Der Spiegel: Democracy at the Tipping point

[Deleted]

Surely he has. But "Der Spiegel" splits comments from news. They dont add biases to news.

Of course they don't, that cover is completely unbiased...

[Deleted]

Of course they don't, that cover is completely unbiased...

Do you know the difference between comments and news?

[Deleted]

The events of Brexit and the US elections increasing voter apathy and undermining faith in democracy is the exact opposite of what I expected. To me they signify that voters can definitely change the course of even the pretty much highest level politics and that there is no real "status quo" that can not be defied. If anything they show that votes have so much power that it is hard defy the results even if few actually want to go through with the changes.

[Deleted]

Do you know the difference between comments and news?

Yes, whats your point? Are you trying to imply this article is unbiased news?

[Krille]

The events of Brexit and the US elections increasing voter apathy and undermining faith in democracy is the exact opposite of what I expected. To me they signify that voters can definitely change the course of even the pretty much highest level politics and that there is no real "status quo" that can not be defied. If anything they show that votes have so much power that it is hard defy the results even if few actually want to go through with the changes.

It's the illusion of actually having a say in politics, realistically neither Trump nor Hillary voters can do anything.

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Yes, whats your point? Are you trying to imply this article is unbiased news?

I think what he's saying is that this isn't news but a comment on a subject.

[Deleted]

Yes, whats your point? Are you trying to imply this article is unbiased news?

No, it is a comment. See original article.

I asked because breitbart and sputnik readers most times dont know the difference between news and comments.

[Ravenblade]

It is nice to see Spiegel posting in English again. Even though they have a point the major problem is that this new movement is going to wash over anyone since the established parties and institutions have no effective response to it. There is too much handwringing and too few solutions. One thing that Trump & Co. and similar movement do have in common is solutions, ideas, ideologies and willpower. It's the same thing that brought down the young Weimar Republic in the end. It's fun to laugh at the stupidity and the depth of it when it comes to their solutions and you wonder whether they just want to see the world burn and the answer is: Yes! Their goal is to burn it down while hoping that everything after will work out as planned. It would be better however if people find back their way to context and start focusing on issues instead on identity and personality, the latter may be the rightwingers biggest strength - well, as per tradition I say - but the former, the issues, are their greatest weakness. The attempted half-hearted ban on Muslims is just one example for that.

[igualitarist]

Democracy is good only when the guys i support are winning

[dd614]

Germany should worry about not becoming an Islamic republic or seeing its women raped by migrants. The sad part is when Germany falls apart thanks to Merkel's experiment, another psychotic leader will probably emerge and blame all non-ethnic Germans. Germans seem hard-coded to fuck up their own country.

infracted - trolling

[ArmoredDragoon]

What do you think? Is the american effort of the people who love democracy slowly diminishing? Or is it growing stronger?

My impression is, as more trump tries to install autocracy, as more people will oppose him.

Democracy is diminishing, and indeed so are our constitutional rights, but not really because of Trump. Namely:

1. When Trump was elected, we saw millions of people protest the result (in other words, protesting democracy itself.) Democracy also means your guy can lose, and protesting a fair election result just says you don't like democracy. Claiming otherwise is just plain doublethink.
2. It's become very trendy as of late to protest the first amendment; namely, see what happened with Milo last weekend, and that incident isn't the first of its kind. Indeed, free speech is truly dead at several major universities, and the same people that killed it there will (like all youth) eventually replace the older generations.
3. The second amendment has been under constant attack since 1983.
4. The fourth amendment has been under constant attack since 2001.

Point number two is especially important to me by the way, because without free speech, you really have nothing. Corrupt politicians can easily subvert the democratic process without it. And banning any speech that is unpopular (including hate speech) is simply unacceptable under any circumstances. No offense to any Europeans, but fascism exists there for a reason, and we really don't need it here in the United States. (For those uninformed, yes, the EU government has many actual self-confessed fascists in its parliament, as do a number of countries within the EU.)

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Germany should worry about not becoming an Islamic republic or seeing its women raped by migrants. The sad part is when Germany falls apart thanks to Merkel's experiment, another psychotic leader will probably emerge and blame all non-ethnic Germans. Germans seem hard-coded to fuck up their own country.

This is almost comical:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XdSsJQ-fvOU

It's as if their politicians WANT their people to become doormats.

[Allerius]

Oh no guys democracy is ruined after the successful democratic election!

[Fitheach]

Democracy already needed to change.

Mainly to be replaced by a superior technocracy. Society aught be managed and controlled by enlightened and educated people. Voting just leads to Brexit and other incorrect outcomes.

[Cerilis]

This thread is both sad and hilarious.

Thanks for trying though, rym.

[Draco-Onis]

the only thing that's dying is globalism

rot in hell

You're going to get rid of the internet, planes, boats, global currency and stock markets etc? because I hope you do realize that technology has pretty much made globalism inevitable. The people who think they can go back to the good old days are like fish trying to walk on land, good thing that generation is on the way to the grave.

[Super Kami Dende]

Oh look, a extremely left bias Magazine spouting shit again. This is extremely new and relevant and hasn't been done before!

Also, find it more and more ironic that the fascist left is saying the current admin is anti-liberty.

Also >people still on the "HE IS A RACISTS" retardation bandwagon. Lul.

[Tierbook]

No, it is a comment. See original article.

I asked because breitbart and sputnik readers most times dont know the difference between news and comments.

By this logic any discussion related to politics is a comment and thus we can ignore any biases involved.

[Super Kami Dende]

You're going to get rid of the internet, planes, boats, global currency and stock markets etc? because I hope you do realize that technology has pretty much made globalism inevitable. The people who think they can go back to the good old days are like fish trying to walk on land, good thing that generation is on the way to the grave.

The Generation that are growing up after the Millenials are one of the most conservative forecasted Generations since before our Grandparents. The only thing getting put in the grave atm is regressives.

[Cyanu]

Trump's election is a HUGE blow to the way democracy works in the USA and it has nothing to do with Trump being a 'dictator in the making' and other alarmist cliches

it has to do with the simply fact that democracy is about finding common ground and not giving the middle finger to the losing side

hypothetical: in an alternative universe me and my buddies, millions of buddies, are american citizens, we're so many and so well spread that we can actually determine the election outcome, so we say:you know what? we're the majority, we can do whatever we want now, let's just elect a hard-line communist president, that will nationalize pretty much everyone's property, shut down any sort of trade deals between US and the capitalist world and proceed to organize the economy upon 4 year master plans in which the state will determine the exact production and distribution of ALL products nationwide, also the state will proceed into massive movement and retraining of everyone able to work and will fill the place with statues of Lenin and Hammer and Sickles because we like those stuff, your yards will look good in red too

technically we're the majority and we just won the election, so it's within our right to determine what we want, that's what democracy is about right? the people want,the people get

but wrong, even if me and my buddies are let's say ~55% of the voters, there will be another ~40% that will absolutely DESPISE what we're doing with the country, if we just say "screw you we won the election' we're bringing the country at a deep division that could even lead to a civil war if pushed to extremes (not the case in US but it will function as a state with 'bipolar disorder' from now on, with constant backs and forths on anything it does)

that is why the mature and responsible voter does not go for extremists and instead works to find common ground and honest compromises, that's the real problem of voting for crazies and it's way greater than their policies which can after all be undone by the next sane president on office

Trump is going in a place anyone with a brain cannot follow, climate change denials, utter dismissal of the US check and balances, a vindictive attitude to his political opponents, instead of answering accusations/criticism he's just launching threats around, he brought neonazi's in the white house and generally fills his cabinet with an explosive mixture of extremists, people with conflict of interest or grossly unqualified for the job and he has 0 interest in compromise and now he's simply making up news and deciding which news are fake and which are not... you don't like what i'm doing? screw you i'm the president! (losers think those authoritarian stuff are badass/effective or whatever)

that's why anyone with a shrink of patriotism would never allow such a divisive force to claim power, because regardless of what he does (even if we assume he's right on everything) the country will be wounded by this division, it's poison in your veins and history teaches that great powers collapse from the inside, Trump is completely incapable of understanding such things, he's too busy getting on his critics on Twitter

Spiegel's article is actually right, freedom is 'dying' and i'm refering to the right of ironically enough the majority of US voters to at least be governed by someone who they can tolerate, all those morons with Trump avatars on the net, trolling the 'cry-babies lefties' and telling them to get over it are only making matter worse, instead of seeking to heal the division they only make it even worse, debating is by all means impossible by now, though let's be straight Trump has little to do with this, the Republicans have been herding mases of brain dead voters trained to ignore facts and label anyone speaking against them so they can keep voting against their interest and for the interest of lobbies, but somewhere along the way the plan backfired, too big and too stupid to control and BOOM! all the candidates that could serve the said lobbies interests fall to a lunatic that speaks to the masses in the language they never could

ironically enough if i was an american i wouldn't be so open about the terrible depths to which republicans are morons (of course i'm grateful for the commedy material they provide), as it would be within my responsibility to attempt to find a common ground but it's your country, if you feel like running it to the ground...what can i say?...

ps: kudos to the democrats for Hillary, it was perhaps the only candidate they could pick that could manage to lose the election... so damn uninspiring... i wouldn't even find the motivation to leave my backyard to vote for her... but then again even in my own country i'm mostly voting for the bad to avoid the worse so...

[Tierbook]

The issue with the comment above is that both sides have been giving the other side the finger the entire election process, the main difference is that the Trump supporters didn't try to burn down cities when the other candidate showed up....

[Cyanu]

The issue with the comment above is that both sides have been giving the other side the finger the entire election process, the main difference is that the Trump supporters didn't try to burn down cities when the other candidate showed up....

the resistance a president meets is based on how extreme his speeches/ideas/policies/actions are

if a president is totally moderate and compromising on all aspects, none is going to protest against him or lose any sleep because he won the election

that's why the assumption that both sides are at fault is wrong: Hillary is a little bit of nothing really, definately a moderate/centrist politician, she wouldn't bring any dramatic change therefore you can all live with it (USA is not that terrible place to live yes?)

Trump on the other hand brings a number of extreme/racist/controversial policies and persons, the resistance was fully expected to be overwhelming, you can't expect for instance to just ban millions from entering the country and everyone be cool about it, it's unconstitutional according to republican judges, it has nothing to do with political opposition but with the president trying to force illegal policies