Jedi, Sith or Grey Code?

[mickybrighteyes]

"Grey Jedi" are non-canon... just typical EU bullshit.
Both the Sith and the Jedi are in the wrong, and they constantly break their own 'code'.

Actually it is cannon for there to be force users that don't fall into the category of sith or jedi and adhere to a middle ground. There isn't any organized straight middle ground of such force users working together though... cause then they'd just be the uber force of the known galaxy propelling existence into a stupidly awesome level of awareness/etc.

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Yes everything but the three trilogies and the Clone Wars/Rebels TV shows is non-canon.

So Darth Bane isn't canon but his rule is...

[Milchshake]

I had no idea people with really high IQs spent so much of their free time debating the moral codes of space wizards.

Poll needs an option; "George Lucas can't write dialog or space wizard morals".

[Dug]

Sith because red light sabers are sick

[Belize]

"Grey Jedi" are non-canon... just typical EU bullshit.
Both the Sith and the Jedi are in the wrong, and they constantly break their own 'code'.

EU is Canon.

[oplawlz]

Sith - what's the point of all that power if I can't use it to get what I want?

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EU is Canon.

None of the old stuff is since disney bought the franchise.

[Orange Joe]

Actually it is cannon for there to be force users that don't fall into the category of sith or jedi and adhere to a middle ground. There isn't any organized straight middle ground of such force users working together though... cause then they'd just be the uber force of the known galaxy propelling existence into a stupidly awesome level of awareness/etc.

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So Darth Bane isn't canon but his rule is...

Darth bane is canon?

http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/Rule_of_Two

[smackyslap]

AS far as the current cannon goes anything that happened after return of the Jedi that was expanded upon in the EU is defiantly none cannon Anything before A phantom menace you can still considered cannon until contradicted later by the current cannon so reven and co can still be considered cannon until well proven otherwise. Reven was also supposed to have a small plot in the clone wars series before Disney shut that down so take that how ever you want.

Darth bane is infarct cannon due to him being mentioned in the clone wars witch Disney did say was cannon and well yeah Asoka and Rex and co is there still.

But for the current question jedi sith or grey I dunno maybe grey like to do my own thing don't like following codes and yeah they both deal in absolutes so that is not good.

EDIT: Forgot to mention that the mandalorian wars was talked about in Star wars rebels witch is cannon and yeah reven and a lot of the old republic stuff was kind of a bih part of that.

[Triggered Fridgekin]

Darth bane is canon?

http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/Rule_of_Two

The problem is is that if Darth Bane is canon then Disney would have to essentially re-write his entire story or consider it and all involved a part of the official story. Without assistance from the holocron of darth revan he wouldn't have been able to institute his own order and create the rule of two.

Since revan isn't canon then that's kind of really muddy but it seems as though there's a scene in Clone Wars which has a mural of the Mandalorian Wars so maybe he is. Who the hell really knows I guess.

[Heladys]

No such thing as grey. Stop trying to make 'fetch' happen, Gretchen.

[xezar]

Even though irl I'm basically a goody two shoes, I do think the Sith philosophy has some merit over the Jedi code. Must be the inner evil self.

[Endus]

I'm going to ignore the Grey, because it's apocryphal and non-canon, and just a little silly.

The Sith code is open to, and really, invites abuse. But it's the more honest of the two. It isn't a moral code, it's speaking to a fundamental truth, and in that, it's perfectly fine.

The Jedi code, on the other hand, is both ridiculously naive and also a deliberate lie. It preaches peace and serenity, while training its members to commit deliberate genocide in the furtherance of their beliefs. The whole "there are two Sith, Master and Apprentice" bit? That's been true for a thousand years by the time of the films, and it's only true because the Jedi mercilessly slaughter anyone who claims to be Sith, forcing Sith to operate in secret, never trusting anyone. And not "arrested and put on trial". They see a Sith, and it's straight to "murder that guy/gal/slug in the face" mode. Worse, and they don't really get into this in the films, but in the old EU, it was made VERY clear that "Grey" force-users were few and far between, largely because, to the Jedi, anyone who wasn't Jedi and used the Force, was Sith. Unless you were strong enough to resist them with force, and flew enough under the radar they could ignore you.

And the Jedi practices were downright evil. And this is totally canon; look at the way Anakin is treated. They almost didn't take him for training, because he had "too much anger in him". Because the Jedi were taking children away from their parents, and raising them to be emotionless. Not in CONTROL of their emotions, to not feel them AT ALL. And if you think they'd have just let a stupidly powerful 9-year old too-angry-for-the-Jedi walk away, you're not paying attention to the films; they'd have killed him. Later, when Anakin falls in love, he has to hide it. Because, to the Jedi, love is as evil as hate. They're equally bad, to the Jedi. That attitude is the only thing that drove Anakin to the Dark Side. Palpatine took advantage of this, but the only reason Anakin was vulnerable to that seduction was the Jedi's abuse of his trust and support.

I love most of Star Wars, but the one thing I find truly galling is that the Jedi are treated as "good guys", when the reality is that they're a secretive order of murderous monks who are above all interstellar law, and have frightening magic powers including mind control which they freely use to get their way. They encourage blind allegiance to the Jedi Council rather than encouraging independent thought or informed debate. These are not "good guys". It's easy to overlook in Eps 4-6, because the only Jedi you see are old Ben Kenobi and Yoda, and both are just generic "wise old dudes" who don't pass on a lot of moralizing. But the Jedi of the prequels are frightening, and if we didn't know that Future Palpatine was even worse, those early episodes would be seen in a much different light, IMO.

It's why I'm really hopeful that Ep 8's tagline "the Last Jedi" is so titled because Luke is going to tell Rey "No, those beliefs killed my entire family, it's an invitation to a war that never ends. The only way to win is not to take sides. How about I teach you how to use the Force, and how to be a good person, instead?"

[Orange Joe]

The problem is is that if Darth Bane is canon then Disney would have to essentially re-write his entire story or consider it and all involved a part of the official story. Without assistance from the holocron of darth revan he wouldn't have been able to institute his own order and create the rule of two.

Since revan isn't canon then that's kind of really muddy but it seems as though there's a scene in Clone Wars which has a mural of the Mandalorian Wars so maybe he is. Who the hell really knows I guess.

You can check the link I posted. HE was in the clone wars animation in a flash back to Yoda.

This Darth Bane has no back story except for the creation of the rule of two atm.


Raven may very well become canon too, just have a bit of a different story. Disney said they weren't throwing out EU lore completely.

[Triggered Fridgekin]

You can check the link I posted. HE was in the clone wars animation in a flash back to Yoda.

This Darth Bane has no back story except for the creation of the rule of two atm.


Raven may very well become canon too, just have a bit of a different story. Disney said they weren't throwing out EU lore completely.

This is why they should have given the EU a thorough look rather than to sever it entirely. Most of it was awful but there was still a lot which fit well within the overall story. It seems as though they are bringing back elements of the EU though with the latest being Thrawn so hopefully they can reinstate the KotoR lore at some point. The story is just too damn good to throw away.

[Orange Joe]

This is why they should have given the EU a thorough look rather than to sever it entirely. Most of it was awful but there was still a lot which fit well within the overall story. It seems as though they are bringing back elements of the EU though with the latest being Thrawn so hopefully they can reinstate the KotoR lore at some point. The story is just too damn good to throw away.

? That is exactly what they are doing. They are just taking their time deciding which parts they want to keep.

[Endus]

This is why they should have given the EU a thorough look rather than to sever it entirely. Most of it was awful but there was still a lot which fit well within the overall story. It seems as though they are bringing back elements of the EU though with the latest being Thrawn so hopefully they can reinstate the KotoR lore at some point. The story is just too damn good to throw away.

That's basically what they ARE doing, they're just not doing it proactively. They'll pull stuff from the EU whenever they need something that fits, but they aren't beholden to anything "bad" from the prior novels and games. They're free to rewrite whatever they like, and keep whatever they want to. So you'll probably see "good" stuff (like Thrawn) kept, and stuff that didn't hold up very well (most of the extended Skywalker family drama) will be rewritten from the ground up.

[Adam Jensen]

The Jedi are too strict with their doctrine. The Sith are too evil.

Me? I'd just want to be able to use my power to do the right thing, but not be so rigidly prohibited from enjoying life or bending rules to get things done.

[Perkunas]

"Grey Jedi" are non-canon... just typical EU bullshit.
Both the Sith and the Jedi are in the wrong, and they constantly break their own 'code'.

I totally hate Grey Jedi but I think that's what we're getting in episode 8 and I'm already rolling my eyes. It seems like The Last Jedi is a play on the new path.

[Triggered Fridgekin]

? That is exactly what they are doing. They are just taking their time deciding which parts they want to keep.

That's basically what they ARE doing, they're just not doing it proactively. They'll pull stuff from the EU whenever they need something that fits, but they aren't beholden to anything "bad" from the prior novels and games. They're free to rewrite whatever they like, and keep whatever they want to. So you'll probably see "good" stuff (like Thrawn) kept, and stuff that didn't hold up very well (most of the extended Skywalker family drama) will be rewritten from the ground up.

Ohhh okay. I'm not sure why I didn't put two and two together on that one. I guess the most I can hope for are the parts they do keep aren't altered for the sake of being altered.

[Radaney]

The Sith are mostly psychopathic maniacs but their 'code' is more feasible and human.

[Orange Joe]

Ohhh okay. I'm not sure why I didn't put two and two together on that one. I guess the most I can hope for are the parts they do keep aren't altered for the sake of being altered.

I don't know. I'm personally ok with the starting from scratch. I mean we get the chance to get a whole new star wars universe. If you're a fan of star wars how can that be bad.


I mean as far as EU goes. I still enjoy rereading many of the books. Just picked up the rogue squadron series on kindle about a month ago. Just because it isn't canon anymore doesn't mean I can't enjoy it still.