Blizzard honestly believes they "buffed" us

[Deleted]

Yeah. My concern is they make these knee jerk reactions and then leave them in when they go for a real fix and have to balance around them resulting in something less than ideal.

Take week 1 of the PTR where Sidewinders no longer applied Vulnerable. That was bad because they also forgot to implement the Marked Shot not being affected by Vulnerable change, so everyone cried out and they reverted it. Now we have Sidewinders applying Vulnerable which conflicts with the new Patient Sniper where you want to refresh the debuff as little as possible and so the rotation is clunkier overall. Do I want focus now or do I want to go for a big, efficient Aimed Shot? Neither feels natural because you're either gonna be wasting optimal Vulnerable uptime or standing around waiting for passive focus regen.

There is no choice.

You tank focus and then you marked, so unload that focus into a vulnerable window. That's all you do the entire fight long, spam arcane shot for focus, use a proc at a sufficient amount of focus, and then followed by 2 to 3 aimeds. More aimeds during BL and other haste effects.

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percent buffs are not huge or little, depends on the absolute value they refer to.

if an attack does 100 8%buff means it would do 108, are 8 points a HUGE? well if every class had an attack which does 100, then it would be. But since every other dps spec make hunter ones sweep the floor even with the "HUGE" buff then the buff is not really HUGE. (There's literally 0 reason right now to even use marked shot, unless you are using it to set up a vulnerable window with high focus to spend into it).

Hunter specs fail at design, clunkyness and awful sinergy, and in top of that we have now the numbers issue.

BM doesn't feel clunky, it's as smooth as it's ever been but the problem is still that the pets can be quite unresponsive or the entire opposite and spas out.

[Deleted]

Well Marksman maybe. Beast Mastery is getting a pretty decent buff, should be at least middle of the pack if not higher. You're not going to have all 3 specs at the top of the meters all of the time. Just wait till the actual content is released and see how it preforms with the 2-4 set bonuses before making any rash assumptions, even more so wait to see how it looks before getting insanely angry.

they nerfed our tier sets as well, BM's buff equates to 7.5% more or close to that and MM's 6.44%. this isn;t being rash, that is how things stand currently.

[Deleted]

My main alt is - as I said my shaman. It was Enhancement as elemental sucked and I did well.
The patch destroyed it and I rerolled to elemental on it - was weapon 35 on both specs anyway and the stat prio was the same so it diden't matter to me.
So I understand what you are talking about, but that was only 1 SPEC out of 3.

For hunters its ALL 3 specs, I can't even go to a different spec on my hunter as these suck as well.

Also if the hunters in your raid are competitive then they are AMAZING while the rest of your raid just isn't.
Sorry to say, but thats the truth.

Exactly this. I dont like playing BM but I would gladly switch to it if it were to increase my damage. I would even be ok playing SV if it did goog damage. Now I have to gear my priest or lock if I want to be competitive.

[MasterOfNone]

Exactly this. I dont like playing BM but I would gladly switch to it if it were to increase my damage. I would even be ok playing SV if it did goog damage. Now I have to gear my priest or lock if I want to be competitive.

i would wait tbh. you never know whats gonna happen in the next couple weeks
i was almost there on my shaman but took it in stride and stuck with it

[Deleted]

they nerfed our tier sets as well, BM's buff equates to 7.5% more or close to that and MM's 6.44%. this isn;t being rash, that is how things stand currently.

The 4 set bonus for Marks was absolutely insane by the way. These changes will bring both specs to the middle of the pack, just wait and see before you start ranting.

[Deleted]

The 4 set bonus for Marks was absolutely insane by the way. These changes will bring both specs to the middle of the pack, just wait and see before you start ranting.

I'm not ranting dude, the changes have been applied to SimC , unless the numbers tomorrow change that is the situation. Yes it was but now 4p isn't worth taking over better itemised gear. It should have been reduced to 25% which would have put it in line with other classes and bring us upto the middle. I really don't know what your argument is about this though, people have calculated what these changes do unless those are then changed the situation is already known, there aren't any unknown variables here.

[Nairesha]

And now stop whining and share the damn tweet, thank you

[samao]

There is no choice.

You tank focus and then you marked, so unload that focus into a vulnerable window. That's all you do the entire fight long, spam arcane shot for focus, use a proc at a sufficient amount of focus, and then followed by 2 to 3 aimeds. More aimeds during BL and other haste effects.

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BM doesn't feel clunky, it's as smooth as it's ever been but the problem is still that the pets can be quite unresponsive or the entire opposite and spas out.

I'm talking Sidewinders working against Patient Sniper, not Arcane Shot.

[munkeyinorbit]

im sure there will be more to come. hunters have realistically never been the absolute bottom. it is possible, but not likely. 7.1.5 has been out 6 days and there are tons of classes (not just hunters) thinking the world is going to end. if anything i would point the finger at blizz for not paying close enough attention to data from the ptr. its what its for. seems in the past several patches they completely ignore input from testers and data alike.

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disagree some here man lets be real.
i know hunters took it in the shorts. i know this. so did other classes. enhancement was a complete rotation rework, and it was SO bad that a lot of it is getting reverted/buffed. you dont have to act like the only victim in the room is what im saying. give it some time to balance out. i was totally willing to take what was given to me on my enh shaman and roll with it. did i like it? fuck no, but im a decent of enough player that the changes didnt effect me near as much as other enh shamans whined about. i know hunters suffered some but our raiding hunter is still very competitive.

As soon as you stop talking smack people will actually take you seriously. There may be classes out there that think the world has ended but for hunters this is actually true. The whole class is bottom and with the buffs the whole class is probably still going to be bottom. Not a fucking spec. The WHOLE class. To actually play the specs is a fucking nightmare. It is disgusting what they have done with hunters. They should just disable survival and give up on some developers wet dream of how shit he was in Vanilla when he thought that's what survival hunters did.

You say you are a decent player? I call BS on that if you are in a raid where your "hunter" is competitive. He isn't competitive. Everyone else sucks. It's not that we havn't given it time to balance out. I think we have given it 9 months and the hunter community has not been heard. Heads need to roll.

[vashe9]

Top specs are getting nerfed (Read: Shadow Priest).
Whining about buffs are just stupid. Quite sure Hunters will STILL be in a good spot.

I'm happy for my 9% buff on Lightning Bolt.

Agree but we are NOT fine without that buff, we are dead down, I've disabled skada until wednesday, I'm BM and it's.. unBEARable

I play BM since legion Day1 and the only think I really dislike is the **** downtime, Why isnt cobra shot a castable builder instead of an instant spender... I'll never understand this.

[MasterOfNone]

As soon as you stop talking smack people will actually take you seriously. There may be classes out there that think the world has ended but for hunters this is actually true. The whole class is bottom and with the buffs the whole class is probably still going to be bottom. Not a fucking spec. The WHOLE class. To actually play the specs is a fucking nightmare. It is disgusting what they have done with hunters. They should just disable survival and give up on some developers wet dream of how shit he was in Vanilla when he thought that's what survival hunters did.

You say you are a decent player? I call BS on that if you are in a raid where your "hunter" is competitive. He isn't competitive. Everyone else sucks. It's not that we havn't given it time to balance out. I think we have given it 9 months and the hunter community has not been heard. Heads need to roll.

I'm having a civilized discussion about a class and you think I'm talking smack? Lol. You can think what you want, but good players always find a way. They don't fold scream that the sky is falling every time they don't get their way. You need to spend more time playing your toon as opposed to judging others. "Heads need to roll". It's a game dude. Calm your shit for real.

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And now stop whining and share the damn tweet, thank you

This can't be real. All these entitled hunters in here won't be able to bitch about anything or hurl insults once it's fixed.

[Gaaz]

Hunters in general are in the worst place since Ice Crown Citadel during WotLK. I still remember one of the quotes from class overview topics back then. The autor describes various classes, their pros and cons, and finishes with this phrase:
"Hunters? Well, hunters need help..."
I believe we are in the same situation right now.
BTW, Preach did his review for survival recently. He was not too enthusiastic, to put it mildly. The shocking part was that even they had to bench 2 hunters in favour of other, better performing classes. Not Survival, but MM hunters. They are far from the world's first race, but still can not find a place for a hunter in their progression rooster at the moment.

[Deleted]

hes good for sure, but the others are not bad. dont confuse what im getting at here. im not saying hunters arent low dps. they are lower yes. its a fact. im saying in a raid style format with mechanics and many other things, dps is subjective to a certain degree. lets take the most power dps class and let that person get hit with every random boss ability where they have to move/fuck up their rotation. lets say the hunter does not get targeted once. in this case alone (which is possible and does happen), the best dps will probably get overshadowed by even the nerfed hunter. im not saying you dont need a buff, im saying a good player is a good player and dps can come and go depending on the needs of the fight and what mechanics are thrown your way.

And a good player is a better player on a class thats actually decent, which hunters are not at the moment.

[MasterOfNone]

And a good player is a better player on a class thats actually decent, which hunters are not at the moment.

thats not being debated lol. thats a given mate.

[Deleted]

I'm having a civilized discussion about a class and you think I'm talking smack? Lol. You can think what you want, but good players always find a way. They don't fold scream that the sky is falling every time they don't get their way. You need to spend more time playing your toon as opposed to judging others. "Heads need to roll". It's a game dude. Calm your shit for real.

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This can't be real. All these entitled hunters in here won't be able to bitch about anything or hurl insults once it's fixed.

Nothing to do with entitled, our class got butchered and we took it all, we didn't moan (to much) and we made it work.
This nerf into the ground was the last straw in more then a year of giving feedback and bullshit.

I don't need to play an OP class, but I want to play a competitive class in ONE OUT OF ITS THREE specs!

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thats not being debated lol. thats a given mate.

Then I hope you understand why people are quiting and rerolling because of these changes, the only thing I bring to a raid is turtle which mages and shadow priests have as well but they are 100% better at everything else.

[ProfessorTjc]

At this point I would love Blizzard if the brought back WoD MM Hunters.

[satimy]

I'm having a civilized discussion about a class and you think I'm talking smack? Lol. You can think what you want, but good players always find a way. They don't fold scream that the sky is falling every time they don't get their way. You need to spend more time playing your toon as opposed to judging others. "Heads need to roll". It's a game dude. Calm your shit for real.

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This can't be real. All these entitled hunters in here won't be able to bitch about anything or hurl insults once it's fixed.

Just like Legion fixed hunters!

[ProfessorTjc]

Hunters in general are in the worst place since Ice Crown Citadel during WotLK. I still remember one of the quotes from class overview topics back then. The autor describes various classes, their pros and cons, and finishes with this phrase:
"Hunters? Well, hunters need help..."
I believe we are in the same situation right now.
BTW, Preach did his review for survival recently. He was not too enthusiastic, to put it mildly. The shocking part was that even they had to bench 2 hunters in favour of other, better performing classes. Not Survival, but MM hunters. They are far from the world's first race, but still can not find a place for a hunter in their progression rooster at the moment.

I played Survival back in ICC and it was amazing

[MasterOfNone]

Nothing to do with entitled, our class got butchered and we took it all, we didn't moan (to much) and we made it work.
This nerf into the ground was the last straw in more then a year of giving feedback and bullshit.

I don't need to play an OP class, but I want to play a competitive class in ONE OUT OF ITS THREE specs!

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Then I hope you understand why people are quiting and rerolling because of these changes, the only thing I bring to a raid is turtle which mages and shadow priests have as well but they are 100% better at everything else.

its not that i dont understand THAT, its i dont understand the griping from a class thats been competitive for ages, and the sayings like "heads need to roll" . its a bit ridiculous to say the least.

[Dracodraco]

its not that i dont understand THAT, its i dont understand the griping from a class thats been competitive for ages, and the sayings like "heads need to roll" . its a bit ridiculous to say the least.

So essentially, because a class has been decent for an expansion, we shouldn't make a fuss when we become shit-tier? I'd find it more ridiculous if any person actually thought that would be the correct way to react. *any* class should make it known when they're headed down the shitter, as loud as possible, because it's the only way to get the devs to react. Doesn't matter if they've been OP for the entirety of the game, doesn't excuse nerfing them into obscurity.