How high of a minimum wage would you be willing to tolerate?

[Elegiac]

Entry level jobs are entry level jobs. Many of which are done by high school and college students. If you decide to stay in an entry level job and never progress past that, its not societies fault. Its yours. Minimum wage is just what it says. Minimum. The absolute minimum you need for food, shelter, water. Anything outside of "need" is a want or desire. For a number of years I lived off around $15k/yr. Then I did something about it, I make an extremely competitive wage and absolutely love what I do, and the only debt that I have is a mortgage. It isn't hard, it just takes drive and sacrifice; something many people in society seem to not have anymore.

If you don't like it, then do something about it. People are their own worst enemies, always pointing the finger and everything else except in the mirror. I do believe minimum wage should (and generally is) be different based on your areas cost of living. But it shouldn't award you anything beside the minimum means of living, and taking care of yourself (and if your smart with your money, be able to put a bit away every month). I truly feel sorry for people who sit back and complain about their wage, yet do nothing to improve it.

If you aren't willing to sacrifice anything to move up financially, then you aren't ready to make more money. If you don't have the drive to fight for your goals, then you belong in the bottom. It sounds like a terrible thing to say, but it is what it is. If I, as an employer, can replace you in the same day with a 17 year old kid, then how valuable are you to me? Should I increase your wages because you're extremely competitive on the market, or should I keep your wages low because I know I can get any kid off the street to do the same thing? From a business point of view, its a simple answer. I do believe we have an obligation to take care of each other as a society, but that doesn't mean we should give free handouts.

Wow, this argument is so original and not in any way factually incorrect owing to the majority of minimum wage workers being over thirty and having degrees.

[AlphaOut]

Wow, this argument is so original and not in any way factually incorrect owing to the majority of minimum wage workers being over thirty and having degrees.

Who said anything about a degree?

[Elegiac]

Who said anything about a degree?

Getting a degree constitutes doing something to improve your 'marketable skills' or whatever the conservative truism de jour is.

[AlphaOut]

Getting a degree constitutes doing something to improve your 'marketable skills' or whatever the conservative truism de jour is.

Does it?

It doesn't take a degree to open a business. It doesn't take a degree to work in a trade (although certs are required for advancement). It doesn't take a degree to drive a truck (CDL, however). It doesn't take a degree to tattoo. It doesn't take a degree to work in a union with great wages and benefits, such as UPS. There's a pretty long list of paths to take the make a solid income without a degree.

Just for cash on the side I buy slabs of wood from Montana, ship them to me, and build tables; which I sell for $2500-$5000 each.


Degrees are absolutely not needed to make a good income.

[xGLxAnubis]

Copied from a previous post I made a while back:

Increasing wages increases costs for everyone and everywhere because most businesses have employee’s. It is universal.

First of all: Not all industries are created equal. Any business with higher labor costs will suffer far more than a business that doesn't staff as many employees. Don't forget about the complete business cycle! Most of the pro min wage hike folks forget about the big picture.

Manufacturer -> Distributor -> Retailer -> Consumer

Let’s say a state has an instant 25 cent increase to min wage state wide. All business is conducted within the state. It starts at the Farm Owner, who has only Rent, farmers, seeds and hoes as his expenses. Not those kind of hoes, but the tools!

If I need to pay farmer Sam 25 cents more per hour, then the farm will have to sell those carrots for more $$$ in order to make the rent, maintain equipment and have some left over for a rainy day. Will that carrot costs 25 cents more each? No, but that 1 bundle/hour will cost 25 cents more. Think I am done? Nope! That same farmer's suppliers also have increase labor costs. For now, he doesn't need any new Seeds/hoes but eventually he will have to prepare to spend more. This can get convoluted very easily so I will keep it simple. The farm figures out that it must sell that bundle at 1.25 instead of 1.00 in order to maintain a healthy profit margin. The farmer could sell for only 1.20 but let’s say he either can't or is unwilling to do so. He has the future too think about. Not everyone will approach overhead increases the same way.

Now the food company "Acme" buys the bundles at 1.25. There are other suppliers out there, but most of them have the same increases. Since they are paying more per bundle that means they must resell them for more to grocery store. Since they use to sell it for 3 dollars, do they decide to sell it for 3.25 now? That answer is No, because their own labor costs have also increased. And their other suppliers have also raised prices. Acme's warehousemen get paid more (as well as every employee on the payroll). In fact, if the truck driver is making over min wage, then he should get a pay raise as well. In the end, with the extra costs from their suppliers, they figure that they must now sell that same bundle of carrots for 3.50 to the grocery store.

The Grocery store buys the carrots! They use to be bought for 3.00 and sold for 4.00, but now they must buy for 3.50. They planned on selling it for 4.50 but they also have that increased overhead as everyone else and in order to maintain healthy profits, they sell that same bundle 4.75. That is a 75-cent increase for a 25-cent increase for the farmer. This number is not a real-world scenario but just an example of how a price increase will “Pyramid” their way through the business cycle. That price went up 3 times and as you can see just gets passed onto the consumer.

The consumer now has more money to spend. Does he feel as though the value of carrots is worth the extra 75-cents? I guess it depends on the person. But in the end, his pay raise inflated the costs of carrots (and everything else) and weakened his savings account. Everything he buys will eventually cost more.

So, I guess the question is; where do you find the right balance? What kind of min wage increase makes the consumer better off than before? I guess the answer is partly based on where the consumer lives, and the rate of inflation. The consumers buying power should stay relative to the cost of living. I guess it depends on where we set our measuring stick. Should a min wage person make enough for rent or a mortgage? Should that life be comfortable or should there be a reason to better one’s self and be hard? Should they get government subsidies to go along with it?

Once we figure out our measuring stick, then we have to figure out a way of implementing it into the economy and this is where you get a lot of disagreements. A instant increase of 5 dollars per hour would literally cause business to belly up overnight. Small increases each year may take years to reach the desired level of buying power. Somewhere in the middle will see major inflation and a weakened dollar.

Your model is only correct if EVERYONE is making 25 cents more per hour. They aren't. While various wages WILL go up if minimum wage is increased (Wages that are already above $15 an hour) due to being tied in someway to the minimum wage, not all of them will. That means your carrots don't actually cost an extra 75 cents. As well, since your consumers are now purchasing more, you are able to sell more, which means your cost per product comes down as you sell more, offsetting a portion of your increased labor costs.

[Elegiac]

Does it?

It doesn't take a degree to open a business. It doesn't take a degree to work in a trade (although certs are required for advancement). It doesn't take a degree to drive a truck (CDL, however). It doesn't take a degree to tattoo. It doesn't take a degree to work in a union with great wages and benefits, such as UPS. There's a pretty long list of paths to take the make a solid income without a degree.

Just for cash on the side I buy slabs of wood from Montana, ship them to me, and build tables; which I sell for $2500-$5000 each.


Degrees are absolutely not needed to make a good income.

It does, however, take capital to open a business, as does acquiring trade certifications - moreover, the prevalence of DIY and handymen in the US renders trades a non option for a lot of people, particularly as the economy is very service oriented.

Moreover, what works for you may not work for anyone who isn't you. Anecdotal evidence is just that...anecdotal, and thus irrelevant.

[kail]

It does, however, take capital to open a business, as does acquiring trade certifications - moreover, the prevalence of DIY and handymen in the US renders trades a non option for a lot of people, particularly as the economy is very service oriented.

Moreover, what works for you may not work for anyone who isn't you. Anecdotal evidence is just that...anecdotal, and thus irrelevant.

His point being that it's not needed to make a good income. Does having a degree ease the process? Sure. A fraction of assistant managers that work above me have not pursued college after highschool. They just climbed their way within the company.

Ultimately, it depends on what you want to do. Become a doctor? Schooling needed. Try to create music for a living? Only the talent is required.

[Elegiac]

His point being that it's not needed to make a good income. Does having a degree ease the process? Sure. A fraction of assistant managers that work above me have not pursued college after highschool. They just climbed their way within the company.

Ultimately, it depends on what you want to do. Become a doctor? Schooling needed. Try to create music for a living? Only the talent is required.

Cool story. It still doesn't demonstrate that minimum wage workers are in fact 'lazy'.

[AlphaOut]

It does, however, take capital to open a business, as does acquiring trade certifications - moreover, the prevalence of DIY and handymen in the US renders trades a non option for a lot of people, particularly as the economy is very service oriented.

Moreover, what works for you may not work for anyone who isn't you. Anecdotal evidence is just that...anecdotal, and thus irrelevant.

So you rather make excuses? You think people are born with abilities to craft? Maybe some, but anyone can do it. Certifications are generally cheap, and many jobs will pay for them. I mean really? What kind of capital do you think you need for a certification? Personal training, for example, is like $500. A CCNA for Sisco is like $300. The entry cert for Microsoft is less than $200 I believe. If someone cant learn to make a small financial investment to pay out dividends in their future, then that's exactly why they are making minimum wage. That is not anecdotal. That's the difference between an unskilled labor workforce and skilled labor.

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Cool story. It still doesn't demonstrate that minimum wage workers are in fact 'lazy'.

So whats your argument? That minimum wage should be increased? Or that there is a problem with too many skill workers not being able to get jobs in their respective fields?

[rosebull]

One that's livable? The minimum wage has definitely not kept up with the economy over the years, that much is for sure.

[AlphaOut]

And what craft should somebody learn?

Oh, mind you, you do still have living expenses to keep up with while learning said craft - So make sure you're working 80 hours a week AS WELL as teaching yourself a craft, or good luck not becoming homeless or affording materials for said craft.

I can't tell you what craft someone should learn, that's a silly question- you know that.

That was a very small example of a much larger discussion. But I'll give you my personal investment from what I did, since you asked. I started out by building raised garden beds out of cedar. This got me familiar with the materials. I spent maybe $50 at Lowes. Built 4 beds and sold them for around $100 each. They had a reservoir below the soil that holds water so you never have to water above the soil, and would retain water for around a week. So out of $50, about an hour or so per bed, I made $400. Keep in mind this is just something I started one summer out of boredom.

But if you're working 80 hours a week to live paycheck to paycheck, barely getting by; then go back to what I stated earlier. Which is depending on your location, there are areas that do need a minimum wage increase. However, if you're working 80 hours a week trying to finance a new car, on top of credit card debt, on top of high speed internet, the best new phone with tons of data, then whos fault is it really? Its not uncommon.

[Sunseeker]

Ultimately, it depends on what you want to do. Become a doctor? Schooling needed. Try to create music for a living? Only the talent is required.

There's a band my wife showed me recently, "In this Moment" their earlier CDs were made before she got any musical training. Their more recent CDs were made after she got musical training. The quality difference is huge.

So yes, any old idiot can pick up a guitar, a pencil or a hammer and "make a living" but formal training, be it certificates, degrees, whatever, raises that from simply "making a living" to something well beyond that.

Formalized training is simply (or should be) distilled experience. It's not perfect but that's the idea, that's why it exists as a thing. People who have worked hard, learned things and are knowledgeable in their field pass it on to those who wish to do the same and in theory allow them to skip over the 40 years it took grandpa to learn a skill.

[Glorious Leader]

So you rather make excuses? You think people are born with abilities to craft? Maybe some, but anyone can do it. Certifications are generally cheap, and many jobs will pay for them. I mean really? What kind of capital do you think you need for a certification? Personal training, for example, is like $500. A CCNA for Sisco is like $300. The entry cert for Microsoft is less than $200 I believe. If someone cant learn to make a small financial investment to pay out dividends in their future, then that's exactly why they are making minimum wage. That is not anecdotal. That's the difference between an unskilled labor workforce and skilled labor.

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So whats your argument? That minimum wage should be increased? Or that there is a problem with too many skill workers not being able to get jobs in their respective fields?

You are suggesting individual solutions to wide scale social problems. If every individual could do as you suggested and succeed they would fact is they dont for a myriad of reasons least of which is lazyness. Billionaire hedge fund managers do.not work harder than short order cooks and yet...

[AlphaOut]

Won't read it, cause it's still anecdotal, but feel free to keep posting it if you think it's helping someone. (Spoiler: It isn't.)



1) It is not uncommon to be working 80 hours a week and not be making enough to even pay off STUDENT LOANS nevermind all the rest in this day and age.

2) High Speed Internet is required for a wide variety of positions. Not having a smartphone in this day and age is almost equally destructive to your career prospects. While you don't need a ton of data, you pretty much DO need unlimited calls and texts, and that alone is expensive.

3) You're practically EXPECTED to have credit card debt that you're paying off. My credit is horrible only because I don't have ENOUGH of a credit history. (I've bought three cars (Traded one in for the second; totalled the second and bought a third - All financed), have had student loans on my record for six years.) How much debt do I need to be in and how many payments do I need to make to prove I'm a reliable credit holder? How long do I have to stay current on my loans to not have shit credit, because while I've missed a payment or two, I should NOT be as low as I am just because I don't have a credit card.

In other words: You're spewing shit and hoping it sticks, but none of it is even remotely true.

You asked an anecdotal question and got a similar answer. Did you expect anything less? I mean, when you asked what craft someone should learn I nearly just said underwater basket weaving and left it at that.

Sounds like you should file for bankruptcy. It only takes a couple of years to turn your credit around after that. I won't deny that student loans are a nightmare for many graduates. However, high speed internet is absolutely not required for many good paying jobs. I don't know where you get that from. If you're working minimum wage job right now, do you need a smart phone with all the extras right now? No, you do not. You can get a data plan from a local store with unlimited calls and text for around $50/mo. Anything else is just extra expenses brought on by financial negligence. If someone was to live in a minimum status reflecting the wages they earned they'd actually be able to afford to move into something more. Nobody can get ahead if their wages to match their standards of living. I'm not disagreeing that something needs to be done with minimum wage geographically, but there are so many people out there with an insane amount of expenses that they shouldn't have.

If or when that time comes for someone to get a job where they need high speed internet or a new unlimited phone, they should go get it. Not before. I see the issue with minimum wage, but I also see the issue with people not knowing how to budget themselves based on what they make. Its finding that balance of compromise to compliment both.

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You are suggesting individual solutions to wide scale social problems. If every individual could do as you suggested and succeed they would fact is they dont for a myriad of reasons least of which is lazyness. Billionaire hedge fund managers do.not work harder than short order cooks and yet...

Never once did I say laziness. Not at all. I gave 3 examples in a response to needing capital to do something. Simple as that. Nobody can go to each individual making minimum wage and ask them what they would rather be doing, then write up a plan for everyone. That's impossible. But as I said before, there is an issue with minimum wage, as there is an issue with financial responsibility. Also, there's a hell of a lot more responsibility in managing a hedge fund than a cook at a restaurant. You can't even compare the two.

[Glorious Leader]

'Learn a craft' doesn't fix that.

It doesnt fix anything. This is an individual solution that is bring to propossed as a distraction from macroeconomic scale concerns. INDIVIDUALS ACTING AS SINGLE AGENTS CANNOT FIX SOCIAL ILLS. Even in principle the idea is fucking stupid. Lets say everyone took his advice tmmrw. That really only means that particular labor market will be flooded and the wages paid reduced to the min wage assuming one could find work. Back to minimum wage!

PROPOSING INDIVIDUAL SOLUTIONS TO CORRECT SOCIAL ILLS IS FUCKING STUPID.

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Also, there's a hell of a lot more responsibility in managing a hedge fund than a cook at a restaurant. You can't even compare the two.

Youre right. The cook feeds people. Something we can or should agree is a social good.

The billionaire hedge fund manager contributes far less than this and in fact takes much more. He drains intellectual capital people who could be curing cancer or building rockets but dont because the billionaire hedge fund manager will pay them handsomly to develop hyper trading algorithims and various derivative schemes to skim more money while actually producing nothing of value. At the same time his enormous wealth is brought to capture the political process in his favor so he contributes the least amount he can and has the least legal responsibility he can.

The cook feeds people.

[AlphaOut]

Right... Let me just throw my credit FURTHER down the shitter. That'll DEFINITELY fix things.

If you don't see your credit repaired in 2 years (which 2 years goes by fast) then the best option is to bankrupt. You'd have almost no debt, and in a couple years youd have practically a fresh start.

That's $50 a month you can't spend on rent, from a job that already doesn't make you enough to pay for rent.

$50 vs. the $90+ people pay for plans. Not a bad deal. Its not money spent, its money saved. Hell, I make a good wage now, and I only upgrade my phone when the one I have breaks. I went from like a Samsung S3 to a S7. lol

And that has nothing to do with the fact that there are people who are working 80 hour weeks that can barely afford what they need. No minimum wage position allows you to pay rent right now, even full time. Even two full time minimum wage positions doesn't get you there.

That's very geographic. I don't know how people make it in California on minimum wage. I feel for them. I moved out of Seattle when I was younger because the minimum wage versus cost of living didn't make sense. At that time, I was making minimum wage.

With what money?

Either their first paycheck OR the money they put away by NOT having those luxuries.

That 'balance' you keep talking about only exists for people who aren't already in the shitter.

Our economy punishes people who are in bad spots and rewards those who are in good spots.

Once you fall, getting back up is damned near impossible. 'Learn a craft' doesn't fix that.

I brought up a craft as just one thing someone could do. Again, a slight example. There are a number of affordable certificates, or even union jobs to do to be above minimum wage; or while even looking to pursue whatever your degree is in. The point is there are a number of avenues for people that take that takes either a small investment or just the right motivation to hunt for something that pay higher. My friend was unemployed 4 years ago and in a shit place in his life. He works for UPS now; making 80-100k/yr. No degree. No certs. Just a job application. That's just one union job of many that are nearly always hiring. Like I said, I agree that there is an issue with minimum wage to some extent. That isn't an argument for me. But saying that there isn't an issue with financial responsibility with many unskilled workers is where I have a disagreement.

How much more responsibility?

Well, when you're in charge of maintaining complex portfolios for investors whose money isn't yours, I'd say you have a lot to lose. While tomorrow I could go apply to work in a kitchen (which I did during school) and basically have it down in a couple of days. Also, I could google pretty much any recipe out there and be decently successful at it on my first try. While I maintain my own financial portfolio, it gets overwhelming at times, and I have to target each investment daily and read their news and future plans of that company I'm invested in. Now do that for several companies investments and try to have a 80% success rate on their investments. It isn't easy. Overpaid? Sure. Assholes? Generally. But not comparable.

[Goatfish]

I am having serious doubts about your MENSA 140 IQ if you are suggesting that a shortage of doctors is less impacting on society than a shortage of housekeeping....

Shortage of doctors = people start dying of more simple causes. Not everyone can practice. Long term loss potential.
Shortage of Housekeeping = This is non-skilled labor. Anyone can do it.

Im sorry, you've been on the whole non skilled labor train this entire thread, but you are not going to convince many why you a meat butcher should make the same as an Engineer / Doctor / Scientist / etc.

Firstly, I have nothing to prove to you, what you choose to believe is your own business. If it makes you feel better to think I'm lying to you about my IQ, feel free. Also remember I have no reason to lie, everything I have stated backs itself up.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/health/ar...NHS-wards.html
http://www.huffingtonpost.ca/2012/03...n_1374196.html
http://natmonitor.com/2015/08/11/ala...ly-infections/
http://www.cbc.ca/news/health/poor-h...blem-1.1206155

Do you want more? Honestly you can just look it up yourself and see that housekeeping, especially in a hospital atmosphere where the average wage is $8-$10 per hour is actually highly important. That doctor treating you is worthless if you go in for a cold and pick up C-diff or MRSA. If you want the best example of such, do a little research on the "Black Death". The biggest reason it spread was not the initial cause. The uncleanliness of hospitals and improper sanitation was the biggest reason it became a problem.

I am not ignorant by any means, all parts of life are important. We have all these jobs for a reason. I refuse to say the doctor who recognizes and treats an illness is worth more than the housekeeper who prevents illness from spreading... Or the scientist who figures out what it is in the first place. All of these things are necessities. What I don't understand is why we forget about the housekeeper scrubbing floors, walls, ceilings all day to make sure people don't get sick by coming to a building to get better. Why do we pay them so little that they can barely afford to live? Just because anyone can do it? Can anyone do it properly? Is just anyone willing to go to work for 10 hours a day just to break their back cleaning 5 days a week?

As for my personal profession, I never stated I should make as much as a doctor. I actually specifically said that people who put in that effort of learning should make more money. I also believe that it should NOT only apply to your ability to afford and sit in a classroom. For me personally, I don't do well around lots of people. I could have gotten free or almost free rides to college, but I don't do well in a classroom environment and honestly had no idea what I wanted to go for. Instead, I spent a good time finding what I enjoyed, and ended up spending 6 years in different meat shops learning different styles, how to grade product, ordering, sanitation, and just practicing doing my work. I would hope people appreciate that I know how to do my job and perform it well enough that I prevent spreads of E-Coli, Shigella, Salmonella, Hepatitus, Noro Virus...

I'd love to see anyone claiming how easy my job is to be given a side of beef and break it down into cuts with minimal waste and do it in any timely manner. Hell, I'd give you a month free from distraction to try and learn/practice it as well, I enjoy watching big talkers fail. In my personal situation, I get payed shit for the job I do. An actual processing plant would pay me over double what I am making as a retail butcher based on my experience and skill doing it. I can't fix that issue by leaving my job due to personal circumstances, and regardless of the ridiculous profit margins I create, my work couldn't me arsed to pay me what I deserve because there isn't another close place I could go and make any more based off reasons I stated earlier (retail monopoly retarding wages in an effort to boost their numbers minuscule amounts).

The TLDR: Many jobs are overlooked until it becomes a real issue. You can believe that people who clean for a living are worth nothing, until they aren't there. You can pretend otherwise up until there is another Memphis Sanitation Strike and your city looks like the attached image. (which is actual imagery: http://untappedcities.com/2015/02/11...trike-of-1968/ )

[Zython]

How high would it need to be for every CEO to simultaneously die of aneurysms?

[Spectral]

Youre right. The cook feeds people. Something we can or should agree is a social good.

The billionaire hedge fund manager contributes far less than this and in fact takes much more. He drains intellectual capital people who could be curing cancer or building rockets but dont because the billionaire hedge fund manager will pay them handsomly to develop hyper trading algorithims and various derivative schemes to skim more money while actually producing nothing of value. At the same time his enormous wealth is brought to capture the political process in his favor so he contributes the least amount he can and has the least legal responsibility he can.

The cook feeds people.

Also worth a mention is that the cook that fucks up will have their fuckup immediately noticed and punished. Hedge fund manager? Ha.

[Tehshocka]

Firstly, I have nothing to prove to you, what you choose to believe is your own business. If it makes you feel better to think I'm lying to you about my IQ, feel free. Also remember I have no reason to lie, everything I have stated backs itself up.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/health/ar...NHS-wards.html
http://www.huffingtonpost.ca/2012/03...n_1374196.html
http://natmonitor.com/2015/08/11/ala...ly-infections/
http://www.cbc.ca/news/health/poor-h...blem-1.1206155

Do you want more? Honestly you can just look it up yourself and see that housekeeping, especially in a hospital atmosphere where the average wage is $8-$10 per hour is actually highly important. That doctor treating you is worthless if you go in for a cold and pick up C-diff or MRSA. If you want the best example of such, do a little research on the "Black Death". The biggest reason it spread was not the initial cause. The uncleanliness of hospitals and improper sanitation was the biggest reason it became a problem.

I am not ignorant by any means, all parts of life are important. We have all these jobs for a reason. I refuse to say the doctor who recognizes and treats an illness is worth more than the housekeeper who prevents illness from spreading... Or the scientist who figures out what it is in the first place. All of these things are necessities. What I don't understand is why we forget about the housekeeper scrubbing floors, walls, ceilings all day to make sure people don't get sick by coming to a building to get better. Why do we pay them so little that they can barely afford to live? Just because anyone can do it? Can anyone do it properly? Is just anyone willing to go to work for 10 hours a day just to break their back cleaning 5 days a week?

As for my personal profession, I never stated I should make as much as a doctor. I actually specifically said that people who put in that effort of learning should make more money. I also believe that it should NOT only apply to your ability to afford and sit in a classroom. For me personally, I don't do well around lots of people. I could have gotten free or almost free rides to college, but I don't do well in a classroom environment and honestly had no idea what I wanted to go for. Instead, I spent a good time finding what I enjoyed, and ended up spending 6 years in different meat shops learning different styles, how to grade product, ordering, sanitation, and just practicing doing my work. I would hope people appreciate that I know how to do my job and perform it well enough that I prevent spreads of E-Coli, Shigella, Salmonella, Hepatitus, Noro Virus...

I'd love to see anyone claiming how easy my job is to be given a side of beef and break it down into cuts with minimal waste and do it in any timely manner. Hell, I'd give you a month free from distraction to try and learn/practice it as well, I enjoy watching big talkers fail. In my personal situation, I get payed shit for the job I do. An actual processing plant would pay me over double what I am making as a retail butcher based on my experience and skill doing it. I can't fix that issue by leaving my job due to personal circumstances, and regardless of the ridiculous profit margins I create, my work couldn't me arsed to pay me what I deserve because there isn't another close place I could go and make any more based off reasons I stated earlier (retail monopoly retarding wages in an effort to boost their numbers minuscule amounts).

The TLDR: Many jobs are overlooked until it becomes a real issue. You can believe that people who clean for a living are worth nothing, until they aren't there. You can pretend otherwise up until there is another Memphis Sanitation Strike and your city looks like the attached image. (which is actual imagery: http://untappedcities.com/2015/02/11...trike-of-1968/ )

Okay cool. Three of the four articles you linked are tied directly to the Canadian Health Care system which is nothing comparable to the US system.

Secondly, I would like to ask you a straight up question. If civil unrest occurred worldwide and you had to pick 4 people with certain skill sets from a pool of 10. Which would you pick? Here are your choices:

Engineer
Doctor
Lawyer
House Keeper
Retail Employee
Scientist
Military
Teacher
Butcher
Economist