View Poll Results: Will World of Warcraft subscribers go under 10 million this quarter or stay above?

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  • It will stay above 10 million.

    245 62.03%
  • It will go under 10 million.

    150 37.97%
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  1. #161
    Pandaren Monk Kezotar's Avatar
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    I just can't understand what this has to do with you guys? Would you like me to peak in into your families money condition? Talk world wide, they can't afford this or that?`Or that they're making less money know due to "x" reasons? It just seems silly tbh, I can't understand the reason to do that. Are you paying to play the game or are you paying so you can discuss wether the game is going be very sucsesful or not? I bet almost zero of these guys that posted here has any kind of buisness / marketing experience so what all you guys are talking about are bad speculations without any ground. This isn't even anything to argue over, this shouldn't be public information.
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  2. #162
    Quote Originally Posted by ZenX View Post
    <stuff>
    The part where you got it wrong is where you say "need". You don't need to max out your reps. In fact, you don't even need them at all.

    In BC, you actually had to do them just so you could get into Kara.
    Quote Originally Posted by bajskorv View Post
    No, you didn't need to max out your rep with factions and farm heroics to get into the raids in TBC.
    You pretty much had to. You simply couldn't enter the raids without the keys. It was a massive annoyance to all but the most advanced raid groups.

  3. #163
    Quote Originally Posted by Cybran View Post
    The dungeons in TBC were hard and rewarding loads of other things beyond Reputation. They gave epic gems and epic items. These dungeons were hard and designed to prepare players for raiding. If you read the forums you will see loads of people (including me) who suggest there is a daily cap for rep from dungeons or come form of currency dropped in instances that is used to buy commendation items like in Wrath that could be used once a day instead of dailies. We are asking for options, but we will not get them because no one would do dailies and they will have to admit dailies suck.

    Dungeons were a joke. They were boring and repetitive. They existed to gate the progression and create an illusion of "content". The reason dungeons today can't be used for the same reason as in TBC is because the player base is terrible. The 4.0 dungeons showed that queue content that can't be facerolled has no place in wow.
    Fixed that for you.

    They were only hard if it was your random player you've picked up from trade-chat that had only mapped his active two abilities to their keybinds.

    The dungeon model has changed, however, the reasons behind include all sorts of whiners who claimed that did not liked certain aspects of the game to the point that they were admitting in a closed-fashion that they did not actually like the game at all.

    Quote Originally Posted by huth View Post
    The part where you got it wrong is where you say "need". You don't need to max out your reps. In fact, you don't even need them at all.

    In BC, you actually had to do them just so you could get into Kara.


    You pretty much had to. You simply couldn't enter the raids without the keys. It was a massive annoyance to all but the most advanced raid groups.
    The "need" of back then is in line with the "need" of having to do the dailies now.

    Quote Originally Posted by papaz View Post
    I like WoW, but still I want the subs to take a big hit.

    Blizzard is best in the business but WoW being big all the time is not good for the market.

    WoW needs to take a big hit, Titan needs to be brought forward and Valve needs to make an MMO.

    That is for the best of all gamers out there.
    Yeah no. Just because a company has good games should bore the "need" to get them into an MMO market or another market that is hot.

    Look at what has happened with BioWare and SW: ToR. If you still don't get it, read up on Peter Principle.

  4. #164
    Brewmaster Banzhe's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Peso View Post
    The Mists of Pandaria launch brought subscribers up 900,000 to over 10 million again. Now's the time to state your predictions.
    Based on the amount of things to do now, I would be surprised if the few daily Q_Q'ers are enough to bring it below 10 million!

    Quote Originally Posted by ZenX View Post
    The dungeon model has changed, however, the reasons behind include all sorts of whiners who claimed that did not liked certain aspects of the game to the point that they were admitting in a closed-fashion that they did not actually like the game at all.

    The "need" of back then is in line with the "need" of having to do the dailies now.
    Bold statement that would normally require a source to back it up, but seeing as we're on mmo-champs.., I know opinions are often used as fact.
    Anything with a que-system PvE-wise needs to be designed to be completed by tumbleweeds since blizzard found it unrealistic that total strangers was mean't to talk approach etc on encounters, and given the massive amount of players not caring what they do in this game.., I'd have to say they're 100% right, it's just to bad they decide to even design content for those sort of players in the first place!

    Your last statement however I agree with, heroics back in the day wasn't hard either.., it only required your group to be able to play they're character, perfect example is that you could clear Shattered Halls easily with any setup, warriors often used as being the class it was impossible with, but with pulls backwards and using fear / hamstring etc it posed no issue ever.
    Last edited by Banzhe; 2012-11-08 at 12:35 PM.

  5. #165
    Quote Originally Posted by huth View Post
    In BC, you actually had to do them just so you could get into Kara.

    You pretty much had to. You simply couldn't enter the raids without the keys. It was a massive annoyance to all but the most advanced raid groups.
    You didn't need to max out rep to get into heroics and you didn't need to farm the heroics to do the key quests. It's simply false.

  6. #166
    Quote Originally Posted by ZenX View Post
    Prior to 2.1, you needed your own keys to access certain instances that progressed you into making other keys that you needed to enter higher difficulty of instances which were bound to reputation requirements -_-
    Going off-topic, but dailies still came up again.

    Do you realize that it was taking only some normal dungeons to run to get rep to revered for key? It was there just for safety measures, so people in party would be sure that everyone did dungeon on normal.

    How can you compare "TBC rep grind" (by doing dungeons!) with MoP daily grind, while it is 2 completely different activities (I won't even go in depth why they are different and what is so wrong with MoP dailies)? It's like saying: in Diablo II we were fighting demons, and in this hypothetical new racing simulator game we are to drive off demons from the road - this new racing game is based on Diablo II rules.

  7. #167
    The Lightbringer Kevyne-Shandris's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kezotar View Post
    I just can't understand what this has to do with you guys? Would you like me to peak in into your families money condition?
    Your family finances are private. Activision-Blizzard is a publicly traded corporation, and it's finances are available for all to view. It's due to people investing their private monies into it, and their right to know where and when it's spent to make sure it's not wasted.

    For gamers it's an interest to see if it's worth to invest their time+effort+money in an IP that will last. To play MoP many had to fork over a heck of a lot of money per account to play, unlike other MMOs (like EQ2) that have all-in-one expansions for one expansion price.

    It's called being...responsible...with your time+effort+money.
    From the #1 Cata review on Amazon.com: "Blizzard's greatest misstep was blaming players instead of admitting their mistakes. They've convinced half of the population that the other half are unskilled whiners, causing a permanent rift in the community."
    Blizzard's blame game in action: Deleting 6,100+ of Kevyne's posts and threads from the WoW forums.

  8. #168
    Quote Originally Posted by ZenX View Post
    Fixed that for you.

    They were only hard if it was your random player you've picked up from trade-chat that had only mapped his active two abilities to their keybinds.

    The dungeon model has changed, however, the reasons behind include all sorts of whiners who claimed that did not liked certain aspects of the game to the point that they were admitting in a closed-fashion that they did not actually like the game at all.

    No. There were 4 dungeon hubs in TBC and all of them were a real challenge on heroic. Your group could wipe at every give time. That was the time when the game gained the most subscribers and was considered as the most successful period of the game, even WotLK was weak since it was banned in china right until the last few months.

    The dungeon model changed, because of bad designers allowed bad players to get it their way.

  9. #169
    Quote Originally Posted by Ferocity View Post
    Going off-topic, but dailies still came up again.

    Do you realize that it was taking only some normal dungeons to run to get rep to revered for key? It was there just for safety measures, so people in party would be sure that everyone did dungeon on normal.

    How can you compare "TBC rep grind" (by doing dungeons!) with MoP daily grind, while it is 2 completely different activities (I won't even go in depth why they are different and what is so wrong with MoP dailies)? It's like saying: in Diablo II we were fighting demons, and in this hypothetical new racing simulator game we are to drive off demons from the road - this new racing game is based on Diablo II rules.
    A single run of Hellfire Ramparts, Blood Furnace and Shattered Halls rewarded you a total of ~2.8k rep on normal and even if you had done normal quests tied to Honor Hold/Thrallmar to make it to Honored, it did require you to complete this trio approximately four times to get to the revered. That is 12 dungeon runs you need to complete to access their HCs.

    Then you needed to repeat this for:
    Coilfang series (3 Dungeons)
    Auchiondun series (4 Dungeons)
    Keepers of Time series (3 Dungeons)
    Eye series (3 Dungeons)

    It was a grind so are the dailies that consume much much less time.

    The only difference is in those dungeons you needed a group to carry your weight as well while with dailies it is all you making it much more accesible.

    What I would want to see would be to tie both together as how LFD now removes the main hassle back then for doing those dungeons.

    You may dismiss the daily grind as being probably trivial, however, it is not the FoM for the difficulty of content, it is only the key portion of the end-game.

    ---------- Post added 2012-11-08 at 12:56 PM ----------

    Quote Originally Posted by Cybran View Post
    No. There were 5 dungeon hubs in TBC and all of them were a real challenge on heroic. Your group could wipe at every give time. That was the time when the game gained the most subscribers and was considered as the most successful period of the game, even WotLK was weak since it was banned in china right until the last few months.

    The dungeon model changed, because of bad designers allowed bad players to get it their way.
    Fixed that for you.

  10. #170
    Haven't heard that much complaining this expansion around compared to Cata.
    So I assume it will be roughly the same, slight drop perhaps but nothing noteworthy.

  11. #171
    Quote Originally Posted by Kevyne-Shandris View Post
    Your family finances are private. Activision-Blizzard is a publicly traded corporation, and it's finances are available for all to view. It's due to people investing their private monies into it, and their right to know where and when it's spent to make sure it's not wasted.

    For gamers it's an interest to see if it's worth to invest their time+effort+money in an IP that will last. To play MoP many had to fork over a heck of a lot of money per account to play, unlike other MMOs (like EQ2) that have all-in-one expansions for one expansion price.

    It's called being...responsible...with your time+effort+money.
    TBC and WotLK comes together with the Vanilla, with the only requirement of Cata and MoP to be bought afterwards separately. Furthermore, EQs supposed expansions are glorified content patches apporoximately the size 4.3 nothing more.

  12. #172
    The Lightbringer Seranthor's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cybran View Post
    They are dancing around the figures and refuse to accept that the real subscribers are going down.



    What a load of manure... The challenge mode scene is only about the FotM classes. Pet battles are an extreme waste of time.

    People here completely ignore the fact that the forums have been exploding with negative feedback about class balance, gating, grinds for raid gear, etc. These things have already driven people away and seeing how Blizzard just flat put lies about numbers and ignores questions is frustrating.
    Seems you think you know the answers... if you are going to BASH the numbers lets see you produce them to bash... if you are going to say you dont have then then tell us again why you are bashing something you dont know?

    ---------- Post added 2012-11-08 at 07:06 AM ----------

    Quote Originally Posted by Synstir View Post
    If the numbers where really great, it would have been communicated, like always (even decreasing numbers have been communicated up until now).
    What the reason is that it is kept a secret now, is beyond me. Even big losses have been published on the frontpage... so why not now?
    I don't know if it is because of the earlier announcement that subs went up to 10 million?
    No, not always, and just because you THINK you know, doesnt mean you DO know...

    --- Want any of my Constitutional rights?, ΜΟΛΩΝ ΛΑΒΕ
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  13. #173
    Quote Originally Posted by ZenX View Post
    The "need" of back then is in line with the "need" of having to do the dailies now.
    Not so. One was a hard requirement enforced by the game itself, the other is purely community enforced.

    Quote Originally Posted by bajskorv View Post
    You didn't need to max out rep to get into heroics and you didn't need to farm the heroics to do the key quests. It's simply false.
    You had to get them up and do the dungeons, though. In MoP, you can(though not necessarily should...) get into a raid without ever entering a single 5 man or raising even one rep on purpose.

  14. #174
    The Lightbringer Seranthor's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Atrahasis View Post
    Well i have watched the forums and the current stew of crz hate, daily hate, and brawlers guilds anger is a shit storm unparalleled since horde got paladins. Or since dungeons got hard in Cataclysm. In fact just like when dungeons got hard in cataclysm we had people like you dismissing the forum vitriol and anger away saying thats just normal and standard procedure. Well I hope you keep it up then just like hard dungeons we'll EVENTUALLY see some change. Cataclysm 2.0 right on display folks.
    and the HAPPY people that ARE subbed aren't living in the forums to counter your attacks, they are actually playing.... btw... are you still subbed? if not then pray tell why are you stalking your ex-game?

    --- Want any of my Constitutional rights?, ΜΟΛΩΝ ΛΑΒΕ
    I come from a time and a place where I judge people by the content of their character; I don't give a damn if you are tall or short; gay or straight; Jew or Gentile; White, Black, Brown or Green; Conservative or Liberal.

  15. #175
    The Lightbringer Kevyne-Shandris's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cybran View Post
    That was the time when the game gained the most subscribers and was considered as the most successful period of the game
    As there were no MMO challengers in 2006-2010.

    Now there's many more, and each eats a piece of WoW's player base.

    The idea that TBC was the best because of what it offered doesn't translate to even Blizzard asking players how to improve leveling through Outland, since so many hate going through it. It's the worst expansion to me as I hate Day-Glo anime fantasy junk. All the bright colors and color harmony you expect from a painting done by schizophrenics, too.
    From the #1 Cata review on Amazon.com: "Blizzard's greatest misstep was blaming players instead of admitting their mistakes. They've convinced half of the population that the other half are unskilled whiners, causing a permanent rift in the community."
    Blizzard's blame game in action: Deleting 6,100+ of Kevyne's posts and threads from the WoW forums.

  16. #176
    Elemental Lord Snowraven's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cybran View Post
    "2.7 million mop games sold first week and 10 million-ish subscribers" is what they said. They didn't mention that their subscriber revenue has dropped by 25% from 380-ish million last year Q3 to 300-ish million this Q3. This shows that their subs in July and August were low and some people came back in September to try 5.0.4 and Mop. The fact they didnt even release sales numbers of Mop so far is hinting that they are not happy with their numbers and want to keep a low profile until they launch some RAF or scroll for christmas to boost numbers for Q4.
    Thank you.

  17. #177
    Quote Originally Posted by huth View Post
    Not so. One was a hard requirement enforced by the game itself, the other is purely community enforced.

    You had to get them up and do the dungeons, though. In MoP, you can(though not necessarily should...) get into a raid without ever entering a single 5 man or raising even one rep on purpose.
    Yet in both cases, you could not really "successfully" raid without doing so in TBC whereas you can now in MoP.

  18. #178
    Over 9000! Glorious Leader's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ZenX View Post
    Its stunning how some people can come short on understanding the links between comparisons.

    TBC - You needed to max out your rep with factions and farm heroics to get into the raids
    WotLK - You needed to only farm heroics to get into the raids
    Cata - You needed to only farm heroics to get into the raids
    MoP - You needed to max out your rep with factions and farm heroics to get into the raids
    Here I was thinking dailies were optional. Your whole speech aside it still doesn't change the overall fact that this expansion IS NOTHING LIKE THE BURNING CRUSADE AT ALL. Doing dungeons for rep and gear, "double dipping" in other words made the rep grinding process less painful than it is now. Much less and dailies NEVER HAD GEAR BEHIND THEM. Even IOQD I could safely ignore and did quite frankly. In every version of this game I have been able to get rep out of dungeons. Well all except one. One of these things is not like the other... when you figure out which one stands out then you'll understand why it's shit, and why their excuse about double dipping rings so fucking hollow.
    Last edited by Glorious Leader; 2012-11-08 at 01:27 PM.
    The hammer comes down:
    Quote Originally Posted by Osmeric View Post
    Normal should be reduced in difficulty. Heroic should be reduced in difficulty.
    And the tiny fraction for whom heroic raids are currently well tuned? Too bad,so sad! With the arterial bleed of subs the fastest it's ever been, the vanity development that gives you guys your own content is no longer supportable.

  19. #179
    Quote Originally Posted by xanzul View Post
    What sub loss? You do realize subscriptions went up right? Yes obviously some NA/EU accounts were lost in favor of Asian accounts but paying accounts are paying accounts and profit is profit. Again the situation was explained to the shareholders you just refuse to see it because it eats you up knowing the game isn't dead yet and won't be for quite some time.
    The quote below is from this quarter's report. Language like this is repeated about every 4 paragraphs throughout the report.

    Blizzard’s net revenues increased significantly for the three and nine months ended September 30, 2012 as compared to the same periods in 2011, primarily due to the successful launch of both Diablo III and World of Warcraft: Mists of Pandaria . The increase in net revenues was partially offset by lower World of Warcraft subscription revenues due to a lower number of subscribers in 2012 .

  20. #180
    Quote Originally Posted by Seran View Post
    and the HAPPY people that ARE subbed aren't living in the forums to counter your attacks, they are actually playing.... btw... are you still subbed? if not then pray tell why are you stalking your ex-game?
    Repeating your signature is got old ages ago. Don't you have anything else to say except "unsub"?

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