a response to those who hate casual players

[Jotunhammer]

First of all allow me to say that I am a casual player that enjoyes the AH game and earning gold etc.

Now... those who say that casual players should NOT have access to everything...
in some manner you are right, those who are interested in raids and to excell should be rewarded
BUT.... the mistake Blizzard does is to have lore endings, ending of lore storytelling within the raids
it is a great mistake because those who raids are not often interested in the lore ending or the movies
they just want to get the loot and to excell at doing hard modes and harder content.

solution is simple, change the game so that lore ending etc will be made solo content, for example
SWTOR has started with solo flashpoints, means that you can do solo things thats normally 5 man
and that is for pushing storyline onwards and does not have to be raiding

That accomplishes the difference that the raider people wants, they get their super raids with bosses
that does not necessarily have to do with the end of the storline. There can be made other bosses
and there are, but they also combine with such events that the casual player wants to see.

So, separate the casual content, storylinbe content from the raid content and everyone will be happy.
The raider can do storyline and solo mode if he/she wants and still be able to raid and do hard modes etc
while the casual player can plodd around doing his/her stuff and continue with the storyline
and everyone is happy. no?

anyone find anything bad with my reasoning?

[Lightbull]

WoW's lore has always ended in raids. That is how WoW works. Illidan, Lich King, Deathwing, etc have all been final bosses of the expansion and have all been in raids.

I don't see why we should fix what isn't broken.

[Deleted]

nobody cares dude

also this is an MMO designed for raids from the ground up, 70% of the development time goes into that. Lore has always been big in the raids, thats what the raids do. Deal with it. Don't like it? Play a singleplayer game.

Back in BC nobody cried as much as you "casuals" do now, but i guess thats because people like you were like 10 years old back then. The player demographic changed and thanks to garbage instant gratification from these incredibly terrible mobile games, people expect the same in WoW.

Want something? Work for it.

[Justpassing]

Nobody really "hates" someone over a video game, except if you're like 15. And it also takes a very immature mind at least to assume people do.

[Melancolie]

It would be pretty weird if the apex of the expansion wasnt about killing the major generals/leaders of the invading forces, so i completely disagree.

No matter how casual a person is, he can easily get the lore from LFR.

[Pull My Finger]

I don't think any kind of solution is necessary because there's no problem. There's just a bunch of butthurt kids who convinced themselves that they have to have an issue with the diffuse, faceless mass of "the other" that they call "casuals". I don't give a shit.

Nobody "wants" the raid crap anyway. Raiders can have that all for themselves. If people really wanted to raid, they would. It's all just echo chamber talk, all the time - these people keep telling themselves, each other and everyone else how it's not right for "lesser players" to demand more, and they don't realize that actually no one even does that. It's just a bunch of self-centered, chilidish kids who can't get over themselves and constantly soapboxes on forums because apparently they really really need the attention. Don't let their constant whining create the illusion that there's some big "divide" among the playerbase. It's just their own stupid little self-pitying headtrip.

[Deadite]

Nobody really "hates" someone over a video game, except if you're like 15. And it also takes a very immature mind at least to assume people do.

You have never been to a thread about LFR i see.

[Laqweeta]

I honestly feel like retail is becoming one of those donation heavy private servers...

Example:
"Oh god I HATE those donators(donators would be called casual here) who buy that gear, It's so fucking stupid they get to run around with <insert weapon here>. Fuckers"
"Hey, man, don't say that! Those donators(Again, donators would be called casuals here) keep the server running! It sucks, but what can ya' do"

[Deleted]

There's something called LFR dude. Even easier than solo content.

[Egregious]

I mean they could easily accomplish the lore of the story being available outside of organized raiding.

Once the final boss has been dead for like a month, there opens up a quest chain in which the individual gets to "raid" with a bunch of NPCs (could even be modeled after the world first kill composition) where the casual "kills" the final boss seeing the story line. They could even make it interesting by giving the person some mechanic to do during the encounter. Nothing too difficult, but something more involved than AFKing while a group of NPCs does your work for you.

Or they could just do what they already do and have fucking LFR.

[Jotunhammer]

nobody cares dude

also this is an MMO designed for raids from the ground up, 70% of the development time goes into that. Lore has always been big in the raids, thats what the raids do. Deal with it. Don't like it? Play a singleplayer game.

Back in BC nobody cried as much as you "casuals" do now, but i guess thats because people like you were like 10 years old back then. The player demographic changed and thanks to garbage instant gratification from these incredibly terrible mobile games, people expect the same in WoW.

Want something? Work for it.

Majority of players in wow are casual players so if Blizzard panders to them and makes it easier and easier then do not hate Blizzard for pandering to those who pay majority of their paycheck then. I offer a solution for both raiders and casual, if you can't come up with an idea to rival mine, just hush up with your stupidity about blizzard pandering to causal players then.

- - - Updated - - -

Hey, if you do not like those that pony up the cash, feel free to go to a vanilla server, and those that want to pay for stuff like that, 300k vs 8 million, guess whos gonna earn most money. and then once your in vanilla and can't get forward and raided MC for the x millioth time, then what? bored and move to another game.

[Themanintobuildafire]

nobody cares dude

also this is an MMO designed for raids from the ground up, 70% of the development time goes into that. Lore has always been big in the raids, thats what the raids do. Deal with it. Don't like it? Play a singleplayer game.

Back in BC nobody cried as much as you "casuals" do now, but i guess thats because people like you were like 10 years old back then. The player demographic changed and thanks to garbage instant gratification from these incredibly terrible mobile games, people expect the same in WoW.

Want something? Work for it.

Disagree with you. 10 years ago I was in my 30s and had way more free time. I don't play mobile games and so don't know what that allusion is about, but for me, being in my 40s now, I just don't have time. I want to see the story. I am fine with LFR and LFD enabling me to do that. Honestly, if this game didn't cater to casuals, you probably wouldn't have the game. I would guess they are the vast majority of the player base.

I don't want things to come easy, but they have to be ACCESSIBLE. That is the key word. Gating stuff behind content only the top 20% can do is why people complain so much. I don't care that probably 80% of my xpac money went to making content for the top 5% of players as long as I get access to the story.

[Sylvaeres]

First of all allow me to say that I am a casual player that enjoyes the AH game and earning gold etc.

Now... those who say that casual players should NOT have access to everything...
in some manner you are right, those who are interested in raids and to excell should be rewarded
BUT.... the mistake Blizzard does is to have lore endings, ending of lore storytelling within the raids
it is a great mistake because those who raids are not often interested in the lore ending or the movies
they just want to get the loot and to excell at doing hard modes and harder content.

solution is simple, change the game so that lore ending etc will be made solo content, for example
SWTOR has started with solo flashpoints, means that you can do solo things thats normally 5 man
and that is for pushing storyline onwards and does not have to be raiding

That accomplishes the difference that the raider people wants, they get their super raids with bosses
that does not necessarily have to do with the end of the storline. There can be made other bosses
and there are, but they also combine with such events that the casual player wants to see.

So, separate the casual content, storylinbe content from the raid content and everyone will be happy.
The raider can do storyline and solo mode if he/she wants and still be able to raid and do hard modes etc
while the casual player can plodd around doing his/her stuff and continue with the storyline
and everyone is happy. no?

anyone find anything bad with my reasoning?

I'm going to try to stay civil, since you made a fairly good post that you backed up with more than "I want this and I'm entitled".

The major issue with doing so, is you're essentially dumbing down the game for the less skilled or less motivated individuals which takes away from the prestige of clearing mythic raids and so on. It hasn't worked out well for this game, because the oversimplification of everything led us straight to WOD, which was the worst pile of dogshit we've ever been given.

[Wries]

Disagree with you. 10 years ago I was in my 30s and had way more free time. I don't play mobile games and so don't know what that allusion is about, but for me, being in my 40s now, I just don't have time. I want to see the story. I am fine with LFR and LFD enabling me to do that. Honestly, if this game didn't cater to casuals, you probably wouldn't have the game. I would guess they are the vast majority of the player base.

I don't want things to come easy, but they have to be ACCESSIBLE. That is the key word. Gating stuff behind content only the top 20% can do is why people complain so much. I don't care that probably 80% of my xpac money went to making content for the top 5% of players as long as I get access to the story.

Disagree with you. We have plenty of people in our guild that have very little time to play. Difference is, when they log in they can actually get into a non auto-match made group, still see the content AND get to play at a level that challenges them rather than just see everything mowed down which is what the matchmaking level is.

That said you do always get to see the content in WoW sooner or later. I don't necessarily disagree with them adding Kara/CoS/Arcway into LFD by 7.2. Mainly because 7.2 is still a loong time away and it will have been a timed "exclusive" for a good while, giving incentive to new players to actually get social and play better because they wanted to see the cool "cutting-edge" content when it was current and provided gear upgrades.

[Deleted]

I mean they could easily accomplish the lore of the story being available outside of organized raiding.

Once the final boss has been dead for like a month, there opens up a quest chain in which the individual gets to "raid" with a bunch of NPCs (could even be modeled after the world first kill composition) where the casual "kills" the final boss seeing the story line. They could even make it interesting by giving the person some mechanic to do during the encounter. Nothing too difficult, but something more involved than AFKing while a group of NPCs does your work for you.

Or they could just do what they already do and have fucking LFR.

Yeah, LFR is a lot better than your bad suggestion.

[Egregious]

Yeah, LFR is a lot better than your bad suggestion.

I mean, except for the entire part of LFR being aids and ridiculously stupid for the god damned game. Funneling casuals into "raiding" just to show them the story line is retarded. Oh wait, that's what I've done. It's almost like raiding is the only framework that makes sense to disclose the entire story line. Oh well... guess you just won't know the entire story. Too bad.

Fucking people who play this game for "the story." For real.

[Flarelaine]

Nobody really "hates" someone over a video game, except if you're like 15. And it also takes a very immature mind at least to assume people do.

Assuming there are immature people out there is a very safe bet.

[Galax]

Back in BC nobody cried as much as you "casuals" do now, but i guess thats because people like you were like 10 years old back then. The player demographic changed and thanks to garbage instant gratification from these incredibly terrible mobile games, people expect the same in WoW.

Want something? Work for it.

What happened is that these casuals whined and cried, Blizzard knuckled under, many of the good players left, and in the wake of this exodus was all the whiners left over and more bubblegum casuals who joined, which amplified the problem, where the whiners now feel encouraged to cry about everything because of the positive reinforcement.

Blizzard got the playerbase it deserved.

[endersblade]

Want something? Work for it.

This is a game bro, I'm not working for anything. Don't be so edgy, you might cut yourself.

[Galax]

Disagree with you. 10 years ago I was in my 30s and had way more free time. I don't play mobile games and so don't know what that allusion is about, but for me, being in my 40s now, I just don't have time. I want to see the story. I am fine with LFR and LFD enabling me to do that. Honestly, if this game didn't cater to casuals, you probably wouldn't have the game. I would guess they are the vast majority of the player base.

Well yeah they are NOW. See above.

I don't want things to come easy, but they have to be ACCESSIBLE. That is the key word. Gating stuff behind content only the top 20% can do is why people complain so much. I don't care that probably 80% of my xpac money went to making content for the top 5% of players as long as I get access to the story.

I think Blizzard really should have made separate servers starting in Wotlk for gated vs. non-gated. This would have solved years and years of conflict.