Ratings aren't needed for BG's

[Copain]

I've seen a lot of people saying how they only do BG's and think BG's need gear like Arena's. Allow me to explain some reasons I think they don't.

First off, think of what a BG counters, this would be normal instnaces. BG's give gear, but not as high quality gear as Arena's, just as Instances give gear, but not as high quality gear as raids. BG's are Like 5 man's in the sense that they are meant to introduce you into PVP and let you ahve some fun times without doing the more hardcore stuff.

Seconed, you ahve to think of the actual problems caused by this. By the end of BC most people got Merciless gear by going around and Afkin in a Battleground. If BG gear came out then this would see a Sharp rise because people would be getting gear, and not only not working, but not doing anything, making it harder on you. IT doens't matter to them if they win or lose, because they didn't invest any time. You might be thinking "They could invent some system needing kills for it" but where would that leave Healers? Inventing a System for that too would just let healers afk with some Macro/addon spamming spells for them. Other people like Tanks who do BG's (Say for AV or something) will not be able to get killing Blows for their stuff over the DPSers.

Third, work. As I stated before, BG's are Like Instances, easier things to introduce you into this stuff and so you can have fun (even raiders like to do BG's to have fun, and I assume even PVPers like to do some instances for fun). Arena's are more work and are harder and require more skill, and I don't want to hear someone saying "no they don't" because a BG has 9, 14, 39, (And the other numbers here, don't remember Strand/Eos ) covering for you or other people who have lack of skill, where as the Arena only has 1, 2, or 4 other people covering for you, and even then each one makes a big difference. The harder you work, the better stuff you get

Four, Current system. Just as new five man instances will come out, new BGers gear will come out. This BG gear will be old Arena gear (if they do like they did in BC), while it's behind, you still get gear for doing Battlegrounds. You earn Honor and Marks (Granted right now the marks don't do much). If you don't wnat to do the more Hardcore stuff, you are going to have to wait for your gear =p.



I can understand some of your frustration, but if you think about it it's really Fair that the easier things give less gear. I'm not saying BG's are Easy or anything, but I'm saying they aren't as hardcore as Arenas, just as instances aren't as hardcore as Raids. The more Hardcore stuff you do, the more rewards you get =).

[Cakethebarbarian]

good comparison but bgs are unlike 5mans because in a 5man people WILL Work with you but normally in bgs its

LOLOLOL IHAZ DEE STABLES LOLFARMTEHFARM AMIRITE?

and it makes a good number of us sad pandas

[Teebu]

Third, work. As I stated before, BG's are Like Instances, easier things to introduce you into this stuff and so you can have fun (even raiders like to do BG's to have fun, and I assume even PVPers like to do some instances for fun). Arena's are more work and are harder and require more skill, and I don't want to hear someone saying "no they don't" because a BG has 9, 14, 39, (And the other numbers here, don't remember Strand/Eos ) covering for you or other people who have lack of skill, where as the Arena only has 1, 2, or 4 other people covering for you, and even then each one makes a big difference. The harder you work, the better stuff you get

It's true that in a Battleground you have more people covering your laziness, but in a Battleground you also have more people to fight against. In an arena match, you are most likely to win a 2v2 if you kill one of the opposing team members, but in a battleground the people respawn. That makes it a bit harder if you're pushing the other faction back to their base or whatnot. In an arena match, you WILL get healed by your healer if you have one. In a Battleground match, the healers(if you have any) have more people to heal and you might not be on top of the priority list thus making survival even harder.

[Ugrana]

Inventing a System for that too would just let healers afk with some Macro/addon spamming spells for them.

There is no such macro. or addon. if there is an addon it will soon be put to rest by blizzard. if it requires Honorable kills instead of just honor, the afk people would get far fewer honorable kills, since most of the time they are not around the action. Right now you get honor for winning/losing. that is what the AFK people are afking for.

[Deleted]

Hmmm...u have some point but...,please don 't compare bg with arena and pve...All of those are completly different things.In arena u are u and ur teamate.If ur teamate does a s...t,then u got f.....d!Arena isn t skill atm its cooperation.It s 2/3/5 ppl that cooperate.You get rated for cooperation.I meen this is very good and there u can see ur understanding about how classes work,or how they used by a certain combo.Sometimes there u use ur brain/mentality/situation/luck/even psycology and u win the match.In a bg u have a solo person doing this and that
help the team,solo acts,1v1,1v2 , 10v10,u need to keep a watch on many things going on all together(thats what the hardcore 1 does,lazies just pewpew),u see critical situation of the game and act(u save it for another day or go all out).Also i don t see a class and spec be less usefull in bgs.Tanks have their own role.They take fire,lasting under ammount of dmg that none can withstand saving dps classes from get smoked(cause if someone starts hitting the tank,he stacks to the tank),also they are best FC in the game.Its not about killing blows...healers heal,dpsers kill,and tanks go front take dmg and be the mosquito who's breaking ur b....ls and carry flags!Also an arena is a "honored" competition,while bg is the "dirty" war one!It s not the same arena and bg...and u must be rated and be rewarded diffrently but at the same lvl.I think u don t remember LvL60 bgs that were rated.Did u see anyone slacking in bgs those days??Nop...whatever gets rated somehow its not slacking place.And no it s not the same playing bgs and 5man instance...in bgs when u playing seriously u re always in tention...are u ever playing like crazy in a 5man?or do u need much "skills" to pve anyway?
You re not saying it is easy,you say it s slacking...but if they rate it too,it won't be anymore!And arena it s not hardcore.It s the pvper that can be hardcore and he ll spread pure pwnage in arena,in bg and even he'll do it in world pvp and even in duels!!!The man does it hardcore,not the place!Think about those things...

[Copain]

There is no such macro. or addon. if there is an addon it will soon be put to rest by blizzard. if it requires Honorable kills instead of just honor, the afk people would get far fewer honorable kills, since most of the time they are not around the action. Right now you get honor for winning/losing. that is what the AFK people are afking for.

I've heard people say they should make it based on honor Kills, and I'm saying a Healer is healing, not killing. And they are still "pvping" by healing. You aren't reading the whole thing. It's possible to set up a macro/addon that cast say, Lesser heal every 5 secs.


Teebu, you have a point, yes. But you counteract it. You have To fight more, but because the heals are so spread out you kill them easier.

In a 2v2 killing someone does a lot more on chances, but you also have a largely less chance of dieing since you have someone at your back fo sure (unless he's.. stupid ..?)



You have a good point Cake, but at the same time there's a lot of idiots who don't know what they are doing; one person can end a group =\.

[archform]

I've seen a lot of people saying how they only do BG's and think BG's need gear like Arena's. Allow me to explain some reasons I think they don't.

First off, think of what a BG counters, this would be normal instnaces. BG's give gear, but not as high quality gear as Arena's, just as Instances give gear, but not as high quality gear as raids. BG's are Like 5 man's in the sense that they are meant to introduce you into PVP and let you ahve some fun times without doing the more hardcore stuff.

Seconed, you ahve to think of the actual problems caused by this. By the end of BC most people got Merciless gear by going around and Afkin in a Battleground. If BG gear came out then this would see a Sharp rise because people would be getting gear, and not only not working, but not doing anything, making it harder on you. IT doens't matter to them if they win or lose, because they didn't invest any time. You might be thinking "They could invent some system needing kills for it" but where would that leave Healers? Inventing a System for that too would just let healers afk with some Macro/addon spamming spells for them. Other people like Tanks who do BG's (Say for AV or something) will not be able to get killing Blows for their stuff over the DPSers.

Third, work. As I stated before, BG's are Like Instances, easier things to introduce you into this stuff and so you can have fun (even raiders like to do BG's to have fun, and I assume even PVPers like to do some instances for fun). Arena's are more work and are harder and require more skill, and I don't want to hear someone saying "no they don't" because a BG has 9, 14, 39, (And the other numbers here, don't remember Strand/Eos ) covering for you or other people who have lack of skill, where as the Arena only has 1, 2, or 4 other people covering for you, and even then each one makes a big difference. The harder you work, the better stuff you get

Four, Current system. Just as new five man instances will come out, new BGers gear will come out. This BG gear will be old Arena gear (if they do like they did in BC), while it's behind, you still get gear for doing Battlegrounds. You earn Honor and Marks (Granted right now the marks don't do much). If you don't wnat to do the more Hardcore stuff, you are going to have to wait for your gear =p.



I can understand some of your frustration, but if you think about it it's really Fair that the easier things give less gear. I'm not saying BG's are Easy or anything, but I'm saying they aren't as hardcore as Arenas, just as instances aren't as hardcore as Raids. The more Hardcore stuff you do, the more rewards you get =).

BGs and Arena are very different



for a BG rating system....

Average out dmg and healing...

extra points for
HK
Deaths*yes deaths cause that means your at least in a fight**Killing yourself by a spell wont count*
.........................the 2 above would prolly give the least amount

WSG
capping flag
returning flag
AB
being within 50 yards of when a base was assulted and if tis captured you earn the extra points
if you dont capture base you earn no points
..................killing Enemy players while within 50 yards of the base you control
*there is no possible way to tell the diff between a afker and someone jsut standding in one place defending *
*being within 50 yards of flag when its defended
.....................
AV well....il skip this one for now
............................
EoTS
earn points for carrying and capping flag
earn points for being in teh area of the captured building
*lose some points if the building you got points for being in the area when it was captured was taken by the Opposite faction but you dont lose all the points maybe about 1/4 or 1/2
........................
SoTA....again cant think of everything thats involved....

[Copain]

BGs and Arena are very different



for a BG rating system....

Average out dmg and healing...

extra points for
HK
Deaths*yes deaths cause that means your at least in a fight**Killing yourself by a spell wont count*
.........................the 2 above would prolly give the least amount

WSG
capping flag
returning flag
AB
being within 50 yards of when a base was assulted and if tis captured you earn the extra points
if you dont capture base you earn no points
..................killing Enemy players while within 50 yards of the base you control
*there is no possible way to tell the diff between a afker and someone jsut standding in one place defending *
*being within 50 yards of flag when its defended
.....................
AV well....il skip this one for now
............................
EoTS
earn points for carrying and capping flag
earn points for being in teh area of the captured building
*lose some points if the building you got points for being in the area when it was captured was taken by the Opposite faction but you dont lose all the points maybe about 1/4 or 1/2
........................
SoTA....again cant think of everything thats involved....

"Average out dmg and healing..."

Flash of light flash of light Flash of light flash of light Flash of light flash of light Flash of light flash of light Flash of light flash of light Flash of light flash of light Flash of light flash of light Flash of light flash of light Flash of light flash of light Flash of light flash of light Flash of light flash of light Flash of light flash of light Flash of light flash of light Flash of light flash of light Flash of light flash of light Flash of light flash of light Flash of light flash of light Flash of light flash of light Flash of light flash of light Flash of light flash of light Flash of light flash of light Flash of light flash of light Flash of light flash of light Flash of light flash of light Flash of light flash of light Flash of light flash of light Flash of light flash of light Flash of light flash of light Flash of light flash of light Flash of light flash of light Flash of light flash of light Flash of light flash of light Flash of light flash of light Flash of light flash of light Flash of light flash of light Flash of light flash of light Flash of light flash of light Flash of light flash of light Flash of light flash of light Flash of light flash of light Flash of light flash of light Flash of light flash of light Flash of light flash of light Or another healing spell, easily cheatable, and can't nerf the points because then it's not fair to the real healers who would be earning less since they aren't actually spamming (and don't claim tehre is something they could do to prevent spamming, writing a conditional script complex enough to mee the situations is nigh impossible). And if it's not castable on themselves just two people do it two eachother.


AB being within range, Just hide in the Lumber mill or something, the mines work too. Rogues/Druids/Night elves would have a much easier time just sitting around with this.


Death's, just something on the W key so it moves you forward, then you auto go to the BG area, die, eventually release and res, auto run forward...

Capping/Returning Flag. Bonus HONOR is given for this, yes. But this isn't a balanced way. Capping is harder for some classes than others. Rogues have Sprint and Shaman's have Ghost wolf, where a Warrior or something has nothing.


AV, kinda one of the biggest deals from waht I've sen >_>;...


EoTs, hide behind a tower.



People will find ways to abuse it no matter what the system is, currently honor is the only good one that doesn't prove problematic in a lot of ways. The only improvement I could think of would be the Reporting AFK system. But People always find ways to cheat them.

Search for AV afking on YOutube, IIRC there's a ton of videos.

[kailtas]

Dear OP.

i stoped readin when u said that in 5 man u get lower quality gear than in 25 man. makes sense.

please explain what makes Arena higher up than BG now

[Shamb]

"Average out dmg and healing..."

Flash of light flash of light Flash of light flash of light Flash of light flash of light Flash of light flash of light Flash of light flash of light Flash of light flash of light Flash of light flash of light Flash of light flash of light Flash of light flash of light Flash of light flash of light Flash of light flash of light Flash of light flash of light Flash of light flash of light Flash of light flash of light Flash of light flash of light Flash of light flash of light Flash of light flash of light Flash of light flash of light Flash of light flash of light Flash of light flash of light Flash of light flash of light Flash of light flash of light Flash of light flash of light Flash of light flash of light Flash of light flash of light Flash of light flash of light Flash of light flash of light Flash of light flash of light Flash of light flash of light Flash of light flash of light Flash of light flash of light Flash of light flash of light Flash of light flash of light Flash of light flash of light Flash of light flash of light Flash of light flash of light Flash of light flash of light Flash of light flash of light Flash of light flash of light Flash of light flash of light Flash of light flash of light Flash of light flash of light Flash of light flash of light Or another healing spell, easily cheatable, and can't nerf the points because then it's not fair to the real healers who would be earning less since they aren't actually spamming (and don't claim tehre is something they could do to prevent spamming, writing a conditional script complex enough to mee the situations is nigh impossible). And if it's not castable on themselves just two people do it two eachother.

WTF are you talking about ? They would obviously just count healing done that is NOT overhealing .... Just like recount doesn't monitor overhealing in the healing done section. It ain't hard to do...

@ OP:

I would just put 1 more thing in eots. Ppl that go for flag before 2 minutes at least after bg start lose 100000 honor for being fuckin morons. I die a lil inside everytime I see like 5 fuckheads alliance going for middle when bg starts... then I know we lost.

First: control towers, then cap flag. No the other way around.

[Copain]

Dear OP.

i stoped readin when u said that in 5 man u get lower quality gear than in 25 man. makes sense.

please explain what makes Arena higher up than BG now

Just as Instances are PuGable and can be done without anyone knowing eachother, so can BG's. Most Raids work better if everyone knows eachother and work together (hense why premades do better in BG's?). In an Arena you can't just go out and do whatever and expect to do well, you follow a plan :P. For instance, if you just randomly attack thjings in Arena, you won't do as much as an entire team blitzing one person or CCing the proper people (so no attacks on CC'd htings); and as a Counterpart, think of Thaddius. If you don't move with your charge, you Die and he won't die fast enough, but in an instance you can basically ignore something like the Tree boss's ice spikes In Nexus and still be ok, since it's easier to slack off.

You won't get as far in Arena's by slacking off as you would in BG's.

[archform]

"Average out dmg and healing..."

Flash of light flash of light Flash of light flash of light Flash of light flash of light Flash of light flash of light Flash of light flash of light Flash of light flash of light Flash of light flash of light Flash of light flash of light Flash of light flash of light Flash of light flash of light Flash of light flash of light Flash of light flash of light Flash of light flash of light Flash of light flash of light Flash of light flash of light Flash of light flash of light Flash of light flash of light Flash of light flash of light Flash of light flash of light Flash of light flash of light Flash of light flash of light Flash of light flash of light Flash of light flash of light Flash of light flash of light Flash of light flash of light Flash of light flash of light Flash of light flash of light Flash of light flash of light Flash of light flash of light Flash of light flash of light Flash of light flash of light Flash of light flash of light Flash of light flash of light Flash of light flash of light Flash of light flash of light Flash of light flash of light Flash of light flash of light Flash of light flash of light Flash of light flash of light Flash of light flash of light Flash of light flash of light Flash of light flash of light Flash of light flash of light Or another healing spell, easily cheatable, and can't nerf the points because then it's not fair to the real healers who would be earning less since they aren't actually spamming (and don't claim tehre is something they could do to prevent spamming, writing a conditional script complex enough to mee the situations is nigh impossible). And if it's not castable on themselves just two people do it two eachother.


AB being within range, Just hide in the Lumber mill or something, the mines work too. Rogues/Druids/Night elves would have a much easier time just sitting around with this.


Death's, just something on the W key so it moves you forward, then you auto go to the BG area, die, eventually release and res, auto run forward...

Capping/Returning Flag. Bonus HONOR is given for this, yes. But this isn't a balanced way. Capping is harder for some classes than others. Rogues have Sprint and Shaman's have Ghost wolf, where a Warrior or something has nothing.


AV, kinda one of the biggest deals from waht I've sen >_>;...


EoTs, hide behind a tower.



People will find ways to abuse it no matter what the system is, currently honor is the only good one that doesn't prove problematic in a lot of ways. The only improvement I could think of would be the Reporting AFK system. But People always find ways to cheat them.

Search for AV afking on YOutube, IIRC there's a ton of videos.

over healing and overkill wont count
and if a pally healer is beating them from healing then...well they can go heal another target *pallys not that good at multiple heals on alot of targets*
*plus dps is gonna go for the guy whos healing*


prot warriors are meant to be hard to kill
*need healer with them*
and any other spec would do dps
*prot isnt that great of a pvp sepc anyway
and prot warrior can go do dps


*stealthing wont count
just like in pvp objectives if you stealth you dont count as being there
*like hellfire towers
*and the area range would be small enough to they dont hide way back where no one can see them
*when i say this many yards its really just a guess and cna be changed
*hiding behind a tower in EotS
and doing nothing wont really increase your rating if your not doing that much
and if your there and it gets taken back you still earn less

the whole system of adding all the points up is still not here yet
so prolly if you dont earn a minimum amount of points your ratings go down
and if you score way above minimum your ratings go alot higher but not by a huge amount

the mimimum will be high enough so you cant lazy your way thru and maybe require a amount of healing or dmg done in the BG for the Bgs that reward points for just being around the area
to make sure they are doing something

now if someone cant do any dmg cause ppl die too quickly or heal cause someone heals too quickly
then guess what
you shouldnt get any points since your really doing nothing and being carried thru
*bgs last long enough and are big enough where at some point your gonna be able to heal or do dmg
unless your in a BG with ppl who are killing everyone very ez
and to stop that
have everyone have a personal BG rating and average it out from all the ppl
*for when theres few ppl and your doing a high rated BG then your prolly gonna get that low rating person mainly cause theres not enough ppl
*ppl who go into a BG and leave in anyway besides DC
will get negative points cause if there already doing something they shouldnt commit to a Rated BG and then say i gtg
*there prolly will still be unrated BGs
i might add more to this sooner or later

[leandar]

Difference is if your not the right class youll have a much harder time doing arena and might not be able to get higher up because 2/3/5 people are something that is doing well. With raiding your class might do less dps than others but the raid can still kill the boss.

[DoomDeezy]

I've seen a lot of people saying how they only do BG's and think BG's need gear like Arena's. Allow me to explain some reasons I think they don't.

First off, think of what a BG counters, this would be normal instnaces. BG's give gear, but not as high quality gear as Arena's, just as Instances give gear, but not as high quality gear as raids. BG's are Like 5 man's in the sense that they are meant to introduce you into PVP and let you ahve some fun times without doing the more hardcore stuff.

Seconed, you ahve to think of the actual problems caused by this. By the end of BC most people got Merciless gear by going around and Afkin in a Battleground. If BG gear came out then this would see a Sharp rise because people would be getting gear, and not only not working, but not doing anything, making it harder on you. IT doens't matter to them if they win or lose, because they didn't invest any time. You might be thinking "They could invent some system needing kills for it" but where would that leave Healers? Inventing a System for that too would just let healers afk with some Macro/addon spamming spells for them. Other people like Tanks who do BG's (Say for AV or something) will not be able to get killing Blows for their stuff over the DPSers.

Third, work. As I stated before, BG's are Like Instances, easier things to introduce you into this stuff and so you can have fun (even raiders like to do BG's to have fun, and I assume even PVPers like to do some instances for fun). Arena's are more work and are harder and require more skill, and I don't want to hear someone saying "no they don't" because a BG has 9, 14, 39, (And the other numbers here, don't remember Strand/Eos ) covering for you or other people who have lack of skill, where as the Arena only has 1, 2, or 4 other people covering for you, and even then each one makes a big difference. The harder you work, the better stuff you get

Four, Current system. Just as new five man instances will come out, new BGers gear will come out. This BG gear will be old Arena gear (if they do like they did in BC), while it's behind, you still get gear for doing Battlegrounds. You earn Honor and Marks (Granted right now the marks don't do much). If you don't wnat to do the more Hardcore stuff, you are going to have to wait for your gear =p.



I can understand some of your frustration, but if you think about it it's really Fair that the easier things give less gear. I'm not saying BG's are Easy or anything, but I'm saying they aren't as hardcore as Arenas, just as instances aren't as hardcore as Raids. The more Hardcore stuff you do, the more rewards you get =).

Very nice and well thought out post. However, i do disagree.
1. I feel that the rating system is needed because no one can afk/bot they're way through it (hopefully) so we don't have to worry about tons of people having the gear.

2. Arena as is, is very favorable to certain classes and while those 4 or 5 classes are enjoying the benefits of a decision they made years ago, other people are suffering. So , I'm all for them making it fun/fair for everyone to get gear. I assume that arena people will still enjoy superior weapons and a cool mount so enjoy those.

[BlacKcuD]

good comparison but bgs are unlike 5mans because in a 5man people WILL Work with you but normally in bgs its

LOLOLOL IHAZ DEE STABLES LOLFARMTEHFARM AMIRITE?

and it makes a good number of us sad pandas

sadly this is sooo true...

[sillverhair]

lol at OP,

bgs and arena are a totally different world, yes their both pvp, just like world pvp is pvp aswell...
there however any same things end..

first off all to successfully participate in bgs vs arena you have to watch for a lot more factors than in arena, 2nd off all as everyone knows a certain arena team build guarantees easier wins than certain other combinations. while this is only partially true for bgs, where you need a couple healers and lots off dps, possibly 1 high hp tank to carry flags and such tho this can easily be done by a dps.

also theres the fact that bgs require tactics while arena is just a zergfest pure and simple... pick the worst geared/hp and zerg it...

then dont forget the fact that anyone can face anyone in bgs thus making the chance high there will be some very well geared players on the opposing team thus you need the gear aswell.

bgs definetly need rating, or atleast a way to get the gear arena players are getting aswell, because theres loads off players who prefer bg>arena coz its just more fun, a lot more possible targets to kill + the fact that no one wants a fair fight?! i rather attack someone with low hp, whose sitting and eating than face someone head on... as does everyone else. theres also the bg buffs which can totally turn a fight around.

the randomness in bgs makes it a lot more interesting than arena for most players (im not saying arena is boring, just my opinion)

and as stated above arena and bgs are a totally different world, arena players arent "better or worse" than bg players, in either world tho people should be able to get the better gear, preferably through a rating system, as otherwise everyone can get the best gear. remember the old ranking system (where the gear was somewhat boring) but atleast you had to put work into getting somewhere.

now people will say you could grind that, but then you did need a good premade which essentially is the same as having a good/active arena team.

[drag4]

I would like rated/bg teams thing as well. Though, I do think things might be worse after that happens, but we should try it anyways
The best way to try it, I guess, is with WSG and make 10men WSG BG teams, just like arena ones. (max 20 members, % things and all that).
But IMO it just might make BG into a larger arena, and make you want turn off the computer, after an hour worth of that kind of fight.

On the pre tbc/battlegroup pvp in battlegrounds and gear/rank chases... It had its charms, but the amount of waiting, only to be faced (as a PUG) against THE premade of the realm over and over again...
And the whole ranks thing pre tbc..... :-X

[Copain]

Alrighty, answer me this.

BGs while easier to get into and easier to win (I will stick by this considering you work with complete strangers (unless you are plowing) rather than working wtih a set team) seem to (atleast according to you) deserve the same gear as Arena players. If this is the case: Then shouldn't instance gear (which is easier than raiding as it's easier to pug and do well) be as good as 25 Man Raid gear? It's not fair to those who have more fun in instances and want good gear but don't want to raid to have to be stuck with less quality gear is it?

[Profyrion]

Sorry but you've got it wrong.

Equal pay for equal work right?

Then BGs need superior gear to Arenas. Coordinating 20 or 40 players against 20 or 40 other players goes way beyond anything you'll ever see in a ranked arena match.

BG > Arena

[Copain]

Sorry but you've got it wrong.

Equal pay for equal work right?

Then BGs need superior gear to Arenas. Coordinating 20 or 40 players against 20 or 40 other players goes way beyond anything you'll ever see in a ranked arena match.

BG > Arena

...No

"Coordinating" is more than saying "half defend and half attack" or something. On top of that they typically don't listen. BG's typically come down to zerging some place as fast as possible. Take AV for example, it is badass in nature, but now if a game last longer than 5 mins the team is turtling and they should stop defending the stuff and attack.

Arena's can last much longer than BG's, specially higher ranked ones. And they require much more cordination to keep everyone alive, as noone comes back after they die by some spirit healer.

In BG's you can do whatever because there is no real downside to your actions from death, you die and your team can still win, you even come back after a few secs. You die in an Arena and there's a low chance your team will win (If you are first to die).

In a BG you can play a few matches and do whatever and stuff will acumalate over time easily. People in Arena's have to play atleast ten a week and many do hundreds of Arenas.