"We think [Elite] Players deserve better gear" - Kaivax

[Jaylock]

What do you think about the recent blue post essentially saying "We think [Elite] players deserve better gear?"

Reminder --
We’re sensitive to your concerns and we’ll keep them all in mind as we settle on ilvl values for gear.

Something worth repeating --
There’s been some concern from both PvEers and PvPers that “raiders will just do Arena to get easy gear” and “gladiators will just do Mythic raids to get easy gear.” We feel it’s important to remember how challenging both types of gameplay can be. Downing Mythic bosses and earning Gladiator rating are two of the most difficult accomplishments in World of Warcraft. We think players who have demonstrated skill at those levels deserve to be rewarded with better gear.

This was a direct quote from Kaivax, a blue poster on the official forums.

Personally I agree. If people are going to spend the time and effort in that type of Raid or PvP environment, we better damn well get better gear than people clicking an "i win" button for LFR.

This is why tier bonuses and trinkets from normal and above raiding should not be in LFR at all. Why give players elite level bonuses / trinkets for janitor level performance?

What are your thoughts?

[oldgeezer]

People who run harder content already get better gear, and will continue to do so. That's fine. No need to stir up forum drama over it.

[Eats Compost]

It definitely makes sense that raiders would get better gear, but it is worth bearing in mind that WoW deals with a complex web of rewards and their relationship to various content. For example, raids and outdoor content are like apples and oranges, but the most striaghtforward gear structure ends with the apple-eater being great at eating oranges and the orange-eater being bad at eating apples. It's a really weird dynamic because of how the game struggles to implement PvE difficulty outside of situations where 9-24 people have to succeed at the same task simultaneously.

Still, it does make sense that raiding would offer a significant power reward, and if it's not significant outside of raids, then it's a bit redundant.

[OreoLover]

What do you think about the recent blue post essentially saying "We think [Elite] players deserve better gear?"

Reminder --
We’re sensitive to your concerns and we’ll keep them all in mind as we settle on ilvl values for gear.

Something worth repeating --
There’s been some concern from both PvEers and PvPers that “raiders will just do Arena to get easy gear” and “gladiators will just do Mythic raids to get easy gear.” We feel it’s important to remember how challenging both types of gameplay can be. Downing Mythic bosses and earning Gladiator rating are two of the most difficult accomplishments in World of Warcraft. We think players who have demonstrated skill at those levels deserve to be rewarded with better gear.

This was a direct quote from Kaivax, a blue poster on the official forums.

Personally I agree. If people are going to spend the time and effort in that type of Raid or PvP environment, we better damn well get better gear than people clicking an "i win" button for LFR.

This is why tier bonuses and trinkets from normal and above raiding should not be in LFR at all. Why give players elite level bonuses / trinkets for janitor level performance?

What are your thoughts?

Item levels and uniquely challenging encounters are the rewards.

Set bonuses need not be.

[Berengil]

Well, yeh. If you do Mythic raids and/or get Glad rating, you should probly get some nifty stuff.

But the idea that LFR should continue to be shat upon, that's where you lose me. Simple solution so that raiders don't feel "forced" to do lfr:

1)LFR shares a lockout with all other raid types. If you do lfr 1 week, you can't even enter a current raid normal and up. Likewise, if you do normal and up, you can't queue for lfr that week.

2)Also, tier gear with the RAID FINDER tag doesn't work with other levels of tier to activate set bonuses.

There. With those two, debate over.

Unless of course the point is that dirty, stinking, filthy casual scrubs should always feel like 2nd class citizens in WoW. That's not it, right?

Right?

[ovm33]

There absolutely should be incentives / bonuses for the best players in the game. I think unique transmogs, mounts, pet's AND the best gear is not too much. But with the caveat that the best gear can't be worlds ahead of everything else.

This entire game is based around making you character more powerful. You start with the leveling experience of gaining new spells, health, mana, etc. then at end game through gear. Blizz needs to find a happy medium between the average players' progression and making them happy - including keyboard turners / mouthbreathers / facerollers etc. And make it so the top 1-3% can fap off to how fucking fantastic they are.

[Saul Goodman]

Even if LFR gear does have a set bonus the Norm, Hero & Mythic raiders are going to have a higher set bonus. And F.Y.I some raid teams start with LFR to get that set bonus to progress into norm not everyone can just hop right into Heroic or Mythics like some. I say it's a good thing tier sets in legion LFR will have a set bonus. it's really not hurting anyone. It just gives the non hardcore raiders a chance to progress, And there's nothing wrong with that.

[oldgeezer]

Then why does legions lfr gear have real set bonuses?

Honestly, I wouldn't care if set bonuses were removed from LFR tier gear.

As a proud LFR-only scrub and role-player I'm more interested in the appearance of the gear than the numbers. In fact, it would lessen the flow of tears from the 'serious' raiders who are forced - forced I say - to run LFR to complete their set bonuses if the bonuses were removed. But I don't have problem with the bonuses being present either. They are largely irrelevant to me.

[Mirishka]

Another day, another dumb-ass topic from this guy.

Of course people running the most challenging stuff in the game are going to get better rewards. In other news, it gets bright outside when the sun comes up. FFS.

[Donald Hellscream]

I agree that they deserve better gear because they do harder content but I really don't care whether or not some guy in LFR can get the same tier bonus from doing that as I can from doing heroic or mythic raiding, my gear is still gonna be better because it has a higher stat value.

[Treno]

People who run harder content already get better gear, and will continue to do so. That's fine. No need to stir up forum drama over it.

Well, this is Jaylock we're talking about. That quote was not even directly about LFR yet he's posting this obviously to stir up a big flame War. The post was about exploiting PVP gear to do PVE and vice-versa not about tiets of content difficulty and Rewards.

[Mirishka]

Honestly, I wouldn't care if set bonuses were removed from LFR tier gear.

As a proud LFR-only scrub and role-player I'm more interested in the appearance of the gear than the numbers. In fact, it would lessen the flow of tears from the 'serious' raiders who are forced - forced I say - to run LFR to complete their set bonuses if the bonuses were removed. But I don't have problem with the bonuses being present either. They are largely irrelevant to me.

People who run LFR because they're impatient and want their set bonuses sooner =/= forced.

Spend some time in prison. Then you'll better understand the meaning of the word.

[Socialhealer]

gladiator and mythic aren't anything alike.

maybe if after serenity gets world first, you have 2 weeks to clear the instance before all titles and mounts are removed from the game, NOW it's like gladiator!

[araine]

What do you think about the recent blue post essentially saying "We think [Elite] players deserve better gear?"

Reminder --
We’re sensitive to your concerns and we’ll keep them all in mind as we settle on ilvl values for gear.

Something worth repeating --
There’s been some concern from both PvEers and PvPers that “raiders will just do Arena to get easy gear” and “gladiators will just do Mythic raids to get easy gear.” We feel it’s important to remember how challenging both types of gameplay can be. Downing Mythic bosses and earning Gladiator rating are two of the most difficult accomplishments in World of Warcraft. We think players who have demonstrated skill at those levels deserve to be rewarded with better gear.

This was a direct quote from Kaivax, a blue poster on the official forums.

Personally I agree. If people are going to spend the time and effort in that type of Raid or PvP environment, we better damn well get better gear than people clicking an "i win" button for LFR.

This is why tier bonuses and trinkets from normal and above raiding should not be in LFR at all. Why give players elite level bonuses / trinkets for janitor level performance?

What are your thoughts?

They arent in LFR as is. so dont see what elite bonus you get in LFR care to explain more or just ramble on with more lies?

[endersblade]

I don't see why this needed a thread. Pretty obvious topic is pretty obvious. Work hard, get better rewards. Been like that since Vanilla.

[araine]

People who run LFR because they're impatient and want their set bonuses sooner =/= forced.

Spend some time in prison. Then you'll better understand the meaning of the word.

But they dont drop in LFR so care to explain how running LFR gets you Tier when it cant fucking drop there? really if we are to have a debate on elite level gear at least be honest about it and not lying like crazy to suit the agenda of the special snowflakes

[Wallmaker Yahzarah]

I just personally hope I can get some competent non-elite gear through pvping, because if we have to raid PVE to have a chance to compete/battle for World PVP quests. There will be no point in leaving class halls; spamming BG/Arena queues.

[bmjclark]

But they dont drop in LFR so care to explain how running LFR gets you Tier when it cant fucking drop there? really if we are to have a debate on elite level gear at least be honest about it and not lying like crazy to suit the agenda of the special snowflakes

Tier will drop in lfr in legion. Maybe anyways, there's raid finder tier gear that's been datamined

[araine]

Tier will drop in lfr in legion. Maybe anyways, there's raid finder tier gear that's been datamined

Good it is a needed change, iti s still shit gear but good change

[Volibear]

gladiator and mythic aren't anything alike.

maybe if after serenity gets world first, you have 2 weeks to clear the instance before all titles and mounts are removed from the game, NOW it's like gladiator!

Not at all.

The way it is currently is like Gladiator. You finish a tier before the next to get the FoS. If the next tier is released and you didn't get the endboss down, you don't get it, ever.