Guild recruiters, please never do this.

[cocacolawheresthesoda]

Edit: Seems some people didn't understand. The problem is that this is on the application page, as a hidden thing, that is basically just LUCK if you see it. If you want people to confirm they read the rules, put it on the rules page, in the middle and then ask them there to put it randomly on the app, so you know they read rules. This is just randomness you're asking for and is simply idiotical.

I applied to a guild, as with every guild, I go through their roster, their rules and generally to see what kind of circlejerk is going on (because there's always one).


So I decide to hop in and have a chat with the officers. All good and I talk to them exactly about their rules, which I had by my left.

Writing my application and hit submit. Silence after 2 weeks, ofcourse it was a no, but felt like I needed to ask.

The answer is, apparently I missed a "hidden text" that says "Remove to show you read rules".

I know, starting out good. Here's how it look looks: http://prntscr.com/f7jqa5

The text is innoculous and is right next to a captcha and looks totally different from forms, without any form of "hey, I'm here", therefore, as someone that works in tech and had even contributed to some versions of captcha, I say, after seeing it "what? am I to be punished 'cause of retarded design? there's a 50/50 chance you'd see it for me."

Let's assume that for most people, it's visible, even so...

They were trying to be smart, witty, they think of themselves as intelligent when they do this, this method yields and shows absolutely nothing.

Apple, Google & other companies have used this way in the past and realized how simply idiotical these are.

Please, if you're a fucking casual guild, don't make people fill long forms (1) and don't put any (2) unecessary obstacles. All you really care about is numbers. I understand the need to yaddy-yadda about personality and stuff, but it's just "this guy doesn't seem like an asshole, let's probably accept him into our inner circlejerk, since we're still animals bound by antique traits that we no longer need".

If you really DO care about people reading rules, which you shouldn't, unless you're a very top high-end guild is add a keyword and ask people on the same page to add it to their application somewhere, it's the only way to make sure rules were read, which by the way, for most guilds, they're obnoxious, stupidly long and all the same.

They'd lost a 9/10 + 10/10M player that not only he was helpful towards everyone and always showed up, but engaged in tactics and was well-rounded.

Ofcourse I went to obliterate the officers' asses. Imagine how they are on Discord, jerking each other off to the thought of how sweet that system is.

It hit personally, because I had someone that should've recruited for me do this EXACT thing, in a company, he got fired under the spot, that same second I found out. This is extremely stupid and it made me rage to the sky and back, because it comes from a desire to be acknowledged, which shows a rotten personality.

The "Aha, see, I got you? " line.

All in all, I'm so happy I didn't get accepted and would I have seen it back then, the site and the guild would've been blocked.

Look, I understand most people will disagree with me and see this as a good idea, but please, for the love of all that's good, these things show nothing and experienced interviewers, when they want to see certain traits in someone, they employ methologies that have certain hit-points, not just a global one, don't miss on people that are actually good.

[Relapses]

I've been in guilds who did shit like this.

Simply put, it's a retard check. Usually if an application was decent and they failed the retard check, we'd give them a try anyway. But if they failed the retard check and they're a shitty-to-mediocre app, we would simply never respond to them and when they eventually wondered why, we'd refer them to the retard check they failed.

I'm not saying that's what happened in your case, but it gave us an easy "out" when we got an app that was merely "okay."

¯\_(ツ)_/¯

[Deleted]

Not sure if serious or not.
If it is, go get some professional help. You clearly need it.

[Yamuri]

They wanted to see if you read the rules, that was right after them so it shows you didn't. If you want to join a guild that even has applications then you should read it all clearly and make sure you understand it. There's a reason they have an application even if it's casual.

[Deleted]

It's pretty standard for guilds to have this kind of thing, we have a line that says "Don't forget to tell us that you haven't read the rules so that way we know you have".

So when the standard "i've read the rules" comes in, we know he hasn't.

Also, people should read the rules, it's pretty important considering every guild is different.

[cocacolawheresthesoda]

They wanted to see if you read the rules, that was right after them so it shows you didn't. If you want to join a guild that even has applications then you should read it all clearly and make sure you understand it. There's a reason they have an application even if it's casual.

I don't think you understood what happened here.

It was on the APPLICATION page, not the rules page. The rules only contained the rules, without any mention of this. The proper way is to add a random line somewhere deep in the rules, then ask them to put it on the application page, somewhere, as a keyword.

This is not methodology they had there. That is luck of seeing things.

Please don't do this with your guild, it's absolutely stupid.

[StationaryHawk]

Please, if you're a fucking casual guild, don't make people fill long forms (1) and don't put any (2) unecessary obstacles. All you really care about is numbers. I understand the need to yaddy-yadda about personality and stuff, but it's just "this guy doesn't seem like an asshole, let's probably accept him into our inner circlejerk, since we're still animals bound by antique traits that we no longer need".

I'm not sure what this is trying to imply. That social skills are an "antique trait" made obsolete by a damage meter?

It's meant to check whether the applicant read through each step of the application, and you failed.

This is not methodology they had there. That is luck of seeing things.

Please don't do this with your guild, it's absolutely stupid.

It's not luck.

[Murderdoll]

Personally when I see silly questions at the end like "Do you like Ice Cream?" I search for one of those stupid questions.

Ill be honest, sometimes those captcha type things simply get blocked by my script filter so I loathe guilds who use them as a filter.

Its annoying and in a time where guilds are desperate for good recruits theyre kinda cutting their noses off to spite their face by simply saying you didnt find the retard check and saying no.

After doing the guild hunt myself recently Ive come to realise that so many guilds out there that complain about no recruits have noone but themselves to blame.

Guilds who add you to realid and never talk, or expect you to fish for information about the guild, never give feedback etc.

[Yunaqt]

Wait what? guilds actually do this? I couldn't believe this is even a real thing.

The retard check is what reading warcraftlogs does.

[Jokerfiend]

I'm not sure what this is trying to imply. That social skills are an "antique trait" made obsolete by a damage meter?

It's meant to check whether the applicant read through each step of the application, and you failed.

It's not luck.

It might not be luck, but it's absolutely stupid.

Do you read your ToSes? I highly doubt it, and this is no different.

[cocacolawheresthesoda]

I am just shocked and I mean shocked by the responses of some people.

Look, in this world, people never change their opinions, that requires a very high intellect and self-conciousness, but understand, you are completely wrong, to cite neuroscience on how trick questions are actually and how they're meant to work and what their purpose is...that'll make me seem like a douchebag. It's a god-damn game, after all, it's baffling to me that guilds do this.


My goal here is not to get likes, that's a given most people won't agree with this, since they think it's a cool thing, but to actually make atleast some people aware of how this defeats their chances to get recruits, good ones sometimes.

Please, regardless of what you think, if your guild is doing this, understand that it's the absolute worst possible way to test a person's capability to read rules. Again, put a message in the rules, ask them to talk about it when they make the app.

Wow.

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It might not be luck, but it's absolutely stupid.

Do you read your ToSes? I highly doubt it, and this is no different.

Completely different, an application is something you interact with, out of your own interest and dedication, someone solid should read the guild's rules, which I did, but due to actually understanding basic design flow, my lizard brain skipped it, with no visual cues. I guess I'm sorry my knowledge is too broad.

[Deleted]

Not a big fan of this myself, one of the first things I did was stripped our application process down to about 4 boxes (What do you want us to know about yourself, character name/s, got any logs, check the raid nights you can make). The reason why I'm not a fan of making it longer/awkward is because it sorts by the people who can just write applications well compared to those who can't, or won't since its WoW. That in itself has no bearing on how they'd fit into a raid team.

If someone isn't in the territory where I know they're going to walk into, or dramatically improve our raid team, I'm just honest - point out the spot they're trying to get is competitive. Take a look at our logs, if you really back yourself then we're happy to give it a go, performances will decide the rest.

[munkeyinorbit]

...They'd lost a 9/10 + 10/10M player ...

No you are not. You cannot even pass a simple retard check and you get angry over little things. I would pass on you in my LFR group. Who needs some bad that flies off the handle when the realise that THEY fucked up. I am glad that the guild who "did this to you" avoided the train wreck that you would inevitably be. Wow "...I wanted to see what kind of a circle jerk...". Just wow.

[Deleted]

Yep, nothing wrong with the player base from reading this thread.

If you want to see what a player is made off take him on a test run, can't do that don't bother recruiting.

Rules should be don't cause trouble.

[cocacolawheresthesoda]

No you are not. You cannot even pass a simple retard check and you get angry over little things. I would pass on you in my LFR group. Who needs some bad that flies off the handle when the realise that THEY fucked up. I am glad that the guild who "did this to you" avoided the train wreck that you would inevitably be. Wow "...I wanted to see what kind of a circle jerk...". Just wow.

Well, uhm, good luck to you.

[munkeyinorbit]

Yep, nothing wrong with the player base from reading this thread.

If you want to see what a player is made off take him on a test run, can't do that don't bother recruiting.

why reward retards who don't deserve to be there in the first place? If you want to see if a player is a team player, see if they read the rules.

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Well, uhm, good luck to you.

why do I need the good luck? I didn't fuck up a simple retard check. It is you who need all the luck that they can get.
The first thing you need to do is accept that you are not a good player. A good player would not have missed a simple details.
The second thing you need to do is adjust your attitude. People do not like dicks. Stop being one and then people might actually like you.
The third thing you need to do is relax. If you are losing your shit all the time, how are you suppose to perform to the standard that is required of you.
The fourth thing is learn to take criticism. This thread is proof that you lack that ability.

[Spacewalrus2010]

why reward retards who don't deserve to be there in the first place? If you want to see if a player is a team player, see if they read the rules.

How the fuck does a random textbox with text saying "delete me" essentially in the application portion (not the rules list) prove you read the rules....

[cocacolawheresthesoda]

Not a big fan of this myself, one of the first things I did was stripped our application process down to about 4 boxes (What do you want us to know about yourself, character name/s, got any logs, check the raid nights you can make). The reason why I'm not a fan of making it longer/awkward is because it sorts by the people who can just write applications well compared to those who can't, or won't since its WoW. That in itself has no bearing on how they'd fit into a raid team.

If someone isn't in the territory where I know they're going to walk into, or dramatically improve our raid team, I'm just honest - point out the spot they're trying to get is competitive. Take a look at our logs, if you really back yourself then we're happy to give it a go, performances will decide the rest.

Thank you.

Please know that I did this with my company aswell and all the companies that care about their time do so. After doing this, we started receiving more CVs, from far better candidates. Our form used to be long, with things about yourself and it would be time consuming. We shifted towards a lean format, where we just ask one personal question and the CV / qualifications.

Not to say WoW is like a company, but certainly there's many similarities with a guild and the recruitment process.

I assume you just have an initial, short application, this incentivizing more people to apply and, should the numbers be good and his progress overall the same, you'd invite them to an interview.

If not, still, a shorter application is a very, very good start (besides progress) to getting more people inside the guild.

I admire your decision and know that it's an universal optimization what you did there.

Good luck!

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why reward retards who don't deserve to be there in the first place? If you want to see if a player is a team player, see if they read the rules.

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why do I need the good luck? I didn't fuck up a simple retard check. It is you who need all the luck that they can get.
The first thing you need to do is accept that you are not a good player. A good player would not have missed a simple details.
The second thing you need to do is adjust your attitude. People do not like dicks. Stop being one and then people might actually like you.
The third thing you need to do is relax. If you are losing your shit all the time, how are you suppose to perform to the standard that is required of you.
The fourth thing is learn to take criticism. This thread is proof that you lack that ability.

Blocked. Please do pm / give me any of your sub-accounts to block them aswell.

[Spacewalrus2010]

Even with the screenshot describing how it was "hidden" is lost on me.

Delete some random text above a captcha prompt doesn't prove you "read the rules" which defeats the purpose of said text. If that's what you disapprove of, I follow you but I don't think that's what you're saying? Either way it's a retarded way to see if you checked the rules.


But as far as it being "hidden" I don't follow. Are you suggesting that, because applications typically use text boxes to fill an answer with, the applicant will scroll over it due to it being already filled sort of deal? I.E. the design of the page doesn't hint there needs to be done something different to this specific textbox?

[munkeyinorbit]

Thank you.

Please know that I did this with my company aswell and all the companies that care about their time do so. After doing this, we started receiving more CVs, from far better candidates. Our form used to be long, with things about yourself and it would be time consuming. We shifted towards a lean format, where we just ask one personal question and the CV / qualifications.

Not to say WoW is like a company, but certainly there's many similarities with a guild and the recruitment process.

I assume you just have an initial, short application, this incentivizing more people to apply and, should the numbers be good and his progress overall the same, you'd invite them to an interview.

If not, still, a shorter application is a very, very good start (besides progress) to getting more people inside the guild.

I admire your decision and know that it's an universal optimization what you did there.

Good luck!

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Blocked. Please do pm / give me any of your sub-accounts to block them aswell.

Proved my point for me. How are you even going to get anywhere in life if all you do is rant about how it is other people's fault that you fucked up and then you do nothing to try and to rectify the situation. Maybe it is all the best that you are too slow to be able to pass a retard check because in the end all that would have happened is that you would have gotten kicked on the guild for having a terrible attitude.