What Went Wrong? My guess is: Convenience and Lack of Potential - Read On

[Deleted]

Greetings.

First and foremost, I wish for people to discuss here. Disagree with me? Then argue why you disagree!


It is no secret that World of Warcraft has gone through a lot of changes the past 11 years. Was Vanilla the amazing unicorn everyone makes it out to be? No. It had its problems too. As a game, World of Warcraft has improved on so many things that ultimately I wouldnt be able to return to. But, Blizzard are not perfect and they took some wrong steps too. And it is fair, they could not have known the impact it would have had. Read on.

With all the changes, I see the game has taken these 3 major steps in the last many expansions:

• Accessibility of the World
• Homogeneous Classes
• Improvements to older Problems

Accessibility of the World
This step comes as a no brainer. With less then 5% of the 7 Million people during TBC having seen all raid content, Blizzard thought their raids didnt amount to much when so few people saw it. It was essentially wasted talent. This had to change, and in WotLK they introduced raid difficulties to engage more people. Fast forward to WoD and we have a whopping 4 difficulties for each raid. Man that's a lot of "lets do this guy one more time".
Furthermore, TBC had a HUGE progression line you had to work through to get anywhere near the tier 5 and 6 raiding. Attunements to everything and gear checks. TBC did one thing towards accessibility which was a great feature, heroic dungeons: a place raiders could go for a smaller (and much harder) challenge. Man, these heroics would tear people to dust. Of course, with a long run, TBC couldnt continue the gear gap between people and eventually added Karazhan badges and other nifty stuff to jump the gear ladder. Fast forward to WoD and we have so many "welfare" epics its starting to feel like Oprah Winfrey is handing out the loot.
Conclusion: To engage more players, Blizzard has removed more and more "walls" that limited certain players from content.

Homogeneous Classes
During Vanilla, this was horrible. If you were a druid or priest, your job was essentially healing no matter what. Only maybe could you be lucky and get some for your offspecc. Because of course your feral or shadow build was nothing more than an off specc. Paladins were buff batteries and support healers. Rolled a warrior because you want to deal damage with a two hander? Sorry, here is a sword and shield. Go tank... with fury specc.
TBC fixed this and in a great way. For the first time, raids were taking feral druids, elemental shamans and retribution paladins. In fact, all these classes had different "things" they brought to the raid which meant, as an officer and raid planner, I spent time theorycrafting raid setups. Man, as a Rogue I loved having my bear offtank in my group, those 5% crit helped a lot!
You had to have mages, because these f**kers had the best CC in the game at this time. Rogues had to risk it for saps etc. It was a great time to be alive as your class identity was so important. But, this was limiting towards accessibility. Guilds needed mages instead of ranged dps for recruitment, and if not enough geared mages were available, the higher tier guilds would snitch mages from further down the progression line meaning that the "mid" progression guilds often lost members to the higher guilds. Blizzard fixed this by trying to make all classes have something to offer within the same branch. To begin with it meant you took a specific class from a pool of classes which offered whatever you needed. Fast forward to WoD and you have the current build where the only thing that really matters is whether or not you are melee, ranged, tank or healer. Sad times indeed.
Conclusion: Blizzard focused so much on "bring the player, not the class", that they ultimately destroyed the sense of class choice.

Improvements to Older Problems
Things Blizzard have done is not all bad. Lots of stuff has been improved over the time, things which are arguably a much better game design than what we saw 10 years ago. But, we can try and argue from now to the 10th WoW expansion what was good or not, and we will not agree. Because it is not clear what was simply too convenient changes and what were necessary changes. Yes farming reputation was booring as f**k, but at least you had stuff to do, right?
The Rank 14 PvP system was horrible as well, and the new PvP system in Legion looks promising.
Raids back then was mechanically simple and booring. As a class, your job in raiding Vanilla was to spam 1 or 2 buttons. Nice!..
What older raids had was much more challenging, and yes WoD has the highest difficulty of raiding being on par with this (with better mechanics, no doubt).
That being said, with all the raid difficulties it adds another problem which we will need to discuss.
But keep in mind, when I compare parts of WoW to Vanilla/TBC/Wrath, Im not saying everything in it was better.
Conclusion: Blizzard has had many improvements over the years and one must not forget all the great changes we have had!

Potential: Why it was important and why we need it again
One of the main reason I kept subbing indefinitely during the first 2 expansions was due to potential. TBC came with so many raids at launch it was amazing, and I had the potential to reach it. All I needed to do was continue on the progression ladder.
I wanted this awesome looking sword from SSC and it took me 4 months to get it. Man was it rewarding having it, no doubt! And it felt unique too.
Potential is one of the main reason people continue to play WoW. Heck, some of us play for the potential of an expansion that felt like the two first.
Now, with potential, let me bring on why I absolutely hate the 4 difficulties of raiding. If I see a sword I really want from this raid or I really want to experience its glory, it absolutely destroys the potential when I can get that feeling simply by taking the lowest of the 4 difficulties. Does not matter if I play Dragon Age on Easy, Normal or Hard, once the story is complete and the world has been seen, it has been done.
Was vanilla a better setup with 40 man raiding? Probably not. I would most likely classify TBC as having the raiding done best. Potential kept people at it.
World of Warcraft used to have all these potentialities all around the world which one would strive for, but ultimately these have been removed to make the world much more accessible to everyone. This leads me to the next step:

Inconvenience: Why it was important and why we need it again
Do you remember staying 1 hour at the main city to find a group for UBRS or Scholomance? Do you remember running to deadmines, dodging all the elites while you ventured forth with your group of explorers? Do you remember having nothing but a menu now?
Convenience have ultimately killed both the MMO and the RPG part of WoW.
Vanilla is probably the time when the World of warcraft was most alive outside cities. Everything was connected so that most zones from 30 to 60 had stuff that everyone needed. Mats, instances (you had to physically run there... or get a warlock to summon you one at a time), questing, pvp and many things. But, having to do things that "suck" is a necessary evil in order to emphasize on the reward at the end. Furthermore, having things that suck also emphasize on what is awesome. If you are used to a 3 meal setup every night then you will never fee the sensation of an amazing dinner setup because it has become your standard. Running to the instance sucked hell yes, but once you got there, chances were you where gonna try and clear that instance no matter what. All the hastle needed to get to one place or another meant that the tolerance of people was much higher. I remember that wiping did break up groups yes, but the tolerance of people these days are so low that the only way that Blizzard could counter it was to reduce the difficulty so that people just didnt wipe. Wiping has become something that mythic raiders does, which is a shame, as nothing is more rewarding than 25 people screaming on ventrillo after 3 months of wiping on a boss, yes Im talking to you Kael'Thas.
Conclusion: Convenience is a double-edged sword which made the game have tedious and unfun aspects but overall were good design choices as the rewards were greater (psychologically. The actual rewards have not changed). Furthermore, with everything being so convenient, the game lacks potential towards your character which means you feel you have nothing to do. At all.

For me, its as if Blizzard continue to shoot themselves with each expansion, making more and more content accessible means that the worth of patches are so short. The notion of "mains" seem to die more and more from each expansion as well.

Dont get me wrong, the classes feel better than ever. They have done lots of great improvements and if we had backtracked (starting at WoD and going towards Vanilla), we would probably hear people whine about "why classes suck so much now".

Finally, I can shed light to the most important aspect which convenience and lack of potential destroyed

Server-wide Community:
When things required groups, when being a douchebag gave you a bad reputation. Back in the day when guilds and guildmasters were known. Vanilla and TBC was a time when anything cross-server related was not implemented and it meant work to get things done. It had its dark side too, as I mentioned earlier, guilds would snitch players from other guilds with less progression which meant that the bottom and middle group had it hard. I was in the middle group and remember the frustration with my guildmaster talking about "yet another member got recruited by the top guild". But ultimately, I would trade this frustration any day rather than have the current "silence" that we see. Trade chat has become nothing more than a few recruitment messages and trades. General chat is entirely empty. Hell, asking people for help often gives you "google it".
Where the server community went the past 10 years I dont know. I blame, convenience, lack of potential and cross-server related actions. When you can solo everything, and get everything done within weeks. When you can queue up with (N)PC classes and not say a word to them because in 15min you will never see the again.
Conclusion: Things in older expansions of WoW was so hard you needed other people to help. It had a server-wide community because it was forced to be. It emphasized so much on MMO that people would spend hours simply socializing. They had things they could do, but there were no reason to rush for it.

Would I want a vanilla or TBC server? No, I cannot rekindle the past and there are many reason why TBC was unique to its time.
But when looking past the rose-tinted glasses there are a few design choices which are apparent and that are not necessarily dependent on its time.
I refuse to believe that online server community is something of the past.

Do you agree? What is your opinion? What would bring back content that lasts for almost a year and the social aspect of WoW? or do you not miss it at all? Tell me what you think!

[Deleted]

90% of what happened is that it got old. Most of the complains are rose-tinted glasses generated. For example, finding a 5man to do a heroic in TBC was not fun, it was abhorrent.

[Deleted]

90% of what happened is that it got old. Most of the complains are rose-tinted glasses generated. For example, finding a 5man to do a heroic in TBC was not fun, it was abhorrent.

I cover this exact thing in the topic above. its literally the main focus of the topic...

[Cæli]

Old content:
I don't understand why they don't put more emphasis on old content. When new content is released, it's like the old one never existed. Can't understand. That amount of old content is colossal, makes players addicted, they even make the new players skip it with free boost. Logic ?

Difficulties:
I agree on the potential thing. They don't need 4 difficulties anymore now that flex exists. They need to get back to the bc raid model, with hard raid, and easier raids, included at launch. 4 difficulties and LFR especially, destroys the player base because a normal player sees the content in a day with LFR, players want to discover content, with LFR they have few incentives left. Game is too redundant now. We/they need multiple raids. And raids will always get explored by everyone once the new expansion hits and the player power increases.

Lfg:
A few tweaks is needed (like no reward on the tool but only on the bosses, especially on the last, and instant teleport with no pre-dungeon is controversial) but overall it's a fine tool.

Community:
Again, a few tweaks can change everything in my opinion:
-Disable cross realm games
-Merge more realms so that every singe realms is at least 80% the size of the biggest realm
-Leave the possibility to play cross realm with a battle tag friend
Players will end up knowing each others players on the realm again, no more anonymity, less toxicity

If you have 1 M players to be matched with, in fact there is also 1 M players that needs to be matched with a group. Cross realm region auto lfg is not a good thing in my opinion. All they need is tracking per realm and per hour for a month how many people are getting in a queue for a dungeon. And ONLY when the program don't find 4 others players for like 5 minutes (likely late at night) should the program pick cross realm players, it's better to have a cross realm player than no dungeon. But if realm is big enough, it should not happen.
There is faction imbalance but that's another subject. They'll need to remove combat racials first and find a way to have balanced faction.

Designing the game is complex and simple at the same time, I think. Players, old and new like WoW for what it is, there is no need to change it. The more they change it, the more likely people won't like WoW anymore, that's simple. They just need to add content to what we like. And having a big bad guy with a name on it for each expansion for the hype, good and advancing lore, good music, good blizzcon trailer with good music, done.

[Deleted]

I cover this exact thing in the topic above. its literally the main focus of the topic...

I know you try to cover it. And you don't convince me. You still are wrong.

Most of the people hated finding a pug to a 5man in TBC for instance.

If they forgot they did it's their problem, or they only had their guild.



Blizzard didn't design LFG just as an experiment.

They knew people wanted it to have more fun.

And it would be a disaster to remove it.

[Vaelorian]

90% of what happened is that it got old. Most of the complains are rose-tinted glasses generated. For example, finding a 5man to do a heroic in TBC was not fun, it was abhorrent.

Please stop with naming the horrid features the old expansions had. I mean no one is asking for lagg in Ironforge (falling in the gap). No one is asking for hour long cooldowns and the like.

But the world was huge and you always had a goal. I had 150 days played during Vanilla. I had so much to do. Once you got your dungeonset (after a long looooong time, which you did gladly) you had pretty damn good gear. And epics in raids didn't scale so hard that you would suddenly mass pull and AoE everything either. So everything remained relevant. You could gather materials for professions in dungeons (or raids).

There were a zillion quests to do. Groupquests were GREAT!!

These days we have the groupfinder. Great! Sadly it is crossserver = anonymity. No one cares who you are. Equally so the content is so easy, no communication is needed.

Fix this last part... by truly merging servers and you will have a great game to do again.

[Deleted]

Please stop with naming the horrid features the old expansions had.

The OP did. He talks about how 'fun' it was to 'fight your way to a 5man'. No, just no.

[Vaelorian]

I don't understand why they don't put more emphasis on old content. When new content is released, it's like the old one never existed. Can't understand. That amount of old content is colossal, makes players addicted, they even make the new players skip it with free boost. Logic ?

Blizzard want peoples friends to have an easy time to get to the level of their friends who are already subbed. So they can play together. I understand this but I think overal it hurts more then it solves.

[Deleted]

I know you try to cover it. And you don't convince me. You still are wrong.

Most of the people hated finding a pug to a 5man in TBC for instance.

If they forgot they did it's their problem, or they only had their guild.



Blizzard didn't design LFG just as an experiment.

They knew people wanted it to have more fun.

And it would be a disaster to remove it.

The disaster you speak of is nothing specific in World of Warcraft. Blizzard focuses so much on change in world of warcraft, while people hate change.
They changed WoD in that it removed flying mounts again and see what that did.

WoW has had most likely anywhere between 15 to 25 million players over the 11 years it had run. What those individual people consider good and bad choices are subjective. Furthermore, an argument against removing LFG is that "people have gotten used to it", but that was the same deal with going from 40 man raids to 25 man raids between vanilla and TBC.

All I can say is that WoW used to emphasize on MMORPG and originally accepted the genre to be a niche. Now after having had 10 million players, and ultimately seeing other genres such as MOBAs reach 30 million active users, I believe Blizzard is trying to streamline WoW into the MOBA experience of "15-40 min of fun, then log off again". I just dont believe it fits the MMORPG genre at all and ultimately believe its a misunderstanding of the genre from Blizzards part.

Furthermore, since Blizzard has to jugle both the MMORPG crowd and the "MOBA" crowd, it means you have one vocal group shouting for harder content that lasts longer and emphasizes on classes while another group shouting for content to be easier to access so it doesnt take 4 hours to do.

[Deleted]

The disaster you speak of is nothing specific in World of Warcraft. Blizzard focuses so much on change in world of warcraft, while people hate change.
They changed WoD in that it removed flying mounts again and see what that did.

That's wrong. People don't hate change. That's a fallacy, what they really want is to have fun.



It's a strawman fallacy because you misrepresent any good change as a generic bad change. The irony is that you want a bad change yourself. You want to make the game more obnoxious just because it was like that when it was old.

The main issue is exactly that is old.



Also it's why people hated no flying and why Blizzard admitted their error. It was a bad change. Not just a generic change.

[Vaelorian]

The OP did. He talks about how 'fun' it was to 'fight your way to a 5man'. No, just no.

That is entirely something different as you first said. You said it was terrible getting a group. It was.
Now you are saying that it was horrible to fly(taxi) over to dungeons with the 4 people who joined you.

I agree that this was actually enjoyable. Namely because you had time to get to know eachother. Sure sometimes someone would demand a summon. Sure some people just went afk. What else is new? Nothing has changed in this. But overal if you actually got together you were more committed to the group. You would not right away pick up and leave if something went not according to your liking. It happened but far less. Mainly because you had spend time already on forming the group and getting there. This was good. At times annoying ofcourse. But overal the chances of making friends due to this were greater. The dungeons also took longer and needed communication. Also a great feature that brought friends.... Can you not see the merit?

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That's wrong. People don't hate change. That's a fallacy, what they really want is to have fun.



It's a strawman fallacy because you misrepresent a bad change that you want as a generic change. You don't want an abstract change. You want to make the game more obnoxious just because it was like that when it was old.

The main issue is exactly that is old.



Also it's why people hated no flying and why Blizzard admitted their error. It was a bad change. No just a generic change.

I agree with you there. I don't think we would have even the 5 million people subbed if blizzard never changed WoW a bit. I don't agree with your statement about it being old.

Every expansion it gets updated. Models get renewed. I don't even call it an expansion anymore. I call it WoW 1 2 3 4 5 6 etc.

[Low Hanging Fruit]

The disaster you speak of is nothing specific in World of Warcraft. Blizzard focuses so much on change in world of warcraft, while people hate change.
They changed WoD in that it removed flying mounts again and see what that did.

WoW has had most likely anywhere between 15 to 25 million players over the 11 years it had run. What those individual people consider good and bad choices are subjective. Furthermore, an argument against removing LFG is that "people have gotten used to it", but that was the same deal with going from 40 man raids to 25 man raids between vanilla and TBC.

All I can say is that WoW used to emphasize on MMORPG and originally accepted the genre to be a niche. Now after having had 10 million players, and ultimately seeing other genres such as MOBAs reach 30 million active users, I believe Blizzard is trying to streamline WoW into the MOBA experience of "15-40 min of fun, then log off again". I just dont believe it fits the MMORPG genre at all and ultimately believe its a misunderstanding of the genre from Blizzards part.

Furthermore, since Blizzard has to jugle both the MMORPG crowd and the "MOBA" crowd, it means you have one vocal group shouting for harder content that lasts longer and emphasizes on classes while another group shouting for content to be easier to access so it doesnt take 4 hours to do.

I really like this perspective. One can only hope now that they have a MOBA that they will relax this stance. But.. I have my doubts.

[Deleted]

you had time to get to know eachother.

The thing is we had a very game-breaking problem with dead realms. Look, I fully understand these dynamics because I fully lived the game since late Vanilla. But the issue of dead servers and people refusing to pay to transfer or the company being unable to freely transfer them properly was just game breaking.

The cross-server and LFG conveniences basically fixed that for 90-95% of the player base while they removed the small fun of occasionally finding local realm friends. It was fun to do that but the problem of having dead gameplay completely if your realm is small of badly progressed in what you are doing was much less fun.

Now only mythic raiding is restricted that way. I think that should be also opened up. I don't get why we can't attempt pugging a few bosses more easily. If a mythic raiding guild can't stand pugging and they would disband because of it then they shouldn't be a guild to begin with.

[Deleted]

That's wrong. People don't hate change. That's a fallacy, what they really want is to have fun.



It's a strawman fallacy because you misrepresent a bad change that you want as a generic change. You don't want an abstract change. You want to make the game more obnoxious just because it was like that when it was old.

The main issue is exactly that is old.



Also it's why people hated no flying and why Blizzard admitted their error. It was a bad change. No just a generic change.

You dont convince me you even read my original article.

As I tried to explain, in the article, some inconvenient features are needed due to the psychological effect of gaining the reward and for making the content last longer. You tell me that I am attempting to rediscover what WoW used to be and I cover this topic as well, talking about all the bad things WoW used to have. Heck, I even specifically mention in the article I would never go back as WoW has clearly improved on many levels as well.

Simple psychology; The harder you work for something, the better the reward feels. You can get many cars which look cool, but ultimately the feel of a Ferrari wins because of the hefty price tag. Hefty price tag means work to gain money. Epics in Vanilla wasnt better or more unique then now, but because they were hard to get, they felt more rewarding. It is simple psychology.

It is also simple psychology, for humans to want it as easy as possible. Heck, about everything we invent these days are so that "things can become easier than ever!".

But for what the MMORPG genre tries to do, atleast its original crowd, many design choices blizzard made contradicts that and attempts at changing WoW into another genre. A "Online RolePlaying Battle Arena".

Old is not the issue. I can give many reasons for why I find certain design choices bad or good.
No flying means people stay on the ground and makes the world more alive. It increases the chance of world PvP and engaging with other people, and Blizzard has stated many years ago that they wish they never added flying mounts (in regards to the social loses of WoW).
Why WoD failed its attempt with flying mounts has to do with other things of the game, such as Garrisons doing exactly what they tried to fix with flying, so in WoD they removed a feature to fix another problem but then added another feature which contradicted what they wanted to fix in the first place.

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The thing is we had a very game-breaking problem with dead realms. Look, I fully understand these dynamics because I fully lived the game since late Vanilla. But the issue of dead servers and people refusing to pay to transfer or the company being unable to freely transfer them properly was just game breaking.

There are many ways to fix this without destroying server communities. Find some servers that are dead and merge em, or find a "horde only" server and an "alliance only" server and merge em. Be more active in giving free specific server migrations etc.

Cross-server was a theoretically great idea but has shown to be destructive. At least in the perspective of MMO. I dont know about you, but there isnt so much "MMO" about WoW anymore.

[Deleted]

The harder you work for something, the better the reward feels.

That argument is usually said with rose-tinted glasses since the hardest parts of the game are right now much harder than they were in the first two iterations of the game. Especially in vanilla the main thing to succeed was knowing how to read tooltips and throw a bunch of people that actually read said tooltips in the same group. TBC did get harder but it wasn't to the level hard-mode raiding put it from Ulduar onwards. On Ragnaros Heroic we had the hardest boss ever created in the history of WoW. It's still much, much harder to do something like Archimonde mythic compared to anything the first two games had and most people will not even attempt touching it before it's totally nerfed or completely on an old expansion.

The game isn't easier. It's easier to do the tedious stuff. The high end stuff it's still as hard or just harder.

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There are many ways to fix this without destroying server communities. Find some servers that are dead and merge em

You haven't thought this through. We reached this state because we also tried to answer suggestions like that. You insult the intelligence of devs and plenty of us thinking of that problem for months to no end when the solutions were being developed.

Start with thinking how are you going to merge their names? Most servers have reserved most player names.

[Deleted]

The game isn't easier. It's easier to do the tedious stuff. The high end stuff it's still as hard or just harder.

I agree with this, but it depends on how you define hard.

People consider PHD university degrees hard because they take so long to do. The hard part being able to continue doing it.

Hard has many sides to it. We can both agree that raid content is much harder now than in vanilla (again... I discussed this exact thing in the original topic).
As a hunter in Vanilla, Autoattacking wasnt hard at all...

Vanilla raiding was a different hard, as it was hard to coordinate. Loot was a different hard, as it was less frequent and thus took longer to get.

If Blizzard expects longevity of the game, they much focus on different hard content again, because mechanically hard content, they have nailed (in the last difficulties of raiding, the actual content up to that point is piss easy).

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You haven't thought this through. We reached this state because we also tried to answer suggestions like that. You insult the intelligence of devs and plenty of us thinking of that problem for months to no end when the solutions were being developed.

Start with thinking how are you going to merge their names? Most servers have reserved most player names.

As I mentioned in the same reply, cross-server was a theoretically great design choice but has proven to be destructive. I dont blame Blizzard, as they could not know beforehand how it would hurt a certain aspect of WoW. It is easy for me to look in retrospect.
Yes I know merging servers isnt easy, but there many design choices of WoW that was not easy to implement.

In a way, I hope they do make a new MMORPG in the future, because Blizzard has gathered so much knowledge on what works and what doesnt work. And by what works I mean what keeps the spirit of the MMORPG genre, which lets be honest, is not in a healthy position right now and has not been the past 7 years.

[Deleted]

Convenience have ultimately killed both the MMO and the RPG part of WoW.

Exactly this.

It was the interaction requirements between the players which made Wow successful.... its as simple as that.

All these fanboys who think Wow is better now really dont understand what made Wow so great.

The way i see it is that all of those players who prefer Wow now are the guys who had trouble socialising in old Wow. The main barriers to progress in early Wow was grouping up. If u didnt/couldnt group up then u found yourself missing out on alot of content ... basically speaking the guys who wanted to play Wow solo really didnt get very far.

Now fast forward to today... and we have a game that these very same players can happily play solo. Thats why they prefer Wow now. And on the flipside all of those guys who loved the close interaction requirments, the MMO'ness' and RPG'ness' of Wow have all pretty much left the building.

The only barriers left in Wow are in raiding, and even there the barriers are small (compared to early Wow). You can even raid heroic without interacting with other players, just login, use Finder to find a heroic raid group, kill boss, collect loot, logout.

[PuffyPussy22]

90% of what happened is that it got old. Most of the complains are rose-tinted glasses generated. For example, finding a 5man to do a heroic in TBC was not fun, it was abhorrent.

This is the perfect example of a useless response that adds absolutely nothing to the topic. I will give you the honor of telling you why, even though you didn't do the same for the OP.

First off, using rose tinted goggles doesn't say anything. Do you even know what you mean by this? You mean nostalgia. Do you know what nostalgia means? Lets look at it.

Nostalgia: a sentimental longing or wistful affection for the past

So essentially, you are saying that a game the OP liked in the past.....that the OP liked in the past. This adds nothing to the conversation. Of course he liked the game in the past, the game existed in that form in the past, there is no other way for him to like it. The question is did he have good reasons for liking it? Well, he spent a lot of time explaining what those reasons were, then you came across with this completely irrelevant point you just made.

Most of the people hated finding a pug to a 5man in TBC for instance.

This is opinion. You have to actually prove that people disliked this aspect. You see bad arguments can be returned with bad arguments, for example I could now say, "People hate using the LFR tool, its why 5 million people have left" However, unless I post something that actually makes you think about whether my point could be true, its just a piece that can be easily ignored and forgotten. You also don't seem to mention the Group Finder that BC had either. There was always /4, but they introduced a more in depth group finder shortly into the expansion. Were you not using that?

I usually don't respond to people like you, but the OP put forth a pretty good that was kind of disappointing seeing the lead in comment to the thread do it such a disservice (while also doing your point a disservice).

[Enosh]

wildstar
#hardcore

[Deleted]

People consider PHD university degrees hard because they take so long to do.

That's so wrong. It's actually exactly the point here. If you find a university that only required or even additionally required time-invested to give PhDs, they are not a good one.

The whole point of what they do is requiring quality in the work requested. If the work requested would be generated in 10 minutes it should be fine.

In fact, it would be better if they had an Einstein that gave them the work requested after he generated it in only 10 seconds.

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So essentially, you are saying that a game the OP liked in the past.....that the OP liked in the past.

No. I didn't say that. I said that most that complain didn't like it, i.e. I said the opposite. It's simple really. The majority of players around those iterations of the game were very young. That is coupled with the fact they still play now to comment. So if they still play now and they comment, in most likelihood, in majority were younger than 20 years old, they were teenagers. i.e. the rose-tinted glasses effect was in full effect.


Also don't insult our intelligence. The phrase rose-tinted glasses was obviously used in the context of nostalgia. So the dictionary lesson was completely off topic and a way for you to show-off you know a greek word.