#MorallyGrey

[Rafoel]

1- Blight was only delay, they would stay outside sieging the city until it was over (which reminds me, what happened to Lordearon now? As we saw in wrathgate and Gilneas, blight don't really stick forever)
2- alliance don't kill their prisoners on sight (at least not when genocide mode on, which is off since cata), everyone know that Saurfang was captured instead of killed, so to claim 'because they would be dead' isn't reason, and a better solution was to even try to save them, not just see them as corpses for ur magic

Hmm... I don't think how you didn'y notice, but basically whole Alliance army DIED during the blight attack. It is shown from Alliance PoV of Siege, and underlined again when the "remaining" alliance forces meet Nathanos - they have no hope winning against the horde defenders. But, of course, immediately another miracle happens and huge reinforcements of void elves and gnomes arrive in the last possible moment.

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You literally couldn't have chosen two worse expacs to support your argument.

AFAIK both Wotlk and BC were both considered masterpieces by p much everyone, so much so a lot of people would say they were peak WoW.


.

Looking at them after years, they introduced many elements that ultimately lead to complete destruction of original game. During their time however, the consequences of such mechanics weren't obvious - some of them were even liked, and that pulled Blizzard onto the slippery slope that continues to this day. For example:


TBC introduced:
- flying, which later became a main selling point of Cata, and removed interactions between player, environment, and other players
- arenas, while not being bad themselves, lead to Blizzard balancing classes around artificial 3vs3 battles, removing uniqueness, utility, and class identities, while also leading to a serie of more specific problems that plagued PVP from that day, like infinite mana or unkillable healers
- 25 man AND 10 man raids replacing 40 man raids >> the 1st is 50% of reduction in raid size and that might be ok, considering 40 was borderline too much, but 10 is 75% reduction and was closer to ordinary dungeons than true raids. With "positive" reactions to these reductions we later got 10 and 25 man versions of same raid, no loot differences between the version, LFR... do I need to continue?
- and, of course, already with TBC leveling became by design a necesary evil before true content in the endgame, and nothing you did or acquired before max level didn't really matter

WotLK introduced:
- the changes to raids already explained in previous point, but also introduction of normal and heroic versions that needs to be underlined (for a lot of players raids were mainly about experiencing the content, and after fastly completing it on easy mode they felt no drive to do anything more)
- LFG, which removed one of most sought after aspects of WoW Classic
- immense reduction in importance of professions

People were saying it all began to fall down in Cata, but it began to fall much earlier. WotLK had highest total sub numbers, but that number for the first time stagnated. People were already leaving the game en mass. Its just that the games popularity kept pulling a lot of new players in (hence the term Wrath babies) that it equalized the loss of old players. You could be suprised, but whenever I get to know someone that used to play WoW and I ask him when he quit, its almost always WotLK, or early Cata.

[MatthiasVonTzeskagrad]

We already saving your fucken Dark Ranger soon, high rankign Dark Ranger at that, high ranking Dark Ranger INSTRUCTOR who was TRAINING NEW BATCH of Dark Rangers. So i propose you to kindly can it because saving Velonara is just over the top. Plus i never seen void elfs kill any waitresses and as i said in Dazar they attack those who attackign them and in Alliance side we see traders attack first instead of fleeing despite path being clear but they take up the arms and fight us anyway so i can only assume they wanted to fight and should have expected us to fight back. Civilian attacking you with a knife or riding a dinosaur to trample you is a valid target. You gave up one prisoner who was tied to a MAGNIFICENTLY DUMB plan that would only anger the Alliance even more while we will be saving your character who is an active wartime officer.

P.S.
Plsu you cna argue that Sylvanas by burning Teldrassil "enabled" such tacits because this what happens IRL when you start burning people alive - their army starts burning you alive in return.

Alliance War campaign. Umbric tells you to kill random people partying because he does'nt like them.
Also, to add to the list of Void elf shenanigans, defiling wildlife, summoning Void lords to feast on the souls of Zandalari people, and having as motto to come back to Sunwell pretending they would'nt turn it into an apocalyptic Void puddle.

Edit: For some creepy reason, Saurfang somewhat reminds me of that story in Alice in Wonderland, that one of the fisherman and the walrus who eat a lot of baby oysters and then cry because they wish they'd still be there.

[VladlTutushkin]

Alliance War campaign. Umbric tells you to kill random people partying because he does'nt like them.
Also, to add to the list of Void elf shenanigans, defiling wildlife, summoning Void lords to feast on the souls of Zandalari people, and having as motto to come back to Sunwell pretending they would'nt turn it into an apocalyptic Void puddle.

Edit: For some creepy reason, Saurfang somewhat reminds me of that story in Alice in Wonderland, that one of the fisherman and the walrus who eat a lot of baby oysters and then cry because they wish they'd still be there.

Summoning void lords? You are really reaching now. And i dont see anything wrong with voidosaurus, it was even dead before! Using undead animals is fine, they are not sentient.

[Verdugo]

Summoning void lords? You are really reaching now. And i dont see anything wrong with voidosaurus, it was even dead before! Using undead animals is fine, they are not sentient.

I love the flexible mindset alliance fans have when it comes to necromancy.

Not talking about you personaly.

[VladlTutushkin]

I love the flexible mindset alliance fans have when it comes to necromancy.

Not talking about you personaly.

It is common sense. If you raise an oxen, is it enslavement? You can only enslave a sentient being. Nothing wrong with making a bone horse or bone dino. Whole aspect of “damning the soul” will not be nearly as crucial when same animals used as beasts of burden or food anyway.

[Super Dickmann]

Summoning void lords? You are really reaching now. And i dont see anything wrong with voidosaurus, it was even dead before! Using undead animals is fine, they are not sentient.

They do summon a void god in Vol'dun. It's just that nobody gives a shit. Also that it's not one of those void lords, it's one of those reverse naaru Entropius-style things. As for the dinosaurs, no raising dinosaurs isn't on par with raising people, but they are the sentient children of a loa and it is meant as intentional sacrilege so the Zandalari have every reason to be fairly salty about it.

[VladlTutushkin]

They do summon a void god in Vol'dun. It's just that nobody gives a shit. Also that it's not one of those void lords, it's one of those reverse naaru Entropius-style things. As for the dinosaurs, no raising dinosaurs isn't on par with raising people, but they are the sentient children of a loa and it is meant as intentional sacrilege so the Zandalari have every reason to be fairly salty about it.

Children of Loa? Yes, although i am not sure they are his offspring, maybe more like a “breed” that he favors. Sentient? Also not sure, they are about as sentient as “clever girl” raptors.

[Super Dickmann]

Children of Loa? Yes, although i am not sure they are his offspring, maybe more like a “breed” that he favors. Sentient? Also not sure, they are about as sentient as “clever girl” raptors.

Discounting that time Rhonin organized an army of raptors, they're implied to be like chimp-tier in intelligence. We do know Gonk calls them his children and that the void elves are going after them for their religious significance, not just because they like shooting dinosaurs with corruption beams. So no, not close to being a person but it's something with significance to the Zandalari.

[VladlTutushkin]

Discounting that time Rhonin organized an army of raptors, they're implied to be like chimp-tier in intelligence. We do know Gonk calls them his children and that the void elves are going after them for their religious significance, not just because they like shooting dinosaurs with corruption beams. So no, not close to being a person but it's something with significance to the Zandalari.

I never denied that they were sacred. After all whole thing with them is that they are both sacred and used as war animals aka why zanda-paladins ride raptors. Its like holy horses to them.

[Super Dickmann]

I never denied that they were sacred. After all whole thing with them is that they are both sacred and used as war animals aka why zanda-paladins ride raptors. Its like holy horses to them.

In terms of demoralizing tactics it's pretty cool.

Though you know, now that you mention it dawns on me that if they had the Zandalari be upset about it they might also have to take issue with the fact that the blood elves are using loa blood to power their golems out in Nazmir.

[VladlTutushkin]

In terms of demoralizing tactics it's pretty cool.

Though you know, now that you mention it dawns on me that if they had the Zandalari be upset about it they might also have to take issue with the fact that the blood elves are using loa blood to power their golems out in Nazmir.

And goblins tearing apart that super-mega-sacred tomb of Kings we spent so much time defending against Zul btw.

[MatthiasVonTzeskagrad]

I guess they had to aspull a way for Horde players to have Alun'za as boss in the dungeon instead of making something different like they did in Siege of Boralus.

[Powerogue]

We changed topics pretty quick but I'd like to bring back the post I made on Sylvanas. What say you, on whether Sylvanas has finally come full circle and abandoned everything she ever stood for?

Children of the grave, heed my call!
In life, we suffered unspeakable tragedies.
We watched as our homes were razed to the ground.
We cried out in agony as our families were cut down before our eyes.

[snipped for length]

[Hitei]

We changed topics pretty quick but I'd like to bring back the post I made on Sylvanas. What say you, on whether Sylvanas has finally come full circle and abandoned everything she ever stood for?

"We are the Forsaken, we will slaughter anyone who stands in our way."

[Khaza-R]

We changed topics pretty quick but I'd like to bring back the post I made on Sylvanas. What say you, on whether Sylvanas has finally come full circle and abandoned everything she ever stood for?

She's always stood for brutality and doing absolutely whatever she wants to achieve her goal. So no, not a betrayal of her core character at all.

[Super Dickmann]

And goblins tearing apart that super-mega-sacred tomb of Kings we spent so much time defending against Zul btw.

Why is it we kill that golden priestess anyway? She's on our side. Hell, the game knows this and has Yazma point it out.

I'm thinking this was originally a Boralus situation and that was meant for Alliance players before they cut out whatever they had planned. That or the PC is loot-crazed and just wants the cash.
@Powerogue

Only the new version in BTS. If you pretend the book never happened then BFA with the exception of Teldrassil is in fact extremely moderate by Forsaken standards.

[VladlTutushkin]

Why is it we kill that golden priestess anyway? She's on our side. Hell, the game knows this and has Yazma point it out.

I'm thinking this was originally a Boralus situation and that was meant for Alliance players before they cut out whatever they had planned. That or the PC is loot-crazed and just wants the cash.
@Powerogue

Only the new version in BTS. If you pretend the book never happened then BFA with the exception of Teldrassil is in fact extremely moderate by Forsaken standards.

Its actually a reocurring theme - Horde protects the Tomb from Zul - goblins desecrate and pillage it afterwards while Alliance players chase them off (wtf).
Horde player saves sentient gorillas from evil sentient gorillas and leaves them to live in peace - goblins hungry for kaja’mite attack them and hunt sentient gorillas to near extinction forcing Grong to seek help from Alliance.

[mickybrighteyes]

We changed topics pretty quick but I'd like to bring back the post I made on Sylvanas. What say you, on whether Sylvanas has finally come full circle and abandoned everything she ever stood for?

The only real hard shift is how the game shows teldrassil. Most everything else is par for the course for Sylvanas. IMO the only other thing is how everyone suddenly is super wary of literally everything she does.... Like Guards in Elderscroll all being the same faction and knowing you stoll three coins from some dude in Ald Velothi but these guys have never been outside of Hla Oad or Tel Branora (places all across the game's continent).

I would simply shrug it off as poor writing... but we can only do that so much with this trash.

Just waiting for the inevitable shift where Sylvanas does something else even more batshit crazy for no real reason other than to drive home she's the villain... OR they go the Kerrigan route where she fuses with some uber power and transcends into something on a level of a god and saves us all.... So... lightforged Sylvanas absorbing a wild god maybe?

[Friendlyimmolation]

The only real hard shift is how the game shows teldrassil. Most everything else is par for the course for Sylvanas. IMO the only other thing is how everyone suddenly is super wary of literally everything she does.... Like Guards in Elderscroll all being the same faction and knowing you stoll three coins from some dude in Ald Velothi but these guys have never been outside of Hla Oad or Tel Branora (places all across the game's continent).

I would simply shrug it off as poor writing... but we can only do that so much with this trash.

Just waiting for the inevitable shift where Sylvanas does something else even more batshit crazy for no real reason other than to drive home she's the villain... OR they go the Kerrigan route where she fuses with some uber power and transcends into something on a level of a god and saves us all.... So... lightforged Sylvanas absorbing a wild god maybe?

Sylvanas perfects tonal forging and creates a Numidium which she powers with the heart of a dead god which then denies the old gods and void lords out of exsistence.

Then Sylvanas creates a dragonbreak where she ends the war, becomes a god and doesn’t become a god.

[Arrashi]

Sylvanas perfects tonal forging and creates a Numidium which she powers with the heart of a dead god which then denies the old gods and void lords out of exsistence.

Then Sylvanas creates a dragonbreak where she ends the war, becomes a god and doesn’t become a god.

Sylvanas uses "war as a business" to end "war as business" ?