7.1.5: Fire completely wrecked

[Deleted]

Looking at simcraft and logfiles, fire was far from a top DPS spec.

Looking at parse numbers Fire is the most played spec in raids. Fire and MM hunter are dominating raids - probably Mythic+ dungeons too.

Out of curiosity: what do you think Blizz should do? Wait that everybody is playing Fire and MM? Or what?

[Deleted]

Looking at parse numbers Fire is the most played spec in raids. Fire and MM hunter are dominating raids - probably Mythic+ dungeons too.

Out of curiosity: what do you think Blizz should do? Wait that everybody is playing Fire and MM? Or what?

How about make other specs more fun to play? Logs PROVE that fire is far from a top damage spec, especially on single target. Denying this, is pointless and quite frankly, stupid.

[Armourboy]

How about make other specs more fun to play? Logs PROVE that fire is far from a top damage spec, especially on single target. Denying this, is pointless and quite frankly, stupid.

Exactly, some of us chose fire because it was fun as hell to play. I have no real issue with them moving knobs up and down, just a bit scared they are going to suck all of the fun right out of it at the same time. We will wait and see I suppose.

[ssviolett]

As of right now, the spec is completely dead on the PTR, yes.

However, unlike a lot of the naysayers, I can't really imagine that they leave the spec in this state. There were a few reports that it was up to a 33% dps nerf. Cry about Blizzard's balance team all you want - and sometimes they deserve it - but there's no way they cut 1/3rd of an upper-middle spec's entire dps and provide no compensation buffs. For reference, if they cut 1/3rd of spriest's dps, it would be, by far, the worst spec in the entire game. And that's an overpowered spec, now imagine fire which, while definitely strong, is not nearly what you'd call overpowered.

Well, actually they do - solution is switch to Frost. Farm your relics, farm AP again. Next patch they will nerf Frost and buff Arcane. Working as intended!

[Deleted]

The balls of fire mages to whine like this when unholy has been buttfucked for years is staggering.

Can't you stick to your own forum instead of going to other classes' forums to complain about their threads?

How pathetic.


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That said, I'll chime in with the guy ridiculing the OP. It's the first iteration of an upcoming patch. Numbers tuning still needs to happen. And moreso, the changes are probably not everything that's going to happen, as some talent rows (rune of power) are still void of choice ...

These changes SCREAM "work in progress" so stop pretending the sky is falling. It's not final at all. Good god.

[Deleted]

How about make other specs more fun to play?

Yes, but because they can't/won't do that then other means are required.

Logs PROVE that fire is far from a top damage spec, especially on single target. Denying this, is pointless and quite frankly, stupid.

Who is denying that? But I think everybody agrees that Fire (and MM) has been exceptional in Legion. The package had it all: good damage, good burst, good mobility... It is not uncommon to see Mythic+ teams with two Fire mages. I'm afraid that Fire just got too popular.

[Notdev]

I understand that this is the first iteration of the PTR. But the dev interview did state that they thought fire was still a little too strong. I don't think these are final obviously, and I don't think Blizzard is dumb enough to completely dump on and wreck the most represented spec in raids.

Again, while these changes aren't final, I never understood why people celebrated nerfs to other classes. Undoubtedly you all have guildies and friends who play other specs. You understand your groups will be worse off? And that your guildies/friends will be unhappy, and some of them might quit, or at even spec/main change, rendering countless days of ap and legendary farming wasted?

I'd have far less issue with blizzard inability to tune classes if main/spec swapping wasn't a terrible chore this expansion.

[Deleted]

Looking at parse numbers Fire is the most played spec in raids. Fire and MM hunter are dominating raids - probably Mythic+ dungeons too.

Out of curiosity: what do you think Blizz should do? Wait that everybody is playing Fire and MM? Or what?

Well thats because we are FUN! Not cause we are doing great dmg. Look at current ToV and nightmare logs: https://www.warcraftlogs.com/rankings/12
Fire is only ever topping any meter if the fight is based on short AoE phases.

What blizz should do? They should not listen to all the q.q mages doing too much dmg when 10 adds stack up to a boss in my mythic dungeon q.q

I know, balance is a hard thing to achieve, but fire mages are the best example of a class getting played because its FUN to play even though NOT doing top DPS (as I said, except for burst AoE). We were the lucky ones and got some great new mechanics this addon, thats why there are so many mages.

[GMZohar1]

Psh Arcane is about to get destroyed for PvP.. Taking away Ice Barrier giving us a Shields that is weaker.. Making us between Shimmer and Presence of Mind.. That choice is pretty damn stupid, Ice Floes is gone.. Nothing but nerfs

[Notdev]

Fire being the most represented spec is not a reason to nerf it, it's just the opposite. At least this expansion, where spec swapping is not a short term option for most people.

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Also while mage does great damage in mythic plus, our use is highly diminished once you get to the higher levels. Bosses who are mostly single target take longer to die, so our benefit from being bursty is diminished. No aoe stun. Long CD interrupt. And while our 3-5 target damage is good, it is far from OP unless we use cooldowns.

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The thing plaguing mage right now is that we do obscene amounts of damage on quick, massive aoe pulls. People, and apparently blizzard devs as well, see mages doing 3m do on huge quick aoe pull in certain dungeons, and think OMG Nerf fire. Fights like xavius and helya give people the illusion that mages are still OP when the fact is that most of our damage on those fights are useless padding. (big ignites cleaving to tentacles, and massive wave of adds on Helya).

But fire needs single target buffs right now, not nerfs.

[Orrin]

So far what happened was exactly what developers have said about: they are changing and removing must pick talents.

Blizz also nerfed Combustion power and RoP which reduces their cumulative effect so they might be less of must pick. It reduces, true, but devs must be complete idiots not to buff base numbers to make dps tuning.

Then again, we know about Blizz history of ignoring players, Mage forum posts and fresh example of Outlaw Rogues who were nerfed into the ground without compensation

[Deleted]

Can't you stick to your own forum instead of going to other classes' forums to complain about their threads?

How pathetic.


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That said, I'll chime in with the guy ridiculing the OP. It's the first iteration of an upcoming patch. Numbers tuning still needs to happen. And moreso, the changes are probably not everything that's going to happen, as some talent rows (rune of power) are still void of choice ...

These changes SCREAM "work in progress" so stop pretending the sky is falling. It's not final at all. Good god.

Ill be swapping mains from my chart topping dk to my bottom of the charts fire mage shortly.

Am i allowed to post in here then?

[jplusl]

Cant believe the amount of whining over first ptr post. try playing a warlock then see me

[Lemondish]

I can't get on the PTR, but I want to know how things feel in action and I do not give a crap about numbers until it hits live.

How does the new Flame On feel in action compared to the current live incarnation? What about Alexstrasza's Fury? Is Flame On still the clear winner in this tier for how the gameplay flows?

[Doffen]

Cant believe the amount of whining over first ptr post. try playing a warlock then see me

Cant believe the amount of warlocks whining about fire being mediocre slash good when they have the 2nd best dps-specc atm at live.

Try playing a fire mage and then see.

Useless post, do you see how pathetic these posts are?

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Ill be swapping mains from my chart topping dk to my bottom of the charts fire mage shortly.

Am i allowed to post in here then?

Go Frost yourself, frost dk whos currently above all mage speccs in ToV. Try better.

Sorry, in 90 percentile arcane mage is above, my bad! 80 and below frost dk is better

[Deleted]

Cant believe the amount of warlocks whining about fire being mediocre slash good when they have the 2nd best dps-specc atm at live.

Try playing a fire mage and then see.

Useless post, do you see how pathetic these posts are?

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Go Frost yourself, frost dk whos currently above all mage speccs in ToV. Try better.

Sorry, in 90 percentile arcane mage is above, my bad! 80 and below frost dk is better

Frost dks are out dpsing firemages? Eh what now?

[Skylarking]

Frost dks are out dpsing firemages? Eh what now?

Please read, ToV is one of the worst raids for fire mage except helya.

[Cejn]

IF Icy Floes removal change goes live I'll definitely take a break from WoW.
Blizzard just bunch of liars.

[Nico3337]

I can see the reasoning behind nerfing combustion to 50%, as this spell is the reason crit values 50% higher than int. We will however need compensations for our base spells after these changes, if fire is to be just the least bit viable. The changes like that you would probably go from 400k to 300k dps :P

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Cant believe the amount of whining over first ptr post. try playing a warlock then see me

warlocks aren't getting a huge nerf though and since fire mages are already just "mediocre" it's obviously a topic for discussion when we get a 30% dps nerf. Yes it is possible some of these changes won't go through or that we recieve compensation buffs but there are no evidence of this yet, so of course we are whining. Get over yourself :P

[Doffen]

Frost dks are out dpsing firemages? Eh what now?

Yes fire is below frost dks in ToV, in every percentile except 99%, and to make a wild guess, those mages have the bracers. Dont have to reroll class, just speccs man