Developer Q&A - Matt Goss: Legion Itemization

[quez]

You can't trade loot from bonus rolls right now because the team wants you to spend that token on yourself.

The current system hurts people way more than it could possibly do if you could trade loot from bonus rolls.

I've bonus rolled several items which are BiS for others but complete garbage for me(or something i already had). The first member in our guild who got Whispers in the dark on HC managed to bonus roll it twice the following weeks..

If you are playing with a group of people who would even think to force others to spend coins to trade loot you should stop playing with them. Blizzard should not have to design the game around this.

[Deleted]

No news on the RNG front, oh well lets see with next patch then while i spend my money on other stuff.

[Canada42]

You don't need Warforged or Titanforged, you can move to a higher difficulty or mythic dungeons.

No, that's exactly the problem. You shouldn't need titanforged because you can move to a higher difficulty... but the higher difficulties had to be balanced around the fact that titanforging exists so the appropriate level for the content seems to be the same or higher than the gear that actually drops in that content. M+ feels balanced around the level of gear that drops from the weekly chest rather than the gear that drops in the dungeon.

[Hawksolo]

"Artifacts have extended the amount of time players are playing their main characters."
It should say...
"Artifacts have shortened the amount of time people are playing their alts characters."

I don't find I am playing my main toon more just that I am not playing my alts as much and therefore not playing the game as much.

[Deleted]

Hey they answered my question :O


I was kind of hoping they'd reckognise that due to the wf/tf situation mythic loot feels entirely lackluster.

Saying 'you dont need wf/tf' is the exact same ignorance as was shown with the utility legendary stuff.. in the sense that, you can't compete with a lucky person that is spending less time in wow, and that feels very wrong

[DaGhostDS]

NPC Armor

The team would love to offer some of the armor from NPCs, especially bosses to players.
This is usually offered to players by adding one or two of the armor set items from a boss to their drop table.

Shado Pan (not just the hat) and Shattered hand armor

- - - Updated - - -

NPC Armor

The team would love to offer some of the armor from NPCs, especially bosses to players.
This is usually offered to players by adding one or two of the armor set items from a boss to their drop table.

Shado Pan (not just the hat) and Shattered hand armor

Might be too late for them to go back on those though.. /sigh

[Polarthief]

Literally the most pointless Q&A ever. Practically nothing got answered and they want to drop the legendary rate? Are you serious? I thought the whole point was to be able to swap them. I play a lot and I only have 6, 4 of which are just utter crap, so I don't really have a lot of "switching" I can do -_-

But yeah. Worthless Q&A. Told us nothing new, completely ignored feedback/community (as usual), what a waste of time.

[Primal]

Well no fucking shit... Maybe that's because for some time it was a pain in the ass to even consider trying to level an alts artifact weapon on top of trying to max out a mains weapon.

Some of these "answers" are more like "Well let's just state the obvious and not think about why things are the way they are!"

Another example: "Reforging also meant an interruption to your raid, as you had to go and reforge an item."

I can literally say "no shit sherlock" to every answer they given.

[scrappybristol]

i just want a lore Q&A

[MasterHamster]

How DARE Blizzard not agree that <my personal pet peeve> needs to be changed? Totally ignoring the community by answering about the question in a way I do not approve of.

So many posters in this thread shows clearly why players aren't game devs, and especially why game design isn't a democracy.

[Doffen]

NPC Armor
The team would love to offer some of the armor from NPCs, especially bosses to players.
This is usually offered to players by adding one or two of the armor set items from a boss to their drop table.

Please, give us suramar transmog-gear already. The one you get as female in CoS is so awesome. And Elisande's helm, droooool.

And make it all mail loot please. Ty.

[Logwyn]

How DARE Blizzard not agree that <my personal pet peeve> needs to be changed? Totally ignoring the community by answering about the question in a way I do not approve of.

So many posters in this thread shows clearly why players aren't game devs, and especially why game design isn't a democracy.

Is it not? If game devs do not listen to the opinion of the masses... they will be voted out of designing a game altogether!

[MasterHamster]

Is it not? If game devs do not listen to the opinion of the masses... they will be voted out of designing a game altogether!

The vast majority of game design decisions, especially in MMORPGs, are never up to "vote" by players. For the simple reason that players will ask for more until they don't understand why they're bored. "Players" as a whole are too shortsighted to see long term consequences...

WoD is actually a good representation of what happens if players gets too much of a say in how endgame should be. Since we 'don't want to be forced to farm' or anything else. Everything outside of raids should be 'optional'.

Players think they want a lobby MMO-arcade until they get it. WoW would never have lasted this far if Blizzard caved in to every bandwagon riot the forums can conjure, such as removing AP because people can't live with themselves unless they're capped, etc.

[ZenX]

Literally the most pointless Q&A ever. Practically nothing got answered and they want to drop the legendary rate? Are you serious? I thought the whole point was to be able to swap them. I play a lot and I only have 6, 4 of which are just utter crap, so I don't really have a lot of "switching" I can do -_-

But yeah. Worthless Q&A. Told us nothing new, completely ignored feedback/community (as usual), what a waste of time.

Wow I had my doubts about it before but their answers here make it certain that those who are behind Legion's Itemisation are certainly clueless in what they are doing.

I sort of did refute people's claims with regards to how game was being diablofied (And having played LoD since '04 till D3's release and hopping into it from time to time ever since, I can say D3 which I get to play at least every week for 4-8 hours is currently better than LoD) but by the answers given I am realising now that the situation is even worse.

They did indeed integrated everything gruesome with D3 without having the faintest idea how they operate (a game that is light-years more dynamic as well as flexible than WoW allowing for such an itemization) and tried to shoe-horn it into game a that couldn't really take it, creating an abominable mess.

If this is the way they are going to continue with this form of itemisation in place, they need to provide challenging solo content which have the same rewards are RNG-based and static-material base of the same caliber as those rewarded with organised higher-difficulty content. Why? This is how D3 matches this kind of itemisation with grouping being the factor in increasing scaling in difficulty per user while providing a small benefit in terms of rewards.
But providing such a solo-system is absurd considering the holy-trinity of roles along with the game being an MMORPG with gating, not a solo ARPG with a highly scalable difficulty slider and unbound replay potential.

This is pure incompetence. Its as if these designers' previous experience in itemisation is from Minecraft along with having any knowledge neither in WoW's nor Diablo's.

Though again the horrible itemisation is the only problem I have with Legion with AP system being a part that I like. Having played this game since (mid to late) TBC, it really has been the best expansion of WoW for me aside from the whole itemisation ordeal.

[Logwyn]

The vast majority of game design decisions, especially in MMORPGs, are never up to "vote" by players. For the simple reason that players will ask for more until they don't understand why they're bored. "Players" as a whole are too shortsighted to see long term consequences...

WoD is actually a good representation of what happens if players gets too much of a say in how endgame should be. Since we 'don't want to be forced to farm' or anything else. Everything outside of raids should be 'optional'.

Players think they want a lobby MMO-arcade until they get it. WoW would never have lasted this far if Blizzard caved in to every bandwagon riot the forums can conjure, such as removing AP because people can't live with themselves unless they're capped, etc.

Hmm. true enough. But I still think Lore looks like a muppet with that hair cut. Hard to take these Q&A with someone leading them with hair like that.

[Narabug]

Reforging
Reforging lets players make items more optimal, but it isn't a great solution to the current problem of some higher item level items not being as good as lower item level items.
Reforging made every upgrade more difficult to figure out, as you had to consider the base item and all of the variations you could make.
Reforging also meant an interruption to your raid, as you had to go and reforge an item.

• It's actually an amazing solution the the current problem because it means the more stats are more globally more valuable, because you can always have at least some of your 'best' stat on a piece of gear.
• No it didn't. The issue you're talking about is hit/expertise/haste/crit caps and soft caps. Moreover, what is the relation to the problem of something that is a large item level upgrade (untradeable) being a performance downgrade?
• No it didn't. Actually never. If it did, how is that any different from getting an upgrade today that requires gems/enchants, or grabbing items out of the bank? This is just another excuse that doesn't address the issue.

Titanforged and Warforged RNG
Warforged and Titanforged was intended to make the upgrade feel like a bonus.
If you are a Heroic raider and want to help out a friend in Normal, there is no chance of getting an upgrade. This system gives you a chance to get something that is an upgrade.
The team is still looking at the tuning, maybe it is happening more than it should.
You don't need Warforged or Titanforged, you can move to a higher difficulty or mythic dungeons.

• This would be true if warforge was a small bonus, such as 4 ilvl, and Titanforging was a slightly better bonus, such as 8 ilvl. Allowing an item to Titanforge to literally double the base stats is just absurd.
• There is still little-to-no chance of getting an upgrade. What this has actually created is that people who do not massively out-gear Normal/Heroic raids are quickly unable to join groups because the people who are running them for the low chance of item upgrades are not interested in 'carrying' appropriately geared players. Also, running with higher-geared party members increases the chance of them not needing an upgrade and sharing it.
• It is not happening more than it should. It simply shouldn't be so required. And it is required.
• Look above. It is required. I get 0 upgrades from M+ without a titanforge. I get 0 upgrades from Heroic NH without a Warforge. Most mythic raiders get 0 upgrades from Mythic raid without a Warforge. Am I supposed to just run a higher difficulty of +15 to get better gear?

I actually kind of feel bad for ToddMatt. He obviously doesn't play or understand the game, but he was hired to perform some job at Blizzard, so he took it. I just wish that they'd check their ego at the door and spend some time looking at feedback instead of repeatedly spewing their uninformed excuses and destroying the game that they were hired to maintain.

[Onikaroshi]

Hmm. true enough. But I still think Lore looks like a muppet with that hair cut. Hard to take these Q&A with someone leading them with hair like that.

I dream of a day when someone's choice of haircut has no bearing on whether or not they are to be taken seriously.. seriously it's just hair, its the way he likes it, leave him be.

[supertigerlamp]

Once again they double down on their bad design ideas that resulted in some Legendary items being better than others, but they continue to claim "they're bringing it more in line."

I don't mean to be Johnny Raincloud, but even with additional stats allotted to the duds, some Legendaries are still going to be categorically superior because of their bonus effects. I don't really see how they continue to deny or overlook this in such a blase way. Just as an example, Anger of the Half Giants and Delusions of Grandeur will be better than the Blur+Leech chest piece for Havoc simply because they smooth out the bad design of the class by increases resource generation and allow a powerful CD on a ridiculously long CD to be more in line with the other CDs. I don't care if you add Mastery to something, that is an incremental gain compared to the QoL benefits + overall benefit in terms of output.

I understand that not every piece can be a winner, but some by design are clear losers. You can't tell me they didn't know Leech was inferior to more output. They went live with that incredibly lopsided, bad design. If nothing else they should have made every legendary impact one DPS/Heal/Defensive CD of the appropriate class, you could at least say "Well this doesn't help my resource management, but I at least get more oomph from Blade Dance when I use it."

edited for rage spelling

[Kaedis]

The challenges aren't normalized, so your gear matters. It will probably be rough early on.

Wait, what? What the hell is the point of them, then? These challenges, and their associated tints, were sold as being for people capable of demonstrating outstanding skill with their class. If they are not normalized, all they are going to demonstrate is that the person geared up sufficiently to trivialize it. Without gear normalizing, these tints lose their prestige, with mythic raiders getting them almost immediately and non-raiders being blocked from them likely until Argus, regardless of skill (and I say this as a mythic raider myself).

Seriously, normalize these things. They don't reflect skill in the slightest if you can simply outgear them.

[Coffeexbean]

I love Blizzards response to legendaries and warforged RNG. They are bonuses and a part of the community doesnt understand that