Real hard modes for ICC - achievements for using no addons

[Ammeyh]

OMG - you mean heal people who are low health... Did our first heroic runs without mods to show who had it besides dbm. Having it shown just makes the fight mindless as healer (even more than normal).

The essence of a troll.

[Deleted]

Show me her dispells on FC.

And I wonder how well all of the DPS here would fare without Omen or anything similar (yes I do count the built in Blizzard Threatmeter as an addon.) There was a time in Vanilla where there was no threatmeter at all.

You had to literaly wait for 5 sunders on the boss...and on onyxia P1 most casters had to level their wands because you could not know exactly how much damage you could do until you pulled aggro.

And we all know that THERE IS NO AGGRO RESET!

I can tell you've never done Anub25 Heroic.

No. You absoultely DO NOT heal everyone that is low. You heal specific people that get Penetrating Cold. Everyone else should be at 5% health or less.

5% is too much.
Other than from JoL and Healing Stream totem, the raid shouldn't recieve any healing.
The minimum Leeching Swarm tick on Heroic 25 is like, what? 500?
That's the amount that should be healed. NOTHING above that.

[ritarian]

Now im going to agree with the majority here because thats how I feel as wall. First..I just want to refresh that you've never fought Anub 25, and if you have, you have no idea whats going on.
I dont see the big fuss about healers defending all the addons they claim to need. I play a shammy healer and manage to keep consistently on 1st or 2nd in healing done and hps against a holy priest, stay pretty close behind him on dispells but he's a holy priest so thats expected, and at the same time am doing the raid leading so im bound to drop a little on my heals some fights trying to babysit everyone. I only use dmb omen and recount. Blizzard UI gives you enough to see debuffs as long as you organize it right and dont have frames. I know the holy priest is running xperl quartz decursive and healbot and we're the two that make or break the raid on healing most of the time. Its just a matter of knowing what to expect and how to react to it.

[Soban]

make archevment for clearing ICC without using any special abilities
ftw

[SoulFrame]

make archevment for clearing ICC without using any special abilities
ftw

Brutallus that shit.

[Maduk]

Now im going to agree with the majority here because thats how I feel as wall. First..I just want to refresh that you've never fought Anub 25, and if you have, you have no idea whats going on.
I dont see the big fuss about healers defending all the addons they claim to need. I play a shammy healer and manage to keep consistently on 1st or 2nd in healing done and hps against a holy priest, stay pretty close behind him on dispells but he's a holy priest so thats expected, and at the same time am doing the raid leading so im bound to drop a little on my heals some fights trying to babysit everyone. I only use dmb omen and recount. Blizzard UI gives you enough to see debuffs as long as you organize it right and dont have frames. I know the holy priest is running xperl quartz decursive and healbot and we're the two that make or break the raid on healing most of the time. Its just a matter of knowing what to expect and how to react to it.

playing resto shamy is such a hard job...
no buffs, can only remove meaningless debuffs. yay !

(iam also a resto shamy..)

[Eletharin]

Would disabling them make raids harder? Yes. But so would setting your language to Swahili and having everyone in your raid speak in pig latin. It's about the same.

Amen brother. Or instead of changing language settings, play on a minimum system requirement computer. Since the game is designed to be playable at minimum system requirements, anything past this is an unfair advantage. Having a good computer, and a good connection to the internet does make the game A LOT easier. I raided on a busted, old laptop from shady hotel internet connections for years, and the day I bought my MSI laptop was like opening up a whole new world.

I don't know who started this "no addon" fan club, but its retarded. Putting together a good UI that works for you is part of what defines you as a player.

Also to beat a dead horse, some fights like ToGC25 Anub would not be possible without some form of addon (or tremendous RNG luck that every healer picks a different penetrating cold target at the same time every cooldown).

[Dedweight]

OMG - you mean heal people who are low health... Did our first heroic runs without mods to show who had it besides dbm. Having it shown just makes the fight mindless as healer (even more than normal).

I lol'd

OP, Addons have never really been necessary, especially not ones like DBM, for quite a while. I personally didn't run DBM until around Hyjal/BT and even then didn't need it. Most of the boss mechanics are given to you by default, try disabling any boss mod and watch your chat log, you'll see what I mean.

Only addon's I consistently used were Recount and Omen(since most dps could easily out threat tanks in BC it was nice to know when I needed to use my threat cooldowns).

Also to beat a dead horse, some fights like ToGC25 Anub would not be possible without some form of addon (or tremendous RNG luck that every healer picks a different penetrating cold target at the same time every cooldown).

It would be possible and wouldn't require much of any RNG luck, there's something called "healer assignments" might consider looking into it. :P

[Yosef1015]

You know how fun heroic anub would be if none of the healers had grid or healbot or dbm to mark penetrating colds. Vent would be insane trying to figure that out every 20 or so seconds. Probably a lot less guilds would have him down. Like almost no guilds.

That's the point.

[Grimreaper]

How about disabling addons, and also not watching videos from Tankspot or something of that nature? How about no sites like mmo or wowwiki to delineate the abilities and skills of the bosses?

Thats exactly what i'm doing, and i still complain about the game beeing too easy. I have seen and done all the encounters as tank and dps, and most of them as healer. It has never held me back or been any sort of disadvantage. The most fun i'll ever have when raiding, is pulling a new boss that i havent seen before, without knowing anything at all about it.

[Asgard]

Yeah... Comfort is bad.

I think all produced cars shouldn't have any seats, steering wheel, speed and RPM gauges, you know a REALLY skilled driver should drive a car without all of that.

[Tore]

OMG - you mean heal people who are low health... Did our first heroic runs without mods to show who had it besides dbm. Having it shown just makes the fight mindless as healer (even more than normal).

Torethyr looks at Mandible and covers his face with his palm.

[Edog720]

I've read the first 2 pages of this thread, and i'm a little confused. How exactly does taking away addons like DBM, Recount, and Grid make this game any more difficult? The blizzard UI has most, if not all, of these features standard now...and it wasn't by default. Blizzard took a look at the most popular addons and incorporated them into the game as it is ( Just look at seeing item levels, the new questhelper option in 3.3, Equipment Manager!!!).

I've done a little of everything (Healing, DPSing and Tanking) both with and without addons *For the record, nothing was hardmode, so I can't comment on that stuff* and found out that its simply the way its presented that makes the addons what they are! DBM timers simply alert me when a "Special Ability" is about to happen, so i'll hold off on a cooldown if it means burning a new add down, or possibly needing to change colors or something in twin valkyries fight. If I didn't have DBM, i might have popped a big cooldown and then went "Dammit, have to change color", of which I can do with or without an addon. Its a preference on GUIs in the long run.

No addon makes you better at Tanking/DPSing/Healing besides just dumbing down the buttons you push. The reason content has become "Nerfed" compared to vanilla is that Blizzard wants more people to see it. They offer the easier versions for everyone, and those that wish to get better gear can fight in more difficult conditions *Hardmodes*. I just think a lot of people get burnt out on content when they clear it on easy mode over and over, and the few wipes they put in on hardmodes are just like "oh man, lets just kill this guy" type reactions.

Hard modes are fine...whether they're reserved for there own raids or gimmicks that you activate during the fight. You want to separate yourself from the herd of sheep? GO DO HARDMODES...don't complain that people who pay the same amount of money every month that you do should be denied access to stuff you want special access to! Hell, if you think Addons make the fights really easy, try the new content with no guild vent!


Edited for spelling. Yes, English is my first language...I just type to fast to be that accurate sometimes

[Annoying]

I have DBM activated because it's required by the guild

I have absolutely no need for it as I put in enough research before ever entering an instance- that it's wasted on me.

Other addons are just to make my UI prettier & that has nothing to do with a fight's difficulty.

I swap poisons manually so that I manage my GCD rather than the bads who rely on poison swapper to do it for them.

I know my character well enough to know what buffs are happening when- Envenom/S&D/HFB without a tracking addon.

So I'm going to say no- for some of us addons are un-needed... although it would be amusing to see other people flop around without DBM.

The difference between your run of the mill rogue and a good one is the ability to track 4+ buffs from trinkets/weapons. You can't do that with the default UI. Sorry, but as a rogue, if you're not using something to track everything, it means you're not effectively pooling energy. If you're not effectively pooling energy, you're a run of the mill rogue who can be replaced in a heartbeat.

[Fbl]

i dont see a problem here
if you wanna play without addons - play without addons
what seems to be the problem?

[Doctor Professor]

OMG - you mean heal people who are low health... Did our first heroic runs without mods to show who had it besides dbm. Having it shown just makes the fight mindless as healer (even more than normal).

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fEkWH...eature=related
Seriously. No other words can express it better.

make archevment for clearing ICC without using any special abilities
ftw

Archevment. Right.

[jonnybrovo]

Reminds me of being MT for sarth 3d 25 w/ no addons besides a bag addon, and a boss quote addon (It just makes your character say the quote and plays the soundfile). I'm a feral dr00d. I even got top 3 dps on mally 25 speed kill as a "side dps" (I'm mostly tank, but go dps when I need it.) Back before Ulduar, mind you.

Good players can manage their rage/mana/energy and buffs/debuffs/usables without any addons. (Says an old cat druid pre ulduar :)


I support the OP.

[exochaft]

Also to beat a dead horse, some fights like ToGC25 Anub would not be possible without some form of addon (or tremendous RNG luck that every healer picks a different penetrating cold target at the same time every cooldown).

It's actually very doable with the default Blizz UI. I actually don't use any form of non-Blizz UI display for raid frames, and keeping track of debuffs is easy. If you had every healer pull out the default raid frames and put them in group order, all ya need to do is assign healers #1-6, and they heal the targets in order as they appear on the raid frames. Takes the same amount of time to find a raid symbol to heal as it is to count real fast. The reason addons that mark symbols on PC targets exist isn't because it's not easily done with the default UI, it's because most people can't count... that was the joke, I hope. Addons that I personally use are X-perl for party only (just because I like seeing HP numbers and %'s at the same time, that's it), DBM cuz it's required by the guild, Omen (if i remember to turn it on, I tend to look at the default Blizz glowing now), and Atlasloot/Itemrack.

[13vgs97332]

You know how fun heroic anub would be if none of the healers had grid or healbot or dbm to mark penetrating colds. Vent would be insane trying to figure that out every 20 or so seconds. Probably a lot less guilds would have him down. Like almost no guilds.

man the blizz raid frames show debuffs...

[Aswed]

I Don't get some people. You want harder content? easy, make your own hardmodes.. there doesn't have to be an achivement!!!! the achivement system F'ed up at these places!!! if there is an achivement to kill NRB with 4 snobolds up, why not leave all of them up? Maybe leave mistresses and eternals up all the time (on hc cos on normal that is easy :P ), you say it would be harder without adds? disable them!!!!!! Stop QQing about ahrdmodes being Easy!!! Create your own hardmodes! there doesn't have to be an achivement for it!!!

If you want to check if im a scrub or whateva, go ahead..... Name and Realm are there.. Just for the love of god stop the hardmode being easy shi!


o/ Peace.