Protection legion Discussion

[Konnery]

Immortality is definitely worth the gold.

While I usually agree with Macrologia, I don't with his assessment of stat sticks or Goblet of Nightmarish Ichor. With just a Weakaura and the normal amount of awareness, I've had ease maintaining at least 30% uptime across nearly all encounters. I had 47.4% uptime on Guarm last night. That's far better than his valuation. Additionally, I feel the valuation of Majordomo's Dinner Bell is a good bit too high in the second list. A Stamina trinket, even with the on-use effect, just isn't great.

Defenses are great, and survival is certainly your primary focus as a tank, but damage output is always important. Well-itemized stat sticks and Goblet are among your highest-priority dps trinkets, making them very strong overall.

Yeah I think the dream right now is Goblet/Urn(Or Odyn stat stick), with DMC for the "tank gets hit hard" fights like Ursoc and Guarm. Goblet just does everything so well and the uptime is insane.

[eksdra]

I checked my logs from heroic and normal Guarm, and I only got three procs from Goblet over both fights combined. On a fight like Cenarius I generally have ~40% uptime.

Is that happening for anyone else? From the logs, the only time I got a proc was when I stole aggro off my co-tank, so it looks like it isn't procing from Multi-Headed.

[Valech]

Aaaaand weaving is back bois.

Shield Slam Devastate, Thunder Clap and Revenge have a 30% chance to reset the remaining cooldown on Shield Slam. Warrior - Protection Spec.

That means we do not use Revenge only on proccs. We ACTUALLY use it just like we use focus rage right now: Parrying an attack is like an ultimatum procc, revenge lowers the cost of IP, IP lowers the cost of revenge and you STILL fish for a Shieldslam procc when hitting revenge. Good times.

Additionally revenge hits multiple enemies! If the damage tuning is done right, we might see smaller Shieldslam numbers but the same output overall + a more constant dmg output.

Other buffs as well. I am SO glad this happened. I REALLY like the weaving.

[Konnery]

Glad to hear, though I'm going to miss the shoulder slam animation from FR .

[Deleted]

So they basically realized that spaming devastate was not engaging enough and gave us the guardian druid model. Can't really complain, I was beginning to entertain the idea of rerolling to druid, but I guess now I might not have to. I hope this translates into more rage gain tbh, right now, if you are not taking massive damage it can get quite slow.

[Llarold]

Aaaaand weaving is back bois.

Shield Slam Devastate, Thunder Clap and Revenge have a 30% chance to reset the remaining cooldown on Shield Slam. Warrior - Protection Spec.

Fantastic news.

[suprep]

Quick testing on PTR (with legendary gloves) it seems I was able to maintain 275k single target DPS over 50 million damage @ 880 ilevel (no flask, food buff, etc) using Devastator, Heavy Repercussions, Booming Voice and Avatar talent. It feels pretty good now, and this is taking into account that revenge is costing me the full rage (as I can't dodge/parry target dummies).

Thunderclap and ravager as a talent still feels very very weak though in terms of damage output, the 35% parry is nice but the damage output is next to nothing (roughly 90k-100k per minute).

I can't seem to find a scenario where I'd take anything but Heavy Repercussions in the last row, they need to tweak that row if they want to make it more attractive. If I had the legendary belt I /may/ take the first talent in that row depending on how long it would take me to have demo shout back up again.

[Valech]

Glad to hear, though I'm going to miss the shoulder slam animation from FR .

Wait, this was tied to focused rage? I never knew.

[ult1m4tum]

Shockwave - Sends a wave of force in a frontal cone, causing [ 47.5% of AP ] damage and stunning all enemies within 10 yards for 4 3 sec. Cooldown reduced by 20 sec if it strikes at least 3 targets. Fury Warrior - Level 30 Talent. Instant. 40 sec cooldown.

Warbringer (Protection) - Intercept now deals [ 108% of AP ] damage to all enemies within 5 yds of the target, and stuns them for 1.5 sec. 2.5 sec.

Nice to have revenge on the reset list too now, but whats with the nerf to shockwave and buff to warbringer? O_o

[Konnery]

Nice to have revenge on the reset list too now, but whats with the nerf to shockwave and buff to warbringer? O_o

They're trying to make the other choices in the tree a choice, and shockwave was really really powerful(20 sec CD, 4s stun).

Problem is, Stormbolt is still only good for PvP, and merging your mobility and CC into one button is an awful idea. They need more than just number tweaking to fix that row.

I'm honestly surprised they didn't buff Stormbolt.

[Senen]

Ok, that looks better already.
Still sad that Blizzard goes to throw the off GCD gameplay out of the window. It was my favourite part in warprot gameplay, I loved Glad spec and its 90apm and want it back really bad, so I'm afraid the loss of this gameplay for prot too is gonna make me sad in future months/years.

1) Without Vengeance, our priority should be SS > TC > Rev (proc) > Dev, as far as survival is concerned.
2) With Vengeance, our priority should be SS > Rev (proc) > TC > Rev (if Vengeance buff is up, assuming your next IP will be a full IP) > Dev
3) Note that these rotations are correct for both st and aoe. Literally zero difference in how you play in both situation, except you'll have more Rev procs in aoe situations. I don't like that, but whatever.
4) Revenge has no more opportunity cost. Which means the difference between Devastator ST value and Devastator Multi value has been greatly decreased. Devastator is still better in aoe situation because you'll have more Rev procs so you'll use Rev slightly more and have less free GCD for Dev. But it's "less better" than it was.
5) Devastator becomes really better than it was before because we now include Rev in our rotation, so we'll use Dev less. The less we use Dev, the better Devastator is. And by better I mean "better results" AND "less boring".
6) Vengeance and Devastator have a pretty good synergy.

- - - Updated - - -

To be clear on why Rev>TC>Rev>Dev in my second point:
Rev with Vengeance buff costs 19 rage and makes our next IP goes from 60 rage to 39 rage (IF we do a full IP), effectively saving us 2 rage.
Rev with proc costs 0 rage and makes our next IP goes from 60 rage to 39 rage (IF we do a full IP), effectively saving us 21 rage. So if your next IP is a full one, it's definitely better than TC.
If your next IP is a small one for whatever reason, you'll only save 7 rage (from 20 rage to 13 rage) so it's still slightly more rage than TC (which generates 5 rage in the new iteration) but you're delaying a TC, so not 100% sure it's worth it, you gotta factor in the opportunity cost and use more complicated maths. But you shouldn't make small IP that often, so *in general*, Rev (proc) > TC.

[Leih]

Crackling Thunder nerf seems... odd? Did anyone really think that talent was too powerful? Kind of felt like it was mostly underused as it was, never mind after a nerf.

[Milocow]

Crackling Thunder nerf seems... odd? Did anyone really think that talent was too powerful? Kind of felt like it was mostly underused as it was, never mind after a nerf.

16 yard radius is pretty retarded, pulling the mobs inside the house beside the 2nd beacon in CoS when you were outside was craaaazzyyy
anyway im glad they made revenge proc SS now, revenge finally feels rewardin to press

[Deleted]

Thunderclap and ravager as a talent still feels very very weak though in terms of damage output, the 35% parry is nice but the damage output is next to nothing (roughly 90k-100k per minute).

Kind of funny. After this the 7.1.5 Buff its going to do as much damage as it did in 6.1. In BrF i did ~100k ST damage with every ravager.

[Leih]

16 yard radius is pretty retarded, pulling the mobs inside the house beside the 2nd beacon in CoS when you were outside was craaaazzyyy
anyway im glad they made revenge proc SS now, revenge finally feels rewardin to press

I mean, I guess, yeah, making it smaller might make the talent easier to use in some places, but it also means the talent is giving you already less, and most people don't bother with it anyway. Would have thought a better fix would be to add some kind of secondary effect if they're reducing the range... give us a reason to pick it, isn't that the point?

Anyway, other changes this build seem a step in the right direction if I'm reading them right. Though the indom/NS/Devastator row still feels like a mismatch to me.

[Stallion]

New rotation incoming:

https://abload.de/img/warriorflowchartq0bnp.png

That change to Revenge would have been a good idea on live. Together with Thunder clap being forced into our core rotation + resetting Shield Slam and Focused Rage removed, it just dumbs down the rotation too much imho. If you spec into Devastator, the rotation can get pretty much automized as described in the screenshot... Sure, single target you would want to use Shield Slam with higher priority than Revenge probably but come on, that's almost the only reason not to spam all 3 buttons at once now.

I'm afraid the class shifts towards a "press whatever is popping up" style. The changes are a big buff in terms of dps though, both single and multi target which was needed.

[Deleted]

stil woulnd take vengeance talent if revenge is tied to the gcd it makes IP usage clunky.

[Chrno]

New rotation incoming:

https://abload.de/img/warriorflowchartq0bnp.png

That change to Revenge would have been a good idea on live. Together with Thunder clap being forced into our core rotation + resetting Shield Slam and Focused Rage removed, it just dumbs down the rotation too much imho. If you spec into Devastator, the rotation can get pretty much automized as described in the screenshot... Sure, single target you would want to use Shield Slam with higher priority than Revenge probably but come on, that's almost the only reason not to spam all 3 buttons at once now.

I'm afraid the class shifts towards a "press whatever is popping up" style. The changes are a big buff in terms of dps though, both single and multi target which was needed.

serious question here. Was it really needed to buff the DPS tho ? ... i was able to pump out sick amounts of DPS already depending on a fight per fight basis, and how much rage i was able to pump into FR.

[Toybox]

serious question here. Was it really needed to buff the DPS tho ? ... i was able to pump out sick amounts of DPS already depending on a fight per fight basis, and how much rage i was able to pump into FR.

We're behind other tanks on pretty much all bosses in TEN Mythic. Only notable exception is Cenarius, and that's because DHs/DKs struggle tanking the Dragons.

[ReD-EyeD]

Shorter Thunder Clap? Noooooooooooooo...