Shadowmourne from 10-man Heroic?

[Harvesting]

Should it come from 10 man NO.

I raid 10m guild runs and pug 25's, I have raided since Vanilla have seen 40, 25's and 10's. My guild did start LK running 25's and we decided to stop recruiting and dealing with loot whores. I like the feel of a 10m better. This game like life is a time sink just because we put the same time as anyone doesn't justify the same rewards. In RL those of us who work 40 hrs get the same pay? same vacations? same car? no.

I can't even use this legendary but an item such as legendary should only be rewarded to those who put whatever Blizz requires to get it, this means by definition it should not be accessable to the masses.

imo 10m TOGC is harder than 25m ToC, unless you take the best 10 members from the 25m ToC. I back this up by asking how many trade chats do you see for 10m ToGC? I see 25m ToC every log in. If 10m ToGC was easier wouldn't we see more pugs? I challenge anyone to start 2 pugs (complete pugs no guildies) 25m ToC & 10 ToGC and tell me what one was easier. I have pugged and killed Anub in 25 ToC, I have yet to see a 10 ToGC pug in chat.

Unless as Humans you think we don't go towards the path of least resistance.

[syanid]

people who do mainly 10mans pay their $15 a month too.. why is it because they don't feel like trying to carry / wiping with 5+ idiots in a big guild, that they don't deserve a legendary weapon?

some servers there are so few alliance that you can't really get into a good 25 guild, so you either do 10's with friends or fail at 25's because people can't hit a few buttons at the right time

Legendary isn't something anyone can have. 10 mans require less effort.
You have VoA, you have 10 mans hard / easy modes which are doable within a day. You cannot honestly think you really deserve a legendary on top of that.

[Temsen]

If you say that Shadowmourne shouldn't be obtainable from 10man Heroic because "LOL, 10man is easier than 25man, LOL" you're a retard who fails at reading.
Difficultywise it'd be fair seeing that HEROIC 10man is usually harder than NORMAL 25man.

The only "valid" reason I see is that dedicated 25man guilds could (easily) form 3 or more 10man groups just for Shadowmourne, essentially making 4 legendaries while a pure 25man guild would just obtain one. So yea, not gonna happen. (although I like the idea of Shadow's Edge from 10man )

[Maskinen]

I love it that people talk about 15$ a month like it matters.
Who cares. It's pocket change. It's nada.

Well if your a kid/troll/noob I see why would want to mention it,
but should we really care about people who use the monthly subscription
as an argument, regardless of what they are discussing.

If your server dosen't have any good guilds, try to make one or x-fer.

Should roleplayers be given a legendary axe because they pay 15$ too?
If you don't have any guilds but instead prefer doing 5-man heroics, should
you be awarded a legendary axe?

Take those 15$ and spend them on some candy, because that argument is
worthless, and quite frankly annoying as hell.

[Pieuvre]

still means no for shadowmourne, caster legendary however every scrub will have from 10 man and will just be an epic with orange letters

Disagree, because that would be going against what Blizzard wants from their legendaries.

[FamilyGoat]

I still don't understand why we don't "deserve" things. Some of us who only do 10 mans put in just as much time and effort as people who do 25 mans (and sometimes MORE)...we just do things with less people.

This is fail logic. By your own words, people who get the gladiator titles should also have a chance at getting this (random drops off PvP kills!), since they put in just as much time and effort (:P) as people who do 10 mans...just with less people.

People complained that they couldn't raid cuz they couldn't get 40+ people on at the same time to raid.
-->Blizzard came out with 25 man raids (with 1 10 man baby raid at the start).

People complained that they still couldn't get 25 people to log on at the same time, or didn't have the time needed to run 25 mans. They also complained that only the best got epics and they couldn't get it cuz they didn't have the time.
-->Blizzard came out with 10 mans and 25 mans, and made purples drop like candy from the last bosses of heroic 5 man dungeons, later from every boss from dungeon 5 mans (reg AND heroic). They also started to let you buy better purples from badges you could get without raiding any content at all, and made the crafted epics much easier to obtain (can get the rare mats from badges instead of JUST random raid drops).

People complained that 10mans where not a challenge and the baby mod to raids, that the wanted hard content, but still coulnd't get 25 people to do it.
-->Blizzard introduces HM content from certain bosses, with better loot. This later became a separate raid so you could do every boss on HM, get better loot, and it was more of a challenge.

Now people complain that its not fair only 25 mans get legendary items.
-->? (Blizzard will bend once again, legendary items will drop from 10man content, once cata hits:
Green=droped off every mob (new gray)
Blue=all quest rewards(the new green)
Purple=all dungeon rewards (the new blue)
Orange=all raid rewards (the new purple)
Bronze=the new orange (ignoring BoA oc)

Personally, I can't wait to get:
http://www.wowhead.com/?item=17
http://www.wowhead.com/?item=12947


EDIT: OMG! I forgot:
gray/white=droped by all critters!

[Lady Mormont]

1) yes from reading the quests it DOES appear that it can be obtainable via regular mode, but we wont know for sure until the quest has been completed

2) An i284 item through heroic 10m? nope

[JimPanse]

if the 10man ICC heroic has a worthy difficulty for that, why not?

But they will not be able to do this, since 10man content gives players the chance to outgear the place in no time due to the 25man-gear.

€dit: Main problem is that you would get twice the chances and all that stuff per week.

[Rspec]

Since it seems Shadowmourne will be available from 25-man normal modes, do you think there is any chance Blizzard would make the weapon available for the 10-man Heroic version of ICC? Historically, the two have always awarded the same iLvl of gear, typically even with some BiS pieces in the 10-man Heroic version.

I've been monitoring some of the posts on the official forums on the subject, and one of the major concerns seems to be that 25-man guilds would farm 10-mans to get the legendary faster, but I really don't think that would be a problem. There's only 3 things that need to be farmed in the quest chain: Primordial Saronite (which doesn't bind, so you could just buy these off the AH if you needed them), souls (which can already be obtained from either 10 or 25), and Shadowfrost Shards (which is pretty much the only real problem).

The Shadowfrost Shard problem could be easily fixed by splitting the quest chain in 2 at that spot, giving a "The Splintered Throne (Heroic 10 Player)" quest and a "The Splintered Throne (25 Player)" quest. The 25 player version would be exactly the same as the one that exists now, and the Heroic 10-man version would simply have you collecting similar shards (same name and icon, but different ID) from 10-man Heroic bosses. You'd only be able to choose one of the quests, and both would lead back into the same spot of the questline.

This would allow both Heroic 10-man groups and 25-man groups to obtain Shadowmourne without forcing 25-man groups to do any more 10-mans than they'd already need to do.

Its a Legendary. You have to actually work hard for it. Thats why they gave you the trash farming. Otherwise, people would just run in and get it.

[FamilyGoat]

Since it seems Shadowmourne will be available from 25-man normal modes, do you think there is any chance Blizzard would make the weapon available for the 10-man Heroic version of ICC? Historically, the two have always awarded the same iLvl of gear, typically even with some BiS pieces in the 10-man Heroic version.

Sorry, just noticed this. Historically? Really? Since when does the last (read LAST) tier content represented historically? Ulduar had HM loot, yet HM loot from 10 man was a higher ilv then reg 25 man loot. ONLY ToC has had HM loot from its 10 man that was of the same ilv as 25 reg. Or are you one of those people that JUST started to raid 3.2 and assumes everything has always been like this? Historically, 10 man content didn't exist prior to WtoLK, and Historically, neither did HM content. Historically, 10 and 25 man loot have always (prior to ToC) offered loot with different ilvs. Historically, Legendary items have also only been available from 25+ raid content.

[Herecius]

Historically, 10 man content didn't exist prior to WtoLK

Historically, Karazhan was a 10-man raid.

[Netherinfern0]

Yeah sure... here we go again. 10 man is ONLY easier because ppl have 25 man gear... sure.

It's not for nothing that 25 man drops higher ilvl gear...

This. 100%.

[ThunderBear]

This is fail logic. By your own words, people who get the gladiator titles should also have a chance at getting this (random drops off PvP kills!), since they put in just as much time and effort (:P) as people who do 10 mans...just with less people.

People complained that they couldn't raid cuz they couldn't get 40+ people on at the same time to raid.
-->Blizzard came out with 25 man raids (with 1 10 man baby raid at the start).

People complained that they still couldn't get 25 people to log on at the same time, or didn't have the time needed to run 25 mans. They also complained that only the best got epics and they couldn't get it cuz they didn't have the time.
-->Blizzard came out with 10 mans and 25 mans, and made purples drop like candy from the last bosses of heroic 5 man dungeons, later from every boss from dungeon 5 mans (reg AND heroic). They also started to let you buy better purples from badges you could get without raiding any content at all, and made the crafted epics much easier to obtain (can get the rare mats from badges instead of JUST random raid drops).

People complained that 10mans where not a challenge and the baby mod to raids, that the wanted hard content, but still coulnd't get 25 people to do it.
-->Blizzard introduces HM content from certain bosses, with better loot. This later became a separate raid so you could do every boss on HM, get better loot, and it was more of a challenge.

Now people complain that its not fair only 25 mans get legendary items.
-->? (Blizzard will bend once again, legendary items will drop from 10man content, once cata hits:
Green=droped off every mob (new gray)
Blue=all quest rewards(the new green)
Purple=all dungeon rewards (the new blue)
Orange=all raid rewards (the new purple)
Bronze=the new orange (ignoring BoA oc)

Personally, I can't wait to get:
http://www.wowhead.com/?item=17
http://www.wowhead.com/?item=12947


EDIT: OMG! I forgot:
gray/white=droped by all critters!

I concur

[nucz0r]

10 man content didn't exist prior to WtoLK

Historically, Karazhan was a 10-man raid.

Also, UBRS was 10-man after like 1.6 if i remember right

[Dalco]

Historically, 10 man content didn't exist prior to WtoLK,

Wow, you don't understand just how wrong you are.

[kliffharry]

Historically, Karazhan was a 10-man raid.

Historically, Zul'Aman was a 10-man raid as well.

[Xleetskeetx]

Stratholme and Scholomance too, one of them was 15 with UBRS, I think it was Strath. I don't remember, that was a long time ago.

[Cookies_N_Creme]

Historically, 10 man content didn't exist prior to WtoLK, and Historically, neither did HM content. Historically, 10 and 25 man loot have always (prior to ToC) offered loot with different ilvs. Historically, Legendary items have also only been available from 25+ raid content.

>.> Kara, ZA, LBRS, Ect... Well, Ilevel wasent in BC or Vanilla so I can't make contest. And finally for the Legendary items... Yes because I'm pretty sure everything was in 40 mans... I may be mistaken with a peice of Atiesh but, Meh, to lazy to go look it up, The point is, Both BC and Vanilla had 10 mans... Fail flame is Fail.

[Deleted]

Since it seems Shadowmourne will be available from 25-man normal modes, do you think there is any chance Blizzard would make the weapon available for the 10-man Heroic version of ICC? Historically, the two have always awarded the same iLvl of gear, typically even with some BiS pieces in the 10-man Heroic version.

I've been monitoring some of the posts on the official forums on the subject, and one of the major concerns seems to be that 25-man guilds would farm 10-mans to get the legendary faster, but I really don't think that would be a problem. There's only 3 things that need to be farmed in the quest chain: Primordial Saronite (which doesn't bind, so you could just buy these off the AH if you needed them), souls (which can already be obtained from either 10 or 25), and Shadowfrost Shards (which is pretty much the only real problem).

The Shadowfrost Shard problem could be easily fixed by splitting the quest chain in 2 at that spot, giving a "The Splintered Throne (Heroic 10 Player)" quest and a "The Splintered Throne (25 Player)" quest. The 25 player version would be exactly the same as the one that exists now, and the Heroic 10-man version would simply have you collecting similar shards (same name and icon, but different ID) from 10-man Heroic bosses. You'd only be able to choose one of the quests, and both would lead back into the same spot of the questline.

This would allow both Heroic 10-man groups and 25-man groups to obtain Shadowmourne without forcing 25-man groups to do any more 10-mans than they'd already need to do.

Answers:
1. No, blizzard will not make a legendary for 10man heroic.
2. What you chose 1/10 chance or 1/25?
3. Also the legendary will require to make 25man HARD MODES so no, not every casual 25man guild will get legendarys.
4. Hope you stop with this since there is no point in doing it.

[FamilyGoat]

Sorry, yes 10 man content did exist prior to wrath, but not in its current form is what I was getting at. Since WotLK was released, you either have the choice of doing a 10 man, or 25 man (or both), and the encounter will be the same (as in same abilities, for the most part). Yes tactics will varry, but for the most, you can go from 10-->25 and just add a few more tanks and healers, fill in the rest with dps. Prior 10 mans were raids of their own, and mostly just their to wet the feet of new raiders (ZA might be an exception to this, but when it came out, I had better gear, for the most, so it was just a mount/alt run, so correct me if I'm wrong, but wasn't this just kara 2.0?). So yes, I was wrong in stating 10 mans didn't exist, but my point was the current incarnation of 10 mans isn't the same as those 3 (+?) 10 mans that were just ment to be mini raids.


Edit: Point remains it's stupid to say "Historically" about something thats hasn't been arround for all that long (1...2 tier patches if you really want to count Ulduar)
-->

Historically, the two have always awarded the same iLvl of gear...