[RESTO] 7.1 Nerfs?

[satanicway]

I'm not saying we are bad right now, but it is not like we are above the other healers.
They are even buffing other healers, and making some small nerfs on us.

Torrent -> Riptide extra heal from +40% to +30%.
Ancestral Vigor -> From +10% Hp to +8% Hp

Should we spec out of Torrent now? I still believe Ancestral Vigor is the best choice of it's level, because it reduces spike on tank.

/discuss?

[Scarge]

Ancestral VigorTargets you heal with Healing Wave, Healing Surge, Chain Heal, or Riptide's initial heal gain 8% (Down from10%)increased health for 10 sec. Restoration Shaman - Level 75 Talent. Even with the nerf, like you said this will still be the strongest talent in the tree, it might make Ancestral Protection Totem a bit more viable on some fights, but I think Ancestral Vigor will remain best pick for that line.


Torrent Increases the initial heal from Riptide by 30%(down from 40%). Restoration Shaman - Level 15 Talent. With this talent, I see Undulation becoming a lot more viable, and being on par with Torrent for raiding. I will still be running torrent in raids with echo for now, but I think Undulation will be use a lot more.

[Stabatya]

ROFL wtf are they thinking nerfing resto? We are middle of the pack healers in both mythic+ and raiding... Meanwhile resto druids are dominating (i won't go into the fact their tranq legendary is extremely overpowered, essentially giving them a "lol400khps" swifty button).

Stupid, undeserved nerfs.

[vulena]

Torrent is a nerf to bring it in line with the other talents, Ancestral Vigor was too powerful in raids.

They'll buff the class as a whole elsewhere, most likely, since our ST healing drops a bit with the Torrent line being brought down, and since it was somewhat lacking anyway.

[Larynx]

Torrent is a nerf to bring it in line with the other talents

So rather than nerfing an average performing healer, all in an effort to increase talent diversity... why don't they just buff the underperforming talents to match Torrent?

[FrogBow]

Torrent nerf is funny because in beta most people took Undulation so they nerfed it and then buffed torrent, and now on live everyone took torrent so they nerfed torrent too so now everything is nerfed into mediocrity hah.

That tier 1 row has had a rough time. Everything got hammered down so hard.

[Simulacrum]

So rather than nerfing an average performing healer, all in an effort to increase talent diversity... why don't they just buff the underperforming talents to match Torrent?

They're afraid of power creep, I guess.

I agree that it woudn't be dangerous to buff the others instead of nerfing torrent, though. Not like rshaman single-target healing is making anyone wet their pants from fear of being displaced or anything.

[Brewzar]

ROFL wtf are they thinking nerfing resto? We are middle of the pack healers in both mythic+ and raiding... Meanwhile resto druids are dominating (i won't go into the fact their tranq legendary is extremely overpowered, essentially giving them a "lol400khps" swifty button).

Stupid, undeserved nerfs.

We are not middle of the pack healers. We are top in Raids. Our AOE healing is unmatched. Can be equal to other healers in mythic+ if you talent right and know the dungeon.

I'm always top in my guild runs in Heroic and mythic EN.

These two nerfs are minor. Who cares.

[mcbubble]

Guys...Guys...it's okay.
They'll...just....buff...Mistweavers and Druids... and Paladins...?

I highly doubt we will get buffed elsewhere.

- - - Updated - - -

We are not middle of the pack healers. We are top in Raids. Our AOE healing is unmatched. Can be equal to other healers in mythic+ if you talent right and know the dungeon.

I'm always top in my guild runs in Heroic and mythic EN.

These two nerfs are minor. Who cares.

Top in Raids depending on what other healers you're running with.
Try to run with druids and a holy paladin on Dragons mythic and tell me you're #1...

Also...not top:
75%:
https://www.warcraftlogs.com/statistics/10#metric=hps

99%:
https://www.warcraftlogs.com/statist...hps&dataset=99

[Ahovv]

Guys...Guys...it's okay.
They'll...just....buff...Mistweavers and Druids... and Paladins...?

I highly doubt we will get buffed elsewhere.

- - - Updated - - -



Top in Raids depending on what other healers you're running with.
Try to run with druids and a holy paladin on Dragons mythic and tell me you're #1...

Also...not top:
75%:
https://www.warcraftlogs.com/statistics/10#metric=hps

99%:
https://www.warcraftlogs.com/statist...hps&dataset=99

lol.

Dragons mythic is a shit fight for Shaman because a ton of the healing is whack-a-mole ST, people can be spread out a bit too much, and sides are split.
@everyone else in this thread: Torrent is already a garbage talent for Tier 1. Undulation is better when you spend enough GCDs on ST healing, and Unleash Life is better when you're spamming a lot of chain heals. The Torrent change really does nothing for us as a healer class since you shouldn't be using it.

[mcbubble]

lol.

Dragons mythic is a shit fight for Shaman because a ton of the healing is whack-a-mole ST, people can be spread out a bit too much, and sides are split.
@everyone else in this thread: Torrent is already a garbage talent for Tier 1. Undulation is better when you spend enough GCDs on ST healing, and Unleash Life is better when you're spamming a lot of chain heals. The Torrent change really does nothing for us as a healer class since you shouldn't be using it.

Not all of us can be fed 3 innervates while 3 healing (well 4 if you count your disc) Talking about your Ursoc kill. I'm just jelly

I totally agree that it's a shit fight...but for unclumped fights we're middle of the road.

[Shawken]

Not really sure why they feel Shamans need a nerf. We are average.

[Jooji]

We are not middle of the pack healers. We are top in Raids. Our AOE healing is unmatched. Can be equal to other healers in mythic+ if you talent right and know the dungeon.

I'm always top in my guild runs in Heroic and mythic EN.

These two nerfs are minor. Who cares.

Why do people post blatant lies? I just checked out warcraft logs top 200 on every mythic fight. Our representation would suggest we're middle of the pack, not "the best." Maybe you're a better player than your other healers, but that doesn't mean shamans are better just because of your anecdotal evidence. I top healing in my raids also, but I also barely beat the holy paladin who has his best legendary already whom I know I'm better than.

I'm not going to scream "the world is ending" because these nerfs really aren't huge, but I just don't understand why. The logs/rankings don't suggest we need nerfs. I understand them wanting to bring talent choices more in line with each other, but why not buff the other two choices? Just seems like blizzard is blatantly ignoring the data in front of their faces ><

*question about unleash life - does it work with every chain heal bounce or just the initial hit?

[Deleted]

Shamans are getting rekt on all specs, ele is dead, enha is getting shit on and resto is getting raped every ptr patch.

[Stabatya]

We are not middle of the pack healers. We are top in Raids. Our AOE healing is unmatched. Can be equal to other healers in mythic+ if you talent right and know the dungeon.

I'm always top in my guild runs in Heroic and mythic EN.

These two nerfs are minor. Who cares.

A lot of people have already pointed out the flaws here so I won't bother to reiterate.

It shouldn't matter if the nerfs are minor or not... People seem to have forgotton that nerfing something should be a response to it being too powerful. Neither of the talents nerfed were too powerful, torrent wasn't even a auto pick to begin with and come 7.1 you'll probably find it being rarely used (I look forward to UL and Undulation being nerfed in the future to make up for this). Vigor was a auto pick because the other two are average.

[Deleted]

Shamans have always scaled very well and start of every expansion we are mid healers, then the longer in we come the more powerful we get. I am sure they are thinking long term.

[Deleted]

Shamans are strongest when incoming damage is high (because of Mastery). This is exacerbated early in expansions when people don't know the fights as well and when gear levels are lower.

It's hard to work out the logic in the devs spending their time working on evening out the talents in this tier (where all 3 are currently viable options in one scenario or another). There are other talent tiers that are far more deserving of their time and attention where there is a definite "correct" choice.

[Deleted]

Shamans have always scaled very well and start of every expansion we are mid healers, then the longer in we come the more powerful we get. I am sure they are thinking long term.

On the contrary: our early expansion performance is not indicative of our average/median performance due to the way our Mastery works. Nerfing Resto based on current data creates balance issues later on when the value of Mastery drops.
Then again, at that point it doesn't really matter anyway whether we are 5 or 10% below others.

[Kargos]

lol.

Dragons mythic is a shit fight for Shaman because a ton of the healing is whack-a-mole ST, people can be spread out a bit too much, and sides are split.
@everyone else in this thread: Torrent is already a garbage talent for Tier 1. Undulation is better when you spend enough GCDs on ST healing, and Unleash Life is better when you're spamming a lot of chain heals. The Torrent change really does nothing for us as a healer class since you shouldn't be using it.

Agreed and agreed. I get that it sucks to get any kind of nerf, especially unwarranted ones, but at the same time, torrent was literally the weakest talent in the entire tier already. Larynx put some data on another thread somewhere that pretty much proved it. Undulation is double the healing of torrent in ST fights and UL is a ton more healing for chain healing. I haven't even used torrent once since the very beginning of Legion before I had done some math and testing.

*question about unleash life - does it work with every chain heal bounce or just the initial hit?

It affects every bounce (easy to test out for yourself too -- just stand next to some guards in Dalaran and chain heal yourself with and without UL).

[vulena]

So rather than nerfing an average performing healer, all in an effort to increase talent diversity... why don't they just buff the underperforming talents to match Torrent?

"Why don't they do 2 things instead of 1"

Do you hear yourself?