...I tried finding the answer, leveling spec.

[Corner]

I spent 2 hours reading every post I could and their is no direct answer. ( I spent a lot of time enjoying the arguments completely off the OP, it was enjoyable.)

So, for the simple minded raider; who doesn't know all the terms as he's been gone for a year....break it down simply.

What should I level as ?

Strictly PVE - Dungeon and raid oriented.

From what I have read - BM prevails early - then MM takes the cake - Survival isn't viable as it's melee..and you're a hunter, so go home.


With that being said...Do I level as BM? Work on that artifact and conquer dungeons...before switching to MM, going ham on that artifact and raiding MM?

Is that the general consensus? The sims are just showing, go survival because it's best...but wait MM is more raid efficient, but BM for mobility.

For the little guy, break this down for us in simple terms.

"Go BM early, until "so and so" "choose this artifact chain". Switch to MM at this point, until so and so". I don't want reasoning, Just "this is the cookie cutter way to go for best overall performance"

Thank you, and enjoy the days to come!


PS...Azor, so far all your post (granted everyone argues with you for no reason other then to argue) seem to be most informative, can you break this down in simple terms as if I know nothing about wow anymore. Cheers) And I mean SIMPLE - I can go back to all the other post for more detail oriented things, I just can't piece it all together on my own, brain hurts.

[Azortharion]

I wrote a leveling guide for Legion that will be on Icy-Veins later today.

Here's a sneak peek (without formatting and in HTML, but you get the idea).

[Corner]

Perfect, leveling guide I will check out. Cheers for the work you put in.

[jinsu]

without reading azor's post, i would say just go MM and use black arrow to level. If you have trouble you can always switch out of lone wolf and use a bear or something.

[Deleted]

without reading azor's post, i would say just go MM and use black arrow to level. If you have trouble you can always switch out of lone wolf and use a bear or something.

I just find out that BM is more that fine for leveling to 110 its like MD>Barrage>Pew pew beastcleave all the way ahead...Got a problem with to much mobs pulled?? caboom stampede babe

[spinner981]

without reading azor's post, i would say just go MM and use black arrow to level. If you have trouble you can always switch out of lone wolf and use a bear or something.

Or you could just not take Lone Wolf and pet tank everything.

[clevin]

Also without reading Azor's post I'd level as what I wanted to play at endgame. You might have to use different talents but it saves all the work of catching up your artifact, etc and leveling just isn't that hard.

[Azortharion]

Or you could just not take Lone Wolf and pet tank everything.

What a sick idea, achieve the same thing but just do way less fucking damage. Good shit, man.

[spinner981]

What a sick idea, achieve the same thing but just do way less fucking damage. Good shit, man.

And don't have to deal with the extremely awkward and unreliable dark minion misdirecting when fighting more than one mob at a time? I'm looking to hopefully somewhat enjoy leveling, instead of just trying to get it out of the way.

I rather just use my actual pet than some random boar that will despawn in 8 seconds and shift all the threat over to me.

[Azortharion]

Fair point, except not really because regular pets don't hold any aggro beyond Growl which is on a cd, and surprisingly only really usable on one mob at a time.

[spinner981]

Fair point, except not really because regular pets don't hold any aggro beyond Growl which is on a cd, and surprisingly only really usable on one mob at a time.

Misdirecting and multi-shotting or barraging is still more effective at tanking multiple mobs than whatever you are going to do with black arrow minions.

[ryjkur]

how many potion stacks do i need if i want to macro potion to my dps abilities? without having to worry they end before 110

[Dch48]

I just find out that BM is more that fine for leveling to 110 its like MD>Barrage>Pew pew beastcleave all the way ahead...Got a problem with to much mobs pulled?? caboom stampede babe

I'll be doing it as BM but without both Barrage and Stampede.

[Youn]

There is zero issue with leveling MM with lonewolf+barrage+sidewinders. You will pull a few extra mobs but who cares. They die pretty much the same if you have 1 or 5.

[spinner981]

There is zero issue with leveling MM with lonewolf+barrage+sidewinders. You will pull a few extra mobs but who cares. They die pretty much the same if you have 1 or 5.

But you see... that means taking sidewinders.

[Azortharion]

Sidewinders which hits even more stuff than Barrage, pretty obvious pic for mass pulling.

[spinner981]

Sidewinders which hits even more stuff than Barrage, pretty obvious pic for mass pulling.

Depends on the situation which one pulls more mobs. The obvious pic for the leet deeps, but personally I think it feels awkward, makes the rotation less fun/engaging (though that isn't saying much) and looks hideous.

[Azortharion]

OP wanted the best leveling spec, I think your feelings on its awkwardness/engaging-ness could not be less important in this context.

[aysatsana]

Fair point, except not really because regular pets don't hold any aggro beyond Growl which is on a cd, and surprisingly only really usable on one mob at a time.

Really? A self proclaimed rank 1 PVE (lol) hunter says growl is the only way for pets to hold aggro? You can use misdirect+aoe attacks to get aggro on your pet, or you can start attacking and just feign death and get the mobs on your pet (you'll have enough time to kill them before your pet loses aggro).

Having a pet is incredibly useful for soloing/questing especially if you're not fully mythic geared and can't nuke everything. It is a better overall leveling method since it allows you to pull more mobs without worrying about having to kite them around (which might make you pull more mobs). Just MD them to your pet and let him tank. Lone wolf's damage increase is significant for raiding and stuff where you just sit there and press 123, but for questing/pvp having a pet can be more useful even with the damage loss.

At the end of the day it doesn't really matter, chose whatever you want. I just think having a pet outweighs lonewolf just for convenience while leveling.

You really come off as cunt with those replies like you know it all, spinner981 had a valid point. Then again, from what I've read it seems like you know fuckall besides sitting there and pressing 1234 on patchwerk, in which case of course having lone wolf is great. However in the question "what's best for leveling" it's not just about what does the most damage in a patchwerk fight.

[Azortharion]

Really? A self proclaimed rank 1 PVE (lol) hunter says growl is the only way for pets to hold aggro? You can use misdirect+aoe attacks to get aggro on your pet, or you can start attacking and just feign death and get the mobs on your pet (you'll have enough time to kill them before your pet loses aggro).

Having a pet is incredibly useful for soloing/questing especially if you're not fully mythic geared and can't nuke everything. It is a better overall leveling method since it allows you to pull more mobs without worrying about having to kite them around (which might make you pull more mobs). Just MD them to your pet and let him tank. Lone wolf's damage increase is significant for raiding and stuff where you just sit there and press 123, but for questing/pvp having a pet can be more useful even with the damage loss.

At the end of the day it doesn't really matter, chose whatever you want. I just think having a pet outweighs lonewolf just for convenience while leveling.

You really come off as cunt with those replies like you know it all, spinner981 had a valid point. Then again, from what I've read it seems like you know fuckall besides sitting there and pressing 1234 on patchwerk, in which case of course having lone wolf is great. However in the question "what's best for leveling" it's not just about what does the most damage in a patchwerk fight.

Applying that same logic, you will have enough time to kill mobs before Black Arrow expires (which is entirely the case). There is absolutely no reason to drop the Lone Wolf damage bonus for a pet just to have something to keep aggro on yourself. There is no way that's worth the damage loss you suffer (because Steady Focus is as good as a wasted talent besides the pet).

It takes a certain kind of massive idiot to on one hand mock a rank 1 parse signature-haver (why I do not know, it doesn't help your argument nor detract from mine), and then go ahead and say that "it doesn't really matter". It's not self-proclaimed either, genius. You can always talk about how arrogant it is to include in the signature, or how little it matters, all of which has nothing to do with the argument whatsoever and just solidifies your status as a fucking dingus, in case anyone was in doubt after you suggested using "AoE attacks" as a Marksmanship Hunter, of which there is only one in spinner981's world (Barrage), on a 20 second cooldown with a hefty cost that you will only really be able to use at the beginning of each pull, and additionally does almost no fucking damage to each individual mob and therefore does a shit job of building meaningful aggro through Misdirection that you won't ruin by casting Multi into Marked right after.

Convenience isn't what gets you from 100 to 110 quicker, it's being able to pull as much as possible and kill it as quickly as possible. All the survivability you need will come from killing things as quickly as possible because of how the Exhilaration CDR mechanic works, something I have no doubt that you know absolutely fucking nothing about. After you've Barraged, without Sidewinders you'll need to wait for mobs to bunch together on your pet before you can even start marking stuff with Marked Shot. Meanwhile, you can use Sidewinders to not only deal damage to what you've already pulled, you can also pull more stuff than what you're currently dealing with (which may save your life, remember how killing was = surviving?) while doing damage to that.

Instead of bringing your feelings to a fact fight, which is what OP is asking about, maybe just acknowledge some basic fucking facts about the game (actually playing it helps btw, I know many think they can just think their way to the solution):

1. Sidewinders does more damage and generates more focus than Multi-Shot at any target count.
2. Sidewinders' effective AoE range is 45-50 yards. Multi-Shot's is 8 yards.
3. Pets do little to no damage and thus generate little to no aggro.
4. Damage is key to leveling quickly because of how the Exhilaration CDR works when you kill enemies.
5. Black Arrow is the best damage talent, and on top of this it tanks mobs for you, making it a nobrainer even if you do choose to have a pet. This also means that it will detract from the value of having a pet in the first place since you'll be casting it on the most bothersome mob. Oh, and it also CD-resets whenever you kill an enemy, allowing you to pick the next target you don't wanna personally deal with.

Does this mean you'll have more mobs hitting you in the face on average? Yeah, it does, but you'll also be clearing away packs like twice as quickly (Sidewinders damage and ease of AoE, and the pulls will be bigger altogether (Sidewinders, again).

Your unfounded personal feelings towards convenience and obvious lack of knowledge about the game is potentially leading OP and everyone else reading into making wrong decisions, which is perhaps more of a dick move than me calling you a dingus, or an idiot.