Netherlight Crucible

[fengosa]

Lol it's cute you think TF is a "win." Most casual players even hate it. Taliesin has an entire video on how much he thinks it's a fail.

What evidence do you have that most casual players hate it? Personal opinion and a video from some no name streamer don't count.

[klaps_05]

Can the relic with X trait roll as a bonus X trait again?

[Deleted]

Can the relic with X trait roll as a bonus X trait again?

No, at least to the degree I understand it can't roll the same trait. Their reasoning was along the lines of: we don't want you to endlessly re-roll to get the best trait.

[Deleted]

Lol it's cute you think TF is a "win." Most casual players even hate it. Taliesin has an entire video on how much he thinks it's a fail.

Hate it? Please give me a name of a "casual" player who was not excited to get 955 ilvl TF gear piece.
People don't hate it. People are jealous to other people who get those TF gear pieces in the same way some "casuals" are jealous of those "mythic raiders" for their better gear. That's it. People have to admit and they will feel better.

On topic - if most people remove their rng hate glasses, they will see its for the better. So far in this expansion i have DE 2 relics from my weekly chest of disappointment just because they have the most useless trait I can get. Now with this new addition I have 3(?) chances to get 2nd trait that will actually benefit me, instead of vendoring the relic.
But I agree on one thing said here so far - now the chance people to trade their relics in PuG content is close to 0%.
Other than that - its very good addition to the game that will help everybody in the long term

[gutnbrg]

what is this nether crucible all about? What do u do with it and where is it?

[Super Kami Dende]

Why so many people in the official forum are complaining about the RNG aspect of this ?

If anything it remove the bad luck with relic a little bit no ? Or am I missing something ?

You aren't missing anything, this community just loves to bitch and moan about every new thing released in WoW.

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Lol it's cute you think TF is a "win." Most casual players even hate it. Taliesin has an entire video on how much he thinks it's a fail.

I've hardly met anyone that hates TF. for the most part every casual I know enjoys the fact they can get a sweet piece of gear in less than apex content that they wouldn't be able to otherwise obtain.

[huth]

Lol it's cute you think TF is a "win." Most casual players even hate it. Taliesin has an entire video on how much he thinks it's a fail.

Just making videos discounts him as "casual player". Besides, this is just anecdotal evidence. You need more than two opinions.


That aside, most people have to get lucky just to get relics with good traits. This gives them an additional chance at one.

[Raone]

Its more RNG on top of an already RNG system that is only put in place so people play more to farm more relics. Right now all you needed was a good (doesn't even need to be the best) relic with a good trait. Now, that good relic can roll bad talents and second traits which means you need to farm/roll need on the same relic over and over again in the hopes it rolls a good second trait, and also that the second trait is connected to a good talent.

On my holy priest one of my relics happened to roll my best trait as one of the 3 secondary traits, however, it was connected to a damage proc talent which is completely worthless for healing (yes dps can get healing talents too) ... yet on the other of the tree there was a talent that made my heals sometimes proc a absorb shield which looks strong but it was connected to the leap of faith heals 5% health trait ... obviously I want these reversed so I would need to roll on the same relic over and over again till it rolls better.

It also over complicates the "is it an upgrade?" system, is a 920 relic with 2 good traits and a good talent better than a 950 relic with 2 bad traits and a bad talent? It honestly could be. Each trait and each talent is going to give a specific ilvl boost and you'll need outside sources to help you do the math to know which is an upgrade and which isn't ... which is one of the main reasons they got rid of reforging.

Also the only way to know what talents/second traits a relic has is to go to the Netherlight Crucible (aka leaving the raid) to "preview" it (which also soulbinds it so you can't trade it if it rolls a bad secondary trait/talent). Leaving the raid after getting an item is also another reason they got rid of reforging.

And lastly nobody will get relics for offspecs because people will keep rolling need on relics on the hopes for good rerolls.

[Deleted]

No, you have NEVER been playing a game this xpac if all you complain about is every grind that you choose to do to the extreme. YOU, you sorry excuse of a gamer, have CHOSEN to turn this entire xpac into a never ending chore and then you blame everyone but yourself for doing that.

WE, almost collectively, have been playing A GAME. something for enjoyment, relaxation and shiggles. YOU have turned it into your own version of hell that you whine about like a spoiled little bitch every single day

and remember, EVERY SINGLE grind in this xpac has been either purely optional (insta max your ap, rep, whatever else people create out of thin air) has been 100% OPTIONAL. every single one of them happens in time on their own by doing your own daily routine in game. anything over that has been of your own damn choice. so grow up and accept the consequences of your damn choice instead of whining like the little bitch you are about it

There are lots of ways to play this game, and being a flower collecting scrub is not the only way.

[Ribesal]

It's not an extra trait. The final point gives you the option (which you can ignore) to change the relic's trait to one of three other choices. In essence each relic has 4 possible traits, pick one

Are you sure on this?
It always looked like it is an additional trait, which matches their previous idea for 7.2 (or 7.2.5? whatever) to add a second random trait to the relics.
There was a question somewhere if it is possible to roll the same trait on it again. They said this isn't the case so you don't have to roll the relics again and again until you have the best trait a second time on the relic.

Maybe they changed it now. I hope they did, but i can't test it on PTR since my weapon hasn't enough traits.

[Deleted]

It's not an extra trait. The final point gives you the option (which you can ignore) to change the relic's trait to one of three other choices. In essence each relic has 4 possible traits, pick one

This is false, because this part of Lores Q&A on this topic wouldnt make any sense.

Q: What did you mean by "it can't double roll a trait"?

A: Just that you will never be able to upgrade a Relic to increase the same Artifact trait twice. If your Relic already has a bonus rank of Wrath of the Ashbringer on it, that trait will not be one of the three options presented in the bottom row of the Crucible's upgrade tree.

In other words, there's no risk of having your Wrath of the Ashbringer relic be "ruined" by not rolling a second bonus to Wrath of the Ashbringer, because that could never have happened in the first place. However, if you get a relic without Wrath of the Ashbringer, there's now a chance that it'll gain it from the Crucible.

Additionally, those three options will always be unique; it won't, for example, give you the "choice" between Deflection, Deflection, or Deflection. Aside from making sure you always have options, this means that your odds of having your favorite trait appear on a Relic you'd otherwise have discarded are actually pretty decent.

Its very confusing and Blizzard does a very poor job at explaining their new systems as usual, but for me it reads like Nethercrucible gives you the option for a 2nd trait.

[Inci]

Go cry elsewhere. Did anyone even ask for your opinion, did I miss something? There are lots of ways to play this game, and being a flower collecting scrub is not the only way.

What @Thorbalt said is 100% truth, I've cleared everything at its highest difficulty (5/9 tomb atm), I've never did any grind, apart from doing my weekly routine Emissaries/+15/Current raid.

and just to put this in comparison, a friend of mine who grinds all day for ap/legendaries/items, is only 3 traits and 2 legendary ahead of me.

Tl;dr: In my experience, You only need 15-18hours a week to stay relevent.

[klaps_05]

This is false, because this part of Lores Q&A on this topic wouldnt make any sense.



Its very confusing and Blizzard does a very poor job at explaining their new systems as usual, but for me it reads like Nethercrucible gives you the option for a 2nd trait.

Maybe I am reading this Q&A in a weird way, it seems he means, if you have X trait on the relic, the crucible will offer you always 3 others, so 3 choices. If it offers you the same X trait or 2 others, you have only 2 traits, because if you have X trait and you choose X trait, nothing changes, unless you can double down on X trait.

In the end I think it means you have X trait, you get a choice of A, B or C other traits(can never be X trait), and you get it as an additional trait, as they keep saying upgrade your relic.

So either we are adding 1 trait to each relic(which was scrapped, but maybe reborn) or you "reforge" the trait to a more useful one. If its the latter, this effectively makes each relic having 4 traits choices you can pick from(1 base and 3 options).

[huth]

Indeed, I may well be wrong. I wonder if anyone has 72+ traits so we could actually see how it works.

This means 6 trait points from relics, but no more than 3 ranks from any single trait.

Lore is pretty clear. You get one additional trait for each relic, and you always get a choice of 3 traits, none of which can be the original trait the relic has, and each of which is different from the other two options.

It's their replacement for the original 2 trait idea in 7.2 which they ended up scrapping and replacing with this less random system.

[Marrilaife]

Tl;dr: In my experience, You only need 15-18hours a week to stay relevent.

That's nearly as much as a part-time job, you sure you'd call this still "casual"?

Anyway OT, the problems are:
- harder to decide what is an upgrade in case of small ilvl / primary trait disparity, we're already way too deep into "sim it to check whether it's an upgrade" territory in the current game (most common answer to anyone's gear questions), it's cumbersome to "sim" everything especially mid raid before rolling on loot
- harder for people to get you trade relics or to get relics for offspecs because main spec players will hoard all of them "just in case they roll better traits in the crucible"
- harder to get your super BIS relic because there are 2 extra things that need to align (row 2 & 3 on the crucible), so then you'd have again "you can't get top parse for your class because you have worse gear than top players", personally doesn't concern me, I'm a tank anyway and don't give a squat about "top parses" but tons of dps players only play to do "big dick dps" and rank on logs
- can be a big disappointment if you roll your worst traits on the 3rd row, several specs have only a handful of good traits and tons of bad ones, many dps specs have 2 defensive traits but some have even more than that, ofc Blizz could nerf further "good traits" to bring them down in power as they did with howling blast for frost dk and kill command for bm hunters, but that doesn't fix the issue some traits are way too weak (not even counting the mandatory 2 defensive traits I mean beyond that)

[vertigo12]

I believe NLC 2-in-1 trait boosting is more for customized gameplay. Using different relic and a legendary synergy would be nice asssuming they allow the relics not to be destroyed and allowed to socket/resocket. Or Blizz allows a relearning of the trait affected much like relearning talents but using a reagent or having a retraining cost.

[Marrilaife]

I believe NLC 2-in-1 trait boosting is more for customized gameplay. Using different relic and a legendary synergy would be nice asssuming they allow the relics not to be destroyed and allowed to socket/resocket. Or Blizz allows a relearning of the trait affected much like relearning talents but using a reagent or having a retraining cost.

After you upgrade a relic, are the choices set in stone or you can go back and switch them around? I thought it was a perma irreversible upgrade until you decide to use a different relic, but I admit the whole crucible system is convoluted and hard to understand the small details. For example until I came to the forums I didn't know "previewing" the relic makes it soulbound and untradeable, it doesn't say it anywhere in the Blizzard's article.

[vertigo12]

After you upgrade a relic, are the choices set in stone or you can go back and switch them around? I thought it was a perma irreversible upgrade until you decide to use a different relic, but I admit the whole crucible system is convoluted and hard to understand the small details. For example until I came to the forums I didn't know "previewing" the relic makes it soulbound and untradeable, it doesn't say it anywhere in the Blizzard's article.

It is perma but who know at patch 7.3.5 or 7.4 they'll include an option which allows you to switch it around and choose different paths or tree.