[MISTWEAVER] 7.X Discussion Thread

[doozer]

That was nonsense either. there wont be a real difference whether you ask your raid to walk into them or not.

if some ppl think walking into a sphere was difficult, it is also difficult not to walk into a sphere.

You know they're never going to bring back the old mastery, right? Even if they wanted to, it wouldn't be until 8.0 (which will still never happen). We need solutions to buff MW that can be implemented now, under the current game design.

[Taygai]

That was nonsense either. there wont be a real difference whether you ask your raid to walk into them or not.

if some ppl think walking into a sphere was difficult, it is also difficult not to walk into a sphere.

Oh for sure, but it was more so the joke of that I create these green orbs without actively pressing a button to do so (we had the ability but it didn't generate chi and in raids it wasn't worth using IMO). It created the orbs right next to the person healed by whatever healing it was, so it was as you said, hard not to walk into them.

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You know they're never going to bring back the old mastery, right? Even if they wanted to, it wouldn't be until 8.0 (which will still never happen). We need solutions to buff MW that can be implemented now, under the current game design.

How to fix MW in 7.x

- Bring uplift back
- Renewing mist spreads to 3 targets like it used to
- Reduce duration of renewing mist to 20 seconds
- Reduce CD of renewing mist to 8 seconds
- Lower the mana cost of all MW spells
- Remove essence font
- bring back eminence healing
- bring soothing mist back to it's original form
- bring enveloping mist back to it's current form
- statue baseline


I still can't stress enough why they broke MW. I'm fine that they removed mana tea and chi. We never ran out of mana if you played well and still did competitive healing, in fact it was hard to go oom as a MW unless you spammed SCK, but that was exactly efficient healing without using other spells too.

Their goal was to make MW more streamlined to stand next to other healers, but ...at the cost of making the class boring and simple? Bleh...

All of that aside

Mistweavers big problem I notice is revival and mana costs. Revival heals for to little, even with the artifact trait to buff it after it's intial heal. Mana costs can be tuned down. That doesn't fix the design problem, they're boring to play, at least for me. But in theory if they want them to be competitive, they need a DR with life cocoon too, even if it's just 15-20% after the absorption is consumed or expires for 6 seconds or so. That or make the absorption much bigger.

On a M+ note, with overflowing leaving soon, I think gusts of mists will be okay-ish, but like I said earlier, it would've been really strong with our previous kit pre 7.0. But because they changed them, they basically gave us a mastery that worked well, but then changed the kit and forgot about the mastery.

¯\_(ツ)_/¯

I'm asking too much, but I'm passionate about MW, or at least was prior to 7.0

[Probably]

I get what everyone is saying. I' put my holy pally to the side at the start of MoP to play MW as my main, and I never reverted. Sometimes I wish I had, but alas I guess I just dig the monks off specs so much more than Paladins. Anyway, there have always been ups and downs and that's just the struggle we've dealt with all along as MW.

Im at least grateful we've caught some sort of attention. I'm hopeful that the newly altered vivify is just a straight buff, my boots are so much better now, and the new revival trait keeps us competitive with other healers. I know there will be a utility void, and that's a major problem. Who knows maybe we'll see an OP set bonus soon to band-aid us and shut us up....all 8 of us out there.

I'm staying positive. I'm too invested into this toon, and legion surely made it difficult for me to pursue any other healer as of this moment. Stay strong MW's.

[Taygai]

I get what everyone is saying. I' put my holy pally to the side at the start of MoP to play MW as my main, and I never reverted. Sometimes I wish I had, but alas I guess I just dig the monks off specs so much more than Paladins. Anyway, there have always been ups and downs and that's just the struggle we've dealt with all along as MW.

Im at least grateful we've caught some sort of attention. I'm hopeful that the newly altered vivify is just a straight buff, my boots are so much better now, and the new revival trait keeps us competitive with other healers. I know there will be a utility void, and that's a major problem. Who knows maybe we'll see an OP set bonus soon to band-aid us and shut us up....all 8 of us out there.

I'm staying positive. I'm too invested into this toon, and legion surely made it difficult for me to pursue any other healer as of this moment. Stay strong MW's.

What I've learned to deal with utility wise, is that if we have a resto shaman, I just ignore the fact we don't have utility. Granted two resto shamans is better than 1, but unless you're in a top end mythic guild, it's one of those things, where if you can't kill a fight, it's because of your raid group and/or gear. Surely other healers might make it easier, but legion is more forgiving than any other expansion in that view.

[cqwrteur]

You know they're never going to bring back the old mastery, right? Even if they wanted to, it wouldn't be until 8.0 (which will still never happen). We need solutions to buff MW that can be implemented now, under the current game design.

well. if they want to fix the mastery issue at this point, the best solution is to nerf gust of mists massively. Make it a pointless stat and also buff all of our spell healing.

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well, these wont happen in 7.x

- Bring uplift back

ReM targets die? hmhm. maybe they need make ReM jump to a new target if its target dies?

- Renewing mist spreads to 3 targets like it used to

The problem of current ReM is that its hpm is far less than the original.
ReM in WoD (with PoM) : 558.9% sp, 1% mana
ReM in Legion : 862.5% sp, 3% mana

- Reduce duration of renewing mist to 20 seconds

How about reducing ReM duration to 18 secs like mop?

- Reduce CD of renewing mist to 8 seconds

it is still 8 sec now.

- Lower the mana cost of all MW spells

They should do this at SoO. However, blizz hates MW. Our spells are too expansive since beginning

- Remove essence font

well, if so, they need make RJW baseline and increase its range to 25 yards. Or we will be underpowered since we don't have a range AoE healing spell.

- bring back eminence healing

no, that is disc class fantasy now.
i think removing revival and buffing our healing massively would be a better choice. Make mw a throughput healer.

- bring soothing mist back to it's original form
- bring enveloping mist back to it's current form

tbh, a passive soom is far more superior than an active soom. since no one actually uses soom a lot in raid.

- statue baseline

Ability squish LOL. maybe they want wow to be playable on the console????

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Conclusion: legion isn't fun. balancing is horrible. this game sucks. time to quit.

[Buildapanda]

well. if they want to fix the mastery issue at this point, the best solution is to nerf gust of mists massively. Make it a pointless stat and also buff all of our spell healing.

- - - Updated - - -

well, these wont happen in 7.x

ReM targets die? hmhm. maybe they need make ReM jump to a new target if its target dies?

The problem of current ReM is that its hpm is far less than the original.
ReM in WoD (with PoM) : 558.9% sp, 1% mana
ReM in Legion : 862.5% sp, 3% mana

How about reducing ReM duration to 18 secs like mop?

it is still 8 sec now.

They should do this at SoO. However, blizz hates MW. Our spells are too expansive since beginning

well, if so, they need make RJW baseline and increase its range to 25 yards. Or we will be underpowered since we don't have a range AoE healing spell.

no, that is disc class fantasy now.
i think removing revival and buffing our healing massively would be a better choice. Make mw a throughput healer.

tbh, a passive soom is far more superior than an active soom. since no one actually uses soom a lot in raid.

Ability squish LOL. maybe they want wow to be playable on the console????

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Conclusion: legion isn't fun. balancing is horrible. this game sucks. time to quit.

I just wanted to say your communcation skills have improved tremendously, I agree with everything you are saying. When my guild chooses to put me in over my holy paladin so they don't hurt my feelings I put on my mastery set and my spot healing is still shit. Mastery needs to be totally redone. And I play wow on an xbox 360 controller the game already can be played on a console.

[Supliftz]

Again, when I say buff mastery, people take what I say hyper literally and ignore current state of content, Mistweavers etc. When I say 'buff mastery' I don't mean, 'Buff mastery's rating per stat' I mean, buff the effectiveness of Mastery as currently the NET effectiveness of mastery for Mistweavers is pretty much zero percent. There are many ways you can buff mastery that don't involve changing the rating.

Another misnomer is that when I say 'buff Mastery' I don't mean to the point where a Effuse heals for a 150 trillion. C'mon, common sense people.

Realistically next patch Mastery's only problem is rating per stat. You aren't seriously going to cast EF as much as possible, ignoring dbl mastery procs and afk in between ef casts because that's the only thing good. Effuse is significantly better hpm wise (by a large margin) as a filler spell, and UT vivify is insane with boots.

You are right in saying effuse and mastery are a problem, but with how whispers of shaohao/effusive mists work, mastery's value for effuse is far less compared to what it is now.

I also do agree mastery is a bit boring right now. It's intended to be the reverse disc mastery (Where disc mastery is all about raid healing, and does zero for st healing, and mw is all about St healing and does nothing for raid healing), but it doesn't have any interesting interactions outside of ef hots. Compare that to druid mastery, where abusing mastery is actively influencing your gameplay.

[Taygai]

well. if they want to fix the mastery issue at this point, the best solution is to nerf gust of mists massively. Make it a pointless stat and also buff all of our spell healing.

- - - Updated - - -

well, these wont happen in 7.x

ReM targets die? hmhm. maybe they need make ReM jump to a new target if its target dies?

The problem of current ReM is that its hpm is far less than the original.
ReM in WoD (with PoM) : 558.9% sp, 1% mana
ReM in Legion : 862.5% sp, 3% mana

How about reducing ReM duration to 18 secs like mop?

it is still 8 sec now.

They should do this at SoO. However, blizz hates MW. Our spells are too expansive since beginning

well, if so, they need make RJW baseline and increase its range to 25 yards. Or we will be underpowered since we don't have a range AoE healing spell.

no, that is disc class fantasy now.
i think removing revival and buffing our healing massively would be a better choice. Make mw a throughput healer.

tbh, a passive soom is far more superior than an active soom. since no one actually uses soom a lot in raid.

Ability squish LOL. maybe they want wow to be playable on the console????

- - - Updated - - -

Conclusion: legion isn't fun. balancing is horrible. this game sucks. time to quit.

I can't tell if you're bashing me or not, in the case you're not...

1) I don't even understand how this relates to uplift.

2) This would be fine if it jumps. Mana is a big issue for MW at the moment, to my knowledge most of that issue lies in that in raids, we need essence font to be competitive, and essence font costs so much mana. Keeping ReM at it's current cost but jumping 3 times, would be perfect for me.

3) The difference between 18 sec & 20 sec is? I mean I guess, as long as it's near 20 seconds, so we can effectively it on 6 people at once assuming it jumps 3 times

4) My bad. For some reason I thought it was 10 seconds.

5) SoO? Siege of Orgrimmar is all I know that stands for...Idk where this is going

6) RJW baseline would be fine. SCK used to heal, now it doesn't. So an alternative would be nice. Although if uplift came back like it worked before, we'd have an AoE Heal

7) It may be disc class fantasy, but it was an important part to mistweaver since the start. I remember using Xuen was a healing CD with statue because of the eminence healing from him duplicated by the statue. I miss Xuen as a MW. I think removing revival is not needed. Every healer needs a raid CD, or else...why bring one? I know we're at that point now, but that is partly because revival is such a weak CD. It's basically pre-legion divine hymn.

8) Passive soom is nice, but being able to instant cast Enveloping mist and surging mist was nice if you're just healing one target. I actually spammed on raid at time when I needed to generate chi and had no ReM to use and uplift wasn't ready. It was almost like a filler rotation for me to generate chi, but alas, chi is no longer here for MW.

9) WoW shouldn't be on console, I don't think diablo should've ever been. Console MMO's are overall difficult to play in the environment we want MW"s to be good at, which is group content. Especially as a healer. Statue was an important part of monk, I'm really sad they changed how ox statue worked in WoD and taking away baseline statue in legion. It's like taking away circle of healing from holy priests, or beacon of light from paladins.


Conclusion: Legion is fun, mistweaver is not.

[cqwrteur]

I can't tell if you're bashing me or not, in the case you're not...

1) I don't even understand how this relates to uplift.

ReM target dies = Uplift targets Lose

2) This would be fine if it jumps. Mana is a big issue for MW at the moment, to my knowledge most of that issue lies in that in raids, we need essence font to be competitive, and essence font costs so much mana. Keeping ReM at it's current cost but jumping 3 times, would be perfect for me.

High mana cost of Essence font is not a problem. The problem is that its hpm is lower than other healers.

3) The difference between 18 sec & 20 sec is? I mean I guess, as long as it's near 20 seconds, so we can effectively it on 6 people at once assuming it jumps 3 times

pool of mist!

7) It may be disc class fantasy, but it was an important part to mistweaver since the start. I remember using Xuen was a healing CD with statue because of the eminence healing from him duplicated by the statue. I miss Xuen as a MW. I think removing revival is not needed. Every healer needs a raid CD, or else...why bring one? I know we're at that point now, but that is partly because revival is such a weak CD. It's basically pre-legion divine hymn.

revival sucks. https://clips.twitch.tv/DeliciousSmokyWaffleHumbleLife
it also has the issue whether it can be used as a raid CD or an oh shit button.

8) Passive soom is nice, but being able to instant cast Enveloping mist and surging mist was nice if you're just healing one target. I actually spammed on raid at time when I needed to generate chi and had no ReM to use and uplift wasn't ready. It was almost like a filler rotation for me to generate chi, but alas, chi is no longer here for MW.

No, you are tbh not instant cast EnM with active soom, since you are still channeling. The issue is that EnM is weak and not able to be spam on a single target (since it is a hot). Even before legion, we are not good at dungeons either.

9) WoW shouldn't be on console, I don't think diablo should've ever been. Console MMO's are overall difficult to play in the environment we want MW"s to be good at, which is group content. Especially as a healer. Statue was an important part of monk, I'm really sad they changed how ox statue worked in WoD and taking away baseline statue in legion. It's like taking away circle of healing from holy priests, or beacon of light from paladins.

WoW shouldn't be many things while blizz did it. WoW shouldn't have P2W features like WoW token, leveling boost, xp potions. WoW shouldn't have anti-socializing tools like LFD/LFR, CRZ, etc. WoW shouldn't speed up leveling. WoW shouldn't have gambling features like legendaries. WoW shouldn't scrap contents. WoW shouldn't have Arena. However, blizz has added all these shit to this game during the past expansions.

Conclusion: Legion is fun, mistweaver is not.

Legion isn't fun. Most of my friends quit. Sub number drops like shit.

[Taygai]

WoW shouldn't be many things while blizz did it. WoW shouldn't have P2W features like WoW token, leveling boost, xp potions. WoW shouldn't have anti-socializing tools like LFD/LFR, CRZ, etc. WoW shouldn't speed up leveling. WoW shouldn't have gambling features like legendaries. WoW shouldn't scrap contents. WoW shouldn't have Arena. However, blizz has added all these shit to this game during the past expansions.



Legion isn't fun. Most of my friends quit. Sub number drops like shit.

I don't think you know what P2W means. Pay to win means paying to be better than other players. Most of the playerbase who cares about raiding have been 110 for a long time, and people have been paying for a sub for 12 years, I doubt this is going to change anything, let alone it does not give them an in-game advantage. A lot of this is opinion I see. I won't go on much here since that's not why we're here.

I'm sorry you don't like legion, and your friends quit. If you're not having fun, it might be time for you to set it down too. I know plenty of people who enjoy it, far more than those who don't.

[Rakoth]

I don't think you know what P2W means. Pay to win means paying to be better than other players. Most of the playerbase who cares about raiding have been 110 for a long time, and people have been paying for a sub for 12 years, I doubt this is going to change anything, let alone it does not give them an in-game advantage. A lot of this is opinion I see. I won't go on much here since that's not why we're here.

I'm sorry you don't like legion, and your friends quit. If you're not having fun, it might be time for you to set it down too. I know plenty of people who enjoy it, far more than those who don't.

I enjoy my MWer. It feels shitty that I can't help my raid more, but I like the class mechanics and as a filthy casual working through heroics, I am not holding the raid back anymore then the DPS who doesn't gem, or enchant. That said, Krosus has been difficult... I keep the raid up great, but the tanks are very difficult to keep up (we usually have a priest, a druid, and myself). It's mostly hard to keep the raid up AND the tanks up.

I am still loving Legion. World quests are fun, since I can decide exactly what to target and when. If I need AP, I just focus on AP ones, if I need resources, I focus on resource ones, and I can grind some honor when I feel like it.

[cqwrteur]

I don't think you know what P2W means. Pay to win means paying to be better than other players. Most of the playerbase who cares about raiding have been 110 for a long time, and people have been paying for a sub for 12 years, I doubt this is going to change anything, let alone it does not give them an in-game advantage. A lot of this is opinion I see. I won't go on much here since that's not why we're here.

I'm sorry you don't like legion, and your friends quit. If you're not having fun, it might be time for you to set it down too. I know plenty of people who enjoy it, far more than those who don't.

Guys, leveling boost, gold transaction are the most standard kinds of P2W features in mmos.

you don't need time for leveling, you don't need time to grind gold. You are definitely better than those players who never pay these services.

Why gold isn't relevant in wow any more? because wow token as a P2W feature destroys wow economy.

ironically, blizz said wow would never have any Micro-Transactions in 2008. They also criticized micro-transactions in mmos. However, we got cash shop in WotLK.

http://www.gamegoldwow.com/World-of-...-Warcraft.html

Blizzard's Rob Pardo has criticized micro-transactions in MMOGs, saying the increasingly prevalent payment system is unfair to gamers in subscription-based games like World of Warcraft.
Pardo, the senior vice-president of game design at Blizzard, made the comments during the Q&A session following his GDC address entitled "Blizzard's Approach to Multiplayer Game Design." According to a WoW Insider transcript, Pardo was asked if Blizzard had considered implementing micro-transactions in World of Warcraft. "We chose to go with the subscription-based model instead of that approach," he replied. "We've taken the approach that we want players to feel like it's a level playing field once they're in WoW."
"Outside resources don't play into it - no gold buying, etc. We take a hard line stance against it," he continued. "What you get out of micro-transactions is kind of the same thing and I think our player base would feel betrayed by it. I think that's something else you have to decide on up-front instead of implementing it later."
When it was suggested micro-transactions might make it easier for casual gamers to maintain pace with more serious players, Pardo said, "They aren't going to be the ones spending the money."

no gold buying LOL
rip wow economy
How about selling mythic gears for $2000 in the cash shop?

[Taygai]

Guys, leveling boost, gold transaction are the most standard kinds of P2W features in mmos.

you don't need time for leveling, you don't need time to grind gold. You are definitely better than those players who never pay these services.

Why gold isn't relevant in wow any more? because wow token as a P2W feature destroys wow economy.

ironically, blizz said wow would never have any Micro-Transactions in 2008. They also criticized micro-transactions in mmos. However, we got cash shop in WotLK.

http://www.gamegoldwow.com/World-of-...-Warcraft.html

Blizzard's Rob Pardo has criticized micro-transactions in MMOGs, saying the increasingly prevalent payment system is unfair to gamers in subscription-based games like World of Warcraft.
Pardo, the senior vice-president of game design at Blizzard, made the comments during the Q&A session following his GDC address entitled "Blizzard's Approach to Multiplayer Game Design." According to a WoW Insider transcript, Pardo was asked if Blizzard had considered implementing micro-transactions in World of Warcraft. "We chose to go with the subscription-based model instead of that approach," he replied. "We've taken the approach that we want players to feel like it's a level playing field once they're in WoW."
"Outside resources don't play into it - no gold buying, etc. We take a hard line stance against it," he continued. "What you get out of micro-transactions is kind of the same thing and I think our player base would feel betrayed by it. I think that's something else you have to decide on up-front instead of implementing it later."
When it was suggested micro-transactions might make it easier for casual gamers to maintain pace with more serious players, Pardo said, "They aren't going to be the ones spending the money."

no gold buying LOL
rip wow economy
How about selling mythic gears for $2000 in the cash shop?

There are a few reasons for why they started WoW token.

1) The main reason is to combat gold sellers. Gold sellers were a problem, and blizzard thought "If we can make a profit from it, why not?" This is both good and bad thinking. It means less players are banned, it means blizzard can monitor the economy almost directly with that. Depending on who you are, thats good or bad.

2) Activision blizzard. They say they don't impact game decisions, but if that were the case, we'd still have talent trees that we would place hundreds of points in by now, (I'm expecting an artifact joke), LFR probably would not be something, mythic plus would not be a thing and we'd still only have 1 raid difficulty.

Before you quote Rob Pardo though, you have to understand why he left. Much like other developers who have been there since the start, he's just not liking the direction the game is going, it's different. He doesn't claim that in his interviews, so it's only speculation, but chris metzen is retiring, ghostcrawler left for LoL, I wouldn't be surprised if Ion leaves soon. A lot of the original people who were there at the start of WoW are gone, at least the public faces.

To your first point though, buying experience, level boost, etc, can be pay to win. But really if you're not 110 at this point, you probably wouldn't be on this forum, care about class balance etc. It's so easy to hit max level without any kind of experience boost. I don't think buying any of that is winning ahead of those who don't. This is WoW, and MMO theme park. A lot of the game at max level is equalized to the point where as long as you play daily, you're going to be marginally behind someone who plays just a bit more than you.

This isn't mistweaver related though, idk this is even going on.

[cqwrteur]

1) The main reason is to combat gold sellers. Gold sellers were a problem, and blizzard thought "If we can make a profit from it, why not?" This is both good and bad thinking. It means less players are banned, it means blizzard can monitor the economy almost directly with that. Depending on who you are, thats good or bad.

If Gold sellers are a problem, wow token will always be worse. you think wow token is good == there is nothing wrong with gold sellers too.

Wow token could never make gold sellers out of business. I would say you just too naïve. in fact, wow token provides a new way for gold sellers to sell gold in x-realm wide.

S1: You pay gold sellers cash (less than a sub)
S2: gold sellers ask you to create a trial character on certain realm.
S3: gold sellers give you gold as much as a token price
S4: you buy a wow token from the auction house.
S5: Delete your trial character.

That is what happened in reality.
sell wow token for cash

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This is WoW, and MMO theme park. A lot of the game at max level is equalized to the point where as long as you play daily, you're going to be marginally behind someone who plays just a bit more than you.

That is horrible logic inside this game. Should everyone get to lvl capped? I don't think so.

The issue is that when blizz speed up leveling, they also have to add more grinding at level capped. if you look at the history, this trend becomes worse and worse each expansion.

BC: faster leveling than vanilla -> 2.4 Quel' Danas dailes
Wrath: faster than BC, Heirloom, Dungeon finder -> More dailies at level capped
Cata: faster than Wrath, Azeroth Revamped, Linear questline -> More dailies at level capped
MoP: faster than Cata. Level capped boost, xp potion -> Mandatory dailies
WoD: faster than MoP. Free boost. stat squish->xp squish too. One-shot mob -> Garrison and apexis crystal grinding. 2hours get to level cap (From lv1 to lv 100). Flying achievement
Legion: WTF?????? -> 60m AP grinding (now 20b AP grinding?), Legendary grinding, Flying Achievement grinding. Mandatory grinding to enter the Arcway and Court of Stars dungeons.

Even our lord theorycraft geodew has left the game due to too much AP grinding. One of the reason why mistweaver is currently bad is because of geodew's left.

Leveling was a huge part of fun in vanilla. One of the important reason people think WoW was fun was the great leveling experience. I now play both on retail and Elysium. Vanilla leveling was much more fun than legion.

Now, this game has no entire experience, just boring end game. New players don't think it is fun. Veterans don't think either.

[Taygai]

Leveling was a huge part of fun in vanilla. One of the important reason people think WoW was fun was the great leveling experience. I now play both on retail and Elysium. Vanilla leveling was much more fun than legion.

Understand why they do this. If battle chest has every expansion from the past except the latest one, they want you to blaze through it, so they can sell you their current expansion. It's a business model, and a smart one. I doubt people are leaving or unhappy with how fast leveling from 1-100 is. Leveling from 1-100 is...yes faster than 1-60 was in vanilla or even in BC. Without heirlooms, but that's because prior to wrath THE GAME WAS COMPLETELY different. It's still very different than what it was prior to MoP.

I mean, if you ran a business like blizzard, would you disagree with how they handle it to boost profit? At the end of the day, this is still both a game and a company, and the company has to make profit to produce quality material.

[cqwrteur]

WoW subs now at 5.5 million - Blizzard will longer to report sub numbers anymore

Blizzard will no longer report subscriber numbers. Updated post with notes from earnings call.

WoW Down to 5.5 Million Subscribers
Blizzard has their Q3 2015 earnings call tomorrow, announcing that WoW is down to 5.5 million subscribers at the end of Q3 2015. This is down 100k from the Q2 2015 call that listed WoW at 5.6 million subscribers.

World of Warcraft Level 1-100 In 2 Hours and 14 Minutes WORLD RECORD
20 Reasons Why World of Warcraft Sucks Now

- - - Updated - - -

Understand why they do this. If battle chest has every expansion from the past except the latest one, they want you to blaze through it, so they can sell you their current expansion. It's a business model, and a smart one. I doubt people are leaving or unhappy with how fast leveling from 1-100 is. Leveling from 1-100 is...yes faster than 1-60 was in vanilla or even in BC. Without heirlooms, but that's because prior to wrath THE GAME WAS COMPLETELY different. It's still very different than what it was prior to MoP.

I mean, if you ran a business like blizzard, would you disagree with how they handle it to boost profit? At the end of the day, this is still both a game and a company, and the company has to make profit to produce quality material.

I don't think it is related to a business model. They shouldn't make current expansion so fast like the old contents. They can slow down leveling speed from 100-110 for 17 days as vanilla and remove all AP grinding. That would create a much better overall experience that current AP grinding model.

About the old content, it is another story when you can one shot mob or something. Low level experience is pretty bad now. A lvl 1 character can kill a lvl 10 mob easily w/o heirloom. The experience is shit because of stats compressing in warlords of draenor.

Many new players would uninstall wow very fast since leveling experience in retail is like those privacy servers.

[Taygai]

WoW subs now at 5.5 million - Blizzard will longer to report sub numbers anymore

World of Warcraft Level 1-100 In 2 Hours and 14 Minutes WORLD RECORD
20 Reasons Why World of Warcraft Sucks Now

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I don't think it is related to a business model. I don't think they should make current expansion so fast like the old contents. They can slow down leveling speed from 100-110 for 17 days as vanilla and remove all AP grinding. That would create a much better overall experience that current AP grinding model.

I don't think that'd go over well. The community at this point is so used to leveling quickly from expansion to expansion that if it took 17 days to hit max level (from 5 or 10 levels) I'm sure they'd give up half way. Wildstar tried to do this, and it did not go over well, there are a few other reasons but lets not get into that.

This is still mistweaver chat...in case you forgot.

[cqwrteur]

I don't think that'd go over well. The community at this point is so used to leveling quickly from expansion to expansion that if it took 17 days to hit max level (from 5 or 10 levels) I'm sure they'd give up half way.

Many people give up half way either under the fast leveling end game experience too. That doesn't work either.

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This is still mistweaver chat...in case you forgot.

There isn't very much mw chat at current point now. Everyone knows we are bad, so that this thread looks like a dead thread.

And many issues of MW now is the issue of game itself, only pointing out these issues could fix mistweaver.

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We all know the biggest issue of MW is that we lack of utility. However, should blizz give us utility? That depends on what you think about the concept homogenization. In fact, give mw more utility = homogenization.

non-homogenization is like:
HPal : A+B+C
MW : A+B
People think Blizz should give MW something to balance C with HPal. However, that would only increase the homogenization of this game. I think that is why blizz refuses to give mw utility.


The problem is blizz and people think this game is homogenization and homogenization is bad. However, it isn't tbh. Vanilla was much more homogenization than Legion.

My answer is homogenization is right, non-homogenization is wrong. This game isn't homogenization since many specs bring more than the others.


That also happens in mastery design for different healers. They go to some kind of extreme that mastery of every spec should be as unique as possible. Gust of Mist is bad since blizz just cant think out a unique and good mastery.

[Dietrik]

I went back to see if anyone discussed the Drape nerf and had to check what thread i was in.

With the drape going from 10% to 5% i assume now nighthold gear scales better, anyone have an idea where that breakpoint is? I am expecting heroic and above cloaks are better but theorycrafters will know.

[cqwrteur]

This is where you need a mod, seriously.. this is the mistweaver discussion thread, talking about P2W or Gold or any other crap doesn't really belong here does it?

do you think give mw some utility == make the specs more homogenization or not?

Taygai said every healer should have a raid CD == homogenization.