raid tier

Stormwind gets attacked by the legion.
So

[ombus]

I recall people saying Varian is one of the most useless and boring characters and why he's still alive, and now that he's dead people want him desperately back.

Me personally, Always liked Varian and is not something that happens when he dies now..

[Tomana]

Give people 300 varying quests to do at max level, on top of Profession Quest, Class Quests and Story Quests and they still complain about something.

GG forums.

Some people just want to bitch about something, alas.