Blizzard REMOVED Zandalari Warlocks.

[Santern]

Seriously two dudes that use shadow bolt ain't convincing. In Naxx everyone and their dog can can shadow bolts and volleys. Yet they ain't warlocks all of a sudden, right? Sorry, i'm just triggered by this "oH bUt SHadOw BolTs" bullshit.

We didn't get Nelf paladins just cause there two of them in paladin order hall. Neither will we get zandalari warlocks just because some dude used shadow bolt 13 years ago.

Yeah I remember all the dwarfs using shadow bolt or being warlocks ingame

Oh wait, there's 0. Yet, due to proximity and an injection of Dark Irons, they LEARNED how to be warlocks, something that occurred for almost every other race where there'd be event a hint of scholarly pursuits or exposure to warlocks and Fel.

[xpose]

No, the Illidari are Demon Hunters.

Bringing up monks was to refute your point because there are literally ZERO zandalari monks in existence, but zandalari trolls who use fel magic exist. Next.

That you know of. In the leveling quests it was already revealed that ZUL traveled to Pandaria so its not unhead of that some of the guards might have learned it just as blizzard back tracked on kul kiran mages

[Lucrece]

Don't hurt to try I, just set expectations is all.

Would love for them to make this next Q&A fully about class design but I'm not holding my breath.

The usual from this Q&A.

The tried and true "balance is an ongoing process" and "muh 30+ specs to balance through". Nothing remotely specific about the state of classes or any admission of mistakes.

[Baconeggcheese]

The usual from this Q&A.

The tried and true "balance is an ongoing process" and "muh 30+ specs to balance through". Nothing remotely specific about the state of classes or any admission of mistakes.

What's promising is that they've basically admitted the azerite system was a mistake by abandoning it and putting all the progression in the neck itself with 8.2 or whatever. Its crappy because it looks atm like the azerite pieces will still exist, which frankly they shouldn't... but its no small thing that they've basically dumped the system as far as the future plans / development is concerned.

That said the base class design is in dire need of work, but that's simply not going to have any hope of happening until next xpac.

[Deleted]

Well the Q&A was disappointing, guess the forums feedback will just have to continue.

[Lucrece]

What's promising is that they've basically admitted the azerite system was a mistake by abandoning it and putting all the progression in the neck itself with 8.2 or whatever. Its crappy because it looks atm like the azerite pieces will still exist, which frankly they shouldn't... but its no small thing that they've basically dumped the system as far as the future plans / development is concerned.

That said the base class design is in dire need of work, but that's simply not going to have any hope of happening until next xpac.

Which is unfortunate because they can release all the content in the world, but if the class plays like ass it doesn't really matter, and the only spec I can remotely stomach is demonology and it too has its serious flaws that require overtuning to perform well as it's basically a lesser affliction warlock with more ramp up and less useful cleave not to mention with the serious handicap in M+ of not having access to the felhunter for interrupts.

Hopefully they at least have the decency to finish the warlock spell effects and animations by this expansion considering demonbolt looks unfinished as hell and doesn't even work with green fire and Soulfire/Cataclysm haven't even been updated and glyphed demons don't have updated spell effects nor does the summoned imp have the updated felfire bolts that demonology's HoG imps have.

[Baconeggcheese]

Which is unfortunate because they can release all the content in the world, but if the class plays like ass it doesn't really matter

The weirdest thing to me is I regularly see posts on reddit where people are shitting on the BFA class design then turn around and praise legion. I genuinely don't understand it, since legion was the beginning of this shift in class design philosophy and they're built on the same foundation with not a lot of really meaningful change going from one to the other. You look at destro and its basically the same spec with slightly less buttons but functionally almost identical.

I was already burning out by the end of legion, I would have burned out much sooner if I wasn't still in my old guild at launch + still had a lot of that trust currency left over from previous xpacs. They had already spent it all before legion was over, and BFA was very make it or break it for me.

I wonder how many people singing similar tunes of burning out 2 months into BFA just don't realize that that fire was set by legion.

[Lucrece]

The weirdest thing to me is I regularly see posts on reddit where people are shitting on the BFA class design then turn around and praise legion. I genuinely don't understand it, since legion was the beginning of this shift in class design philosophy and they're built on the same foundation with not a lot of really meaningful change going from one to the other. You look at destro and its basically the same spec with slightly less buttons but functionally almost identical.

I was already burning out by the end of legion, I would have burned out much sooner if I wasn't still in my old guild at launch + still had a lot of that trust currency left over from previous xpacs. They had already spent it all before legion was over, and BFA was very make it or break it for me.

I wonder how many people singing similar tunes of burning out 2 months into BFA just don't realize that that fire was set by legion.

I think people notice it more now because the removal of dimensional rift just exacerbated how bad destro's mobility and capacity to perform mechanics is (do siege of boralus or Freehold as the sole caster in the group and you basically have to move all day long).

BfA may be functionally the same-- though I'm happy Lord of Fire is gone-- but the removal of the artifact just left what was a turd barely holding together leaking into outright diarrhea. It has been quite a while since we've had class design this atrocious (I'd include Vanilla+BC in that count, and would include WotLK if they didn't have such a fun variation of DK for example before they pruned the shit out of them too).

[TriHard]

Demoniacs + the Warlock npc in vol'dun

Name one Zandalari Monk in the lore. Or any period when they even existed.

I'll wait

A throwaway NPC has nothing to do with any lore whatsoever, try again.
Demoniacs is an excuse you guys are using to make sense of ZanLocks but in the end, it's just outdated lore.

Try again

[Ehrenpanzer]

Name one Zandalari Warlock in the lore. Or any period when they even existed.

I'll wait

Riiiiiight.... :rollseyes: right around the same point you show me Dark Iron Monks or Gnome Hunters......

[Deleted]

A throwaway NPC has nothing to do with any lore whatsoever, try again.
Demoniacs is an excuse you guys are using to make sense of ZanLocks but in the end, it's just outdated lore.

Try again

So what you're saying is that Lore, be it recent or older, cannot be used to justify things as long as it's related to things you don't personally want.

[TriHard]

So what you're saying is that Lore, be it recent or older, cannot be used to justify things as long as it's related to things you don't personally want.

Demon hunters have lore, DKs have lore, necromancers, witch hunters and dark rangers have lore.
ZanLocks have outdated story that never was built upon for good reason.

I'd love Zanlocks as much as the next person, but it doesn't have the lore to support it, anything from classic is irrelevant and a single placeholder npc in BFA isn't nearly enough to make it happen. They'd have to do a whole lot of class combos before this

[Baconeggcheese]

Demon hunters have lore, DKs have lore, necromancers, witch hunters and dark rangers have lore.
ZanLocks have outdated story that never was built upon for good reason.

I'd love Zanlocks as much as the next person, but it doesn't have the lore to support it, anything from classic is irrelevant and a single placeholder npc in BFA isn't nearly enough to make it happen. They'd have to do a whole lot of class combos before this

I never understand people who are vehemently against class / race combos.

Lore is completely irrelevant, if blizz wants something to exist they make it exist... if they don't want it to they don't. They literally had locks up on the screen at blizzcon because they had every intention of making them a thing until a last minute decision not to. Lore has nothing to do with it.

Unless for some reason a race can't use the magic at all, then there isn't a lore reason why they can't be that class. And frankly even then, its insanely easy to come up with a thin reason why they all of a sudden can if blizzard feels like it.

Monks / panda's set the precedent that as soon as a race makes contact with us the knowledge is transferred and they can now be the race / class. So timeline is irrelevant as well.

I say this as someone who would not roll a zandalari lock if they unlocked it, I have no interest in it. I just see the same mind numbing circular arguments about class / race combos all the time and I never understand it. There is literally no reason why any of the class / race combos that don't exist don't beyond blizzard arbitrarily deciding they don't want them to. At any moment they can come up with whatever reason they want to make any class / race combo happen, it really doesn't take much imagination.

[Nightstalker]

There is a Tauren Rogue in my Garrison but not on my character selection screen!

[tripleh]

Probably because Zandalari had one more class then Kultirans. To even things out one class had to be removed.

[FelPlague]

Demoniacs + the Warlock npc in vol'dun

Name one Zandalari Monk in the lore. Or any period when they even existed.

I'll wait

demoniacs wernt warlocks they were demon hunters
the warlock npc in voldun is an outcast.

- - - Updated - - -

If they kept Warlocks Zandalari would still not be able to be every class in the game. It just makes sense for them to be able to be every Vanilla class because they have an exact match to every one of them.

So what if Zandalari could be 10 classes? It's not a groundbreaking concept, there's other races who can.

I know it's hard to understand when you're not the one affected but different people care about different things, and those who are legitimately upset and want this to be a thing are absolutely valid despite the fact that it sounds like something preposterous to you.

zandalari would be the first race to have every single vanilla race, and even then they ALSO have monk.
also btw they are on par same class numbers as dark iron dwarf. dwarf trading druid for warlock.

[Muajin76]

You know blizz might just be saying they can't be locks, then in next patch say *surprise...zandalari can be locks!*
Why would an announcement at Blizzcon SAY they can be but then say no? I'm calling clickbait on blizz!
I think they will add them tbh.

[FelPlague]

Agreed, especially considering Alliance Allied Races have more class/race combos than Horde Allied Races. It wouldn't be unfair, and the lore for each of these classes adds up.

no theuy dont, the allied races are equal.
Dark iron= zandalari at 9
lightforged= highmountain at 5
void elf= maghar at 7
kultiran =nightborne at 7

- - - Updated - - -

Al'tabim - the guy who gave warlocks their sets in Vanilla. In MoP, he has shadow bolt volley as one of his main moves, and summons meteors not unlike the Eye of Skovald.

Zunashi the Exile also uses shadow bolt, but also is somewhat of a necromancer.

There's little reason that the Zandalari can't be warlocks, considering that the Darkspear can be. It would also stand to reason that there's at least one near Zuldazar considering that the Shivarra Syrawon is hanging out five feet away from the city.

And both of them exiles.

- - - Updated - - -

Probably because Zandalari had one more class then Kultirans. To even things out one class had to be removed.

read above.

- - - Updated - - -

You know blizz might just be saying they can't be locks, then in next patch say *surprise...zandalari can be locks!*
Why would an announcement at Blizzcon SAY they can be but then say no? I'm calling clickbait on blizz!
I think they will add them tbh.

because their slides for blizzcon were made many months in advance, the website was updated with the classes the day of blizzcon, and showed all the classes, and warlocks were not there, paladins and etc were

[Byleth]

And I want Gnome Demon Hunters, but we can’t always get our will can we

Funnily enough, I did a Culling of Stratholme as a BE DH yesterday... I was a gnome DH for the whole instance, ROFL.

[CuchuCachu]

demoniacs wernt warlocks they were demon hunters
the warlock npc in voldun is an outcast.

- - - Updated - - -



zandalari would be the first race to have every single vanilla race, and even then they ALSO have monk.
also btw they are on par same class numbers as dark iron dwarf. dwarf trading druid for warlock.

no they werent Demon Hunters, they were spellcasters. Just as Zand Druids and Paladins have differing power sources (loa) the equivalent of Zand warlocks did too. So tired of this pedantry from people who arent well informed. It's more lore unfriendly to say Demoniacs didnt even really exist like Blizzard has now than to make them a Warlock equivalent (or to say Zand's can be Monks while we're at it)

Also the All-Seeing guy was an advisor to Rastakhan when he was a vanilla questgiver (where we learn about Demoniacs for our warlock gear). So no, he's not "just an exile"

I dont know why people defend even the most arbitrary Blizzard decisions.