Boomkins in WoD arena

[solarfallz]

Try playing literally any other caster right now and you will come back and laugh at your own thread.

[Uoyredrum]

Okay mate - ill be sure to tell the multi 3k rated Moonkins on US that they suck...
People on forums are unbelievably idiotic...

Moonkins aren't played because resto is OP true
Moonkins also suck coincidently which is why they aren't played....

If moonkins are so damn good 3rd best PvP caster - then why has asbur and maorimoron and iamzod failed to get to r1 ratings? Is it because resto is just too OP or is it that moonkins are horrible and it has nothing to do with resto being overpowered?

Do you guys actually read what you say after you've written it?
"balance is god tier in 2s" = Is that literally one of your arguments? That they are god tier in 2s so they should suck in 3s?


Stop speaking to me as if im like some retard 1500 boomkin. I vs'ed and beat many streamers before everyone was in full gear and just like usual Moonkins are so inconsistent because of blizzards poor design of stat scaling for the spec....i want everyone on this forum thread to go ask the top rated players on US about moonkins and tell me what they say....cos apparently you all think we are fine if not overpowered but ratings show the complete opposite....If moonkins were fine and somewhat OP wouldn't more people be playing them?
Stop kidding yourselves - Moonkin is awful and needs buffs...

Like honestly stop basing your opinions of low ratings nobody gives an F about that stuff...you either play hardcore arena and get to the top or you play for fun and sit at a low rating....
Moonkins currently on US cannot reach a high rating....it's not because resto is broken it's because moonkins are TERRIBLE....we don't do as much consistent pressure as a warlock and we do less CC now than ever because stoneform has completely just destroyed Root solar beams counterplay..

http://i.imgur.com/XWatyfi.png I guess all those r1 Moonkins "Iamzod,Luke,asbur" just suck? Or have suddenly just shelved their moonkins? I wonder why they did that - OFCOURSE - IT MUST BE BECAUSE RESTO IS OVERPOWERED - IT HAS NOTHING TO DO WHATSOEVER WITH MOONKINS ACTUALLY BEING TERRIBLE.

Based on what you're saying I don't see how anybody could think you're anything but a 1500 rated boomkin. I'm sorry if you can't comprehend basic logic or understand how class compositions work, but calling other people idiots when they point out why your thread makes no sense just shows how ridiculous this entire thing is. Nobody says those r1 boomkins suck, what we're saying is that they are boomkins and aren't going to play with resto druids so therefore are at a disadvantage to other casters who DO play with resto druids, because resto druids are incredibly overpowered and the other healers are underpowered.

And no I don't care if you've beat streamers. I can pull things out of my ass too and say "I've beat reckful in duels like 100 times as a naked ele shaman" and that doesn't mean a thing. Are you a gladiator? No? Ok good, that's what I was saying in the first place. Stop acting like the spec is holding you back right now because it's not. Get better and stop whining.

[Jensxo]

Based on what you're saying I don't see how anybody could think you're anything but a 1500 rated boomkin. I'm sorry if you can't comprehend basic logic or understand how class compositions work, but calling other people idiots when they point out why your thread makes no sense just shows how ridiculous this entire thing is. Nobody says those r1 boomkins suck, what we're saying is that they are boomkins and aren't going to play with resto druids so therefore are at a disadvantage to other casters who DO play with resto druids, because resto druids are incredibly overpowered and the other healers are underpowered.

And no I don't care if you've beat streamers. I can pull things out of my ass too and say "I've beat reckful in duels like 100 times as a naked ele shaman" and that doesn't mean a thing. Are you a gladiator? No? Ok good, that's what I was saying in the first place. Stop acting like the spec is holding you back right now because it's not. Get better and stop whining.

I am a gladiator.
I am a 2700 experienced player i'm not some spastic...
It's pretty effing obvious when a spec is weak...

Would you rather take a warlock or a moonkin in a 3s comp?
WLS or Warrior Moonkin Rsham?
RLS or Rogue moonkin Rsham

You honestly must have down syndrome if you think moonkins are fine right now....

USING YOUR LOGIC = You think moonkins are fine because everyone is playing resto thus making moonkin an underplayed spec?
So why is feral played at high ratings???? Uoyredrum you literally have absolutely no idea about high rating arena.
And I'm not some 1500 retard I know what the hell im talking about...

You think People would reroll to resto if moonkins were good??????????
That is what your saying right now.

"Moonkins are fine but resto is OP"
You think people don't play Moonkin because resto is better?
I think Moonkin is terrible in the new meta...If they were as good as you say they are then wouldn't the current US Boomkins that have chosen to play Moonkin over resto be dominating the ladder? Instead of just hovering around 400 rating below the top players???? Answer me that Uoyredrum. Your legit retarded and your the reason why PvP is horrible...
I don't understand how class compositions work? Okay - Why is it that when i want to play 3s i get shoved over for a warlock or a mage or a spriest? Is that because RESTO IS TOO OP? or maybe Moonkins are horrible in the new meta.

Go and ask any high rated PvPer about Moonkins this season and tell me what they say....and don't be an idiot and ask them about "RBGs or 2s" because nobody gives a flying F about that....you gain nothing from being strong in RBGs and 2s...3s is what counts.

- - - Updated - - -

http://i.imgur.com/bZYRvys.png MOONKINS ARE FINE MAN
Moonkins have the tools to do well man
Highest moonkin is rank 368
But moonkins are "fine"

Luke and Iamzod struggling to break 2500 because reasons...maybe they've quit because they've gotten bored with arena or maybe out of the blue their spec is suddenly awful and nobody wants to play with a moonkin if you want to push serious rating

But "moonkins are fine".

Infracted

[Christonya]

Given that a boomkin can 3 shot you if you bank starsurge, I would go as far to say: Boomkins do not need a buff, at all. However you arn't seeing many successful boomkins atm, and I will tell you why!

Because resto is so game breakingly overpowered you're a fool to play any spec other then resto. That's it. When resto eventually takes some nerfs, balance will become better because resto will no longer be a clear winning option any more.

hat's like asking a warlock to go play resto shaman because warlocks suck

Wat. Pretty sure they're #2 if not #1 on the caster list.

[Jensxo]

Given that a boomkin can 3 shot you if you bank starsurge, I would go as far to say: Boomkins do not need a buff, at all. However you arn't seeing many successful boomkins atm, and I will tell you why!

Because resto is so game breakingly overpowered you're a fool to play any spec other then resto. That's it. When resto eventually takes some nerfs, balance will become better because resto will no longer be a clear winning option any more.

Wat. Pretty sure they're #2 if not #1 on the caster list.

"Given that a boomkin can 3 shot you if you bank starsurge" Okay....umm?? Maybe at 2k rating when people have the reaction speed of an effing sloth that happens...and even then i've yet to 3 hit someone with 3 starsurges......

So because Resto is so overpowered Moonkins aren't seen? But if moonkins are still good even though resto is OP which is what your all saying? Why would it matter if i played resto or boomkin? If you guys are saying moonkin is fine why isn't there one at 2900 atm? Do you understand what im saying to you guys...your logic is seriously flawed....

Your saying MOONKIN IS FINE okay sure moonkin is fine...because RESTO is overpowered and plagueing the ladders...so what about the players who didn't reroll resto and are struggling to get high rating? Can you explain to me why r1 moonkins are struggling to break 2600 right now? Does anyone here on this forum understand my logic?
Resto is broken obviously....but that's not an excuse to say Moonkin is fine because resto is OP because everyone rerolled resto....not everyone rerolled resto....the people who stayed boomkin are struggling BECAUSE Moonkin is weak...
People rerolled from Moonkin to resto BECAUSE resto is OP and moonkin isn't strong in the slightest at high ratings....
That's pretty much as clearest explanation your going to get from me because in my head it seems like you guys aren't understanding a word im saying...

It's like saying Frost mages are viable so every mage goes frost....because fire is weak...and the people that stayed fire are struggling to get high ratings because fire is weak....if that makes sense?

Resto druids are viable so every Druid goes resto If moonkins were viable then there would be no need to switch specs would there? Do you guys see what im getting at yet?

"that's like asking a warlock to go play resto shaman because warlocks suck" It was an analogy dude...it's has nothing to do with changing classes it's all about roles....
When people tell a boomkin to go resto your telling a caster dps to switch to a healer.....I shouldn't have to.

[Anzen]

Ye, let's not do that.

Moonkins aren't fun to play against.

[Jensxo]

Ye, let's not do that.

Moonkins aren't fun to play against.

Even though we aren't the best caster by a long shot? We aren't fun to play against? So? A warlock is fun to play against? What comp if any in arena is fun to play against.

[zenga]

Unfortunately when specs like boomkin, ele, fury, fire, enhace, arcane, destro, combat, ret, ... are good in pvp it's mainly coincidence due to pve changes. And class nerfs because of an OP spec influencing aforementioned specs typically go without compensation (e.g. think the poor state ele was in first season of MoP when the totem silence nerf came into play for resto). It's been like this for a long long time and I'm afraid it will never change.

[Jensxo]

Hang on zenga are u trying to say that moonkins are weak? I thought 99% of the MMO/PvP forum community was under the impression that r1 players being 400 rating below other r1 players was okay...

[zenga]

Hang on zenga are u trying to say that moonkins are weak? I thought 99% of the MMO/PvP forum community was under the impression that r1 players being 400 rating below other r1 players was okay...

What I'm saying is that most casters that are successful atm are carried by either resto druids or by a specific comp. The problem is much wider than boomkins alone, but they suffer more because they can't play with resto druids and resto shaman isn't as good as in previous seasons. Sure they can give boomkins an additional buff through a tool (shorter barskin, an extra defense,... I don't play it myself), but it needs to be addressed on a bigger scale in my opinion. And by that I mean fixing the melee risk vs reward playstyle, these comps (incl hunter) generally need to give less fucks atm and are quite forgiving relative to caster classes, even more so when they play with a resto druid.

But if you gonna buff e.g. boomkin healing, then it affects 2s as well. It might not matter but it's a very active bracket with plenty of players. I used to queue up in 2s with mates night in night out when we couldn't do 3s, but mop boomkins acting as a 2nd healer totally killed my will to play 2s outside capping. So if you ask me what is the most important: closing that 400 rating gap with the r1 players for boomkins or making 2s enjoyable/bearable then I'd go for the last option.

In an ideal world they find a way to buff boomkins (be it through direct buffs or through other specs nerfs) without it affecting 2s, rbgs, pve ... but looking at the past the chances are very slim.

[Trematode]

Would you rather take a warlock or a moonkin in a 3s comp?
WLS or Warrior Moonkin Rsham?
RLS or Rogue moonkin Rsham

I know Warlocks have two good comps that are r1 viable, but I'm curious to know why doesn't Moonkin have any? What comps do they usually suppress with? Is it because Warlocks do good against Moonkins?

[ellieg]

Lol at how mad this dude is. Moonkin is in the best state they've been in for pvp. Remember moonkin pvp in vanilla? Remember getting rank 1 in tbc, wotlk or cata? I sure as shit don't. Didn't play til the very end of mop so I cant comment on that. I like WW monks, I like arcane mages, I like holy priests, I like assass rogues, I like ele shamans, but guess what? These all suck in arena. I'm ok with this. Im not tied down to 1 spec of 1 class. I leveled an afflict lock and a frost mage so I could play a caster in pvp. Would I prefer to play the classes I like? Duh. Am I gonna bitch and cry and moan on a nonblizzard forum that wont change anything? No im not. Just suck it up.

[Deleted]

Lol at how mad this dude is. Moonkin is in the best state they've been in for pvp. Remember moonkin pvp in vanilla? Remember getting rank 1 in tbc, wotlk or cata? I sure as shit don't. Didn't play til the very end of mop so I cant comment on that. I like WW monks, I like arcane mages, I like holy priests, I like assass rogues, I like ele shamans, but guess what? These all suck in arena. I'm ok with this. Im not tied down to 1 spec of 1 class. I leveled an afflict lock and a frost mage so I could play a caster in pvp. Would I prefer to play the classes I like? Duh. Am I gonna bitch and cry and moan on a nonblizzard forum that wont change anything? No im not. Just suck it up.

pretty sure that moonkins in cata were r1 viable. actually, I wouldn't be surprised if Jens got R1 there as well. not sure about other seasons...

Jens is talking about the spec he is playing, regardless of other specs that might need tuning as well. His argument: Moonkins are not viable to get 2600 with (let alone 2900) and this is not because there aren't competent players. About everyone opposing his argument is talking about 2.2ish or non-3s brackets, which is clearly not what Jens is onto.

there are a ton of issues with moonkins for arena.
-crap defensive (1: barkskin) and about every class/spec heals for about the same, with crazy defensives
-1 silence/interrupt with a 1 minute cooldown (beam). never get full silence duration out of this, ever.
-cyclone as main cc; a very good one, but drs with every comp that was viable in the past
-hardcasts are very long and get easily locked; what's left are instant dots and starsurges: a very strange and not very skilful playstyle.
-burst is more or less non-existent, apart from the 3 minute CDs and/or 3xstarsurge: only manageable at lower ratings.
-rotting with dots is very weak

maybe I should have a look on the eu players, there are a couple higher ones; although lazerchicken isn't 2700 yet...

[ellieg]

pretty sure that moonkins in cata were r1 viable. actually, I wouldn't be surprised if Jens got R1 there as well. not sure about other seasons...

Jens is talking about the spec he is playing, regardless of other specs that might need tuning as well. His argument: Moonkins are not viable to get 2600 with (let alone 2900) and this is not because there aren't competent players. About everyone opposing his argument is talking about 2.2ish or non-3s brackets, which is clearly not what Jens is onto.

there are a ton of issues with moonkins for arena.
-crap defensive (1: barkskin) and about every class/spec heals for about the same, with crazy defensives
-1 silence/interrupt with a 1 minute cooldown (beam). never get full silence duration out of this, ever.
-cyclone as main cc; a very good one, but drs with every comp that was viable in the past
-hardcasts are very long and get easily locked; what's left are instant dots and starsurges: a very strange and not very skilful playstyle.
-burst is more or less non-existent, apart from the 3 minute CDs and/or 3xstarsurge: only manageable at lower ratings.
-rotting with dots is very weak

maybe I should have a look on the eu players, there are a couple higher ones; although lazerchicken isn't 2700 yet...

I feel that. Im just struggling to see what his point of this thread is. If its to bring about a change, then this thread is useless. If its to inform us, i guess thats alright but he comes across as crying. The silence is a full 5 second lockout even if its placed on you and you walk out of it within a second. They have a ton of mobility which translates into some defensive power so they arent as defensless as they seem. I havent played a moonkin since wrath and that was full pve because they were awful in arena. The DR nerf definitely hits hard, i used to play warlock moonkin and now its not viable at all.

I guess all im saying is deal with it. He can write up a thesis and get a doctorates in moonkinology, but its not gonna change his class. He should look at more realistic options like playing a similar caster or quitting until moonkins get buffed. Or he can try and make it work. I dont remember the name, but there is a rogue who always plays the worst spec and gets glad on it almost every season just because thats what he finds fun.

[Deleted]

Lol at how mad this dude is. Moonkin is in the best state they've been in for pvp. Remember moonkin pvp in vanilla? Remember getting rank 1 in tbc, wotlk or cata? I sure as shit don't.

Not that I generally disagree with you, but I know a Moonkin in a 4 dps comp got R1 in Season 4 (Healshami, Hunter, Shadowpriest, Frostmage, Moonkin). The Hunter made a vid about it, I think it's called Arma 2.

[Jensxo]

Does anyone notice how inconsistent moonkins are? Or do people just think that we are constantly R1 viable...
Last season of MOP we were r1 viable because of scaling and warlocks damage LSD2 etc.
The season before that (season i got glad in) I was one of the 3 moonkins on US who even managed to get glad let alone R1 - And our top tier comp was triple dps - Rogue mage Moonkin (pmuch because of HOTW carrying and rogue/mage synergy in that season)
Why can't we just be consistently viable? Like mages or warlocks? Why do i need to take a gamble every new season on whether or not i should play my moonkin? Honestly...what is difficult about making moonkin viable? Our defensives need buffs...our offhealing is pretty avg now which most of us thought would be our "2nd" niche defensive now that we lost might of ursoc and HOTW is practically useless for the cooldown it has...our damage is strong once every 3 minutes? Our control is gutted now because every comp that we use to play relied on cyclone not dring with anything.

[ellieg]

Does anyone notice how inconsistent moonkins are? Or do people just think that we are constantly R1 viable...
Last season of MOP we were r1 viable because of scaling and warlocks damage LSD2 etc.
The season before that (season i got glad in) I was one of the 3 moonkins on US who even managed to get glad let alone R1 - And our top tier comp was triple dps - Rogue mage Moonkin (pmuch because of HOTW carrying and rogue/mage synergy in that season)
Why can't we just be consistently viable? Like mages or warlocks? Why do i need to take a gamble every new season on whether or not i should play my moonkin? Honestly...what is difficult about making moonkin viable? Our defensives need buffs...our offhealing is pretty avg now which most of us thought would be our "2nd" niche defensive now that we lost might of ursoc and HOTW is practically useless for the cooldown it has...our damage is strong once every 3 minutes? Our control is gutted now because every comp that we use to play relied on cyclone not dring with anything.

I feel your pain but youre honestly just asking for the game to be balanced. Everyone would love to be balanced but I don see it happening. When did you start playing? Just curious, because up until wrath you were lucky if you even had 1 spec that was viable. I know you don't want to hear it but its the truth. There are something like 30+ specs right now. Blizzard isn't going to be able to completely balance all of them. Rogue / mage are good 90% of them time. If you want a consistent class, go with them. Youre attached to your moonkin, I love moonkin too, but they aren't good right now.

[Jensxo]

The game is just not fun...even if moonkins were strong perhaps even OP i personally still wouldn't enjoy the game because there's just nothing to press anymore....there's nothing i can do in a match that will make me stand out as a good moonkin....hibernating Rdruids - that's gone....eating scatter traps with treants...that's gone....blinking onto traps...that's gone...hibernating a feral on his cd's....that's gone....the game just isn't fun for me personally anymore. I don't think i've ever played another game in my entire life that has this much terrible game balance in it....i understand blizzard are a company and they want to make money....but from my Perspective - I feel like they've chosen to listen to the wrong people when it come's to Arena balance....Obviously everyone is entitled to their opinion but if you imagine it like this.....Cdew is cristiano Ronaldo and a 1500 resto shaman is just a 18 year old random soccer player for some random team....who's opinion are you going to take? Cdew - a player who's been around for pmuch the entirety of WoW arena or a 1500 player who has never experienced what it's like to vs teams that know how to counter - that have strategies in place for each comp...that work well as a team at the highest level......I know the low rated arena players will hate me but it's the truth....Blizzard have taken the advice of the Forum Community which looks to be made up of 1500-2200 player's who really don't understand most things about arena....they don't understand when opportunities arise during a match they don't understand that you need to have counterable abilities in the game that have drawbacks....I go on the arena forums every couple of days and some of the stuff that people post on their is unreal....Some person proposed that Cyclone should be on the same Tier as mighty bash and disorienting Roar and should have a 10 second cooldown? Who are these people that legitimately think that would fix Resto druid...Do they even realise that druids have 3 specs? And when you ask for nerfs on a certain spell that each spec has it directly affects Boomkin and feral? Remember when Typhoon was Boomkin only? Now look at it....nerfed to the ground because resto and feral got it too and it suddenly became too strong....




PvE on the other hand is amazing...i hope that the people still doing Arena will one day eventually come to realise that PvE is a great aspect of the game and you rarely have to worry about your class/spec sucking..

[Ermelloth]

Buffing moonkins arena wise would be only possible if the way they burst would somehow be changed. It's not OK to 1-shot people with 3x instant casts out of sudden while enemy healer is in deep CC. Bad mechanics, which can hardly be countered.

If more of their damage could be transitioned to casts instead of spamming instants, there could be some way to buff an ability or two.

[Jensxo]

Buffing moonkins arena wise would be only possible if the way they burst would somehow be changed. It's not OK to 1-shot people with 3x instant casts out of sudden while enemy healer is in deep CC. Bad mechanics, which can hardly be countered.

If more of their damage could be transitioned to casts instead of spamming instants, there could be some way to buff an ability or two.

See not to be mean to you but your an example of someone who doesn't know much about moonkins...
3x instant starsurges - maybe at low ratings your going to get 1 shot...that doesn't mean you nerf something because people have slow reaction times....if boomkins were 1 shotting with 3x instant starsurges every 3 minutes wouldn't we see them at r1...You also said "it's not okay to 1 shot people with 3x instant casts out of sudden while enemy healer is in deep CC" so should the person that we are focusing not die even though he's healer is in a CC chain - that's really poor logic. You see what im trying to say here? At low ratings moonkins probably go pretty well...but who cares about low ratings? That's like saying im a good tennis player but im not professional yet? IE your not very good then....Blizzard have made changes to the game based on the low rated players opinions - thus we have this abomination of PvP this expansion.

The majority of our damage is casts now....Moonfire/sunfire don't do a lot of pressure - we actually hardcast starfire/wrath quite a lot.....so your 100% wrong there...Out of all the casters i feel we actually cast quite a bit....