Assault Weapons are not real

[Stacyrect]

So yeah "TECHNICALLY" there is an assault weapon because language exists in a bill. It never ceases to amaze me that law makers, even those with military records, have such a fucking frightening lack of knowledge when it comes to fire arms. The argument has not changed since the last time gun legislation was up so let's re-visit what the federal government classifies as an "Assault Weapon" and what it does not.

Here you have a ruegar and an AR-15. Both are identical except for color and the ruegar is missing a pistol grip. Both fire the same ammo, both have same mag capacity. Both are just as deadly. The ruegar is ok, the ar-15 is not.

It' superficial dumb ass shit like this that makes me smh. FFS paint the AR-15 pink already so washington can use it's time to do something productive instead of arguing about non-sense.

[XangXu]

Not sure how you extrapolated that from what I said. Care to enlighten me?

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Umm, no.
A pellet gun is absolutely *not* a toy or a "glorified" toy. You can penetrate someone with one and kill them.
I can't kill someone with a nerf toy under normal circumstances.

Me, my friend, and one other person have all been shot by a pellet gun. It hurts like hell, but it would take a lot more shots to KILL someone.

I mean maybe if you hand the gun right up against their flesh, it could probably do damage. It's easier to get closer with a knife though, honestly.


So please, don't launch into the "Anything can be an assault weapon" argument. Just don't. Fucking don't. 50 people are dead because of that bullshit thinking.

[ElDoorO]

Me, my friend, and one other person have all been shot by a pellet gun. It hurts like hell, but it would take a lot more shots to KILL someone.

I mean maybe if you hand the gun right up against their flesh, it could probably do damage. It's easier to get closer with a knife though, honestly.


So please, don't launch into the "Anything can be an assault weapon" argument. Just don't. Fucking don't. 50 people are dead because of that bullshit thinking.

Then it was a weak pellet gun. All the ones I've owned can go through your skull.
Further, the fact that you've been shot tells me you lack basic gun knowledge and skills. I sincerely pity how you were raised.

Lastly, are you still confused on an AR-15 is not a machine gun? Because that's what your initial confusion was about. You thought they were the same or, at least, responded as such.

[XangXu]

You know it really is starting to come down to two very simple lines of thinking...

Who wants to watch the world burn in Chaos...?

Who doesn't...?


More and more I see republicans and conservatives choosing to defend flat out EVIL policies... None of us want to say the world EVIL, but when you see conservative pastors saying they are sad that more gay people didn't die, when you have people defending others' ability to own massively destructive weapons even though they are mentally unstable...

It's evil... it's evil to hold back people's rights based on who the fuck.

It's evil to prevent an entire gender from doing what they want with their bodies.

More and More I see that it isn't about politics. It's about what is good and what is evil.

[Youn]

The reason that the folding stock, flash suppressor, pistol grip, magazine capacity and bayonet rules were in place to define assault weapons was because they were trying to circumvent the 2nd amendments rules by banning those. "A well regulated Militia, being necessary to the security of a free State, the right of the people to keep and bear Arms, shall not be infringed." This meant you cannot ban the weapon itself. But you could ban features of a weapon. The AR-15 could easily be argued necessary for people to form militias. And that armed encampments of people are allowed by the constitution.

Now, if you want to regulate the sale of firearms the correct way to do it is repeal the 2nd amendment. We have done it with prohibition of alcohol before and can do it with the 2nd amendment. But, to right laws that infringe on the right be bear arms is against the constitution as written.

[Gorgodeus]

Okay, so why is the AR-15 considered an "assault weapon?" You press the trigger and one round comes out. It also cannot be "easily" modified to be full auto because that would require replacing everything but the barrel.

Go educate yourself before spouting off rubbish.



It is too damn easy to turn a semi-auto into what is effectively a full auto.

[XangXu]

Then it was a weak pellet gun. All the ones I've owned can go through your skull.
Further, the fact that you've been shot tells me you lack basic gun knowledge and skills. I sincerely pity how you were raised.

Lastly, are you still confused on an AR-15 is not a machine gun? Because that's what your initial confusion was about. You thought they were the same or, at least, responded as such.

The pellets were embedded into my skin and needed a doctor to pull it out. It hurt LIKE HELL.

it did not kill me.

[Joathen]

Me, my friend, and one other person have all been shot by a pellet gun. It hurts like hell, but it would take a lot more shots to KILL someone.

I mean maybe if you hand the gun right up against their flesh, it could probably do damage. It's easier to get closer with a knife though, honestly.


So please, don't launch into the "Anything can be an assault weapon" argument. Just don't. Fucking don't. 50 people are dead because of that bullshit thinking.

It's bullshit because it's true and erodes your fear induced knee-jerk reaction? Boston bombing, 9/11, OK City bombing- none of those used firearms; I know it disagrees with your view of a authoritarian utopia with a law enforcement officer on every corner but some of us live quite far from police assistance, the nearest waystation for my department is a little over an hour away- plenty of time for someone to do a resident harm, pretty sure self defense is a valid reason to own a firearm.

But naw- clearly anyone who owns a gun is just compensating for a small package or IQ.

[XangXu]

god you people are talking about forming militias and trying to argue that you need fucking machine guns in an OH so serious manner...

meanwhile the rest of the world fucking looks at you and asks, "Why? To defend yourself against your neighbour? Brown people? The government?"


You know if you set aside the fact that these weapons are freely available to purchase in your country and focus in on WHY people are buying them a much more terrifying picture emerges, one painted with fear and paranoia of your fellow citizen.

But on the other hand, even after all of my arguments and anger, I have to stop myself from time to time. I have to remind myself that as angry as I get, I am not American. So I really will never understand the fact that walking the streets in your country after 8pm is much more dangerous then doing so in mine. I forget that when you live in a society where everyone is afraid of each other or mentaly unstable, you NEED protection.

So based on that, I will apologize if I offend anyone here. I often forget that your country and its citizens are much more dangerous and unstable than others in the western world. So I suppose I can understand your want for assault weapons...

To defend yourself from people who have been mentally broken by your country.

I understand this.

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It's bullshit because it's true and erodes your fear induced knee-jerk reaction? Boston bombing, 9/11, OK City bombing- none of those used firearms; I know it disagrees with your view of a authoritarian utopia with a law enforcement officer on every corner but some of us live quite far from police assistance, the nearest waystation for my department is a little over an hour away- plenty of time for someone to do a resident harm, pretty sure self defense is a valid reason to own a firearm.

But naw- clearly anyone who owns a gun is just compensating for a small package or IQ.

I grew up in a tiny town of only 500 residents. The local police force there consisted of one officer.

No one in my town owned a gun because they were worried about a crazy killer being out on the loose like people do in your country. What's more, is that it is terrifying that the above scenario is more likely to happen in America then anywhere else in the western world.

And in my 20 years of living in that town, we only had ONE incident... involving a break up and a hunting rifle. No one was hurt.

Your country and its people are broken. This is what I've come to realize. It's not the guns that you should be worried about. It's so many other things that I don't see a solution for...

Like the fact that a giant chunk of your people are paranoid and afraid of a false threat that they are willing to stock up on guns and live in their own little fantasy world. You fucking see it when the news dicks shove a microphone in my face.

"Gee I don't know about that, but fucking Obama is a muslim and he better not come onto my property"

Who the fuck thinks like that?

Americans. Mentally unstable Americans ready and willing to kill others because they think the civil war never ended.

The very fact that people say, "Well we can't ban all guns now, that would be impossible" highlights the problem . But why would it be impossible? Because of the people i just mentioned fighting an invisible war.

[ElDoorO]

The pellets were embedded into my skin and needed a doctor to pull it out. It hurt LIKE HELL.

it did not kill me.

Must have been some weak Co2 carts or you didn't pump it much.

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Seems it's hard to have a serious discussion without childish retorts here. Suppose this is for people who need an outlet who have no other way of releasing themselves than an honest discussion. Y'all have a good day now.

[Wildtree]

It never ceases to amaze me that law makers, even those with military records, have such a fucking frightening lack of knowledge when it comes to fire arms.

What doesn't cease to amaze me, is how you guys always think how these people have no knowledge, just because they've coined a label for a group of weapons and you don't like the term.

[Joathen]

god you people are talking about forming militias and trying to argue that you need fucking machine guns in an OH so serious manner...

meanwhile the rest of the world fucking looks at you and asks, "Why? To defend yourself against your neighbour? Brown people? The government?"


You know if you set aside the fact that these weapons are freely available to purchase in your country and focus in on WHY people are buying them a much more terrifying picture emerges, one painted with fear and paranoia of your fellow citizen.

But on the other hand, even after all of my arguments and anger, I have to stop myself from time to time. I have to remind myself that as angry as I get, I am not American. So I really will never understand the fact that walking the streets in your country after 8pm is much more dangerous then doing so in mine. I forget that when you live in a society where everyone is afraid of each other or mentaly unstable, you NEED protection.

So based on that, I will apologize if I offend anyone here. I often forget that your country and its citizens are much more dangerous and unstable than others in the western world. So I suppose I can understand your want for assault weapons...

To defend yourself from people who have been mentally broken by your country.

I understand this.

Yeah- this actually. Wherever you heard that America was a shining beacon of prosperity where there's no crime and everyone drives flying cars and sings songs while holding hands around the campfire- that's a fantasy. There are just about entire cities where you DON'T walk around after 8pm- not because of paranoia but because you statistically put yourself at odds to be a victim of rape, murder or robbery- that's all shit that actually happens, a lot.

The police here are a joke- they aren't nor can they be expected to be everywhere, but even so there are neighborhoods they won't go into without backup because THEY feel afraid- I live in one, police response time is upwards of an hour and a half on average, regardless of what the call is for.

Criminals are going to commit crimes, look at the drug cartels to our south- cocaine is highly illegal but that doesn't stop them, if you ban guns outright it just gives them the upper hand since they're already breaking the law and couldn't care less about another charge- we'd just be making the cartels and syndicates richer by handing them sole sale rights for a hot street commodity.

Shit is different over here, people are crazy- especially in Florida which is the US's circus essentially, to look down on people for wanting to take steps in way of protecting their families and themselves is silly.

[Eviscero]

The problem is that EVERY weapon is an assault weapon. An assault weapon is any weapon that you can assault someone with. Even a knife is an assault weapon. Its a stupid term

Imagine if 'the left' tried to propose this as its definition.

The issue that many of you are ignoring is the fact that the AR-15 and other Assault Rifles, and by Assault Rifle I mean,

"a semiautomatic firearm with the ability to accept a detachable magazine and two or more of the following:

a folding or telescoping stock
a pistol grip that protrudes conspicuously beneath the action of the weapon
a bayonet mount
a flash suppressor or threaded barrel designed to accommodate a flash suppressor
a grenade launcher"

is BY DEFINITION different than, say, a bolt action rifle. It is different in another important way -- which is the whole fucking reason for the definition in the first place. It is different in how deadly it is in the hands of an untrained individual. By this I mean you just point and shoot, squeeze off 50 rounds without moving your finger more than a centimeter with your hands in a position (due to the pistol group) which makes it very easy to aim and maneuver while firing.

To say "THEsE GUNS ARE thE SAMe AS RIFLE-X BECAUSE BULLET SIZE" ignores the other attributes of the gun that make it far deadlier in the hands of the average person. Stop being intentionally dumb.

Let me ask you, was the M16 designed to just look badass and scary or was there some other fucking reason why the military and law enforcement uses these rifles? Might there be SOME FUCKING REASON why the military uses certain types of guns, with certain definable attributes, over others? Because they make them MORE EFFECTIVE AT KILLING. Honestly, fuck off OP.

[Stormdash]

What doesn't cease to amaze me, is how you guys always think how these people have no knowledge, just because they've coined a label for a group of weapons and you don't like the term.

They've coined a term that doesn't actually have a readily identifiable, technical meaning. It's like if the government started trying to regulate drugs for the purpose of treating "cooties", or an environmental regulation capping "yucky" -- they know what they feel like it means, but since it doesn't mean anything to subject matter experts and professionals and the regulated industry, it's garbage.

[Youn]

My mother and I accidentally pulled off on the first exit going into Chicago on a trip up to visit relatives in Minnesota. As we pulled upto a light, a police officer pulled up behind us and turned on his lights. We pulled over and he told us we were in the wrong part of town. That we should follow closely behind him and to absolutely not stop for lights, he would get us back up on the highway. That was 30 years ago, I am pretty sure it hasn't become a safer place in those years.

[XangXu]

Yeah- this actually. Wherever you heard that America was a shining beacon of prosperity where there's no crime and everyone drives flying cars and sings songs while holding hands around the campfire- that's a fantasy. There are just about entire cities where you DON'T walk around after 8pm- not because of paranoia but because you statistically put yourself at odds to be a victim of rape, murder or robbery- that's all shit that actually happens, a lot.

The police here are a joke- they aren't nor can they be expected to be everywhere, but even so there are neighborhoods they won't go into without backup because THEY feel afraid- I live in one, police response time is upwards of an hour and a half on average, regardless of what the call is for.

Criminals are going to commit crimes, look at the drug cartels to our south- cocaine is highly illegal but that doesn't stop them, if you ban guns outright it just gives them the upper hand since they're already breaking the law and couldn't care less about another charge- we'd just be making the cartels and syndicates richer by handing them sole sale rights for a hot street commodity.

Shit is different over here, people are crazy- especially in Florida which is the US's circus essentially, to look down on people for wanting to take steps in way of protecting their families and themselves is silly.

"over here"


I'm Canadian and i'm wanting them to tighten up boarder security against AMERICANS from entering.

Hey America. Just to let you know. You're the new Mexico.

How ironic.

[Deleted]

There are only defense weapons, I know.

It doesn't matter how you call it as long as everyone knows what it is supposed to mean. That's how words work.

Edit: Okay, apparently people don't know what an assault weapon is supposed to be....

[Stormdash]

Imagine if 'the left' tried to propose this as its definition.

The issue that many of you are ignoring is the fact that the AR-15 and other Assault Rifles, and by Assault Rifle I mean,

"a semiautomatic firearm with the ability to accept a detachable magazine and two or more of the following:

a folding or telescoping stock
a pistol grip that protrudes conspicuously beneath the action of the weapon
a bayonet mount
a flash suppressor or threaded barrel designed to accommodate a flash suppressor
a grenade launcher"

is BY DEFINITION different than, say, a bolt action rifle. It is different in another important way -- which is the whole fucking reason for the definition in the first place. It is different in how deadly it is in the hands of an untrained individual. By this I mean you just point and shoot, squeeze off 50 rounds without moving your finger more than a centimeter with your hands in a position (due to the pistol group) which makes it very easy to aim and maneuver while firing.

To say "THEsE GUNS ARE thE SAMe AS RIFLE-X BECAUSE BULLET SIZE" ignores the other attributes of the gun that make it far deadlier in the hands of the average person. Stop being intentional dumb.

... and it doesn't help that you're taking a term that's already got a settled use in the firearms industry -- "assault rifle" -- and coopting it to include a shit ton of things that aren't.

[Wildtree]

They've coined a term that doesn't actually have a readily identifiable, technical meaning. It's like if the government started trying to regulate drugs for the purpose of treating "cooties", or an environmental regulation capping "yucky" -- they know what they feel like it means, but since it doesn't mean anything to subject matter experts and professionals and the regulated industry, it's garbage.

As mentioned, you're about 23 years late to the party.
Might as well accept it as evolution of language?

[Stormdash]

As mentioned, you're about 23 years late to the party.
Might as well accept it as evolution of language?

... or the monumental failure and irrelevance of that law as proof that making up bullshit terms to govern an engineering industry is a waste of time?